Rip-off petrol stations

langdang

Hal Decks wrote: »

(As to why any business should subsidise fuel sales from convenience store sales is beyond me. )

I hate it when Tesco has cheap "ProductX" to draw me in, I always end up buying a few other bits too. Loss leaders, I hear they're called. I dunno, tis all very underhanded. God be with the days of corner shops, they wouldn't catching you with these loss leader malarkeys!

Bandara

corktina wrote: »

a worthless post from start to finish.
Care to explain how it is not the case that the more of something you buy , the cheaper you get it?

Its only worthless to you as you clearly have absolutely no idea as to how the fuel system works, how service stations as a business are structured or how fuel sales relate or otherwise to shop sales and shop profitability.

I may appear to be overtly agressive here for which I genuinely apologise, its not my intention, but you are making so many assumptions based on a standard perception of retail. The fuel industry is a completely different animal to which your observations do not apply.

I can be buying fuel for 1 euro, and selling it for 1.05 and yet be making less money than my competitor who is buying for 1.05 and selling for 1.04

In turn my competitor can be selling for below cost and still be dearer than me, even though I am making a 3 cent margin per litre.

It is not a buy for x and sell for y business. There is no level playing field, no one is starting from the same point.

The busier your pumps its very common you will start to make less money in your shop.

These are just a few examples of the industry specific differences that exists.

Regards
HT

Bandara

Regarding the margin question that hal is asking.

The fact is that a margin of less than 1% is what the forecourts operate off.

There is (I'd suggest) no other business in the world that operates on such tiny margins and has a situation where the company retention from €10,000,000 of sales is currently €18,000 a year above the staff cost alone to deliver such sales.

Hal Decks

Hammertime wrote: »

Regarding the margin question that hal is asking.

The fact is that a margin of less than 1% is what the forecourts operate off.

There is (I'd suggest) no other business in the world that operates on such tiny margins and has a situation where the company retention from €10,000,000 of sales is currently €18,000 a year above the staff cost alone to deliver such sales.

Thanks but you have misinterpreted my question. I know the margins involved but I was asking the OP what margins he deemed acceptable. So far, despite ranting and raving about it, he has refused to answer.

Bandara

Hal Decks wrote: »

Hammertime wrote: »

Regarding the margin question that hal is asking.

The fact is that a margin of less than 1% is what the forecourts operate off.

There is (I'd suggest) no other business in the world that operates on such tiny margins and has a situation where the company retention from €10,000,000 of sales is currently €18,000 a year above the staff cost alone to deliver such sales.

Thanks but you have misinterpreted my question. I know the margins involved but I was asking the OP what margins he deemed acceptable. So far, despite ranting and raving about it, he has refused to answer.

I know hal, I knew what you meant, I was just giving the actual facts regarding the margin to the posters who are throwing around the rip-off rubbish.

You'll never get an answer as no one could ever actually expect any business to earn as little as is earned on fuel. Even the most ludricious person would only allow a 5% profit (which is about 6 times over the actual real figure!!!)

So fuel is actually provided extremely cheaply through the channels involved in the industry.

The fact is it's the government that makes fuel expensive. But the ranters and ravers can't see that for some strange reason !

corktina

Hal Decks wrote: »

Yet, still, you have not answered the question

What margin do you deem acceptable for a fuel retailer?

(As to why any business should subsidise fuel sales from convenience store sales is beyond me. )

annoying isnt it.

corktina

a margin of less than 1% and yet an small independent can sell for 4c less. He must be making a big loss then and I can expect him to close this week. Oh, hang on a bit, he's been selling for less than the big guys for a good while now. Guy probably sells only a 20th of what the big guy does, so you'd assume the big guy would have got supplies since the little guy last did and yet theres still a 4c difference.

pippip

corktina wrote: »

a margin of less than 1% and yet an small independent can sell for 4c less. He must be making a big loss then and I can expect him to close this week. Oh, hang on a bit, he's been selling for less than the big guys for a good while now. Guy probably sells only a 20th of what the big guy does, so you'd assume the big guy would have got supplies since the little guy last did and yet theres still a 4c difference.

Why dont you drop in and ask the inde how they are so low?

Hal Decks

corktina wrote: »

a margin of less than 1% and yet an small independent can sell for 4c less. He must be making a big loss then and I can expect him to close this week. Oh, hang on a bit, he's been selling for less than the big guys for a good while now. Guy probably sells only a 20th of what the big guy does, so you'd assume the big guy would have got supplies since the little guy last did and yet theres still a 4c difference.

Thus proving that, yes, you haven't a clue how the industry works.

pippip

Some fuel related figures -

http://blog.aaireland.ie/index.php/2011/03/09/uncategorized/1159

corktina

Hal Decks wrote: »

Thus proving that, yes, you haven't a clue how the industry works.

no of course i haven't I'm just a punter who thinks that some petrol stations are a rip off.

Seeing as you and others are clearly in the trade, why don't you clearly explain how it is a tiny petrol station can charge less than a much busier one and what's more how they reduce and increase their prices at around the same frequency as oil price change rather than being really quick on the increases and very slow on the reductions.

Hal Decks

corktina wrote: »

Hal Decks wrote: »

Thus proving that, yes, you haven't a clue how the industry works.

no of course i haven't I'm just a punter who thinks that some petrol stations are a rip off.

Seeing as you and others are clearly in the trade, why don't you clearly explain how it is a tiny petrol station can charge less than a much busier one and what's more how they reduce and increase their prices at around the same frequency as oil price change rather than being really quick on the increases and very slow on the reductions.

Do you really care? Or would it upset your rant?

You have to consider the Minimum Order Quantity a supplier might impose on a retailer?
You have to consider how some retailers are tied in to supply contracts with Oil companies?
Small independents can shop around and can take smaller deliveries, larger units may have to exhaust existing supplies, at higher prices, before replenishment.
A new petrol pump could cost in the region of €10k to €15k, there's a lot of fuel to be sold to recoup costs like that!

I don't fault any retailer charging whatever he wants. It's a free market and the consumer is free to go where he wants.

And, you have yet to state what margin you deem acceptable for a fuel retailer.

corktina

i've already said I have no idea about the business and you still havent convinced me that some petrol stations take the mickey, putting up prices like greased lightning and taking their time to reduce them.
Most of what you say seems to me like a smoke screen.I bet an Independent pays more for a petrol pump for instance then a big player...

what puzzles me most is your agressive stance on this.

Dj320

corktina wrote: »

i've already said I have no idea about the business and you still havent convinced me that some petrol stations take the mickey, putting up prices like greased lightning and taking their time to reduce them.
Most of what you say seems to me like a smoke screen.I bet an Independent pays more for a petrol pump for instance then a big player...

what puzzles me most is your agressive stance on this.

Bigger stations are prob most likely tied into a contract with an oil company so they don't make the price, I know , I was with a big oil company now I'm an "indie" . But I wonder sometimes why people get so upset about petrol prices, on average there might be 2c in the price difference at most(anymore and i would question the origins of the fuel)now on an average fill of petrol @50ltr it works out at 1euro, 1EURO and people will drive miles to "save" when in reality it is costing them and the same person will buy cigs and happily spend 9 euro. Everyday I hear this and it just bugs me that people get so obsessed by the price, working a 6and a half day a week 12 hrs a day I sometimes wonder is it worth listening to , "your very expensive", " are you selling dodgy fuel" ( if I'm cheap on a week) , "i didn't get enough in my car "( after putting in 5 euro and the light didnt go out) , "why won't you pump the petrol in for us", and the best is " you hardly want the 10cent ( when they put in 10.10cent)