Did you ask your partner's parents before proposing?

augustus gloop

Shenshen wrote: »

Why not? One thinks that the race needs to be preserved as it is, the other thinks traditions need to be preserved as they are. Both ignore how life and society have moved on, both tend to go a bit starry-eyed about the good old days, with "traditional values".
I've no time for either of them.


Go on believing that, so.

that is a ridiculous statement! im quite sure your flaming now, as I dont see how anyone could equate the two.
good answer;)

astonaidan

My sisters OH both asked, I always wanted to know how that conversation went with my father, needless to say one was cutting logs the next day another digging ridges, me personally yeah Id do it, possibly the way I was raised just something Id like to do, but itd be for a blessing

Zulu

I made the effort with my father in law. He appreciated the sentiment. As did his wife. As did my wife.

It's a traditional thing.

SmilingLurker

No, I did not. I know my now wife would find it old fashioned and would not have liked it.

My brother in law did, my dad said it was up to my sister... Would anyone make the decision for their daughter? I have a daughter now, and will not expect to be asked.

Gongoozler

Yeah, I did. His father wouldn't have me.:pac:

Women only working at home was tradition, doesn't mean it's a good thing. The whole tradition thing is a ridiculous reason. It was also tradition to pay a dowry for girls when 'asking' to marry her. I'm sure my dad would gladly take it, but you'd get some strange look from him once you get to the permission part. It reminds me of buying slaves, and bartering with the slave owner.

Reindeer

eviltwin wrote: »

Different strokes and all that....I think marrying someone is enough of a validation of your feelings, you don't have to jazz it up by asking her folks beforehand. And while its nice that you get on so well with your inlaws its not really necessary to include them in all your life decisions, presuming you and your wife are adults you should be content to do that on your own.

And the best way to respect your inlaws is to treat their child with respect through the marriage, be a good husband/wife and a good parent if you have kids. Thats all they want.

I agree. There's a lot of things you do not have to do. But life isn't about doing what you want to do. Why? Because there are politics. The devil is in the details:

It has nothing to do with how much respect you feel you have, or how much sincerity you know you have. It has to do with diplomacy. It has to do with politics. It has to do with expressing it to the new family members. Granted some folks spurn politics. I know I hate them. I hate playing games. And I am usually fairly good at both, so I imagine if you're crap at such things, it could be even more frustrating. I became frustrated myself, and It's one of the reasons I am currently divorced. So I know from experience a small amount of concessions here and there can make a lifetime of difference when it comes to in-laws.

As I said previously, it has nothing to do with permission. And the camp that thinks it is sexist or unnecessary are completely missing the point. It has everything to do with diplomacy. Sometimes you have to smile, even when you don't want to. Hopefully, in this case, you'd want to. And that small gesture will mean a huge amount to her parents.

If the parents are likely going to not want to bless the wedding, unless you're basically ignorant, it's likely you'll know this beforehand. In such a case, if you intend to marry their daughter regardless, then it's likely her parents already know how you feel about them. The gesture is futile at that point, isn't it? If it is the case that you know her parents wouldn't appreciate the gesture, regardless of whether they love you or not, then simply don't do it. I mean, I know this is AH, and there's a lot of children here that are oblivious to the world still, but this isn't rocket science, folks. Man, if only I had been back there next to my old stubborn self and could have shown me how a simple few concessions and gestures could have made my life exponentially easier, both in marriage and life.

But this is marriage we're talking about. While I understand many of you simply wish to get on with your lives and maybe just pump out a few kids and spend your evening with them at the soccer club, there is more to marriage than that. You may be effectively doubling the size of your family or more. In such a case, politics will be unavoidable. You can either choose to be a diplomat, or not. It takes all kinds, right? Asking for the blessing is part of that diplomacy. It always was, and always will be. And, as I mentioned previously, is a ridiculously easy means to improve or solidify the diplomatic relations with your new family. It will also be one of the easiest forms of diplomacy you have at your disposal. After you are married, the politics will become increasingly more difficult, if not nearly impossible in some cases. So, while the gesture certainly isn't necessary, you will find precious few times in the future when will you have the opportunity to spend a few seconds and gain so much.

Zulu

Gongoozler wrote: »

The whole tradition thing is a ridiculous reason.

...for you.

If you don't get it, she doesn't get it & most importantly her father doesn't get it then fine - it would be ridiculous.

If however, her father is a traditionalist, or if her mother is a traditionalist, then you'd be a fool to snub their beliefs so flippantly. As Reindeer so well put it, it's diplomacy 101.

Reindeer

Reindeer wrote: »

Asking for the blessing is part of that diplomacy. It always was, and always will be.

For you. My mother would be fairly ticked off and so would I if my OH tried that one.

Gongoozler

Zulu wrote: »

...for you.

If you don't get it, she doesn't get it & most importantly her father doesn't get it then fine - it would be ridiculous.

If however, her father is a traditionalist, or if her mother is a traditionalist, then you'd be a fool to snub their beliefs so flippantly. As Reindeer so well put it, it's diplomacy 101.

No you wouldn't be a fool to snub their beliefs. What about if you have children, and you're an atheist, so is your wife, and you don't believe in christening your child. But your parents do, or hers do. Do you do it because they believe you should? how far does this diplomacy stretch?

Zulu

Gongoozler wrote: »

No you wouldn't be a fool to snub their beliefs.

A fool does foolish things.

What about if you have children, and you're an atheist, so is your wife, and you don't believe in christening your child. But your parents do, or hers do. Do you do it because they believe you should?

To answer your question: no. But that's a good question, I'll grant you that.

how far does this diplomacy stretch?

Well, that all depends doesn't it. There are few strict rules on diplomacy. Making small gestures earlier in the relationship will go a long way to harboring goodwill in bigger issues later on.

Being bullish and recklessly disregarding others will harbor no goodwill.

But each to their own.

Gongoozler

Zulu wrote: »

A fool does foolish things.
To answer your question: no. But that's a good question, I'll grant you that.
Well, that all depends doesn't it. There are few strict rules on diplomacy. Making small gestures earlier in the relationship will go a long way to harboring goodwill in bigger issues later on.

Being bullish and recklessly disregarding others will harbor no goodwill.

But each to their own.

You'll grant me that, will you? ah, thanks.

I agree that you can of course make small gestures, and in this instance it would be a small gesture to her father to get his permission/blessing, but my point is it's still disrespectful to your wife. Fine, if you both agree on doing it, to please her father, and she knows it means nothing disrespectful to her, go ahead. I agree with doing some things, but still don't think I'd have it go that far, I just don't agree with that. I wouldn't want anybody viewing me as an item to be traded.

The same as my reason for not telling my granny that I don't want children, for the sake of peace, let him have it his way.

Zulu

Gongoozler wrote: »

... but my point is it's still disrespectful to your wife.

Quite the opposite actually: it was respectful to my wife & her family.

She doesn't see herself as an item to be traded. Neither do I. And neither do her parents. If that was the sentiment, it would have been offensive. If that was the sentiment, you'd have been right: it would have been disrespectful.

Tell me, have you ever greeted someones "hey!" with a "how are you getting on?" and not actually meant to ask someone to tell you how they are actually getting on? The sentiment expressed can be different to the literal language used.

Gongoozler

Zulu wrote: »

Quite the opposite actually: it was respectful to my wife & her family.

She doesn't see herself as an item to be traded. Neither do I. And neither do her parents. If that was the sentiment, it would have been offensive. If that was the sentiment, you'd have been right: it would have been disrespectful.

Tell me, have you ever greeted someones "hey!" with a "how are you getting on?" and not actually meant to ask someone to tell you how they are actually getting on? The sentiment expressed can be different to the literal language used.

Ok so, I'm interested in understanding what it was about, if it's nothing to do with her being an item.

And by the way, no I've never asked how someone is, and not wanted to hear the answer. but then, most would, I get your point. though it's a completely different thing.

God...

HeyThereDeliah wrote: »

It's tradition. Some people want to call it sexist etc its really not. There is no harm in showing a little respect to your in laws to be.

"Tradition"

Genital mutilation is tradition in some cultures.

Fuck tradition.

And the main person you should be showing respect to is the person you plan on spending your life with.

HeyThereDeliah

God... wrote: »

"Tradition"

Genital mutilation is tradition in some cultures.

Fuck tradition.

Hardly the same thing. It's a stupid comparison.

Zulu

Gongoozler wrote: »

Ok so, I'm interested in understanding what it was about, if it's nothing to do with her being an item.

We've covered this, diplomacy & respect.

God... wrote: »

Fuck tradition.

And the main person you should be showing respect to is the person you plan on spending your life with.

Tradition & respect are not mutually exclusive.

Gongoozler

Zulu wrote: »

We've covered this, diplomacy & respect.

That's hardly an explanation though.

Do you think people who don't ask a womans father are disrespecting him & her?

HeyThereDeliah

God... wrote: »

"Tradition"

Genital mutilation is tradition in some cultures.

Fuck tradition.

And the main person you should be showing respect to is the person you plan on spending your life with.

If the bride wants it its ok? If your wife to be wanted it would you respect her and ask her father?

Zulu

Gongoozler wrote: »

Do you think people who don't ask a womans father are disrespecting him & her?

No. Are you reading my posts at all?

Reindeer

bluewolf wrote: »

For you. My mother would be fairly ticked off and so would I if my OH tried that one.

And part of the diplomacy is knowing how your OH felt about it. Maybe in such a case, the OH might possibly spend more time asking your blessing on things...

Diplomacy is a complicated thing, and there are no hard and fast rules. People may be surprisingly stubborn and can seemingly take the smallest issue very personally. Being an ambassador takes a large amount of effort. But part of diplomacy is understanding people's motives, what drives them, and what will appease their self esteem. Much conflict comes form misunderstanding a person's motives, and from feeling slighted. And no one likes to feel manipulated. And diplomacy is nothing if not manipulation. There's a reason why you hear relatively vague and ambiguous talk from our politicians. Words like 'seemingly', 'may', 'might', and 'possibly' can mitigate their impact, yet convey some meaning still without feeling as though your point is forced. The only rule I know from 43 years on this planet that works every time is the old axiom: "You'll catch more flies with honey than with vinegar." Adapting this method to work for things other than flies is where the trick is.

Gongoozler

Zulu wrote: »

No. Are you reading my posts at all?

Yes, thanks for checking.
You're not explaining how it is out of respect to your wife and her father. And if you think it's respectful to do it, it would be a logical thing for me to assume that you think it's disrespectful not to do it.

God...

HeyThereDeliah wrote: »

Hardly the same thing. It's a stupid comparison.

you said...

HeyThereDeliah wrote: »

its tradition

There both traditions, that's the comparison. Not seeing that's what I meant is stupid.

God...

HeyThereDeliah wrote: »

If the bride wants it its ok? If your wife to be wanted it would you respect her and ask her father?

Personally I don't think I'd be compatible with a person who would ask me, to ask her father to marry her.... I try to respect everyone within means but no I wouldn't respect a woman with that attitude enough to marry her.

HeyThereDeliah

God... wrote: »

Personally I don't think I'd be compatible with a person who would ask me, to ask her father to marry her.... I try to respect everyone within means but no I wouldn't respect a woman with that attitude enough to marry her.

You could not respect a woman who had respect for her parents? This would be a deal breaker even if you loved her ?


I honestly don't see the drama that surrounds one little moment in our lives, some people do it for their partner even though they think its outdated but it makes one person feel good and where is the harm in that.
I think we all change our views as we get older and when we become parents ourselves, little things that annoyed us seem trivial years later. I'm aware we are all different.

The Cool

My dad is already offering my BF all the Coke he can drink for the rest of his life if he takes me off my dad's hands!!!

I don't think my BF would ask my dad, because he knows full well that my dad would absolutely rip the piss out of him! I recently told my dad that a friend had gotten proposed to and his response was, "[boyfriend] has more sense thank god"

God...

HeyThereDeliah wrote: »

You could not respect a woman who had respect for her parents? This would be a deal breaker even if you loved her ?


I honestly don't see the drama that surrounds one little moment in our lives, some people do it for their partner even though they think its outdated but it makes one person feel good and where is the harm in that.
I think we all change our views as we get older and when we become parents ourselves, little things that annoyed us seem trivial years later. I'm aware we are all different.

There is no drama I just personally wouldn't be with a person with that attitude.

I look at marriage as a promise to that person that I want to be with them forever. So the person I marry is the person I ask, not there father, dog or budgie.

Who says I'm not older and a parent?

I think people are evolving a bit and the old backwards way of thinking is dying out.

HeyThereDeliah

God... wrote: »

There is no drama I just personally wouldn't be with a person with that attitude.

I look at marriage as a promise to that person that I want to be with them forever. So the person I marry is the person I ask, not there father, dog or budgie.

Who says I'm not older and a parent?

I think people are evolving a bit and the old backwards way of thinking is dying out.

Fair enough but would you call off the wedding over something so trivial ?

I understand this but your not asking her father really it's just a gesture.

Have no idea if you are older or a parent was just speaking about people in general.

Most of us go along with some things for other people because it makes them feel involved.

God...

HeyThereDeliah wrote: »

Fair enough but would you call off the wedding over something so trivial ?

I understand this but your not asking her father really it's just a gesture.

Have no idea if you are older or a parent was just speaking about people in general.

Most of us go along with some things for other people because it makes them feel involved.

If everything else was perfect no I wouldn't call it off, but a person with such "traditional" views is a person I probably wouldn't have a lot in common with in the first place

Gesture, what is the point in this gesture though?? Even if she wants you to ask her father, to ask her, to marry her (getting dizzy here!!). What is the point in asking him? Other than tradition which is not a proper answer. What is the point? Not being funny or argumentative just don't get it.

Rachineire

My OH didn't ask my father for permission even though my father wanted him to. I personally didn't care and am actually happy he never did. Small things like that have set the tone for us in terms of how we deal with my overbearing family.

HeyThereDeliah

God... wrote: »

If everything else was perfect no I wouldn't call it off, but a person with such "traditional" views is a person I probably wouldn't have a lot in common with in the first place

Gesture, what is the point in this gesture though?? Even if she wants you to ask her father, to ask her, to marry her (getting dizzy here!!). What is the point in asking him? Other than tradition which is not a proper answer. What is the point? Not being funny or argumentative just don't get it.

One view on one thing that she probably heard her father speak about as she grew up, girls do it for their dads to involve them that's all.
We could go on all night about lots of things we do out of habit or tradition,
Something old ,something new etc still goes on, what is the meaning of this only tradition.
Why do people go on honeymoon ? You see what I mean, it's life and we try keep everyone happy.

God...

HeyThereDeliah wrote: »

One view on one thing that she probably heard her father speak about as she grew up, girls do it for their dads to involve them that's all.
We could go on all night about lots of things we do out of habit or tradition,
Something old ,something new etc still goes on, what is the meaning of this only tradition.
Why do people go on honeymoon ? You see what I mean, it's life and we try keep everyone happy.

They want a holiday after the stress of paying a shit load of money on a day for people that they haven't much in common with but feel obliged to due to blood ties????

Zulu

God... wrote: »

I think people are evolving a bit and the old backwards way of thinking is dying out.

:rolleyes:
Well there you have it, consideration for your wife & your future family is a symptom of not beig evoloved, and backward!
I've heard it all.

God...

HeyThereDeliah wrote: »

One view on one thing that she probably heard her father speak about as she grew up, girls do it for their dads to involve them that's all.
We could go on all night about lots of things we do out of habit or tradition,
Something old ,something new etc still goes on, what is the meaning of this only tradition.
Why do people go on honeymoon ? You see what I mean, it's life and we try keep everyone happy.

All jokes aside, we really could and they're all equally stupid. Tradition doesn't make things less ridiculous. Just means stupid people are stupid.

He can walk her down the aisle. Otherwise the day is about the bride and groom.

God...

Zulu wrote: »

:rolleyes:
Well there you have it, consideration for your wife & your future family is a symptom of not beig evoloved, and backward!
I've heard it all.

:rolleyes:Explain in detail please??? and could you quote in full, thanks.:rolleyes:

Jogathon

My dad was asked by my now brother-in-law and it was a complete surprise. They'd been living together for years, and dad was really quite chuffed that he'd been asked. He didn't expect it and neither did any of us, but it really made my dad's day!

It's a traditional thing, it's not a big deal, and I suppose it depends on how close the father and daughter are?

Zulu

Gongoozler wrote: »

You're not explaining how it is out of respect to your wife and her father.

Apologies, I thought this was self-evident. I was respecting their wishes by doing what they would have/did want me to do.
My wife wanted me to respect her father and his wishes. My wife wanted me to ask him.
My father-in-law wanted me to respect this tradition because it included him & his wife in the process. It'd made them happy - for whatever reason (I didn't quiz him as to why).

And if you think it's respectful to do it, it would be a logical thing for me to assume that you think it's disrespectful not to do it.

It may be logical, but it's not correct. What is respectful for my wife and her family wouldn't apply to you (unless you intended to marry my wife).

Clearly as another posted stated it would be disrespectful in her family to ask...
Different strokes for different folks; diplomacy.

God... wrote: »

Tradition doesn't make things less ridiculous. Just means stupid people are stupid.

:rolleyes: So we're less evolved, backward, & stupid for respecting our wives wishes? Wow. You're really good at getting indirect insults into your posts.

He can walk her down the aisle.

Why stop at asking him? Why allow him to walk her down the aisle?

ccull123

NiallSparky wrote: »

I think it's disrespectful to the potential wife. It's an outdated, sexist practice.

Understand your point but I just dont see how it is disrespectful to ask the father of your potential wife for his blessing!

Smoggy

Merch wrote: »

I'm suspicious some kind of deal went on behind my back, exchange of brown envelopes, I just dont get it otherwise.

I requested a dowry to take my wifes hand from her father. We started off at two cows, a sheep and his new flat screen TV, However I ended up with a KFC Bargain Bucket.

renofan

We were already engaged when I just asked him if he didn't mind me marrying his daughter. We were going out over six years at this stage and I knew him very well.....t'was more for the craic than anything. His reply.....I thought I'd never got rid of her!

flutterflye

My husband possibly hates my dad more than I do, so no, he did not ask his permission!

My sister in law's husband asked my father in law's permission though.

Each to their own and all that, but I think it's ridiculous!!

fuerte1976

flutterflye wrote: »

My husband possibly hates my dad more than I do, so no, he did not ask his permission!

My sister in law's husband asked my father in law's permission though.

Each to their own and all that, but I think it's ridiculous!!

That's sad ...

oldyouth

My father in law was way too scary (at the time) for me to ask for permission. On the night we told her parents, he was called in from the telly room in order to break the news. His reaction was to declare that 'this better be good, James Bond is on the telly'. He was back in front of it within a minute.

Get along great now though:p

Merch

Smoggy wrote: »

I requested a dowry to take my wifes hand from her father. We started off at two cows, a sheep and his new flat screen TV, However I ended up with a KFC Bargain Bucket.

a bucket over the head, thats an awful waste of food, even if it is kfc