Hedgehogs and Toxoplasmosis

Irish Stones

I can't find any information about the chance that a hedgehog could pass toxoplasmosis onto a cat.
I have a cat that lives in my garden. As I told in another occasion, he arrived here from an unknown place and I don't know anything about him, except he's positive to FIV and FeLV tests. This is the reason why he can't come indoor, where I have two other cats that are healthy.
This outdoor cat has been recently diagnosed with toxoplasmosis.

In this same garden I receive the visits of a hedgehog. It comes every night around midnight and when nobody's around it goes to the cat's bowls and eat what he left and drinks from the water bowl.

Now I'm wondering if the hedgehog could be the cause of the infection of toxoplasmosis in my outdoor cat because of the contact with the bowls.
I tried the same question in an Italian forum but got no answer so far.
Thanks.

Themadhouse

I imagine the cat got it from eating an infected bird/rat/mouse to be honest.
Maybe if the hedgehog is pooping in the water bowl and the cat drinks from it.....

benchppress

I think the rational and sane thing to do with a semi feral fiv+, toxoplasmosis + cat is to get it PTS

Twoelles

The problem with the cat having FIV is that because he is immune suppressed he will pick up anything that is around where a non FIV cat may not. You can't blame the hedgehog as it could have come from a number of possibilities.

Is he ferral or just an outdoor cat? Have you thought about seeking a home for him where he cant go outside, pass on the diseases he has or catch other diseases? Its just a thought, but i recently found a home for a FIV positive cat who had lived 'rough' for years and he is now sooooo happy.

planetX

The vast majority of cats have been exposed to toxoplasmosis, as have the majority of other animals including humans. Healthy animals immune systems deal with it, this cat is immunocompromised so may become ill. It's really the FIV/FeLv that's the problem.

Irish Stones

Themadhouse wrote: »

I imagine the cat got it from eating an infected bird/rat/mouse to be honest.
Maybe if the hedgehog is pooping in the water bowl and the cat drinks from it.....

I thought about this possibility... The hedgehog poops around in the garden, I found the evidence and I think that the cat might roll in the grass and over the... evidence... then the cat grooms himself and the damage is done.
What about this theory?

Irish Stones

benchppress wrote: »

I think the rational and sane thing to do with a semi feral fiv+, toxoplasmosis + cat is to get it PTS

I'm not familiar with this term. What's a PTS?

Irish Stones

Twoelles wrote: »

Is he ferral or just an outdoor cat? Have you thought about seeking a home for him where he cant go outside, pass on the diseases he has or catch other diseases? Its just a thought, but i recently found a home for a FIV positive cat who had lived 'rough' for years and he is now sooooo happy.

I started seeking a new home for him since he came in my garden, 15 months ago. A friend of mine was going to take him, but when I found out the cat was FIV positive he gave up because he has other cats in his home.
I posted several photos of the cat in vet clinics, pet supply shops, internet and so on, but I think that the major problem is that he's an adult cat and has so many troubles that people are scared to face with.
More, my request that the cat shouldn't be allowed outdoor cuts a lot of people away.
The only person that showed up to adopt him gave it up when she came to see him and saw him basking in the sun in my garden and felt sorry for him if she had taken him in her apartment...

EDIT: I forgot to answer yuor first question.
He's a stray cat, probably lost. He's very friendly and knows people and houses. So I think that he lost his way home or that his previous owners took him away from home to get rid of him. All the people and the vets who have met him say that they never saw a friendlier and more equilibrate cat before.

the_syco

Irish Stones wrote: »

I'm not familiar with this term. What's a PTS?

Put To Sleep, so Kitty goes to cat heaven via your local vet, to stop it spreading it's diseases to other cats.

Irish Stones

the_syco wrote: »

Put To Sleep, so Kitty goes to cat heaven via your local vet, to stop it spreading it's diseases to other cats.

That would be extremely cruel to him. It doesn't go around and spread his diseases, because there aren't other cats around and his attitude is very calm and friendly, he never attacks anybody.
More, local laws prohibit any euthanasia in pets that are not terminal or don't show any unbearable sufference. There's not vet here that could satisfy such a request, they could lose their license.

benchppress

Irish Stones wrote: »

That would be extremely cruel to him. It doesn't go around and spread his diseases, because there aren't other cats around and his attitude is very calm and friendly, he never attacks anybody.
More, local laws prohibit any euthanasia in pets that are not terminal or don't show any unbearable sufference. There's not vet here that could satisfy such a request, they could lose their license.

That would neither be cruel or inhumane. You have a cat that you can't isolate from other healthy or other sick cats. He has FIV, FeLV, Toxo, what else? He's a vector and a reservoir for illness, any vet with any sense would do the sensible thing here, in Italy or Ireland.

Twoelles

Irish Stones wrote: »

I started seeking a new home for him since he came in my garden, 15 months ago. A friend of mine was going to take him, but when I found out the cat was FIV positive he gave up because he has other cats in his home.
I posted several photos of the cat in vet clinics, pet supply shops, internet and so on, but I think that the major problem is that he's an adult cat and has so many troubles that people are scared to face with.
More, my request that the cat shouldn't be allowed outdoor cuts a lot of people away.
The only person that showed up to adopt him gave it up when she came to see him and saw him basking in the sun in my garden and felt sorry for him if she had taken him in her apartment...

EDIT: I forgot to answer yuor first question.
He's a stray cat, probably lost. He's very friendly and knows people and houses. So I think that he lost his way home or that his previous owners took him away from home to get rid of him. All the people and the vets who have met him say that they never saw a friendlier and more equilibrate cat before.

That is such a shame. Its so hard as most people dont understand that these cats can lead happy and normal lives just as long as they are looked after. Blue the FIV cat I was looking after had always been an outdoor cat but now he doesn't even attempt to go out so they can settle as indoor cats.

Are you still in Italy? maybe try contacting this rescue, they are based in the uk but have done some TNR in Italy recently and seem to be really well connected http://www.romneyhousecatrescue.org.uk/news/ and maybe contact the http://www.celiahammond.org they should have connections that might be able to help the cat.
The problem that you have is the cat is going to catch what ever is going around but you are an angel for looking after him/her

Irish Stones

benchppress wrote: »

That would neither be cruel or inhumane. You have a cat that you can't isolate from other healthy or other sick cats. He has FIV, FeLV, Toxo, what else? He's a vector and a reservoir for illness, any vet with any sense would do the sensible thing here, in Italy or Ireland.

Today at 6 pm I'll have to take the cat to the vet for a check on his toxo conditions.
I'll ask her if it's legal/moral/advisable to put to sleep a cat in this situation, and then I'll report her answer to this thread, though I'm pretty positive that she'll cry out if I'm crazy.

Irish Stones

Twoelles wrote: »

Are you still in Italy? maybe try contacting this rescue, they are based in the uk but have done some TNR in Italy recently and seem to be really well connected http://www.romneyhousecatrescue.org.uk/news/ and maybe contact the http://www.celiahammond.org they should have connections that might be able to help the cat.
The problem that you have is the cat is going to catch what ever is going around but you are an angel for looking after him/her

I'm Italian and live in Italy, I hope this isn't a problem in this forum
I visted those two websites, and they are simply amazing. The first one seems to have some connections to Italy, but it seems they are more focused on Sardinia and south Italy, where the problems with feral and stray cays are Problems with a capital "P"!!!
I am doing and I'll will do my best (and beyond, if I can) to ensure that this cat in my garden will have all he needs. But I'm not an angel, I'm just a person that's doing what the heart tells me to do.
I'm attaching a photo af this lovely cat. Could you tell that he's sick and need to be "PTS"?

kylith

benchppress wrote: »

That would neither be cruel or inhumane. You have a cat that you can't isolate from other healthy or other sick cats. He has FIV, FeLV, Toxo, what else? He's a vector and a reservoir for illness, any vet with any sense would do the sensible thing here, in Italy or Ireland.

This.

If the cat cannot be contained to a house or garden then it needs to be PTS as otherwise it will 1) spread FIV, FeLV and toxoplasmosis to other cats, other animals, or possibly even people 2) probably die a horrible death from an illness picked up because of its depressed immune system, which would be much crueler than having it PTS.

Twoelles

good luck at the vets

benchppress

Irish Stones wrote: »

Today at 6 pm I'll have to take the cat to the vet for a check on his toxo conditions.
I'll ask her if it's legal/moral/advisable to put to sleep a cat in this situation, and then I'll report her answer to this thread, though I'm pretty positive that she'll cry out if I'm crazy.

the cat is beautiful and looks healthy to me. I applaud you for being so nice to the cat but for me this isn't a matter of sentimentality but really a matter of public cat health. anyway, let us know what the vet says

the_syco

Any update?

Irish Stones

Coming now from the third vet
I'm late because I wanted to ask the same question to more than one vet, but the answer I got is the same for all the three of them.
They told me that the Toxo isn't the great problem, because the cat is not a menace anymore for other cats. The lapse of time during which a cat can be a threat to others is very narrow and at this phase of the disease he's absolutely harmless.
The results of the blood test will come in a few days, we'll be able to know if the therapy with antibiotics was effective.
About "putting him to sleep" because positive to FIV and FeLV they all told me that no vet with a minimum of conscience would do such a thing to a cat that has non symptoms, that is looking alright and still shows a great energy.
Euthanasia is taken in account when the animal is in visible sufference, has stopped eating, has lost much weight and has all the signs of a terminal phase of the disease.
Veterinarians deontological code forbids them to do this thing to a cat in a relative good health.
If the problem is the danger to other cats, they all told me that according this point of view more than 50% of cats should be killed in order to try to fight the diseases, and as a matter of fact nobody does this.

And the answer to the thread is that hedgehogs don't pass toxoplasmosis to cats

benchppress

Irish Stones wrote: »

Coming now from the third vet
I'm late because I wanted to ask the same question to more than one vet, but the answer I got is the same for all the three of them.
They told me that the Toxo isn't the great problem, because the cat is not a menace anymore for other cats. The lapse of time during which a cat can be a threat to others is very narrow and at this phase of the disease he's absolutely harmless.
The results of the blood test will come in a few days, we'll be able to know if the therapy with antibiotics was effective.
About "putting him to sleep" because positive to FIV and FeLV they all told me that no vet with a minimum of conscience would do such a thing to a cat that has non symptoms, that is looking alright and still shows a great energy.
Euthanasia is taken in account when the animal is in visible sufference, has stopped eating, has lost much weight and has all the signs of a terminal phase of the disease.
Veterinarians deontological code forbids them to do this thing to a cat in a relative good health.
If the problem is the danger to other cats, they all told me that according this point of view more than 50% of cats should be killed in order to try to fight the diseases, and as a matter of fact nobody does this.

And the answer to the thread is that hedgehogs don't pass toxoplasmosis to cats

Wow

Twoelles

Great news

benchppress

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PB_4bXC2Gag