Clubs and Socs giving more of their funding to ULSU

Polar Ice

I wasn't at the meeting so I'm not up to date on exactly what was said yet.
I know from the previous meeting, that numbers (or the lack of) and confusion relating to numbers was a point many people might have taken away with them.

reunion wrote: »

The article states 115k however this is not the case. The subvention is currently not given to c&s nor is it required to be given to c&s. So the money the SU is asking for is in the region of ~82k. Keep in mind we would also be paying ~18k to the SU regardless (used to 8% (~41k) now is 3.5% ~18k). This leaves the SU short 64k.

Now that the previous proposal has been rejected, if the SU were to make a new proposal they might consider making the number very clear. My interpretation of the previous proposal was not what you have said above.

reunion wrote: »

The SU is asking for this money, for this year only. Not a permanent change (though a similar budget would be suggested yearly).

Only asking for the money this year, and for many subsequent years too... :rolleyes:

reunion wrote: »

Charging C&S an additional 64k after the capitation split is cosmetic. Taking 64k before hand is little bit more transparent

X=X. It's the same amount of money. What was significant with the previous proposal was the SU were seeking to take money prior to the split of the entire capitation amount. C&S receive two thirds of the entire capitation. Taking money out before the split undermines the split.

When the money comes out doesn't impact transparency. What impacts transparency is the disclosure of information.

Stephen_Byrne

I think the SU in general should attempt to copy some of the fantastic inroads made by Roisin Monaghan with regards to Class Reps council. CRC now issue press releases, agendas and minutes to both ourselves (TST) and An Focal.

deise go deo

The general running cost of the SU is €174,000 in a year.

C&S traditionally paid a share of the SU's general running costs, Since Liz was hired, that contribution amountrd to about €17,500 in a year, or about 10% of the general running costs of the SU, the proposal put forward would have had the effect of raising the C&S contribution from 10% of the general running costs to 67%.

Had that budget been passed, the C&S contribution to paying the bill of €174,000 this year would have amounted to €116,000.
Personally I don't think that's fair, and i'm glad it has been rejected, C&S should be responsible for no more than 50% of that bill.

reunion

deise go deo wrote: »

The general running cost of the SU is €174,000 in a year.

...

Had that budget been passed, the C&S contribution to paying the bill of €174,000 this year would have amounted to €116,000.
Personally I don't think that's fair, and i'm glad it has been rejected, C&S should be responsible for no more than 50% of that bill.

The subvention (€35k) is currently not given to c&s nor is it required to be given to c&s. This means the €116k you state is actually ~€81k they are asking for. As we pay 3.5% of capitation to the SU ~€18k, this leaves the SU short ~€63k.

So the proposal was asking C&S to pay ~€81k to the SU of the ~€174k which is ~47% of the bill.

I do agree an increase from ~10% to ~47% is quite a steep jump and this should have been more gradual.

deise go deo

reunion wrote: »

The subvention (€35k) is currently not given to c&s nor is it required to be given to c&s. This means the €116k you state is actually ~€81k they are asking for. As we pay 3.5% of capitation to the SU ~€18k, this leaves the SU short ~€63k.

Sorry, I am failing to see why a subvention that is not given to C&S somehow reduced the €116,000 to €81,000.
Are you suggesting that all along it was not given to C&S but under the proposed budget it would be?

Just to be clear, Can you explain what you mean by subvention? If it is what I think it is, then as far as I am aware C&S always recieved its portion of it.
Also, the C&S portion of subvention as marked in the budget proposed was not €35,000.

reunion

deise go deo wrote: »

Just to be clear, Can you explain what you mean by subvention? If it is what I think it is, then as far as I am aware C&S always recieved its portion of it.
Also, the C&S portion of subvention as marked in the budget proposed was not €35,000.

I was told that this subvention was given to the SU for leaving wired fm.

C&S have never seen a penny from this, ever. Philips proposal was to split that 1 third : 2 thirds as the SU would have been asking for a huge amount.

I recommend anyone either goes and talks to Philip about this or email him, as he requested at the council meeting 2 weeks ago.

deise go deo wrote: »

Sorry, I am failing to see why a subvention that is not given to C&S somehow reduced the €116,000 to €81,000.
Are you suggesting that all along it was not given to C&S but under the proposed budget it would be?

The amount C&S are paying of the 174k (as pointed out at the council meeting) is equal to 1/3rd of the 174k. which amounts to €115k. The subvention money currently goes directly to the SU but they are offering to split it. If they do not split it, the SU can then cover roughly 95k of the general operating costs (59k +35k from subvention). This leaves roughly 80k left over which the SU would like C&S to pay for. This amounts to 3.5% (~18k) of capitation and the 60k in our agreement last year which we could give.

However should that 60k be gifted over, the terms have already been created. This allows us to see a profit from the shop only in 4 years time, at best.

The motion last night would have allowed C&S to argue for 2/3rds of any additional income not presented in the budget to be given to C&S. Something which Philip and Adam were positive towards at the C&S exec meeting (While not agreeing to this they did say that a working group between C&S and Student Council to set a road map on how future money would be split).

C&S Exec meet just before the C&S council meetings

Jester252

How are C&S going to be getting money from the shop now?
Can anyone just give a round figure for what the SU is asking from C&S and how much that would reduce C&S available money

Polar Ice

Jester252 wrote: »

Can anyone just give a round figure for what the SU is asking from C&S and how much that would reduce C&S available money

Nothing at the moment since the previous proposal was rejected.
We can wait and see what new item will arrive on (or below) the table for consideration.

deise go deo

reunion wrote: »

The amount C&S are paying of the 174k (as pointed out at the council meeting) is equal to 1/3rd of the 174k. which amounts to €115k. The subvention money currently goes directly to the SU but they are offering to split it. If they do not split it, the SU can then cover roughly 95k of the general operating costs (59k +35k from subvention). This leaves roughly 80k left over which the SU would like C&S to pay for. This amounts to 3.5% (~18k) of capitation and the 60k in our agreement last year which we could give.

This was not the proposal that was brought to C&S council. In the proposed budget the general running costs were to be taken out prior to the 2/3 - 1/3 split.
Ie the bill of €174,000 for the Union's general running costs would be paid by 58,000 that would otherwise have gone to the representative function and €116,000 that would have otherwise gone to C&S.

That was definatly the proposal put forward last night.


There was no offer at C&S council to use a subvention of €35,000 to increase the proportion of the gereral costs paid by the representative function. Clearly in the budget proposed, that cost was to be paid before any split in capitation between the representative function and C&S, there was no mention in the proposed butget of a subvention of any amount having anything to do with paying the Gerneral running costs of the SU.

You say that the subvention of 35,000 has never had anything to do with C&S and is a result of the Union leaving Wired FM.
I'v had a look over the minutes of the C&S meeting before last, where this proposal was first discussed, they don't seem to support you. They say: ''The ULSU also recieves a subvention from the University and that is devided 2/3 C&S, 1/3 SU Representation''

Who told you about the subvention? It seems there is some confusion as to what it relates to.

If I have time tomorrow I will see about dropping into Philip to talk to him about it.

The motion last night would have allowed C&S to argue for 2/3rds of any additional income not presented in the budget to be given to C&S. Something which Philip and Adam were positive towards at the C&S exec meeting (While not agreeing to this they did say that a working group between C&S and Student Council to set a road map on how future money would be split).

The only motion presented last night was the proposed budget, this as far as I am aware contained no provisions for what would happen to monies not presented in the budget.

The only mention of monies not presented in the budget at C&S council I am aware of was in relation to income from the shop, to which Philip said that it would be up to Class reps council and C&S council to decide what to do with it.
There may have been discussions before C&S council, but I was personally unaware of them, and I do not recall any such provisions being mentioned as part of the discussions last night.

spacemunter

I wonder if there will be another budget proposal this week.

The lads running www.ulsuelect.com have really left that student's union general manager fella looking like he cant do his job. (although he seems to do a good enough job of that himself according to the minutes)

He is gonna have to pull out all the stops this week to convince people otherwise.