199 different nationalities now in Ireland

diddley

Solair wrote: »

What's that got to do with national identity? That's a cultural / religious misunderstanding. It's nothing to do with one person being Swedish and the other not being Swedish. It's just weird sexism or something. What needs to be worked out is how to not conflate someone being a complete sexist with national identity.

Refusing to shake someone's hand is insulting. There's really no justification for that end of story.

Are national identity and culture not intertwined? It's weird sexism to YOU. It's also not justified in YOUR eyes. By you making those statements, you've proved my point about how a clash can occur. The man in the article obviously doesn't share your views and probably doesn't see that behaviour as insulting.

Solair

diddley wrote: »

Are national identity and culture not intertwined? It's weird sexism to YOU. It's also not justified in YOUR eyes. By you making those statements, you've proved my point about how a clash can occur. The man in the article obviously doesn't share your views and probably doesn't see that behaviour as insulting.

National identity and cultural identity are only as intertwined as someone's prepared to make them.

If you're a radical religious fundamentalist trying to hammer home some bizarre religious notion, or if you're a xenophobe trying to ram home that everyone from nationality X thinks this way, then off course you'll conflate the two because it's convenient and suits a particular agenda.

We saw how nasty and divisive it was in Ireland when national identity was conflated with religious identity in both the Republic and the North i.e. people deliberately mixing up Irish nationalism and catholic fundamentalism and Unionism and Protestant fundamentalism.

I'm not even going to enter a debate on that, but I think we all know the consequences were not good in the North or in the Republic over the decades.

As I see it anyway, it's very important to breakdown that notion.

What's being outlined is a clash between a culture of secular liberal democracy and a notion that someone wants to push in theocratic laws into that.

I mean, you could meet someone from Iran who was an absolutely progressive secularist who was pro-women's rights and very liberal and you could meet someone from a Western country who was some kind of religious fundamentalist who comes out with comments about how Evolution is all a bunch of lies (as per that US politician a few days ago).

That's why I think we need to be VERY careful about generalising about whole national identities! Just because you're from X does not necessarily mean anything in terms of your world view.

This is exactly why I think, for example, Ireland's blasphemy laws were ridiculous and dangerous. We actually put legislation down undermining our own liberal democracy!? Pure idiocy!

Nodin

jugger0 wrote: »

Yes but the people who make up the Irish race, normans,vikings,anglo saxons etc have, bar the boys up the north, integrated successfully, Looking at the UK and other European countries Muslims haven't integrated.

So now we have somebody who is confusing ethnicity, culture and religion. Well done sir.

Gurgle

Nodin wrote: »

So now we have somebody who is confusing ethnicity, culture and religion. Well done sir.

I think you'll find ethnicity, culture and religion are all major factors in peoples' classification of 'we' and 'they'.

Nodin

Gurgle wrote: »

I think you'll find ethnicity, culture and religion are all major factors in peoples' classification of 'we' and 'they'.

You'll also find its possible to be an Irish muslim, British catholic etc.

Gurgle

Nodin wrote: »

You'll also find its possible to be an Irish muslim, British catholic etc.

I think it was Patrick Monaghan's gag:

My father is Irish, my mother is Iranian. I grew up in England in the '80s. We used to go on holidays to Heathrow, we never got any further.

Paraphrasing, from memory, may not have even been him. Dunno what religion he is either.

diddley

Solair wrote: »

National identity and cultural identity are only as intertwined as someone's prepared to make them.

If you're a radical religious fundamentalist trying to hammer home some bizarre religious notion, or if you're a xenophobe trying to ram home that everyone from nationality X thinks this way, then off course you'll conflate the two because it's convenient and suits a particular agenda.

We saw how nasty and divisive it was in Ireland when national identity was conflated with religious identity in both the Republic and the North i.e. people deliberately mixing up Irish nationalism and catholic fundamentalism and Unionism and Protestant fundamentalism.

I'm not even going to enter a debate on that, but I think we all know the consequences were not good in the North or in the Republic over the decades.

As I see it anyway, it's very important to breakdown that notion.

What's being outlined is a clash between a culture of secular liberal democracy and a notion that someone wants to push in theocratic laws into that.

I mean, you could meet someone from Iran who was an absolutely progressive secularist who was pro-women's rights and very liberal and you could meet someone from a Western country who was some kind of religious fundamentalist who comes out with comments about how Evolution is all a bunch of lies (as per that US politician a few days ago).

That's why I think we need to be VERY careful about generalising about whole national identities! Just because you're from X does not necessarily mean anything in terms of your world view.

This is exactly why I think, for example, Ireland's blasphemy laws were ridiculous and dangerous. We actually put legislation down undermining our own liberal democracy!? Pure idiocy!

You've said a whole lot there, which, although nice and interesting and all, is not really relevant to my original point. You say it's dangerous to conflate religious identity and national identity with reference to Northern Ireland. Then you'll be glad to scroll back and read where I said that national identity and religious identity can indeed clash, and I think I provided an adequate source for that. You'll forgive me next time if I don't reply to a whole lot of nothing to do with what I wanted to discuss.

Also I don't understand your point about being' VERY careful about generalising about whole national identities!'. National identities are just that, a generalisation of a group of people. Have we become so overwhelmingly sensitive about generalising that we can no longer use terms such as 'national identity' 'culture' or even 'religion'. Maybe so as not to offend in future we will all discuss things only in terms of individuals. Thanks for the discussion but I'm weary now, and out. Peace.

Nodin

diddley wrote: »

Really? You can't think of any way in which religious identity and national identity can clash given the diverse populations in the world? I don't think you've thought about that too much. Here's just one example, Swedish woman is CEO of company, meets Muslim job applicant who refuses to shake her hand: http://www.stockholmnews.com/more.aspx?NID=4787

Alas, its not just a muslim thing....

Belgium’s health minister said she was “profoundly troubled” by the behavior of her Israeli counterpart, Yaakov Litzman, after the haredi Orthodox minister refused to shake her hand at a conference.

http://www.haaretz.com/news/diplomacy-defense/belgian-health-minister-irked-by-israel-deputy-minister-s-refusal-to-shake-hands-1.432280

Ghost Buster

jugger0 wrote: »

Yes but the people who make up the Irish race, normans,vikings,anglo saxons etc have, bar the boys up the north, integrated successfully, Looking at the UK and other European countries Muslims haven't integrated.

Hmmm. Did The Normans, Vikings, Saxons, landed British and Scottish gentry etc integrate with ease of only after prolonged periods of warfare, plundering, raping and pillaging?
Thats a rhetorical question BTW.
I hope you dont count a Polish or Nigerian getting your prized job mopping the toilets in Supervalu as being as traumatic an integration as the Viking integration;)

Nodin

Ghost Buster wrote: »

Hmmm. Did The Normans, Vikings, Saxons, landed British and Scottish gentry etc integrate with ease of only after prolonged periods of warfare, plundering, raping and pillaging?
Thats a rhetorical question BTW.
I hope you dont count a Polish or Nigerian getting your prized job mopping the toilets in Supervalu as being as traumatic an integration as the Viking integration;)

And in fairness if you tried handing a viking a mop and pointing him towards the jacks, he probably wouldn't respond in as civil a manner.....

Ghost Buster

Nodin wrote: »

And in fairness if you tried handing a viking a mop and pointing him towards the jacks, he probably wouldn't respond in as civil a manner.....

Bloody Swedes, come over here, sacking our monasteries, adding height and blondness to our gene pool, selling fashionable flat pack furniture and taking our jobs..... Not to mention their funny religion with that chap with the hammer and all the lightning.... you know the fellah from The Avengers Movie...

Nodin

Ghost Buster wrote: »

Bloody Swedes, come over here, sacking our monasteries, adding height and blondness to our gene pool, selling fashionable flat pack furniture and taking our jobs..... Not to mention their funny religion with that chap with the hammer and all the lightning.... you know the fellah from The Avengers Movie...

Aye. The wimmin think he's sexy. "What about oul Crom" you might say. "Sure hes as fat as you" they say back. Terrible stuff.

Peregrine

Okay can someone check the census and tell me how many Muslims there actually are in Ireland? (I'm on mobile)
Because most of the non EU citizens I've met, including myself is Christian.
UK is a totally different story

jugger0

Ye're gonna love this lads.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Lb8SLNMIBlM

old hippy

Sappa wrote: »

Good luck with that,seriously the Japanese do not like foreigners integrating and would rather you did not speak any Japanese.
They are very much about there own culture and preserving it's identity.
You should know this being married to a Japanese lady or may e you haven't spent too much time there.
I worked in Japan and spoke with expats living there 20+ years who said they are still treated as just a foreigner and society will never take to you 100 % even if you speak perfect Japanese.
Look at the cases in Japan where American service men knock up a local lady that kid is shunned by Japanese people as being not one of them even though the mother is a native.
I would do some research on this first old hippy Japan is not as it seems.

Our friend's daughter is half Japanese and half Kenyan. She doesn't meet with that kind of predjudice. I've been to Japan many times and have studied the culture since I could read.

I'm not blind to the country's negative aspects, by any means. But pig headed ignorance is sadly rampant in every country. Just read the posts here to give you an idea.

AnonoBoy

jugger0 wrote: »

Ye're gonna love this lads.

Sure who'd listen to a bunch of f*ckin' Frenchies anyways? :pac:

old hippy

jugger0 wrote: »

Ye're gonna love this lads.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Lb8SLNMIBlM

Coming from a Stormfront refugee like your good self, I seriously doubt it.

Good luck with keeping Ireland white, a chara :rolleyes:

jugger0

old hippy wrote: »

Coming from a Stormfront refugee like your good self, I seriously doubt it.

Good luck with keeping Ireland white, a chara :rolleyes:

Good luck with molting into a Japanese man white boy!

old hippy

jugger0 wrote: »

Good luck with molting into a Japanese man white boy!

Good luck posting your racist garbage, O ignorant one :rolleyes:

And said I was white?

A Primal Nut

Was looking up the FIFA world rankings as that's the only list of countries I trust.

They don't include Ireland in the list of nationals in Ireland.

Some of the countries we don't have are:

North Korea; Turks and Caicos Islands, Muaritania; Cook Islands; British Virgin Islands; Montserrat.

South Sudan is not there but I'd say Sudan includes both Sudan and South Sudan.

hooradiation

Ghost Buster wrote: »

Bloody Swedes, come over here, sacking our monasteries, adding height and blondness to our gene pool, selling fashionable flat pack furniture and taking our jobs..... Not to mention their funny religion with that chap with the hammer and all the lightning.... you know the fellah from The Avengers Movie...

Tony Stark is a lot of things, but he's no god.

Solair

diddley wrote: »

You've said a whole lot there, which, although nice and interesting and all, is not really relevant to my original point. You say it's dangerous to conflate religious identity and national identity with reference to Northern Ireland. Then you'll be glad to scroll back and read where I said that national identity and religious identity can indeed clash, and I think I provided an adequate source for that. You'll forgive me next time if I don't reply to a whole lot of nothing to do with what I wanted to discuss.

Also I don't understand your point about being' VERY careful about generalising about whole national identities!'. National identities are just that, a generalisation of a group of people. Have we become so overwhelmingly sensitive about generalising that we can no longer use terms such as 'national identity' 'culture' or even 'religion'. Maybe so as not to offend in future we will all discuss things only in terms of individuals. Thanks for the discussion but I'm weary now, and out. Peace.

There's nothing compelling you to reply. It's a discussion board, not a two-way conversation!

However, thanks for your nice sarcastic, cutting, reply!

(((Grumbles, mumbles stuff under breath and generalises about people)))

Higher

Clareboy wrote: »

So our hospitals are full of foreign doctors and nurses, while at the same time Irish doctors and nurses have to emigrate to find work. That makes a lot of sense!

You're seriously telling me that you would prefer a less qualified surgeon operating on you simply because he or she was Irish?

If foreign doctors and nurses are employed over Irish its because they are better which is a good thing.

Immigration breeds competition for work that ensures that the economy is competitive. The only people who seem to take issue with legitimate immigration are people who can't compete.

I've said it before, Irish who can't find jobs just aren't good enough or dont want to do certain jobs. Theres minimum wage jobs EVERYWHERE. I've never gone past a dominos take-away window that didn't say 'drivers wanted', I always see advertisements for waiters in restaurant windows and chugger organizations are ALWAYS hiring

Peregrine

Just to clarify, only 0.76% of Ireland is Muslim and around another 1.3% in "Other" which I imagine would be Judaism, Hinduism etc. and even cults like Scientology, Palmarianism and so on
The rest belong to either some denomination of Christianity or Atheism
No real threat of foreign extremism :rolleyes:

Solair

Well, I sincerely hope that Irish people are sensible enough to see the cause of our economic woes - inadequate regulation, crazy banking practices, speculation and poor governance not immigration!

Good luck to anyone who can make it here and make a living as to be quite honest we desperately need new blood. Part of the problem in Ireland is that it's all 2 degrees of separation. Everyone knows everyone else somehow.

We suffered a lot from a group think mentality at many levels.

Look at the breath of fresh air in economic thinking from an immigrant like Constantine Gurdiev (Russian) who had consistently held the establishment to account for years! He's prepared to be a lot more patriotic than the bunch of Yes Men who haunted the airwaves during the boom.

The financial regulation agencies have also been restocked somewhat with non Irish experts because they are able to look at things in a totally different light to locals!

Same goes for many others, moved here, rolled up their sleeves and got stuck in!

There are loads of very innovative immigrants here who are making more than just a go of it and are having a very positive impact on Ireland on general.


Frankly, I'd much rather live in modern multicultural Ireland than a monocultural, conservative, backwater!

Clareboy

Higher wrote: »

You're seriously telling me that you would prefer a less qualified surgeon operating on you simply because he or she was Irish?

If foreign doctors and nurses are employed over Irish its because they are better which is a good thing.

Immigration breeds competition for work that ensures that the economy is competitive. The only people who seem to take issue with legitimate immigration are people who can't compete.

I've said it before, Irish who can't find jobs just aren't good enough or dont want to do certain jobs. Theres minimum wage jobs EVERYWHERE. I've never gone past a dominos take-away window that didn't say 'drivers wanted', I always see advertisements for waiters in restaurant windows and chugger organizations are ALWAYS hiring

So foreign doctors and nurses are better than Irish ones and the Irish are not good enough to work as pizza delivery drivers or waiters. How did we ever survive as a nation before all the immigrants arrived?

Ghost Buster

Clareboy wrote: »

So foreign doctors and nurses are better than Irish ones and the Irish are not good enough to work as pizza delivery drivers or waiters. How did we ever survive as a nation before all the immigrants arrived?

Look up the meaning of the word 'if' and it may stop you reading things into posts which are not there.

old hippy

Clareboy wrote: »

So foreign doctors and nurses are better than Irish ones and the Irish are not good enough to work as pizza delivery drivers or waiters. How did we ever survive as a nation before all the immigrants arrived?

Why, we had the likes of you - protecting us from the foreign hordes
:rolleyes:

old hippy

old hippy wrote: »

Our friend's daughter is half Japanese and half Kenyan. She doesn't meet with that kind of predjudice. I've been to Japan many times and have studied the culture since I could read.

I'm not blind to the country's negative aspects, by any means. But pig headed ignorance is sadly rampant in every country. Just read the posts here to give you an idea.

I'd say.

As a gaijin try going into some Japanese nightclub's or restaurants and see what happens.

old hippy

Zackary Magnificent Sentry wrote: »

I'd say.

As a gaijin try going into some Japanese nightclub's or restaurants and see what happens.

Um, the only nightclub or restaurant I've been refused in Japan was run by gaijin - in Okinawa.

Nice effort; try again

jfallon

A very interesting point was made earlier regarding when exactly do we draw the line with regards to Immigration, In the past 12yrs almost 500,000 immigrants have joined us here in Ireland placing a massive strain on our health, education and housing budgets. Immigration can greatly benefit an area if it's regulated properly, if it's not controlled it can be disastrous.. Akin to putting too many people into an already sinking boat.
So my question for the far left posters is this - How many immigrants is too many? Should we have a cap or should just have an open door policy? Should someone wishing to immigrate to Ireland meet any skills, education or other requirements?
There are approx 1.5 Billion people in this world who are living in what as defined as absolute poverty, The world bank defines this as people who live on less than $1 per day. A lot if not all of these people would sacrifice their first born to even have half of the opportunities and living standards that we enjoy in Ireland, I've been to a lot of 3rd world countries and witnessed this poverty first hand, I would love if we could help them all but the reality is we can't! We in Ireland do a lot for 3rd world poverty through charities and government aid but we must also look after our own people first and foremost!
@old hippy, you're username is quite apt!

Ghost Buster

jfallon wrote: »

A very interesting point was made earlier regarding when exactly do we draw the line with regards to Immigration, In the past 12yrs almost 500,000 immigrants have joined us here in Ireland placing a massive strain on our health, education and housing budgets. Immigration can greatly benefit an area if it's regulated properly, if it's not controlled it can be disastrous.. Akin to putting too many people into an already sinking boat.
So my question for the far left posters is this - How many immigrants is too many? Should we have a cap or should just have an open door policy? Should someone wishing to immigrate to Ireland meet any skills, education or other requirements?
There are approx 1.5 Billion people in this world who are living in what as defined as absolute poverty, The world bank defines this as people who live on less than $1 per day. A lot if not all of these people would sacrifice their first born to even have half of the opportunities and living standards that we enjoy in Ireland, I've been to a lot of 3rd world countries and witnessed this poverty first hand, I would love if we could help them all but the reality is we can't! We in Ireland do a lot for 3rd world poverty through charities and government aid but we must also look after our own people first and foremost!
@old hippy, you're username is quite apt!

I do see some sense in what you say and the Australian model is good. So long as you have resources, skills, a job to go to and a clean criminal record then come on in. I cant speak for old hippy but the posts i object to here are the xenophobic/ aryian /lets keep ireland irish crap. You just know that but for the charter these guys would be typing 'nigggar' and 'paki'

Crann na Beatha

This post has been deleted.

jfallon

Phoenix wrote: »

The sooner we adopt the Canadian approach to immigration the better!

Now that's what I'm talking aboot!:)

Peregrine

Phoenix wrote: »

The sooner we adopt the Canadian approach to immigration the better!

Define this "Canadian approach"

Sappa

old hippy wrote: »

Sappa wrote: »

Good luck with that,seriously the Japanese do not like foreigners integrating and would rather you did not speak any Japanese.
They are very much about there own culture and preserving it's identity.
You should know this being married to a Japanese lady or may e you haven't spent too much time there.
I worked in Japan and spoke with expats living there 20+ years who said they are still treated as just a foreigner and society will never take to you 100 % even if you speak perfect Japanese.
Look at the cases in Japan where American service men knock up a local lady that kid is shunned by Japanese people as being not one of them even though the mother is a native.
I would do some research on this first old hippy Japan is not as it seems.

Our friend's daughter is half Japanese and half Kenyan. She doesn't meet with that kind of predjudice. I've been to Japan many times and have studied the culture since I could read.

I'm not blind to the country's negative aspects, by any means. But pig headed ignorance is sadly rampant in every country. Just read the posts here to give you an idea.

It's well known that this prejudice exists,you could live in Japan for 50 years but your still a foreigner in their eyes and many practices and customs are hidden from non Japanese.
I have to say while there are many things I like about Japan it really is a complex society full of idiosyncratic mannerisms but also with old school prejudices prevalent in all aspects of life there.
This is not just solely common to Japan but South Korea to an extent is very similar in attitude to foreigner nationals.
I am glad to hear your half Japanese friend has not been subject to these such prejudices but I have witnessed it on several occasions with American mix raced acquaintences while I was in Japan.

Crann na Beatha

This post has been deleted.

Nodin

jfallon wrote: »

A very interesting point was made earlier regarding when exactly do we draw the line with regards to Immigration, In the past 12yrs almost 500,000 (......)we must also look after our own people first and foremost!
@old hippy, you're username is quite apt!

The vast and overwhelming majority of those are from the EU and are allowed free movement, so why you drag in the third world somewhat escapes me.

MadsL

old hippy wrote: »

Nodin, surely?

Shhh! That fact is only revealed to levels higher than Initiate.

jugger0 wrote: »

Is it racist to want to keep Ireland Irish? And indeed Europe European?

Bit late for that, unless you plan to expel anyone of Norman, Saxon, Welsh, Scottish or Spanish bloodline.
I'm also guessing you probably couldn't colour in "Europe" correctly on a blank map.

jugger0 wrote: »

81% of British Muslims consider themselves Muslims before British, thats pretty bad!

What do 2nd generation Irish living in the UK call themselves I wonder?

Clareboy wrote: »

So our hospitals are full of foreign doctors and nurses, while at the same time Irish doctors and nurses have to emigrate to find work. That makes a lot of sense! !

You probably wouldn't want to run Irish medical schools without foreign students fees.

Tchaikovsky

Phoenix wrote: »

A progressive,understanding approach of how immigration can produce long-term benefits and gains for the Canadian economy.

Canada is what, forty times bigger than Ireland? With a plethora of natural resources and with a very small percentage of native people (aka those who were there before the 1600s)

K-9

Tchaikovsky wrote: »

Canada is what, forty times bigger than Ireland? With a plethora of natural resources and with a very small percentage of native people (aka those who were there before the 1600s)

Peregrine

Phoenix wrote: »

Nimrod 7 wrote: »

Define this "Canadian approach"

A progressive,understanding approach of how immigration can produce long-term benefits and gains for the Canadian economy.

Fact of the matter is, you cannot control immigration from EU states no matter how much you want to nor can you deport the redundant

Majority of immigrants from Asia were brought here on a work visa when there was a genuine need for them (i.e. They didn't just decide to pack their bags and move here). Long term benefits were considered but sure weren't we all surprised when the Irish economy slumped into this recession?

People saying "time to turn off the taps", they're closed. But EU is like a wider country, it allows free movement of it's people, nothing you can do about that.

The chances are, if we had a census in 2013 that 500,000 would be still around 500,000 no change and if it does increase(doubt it), it should be from EU countries

old hippy

Sappa wrote: »

It's well known that this prejudice exists,you could live in Japan for 50 years but your still a foreigner in their eyes and many practices and customs are hidden from non Japanese.
I have to say while there are many things I like about Japan it really is a complex society full of idiosyncratic mannerisms but also with old school prejudices prevalent in all aspects of life there.
This is not just solely common to Japan but South Korea to an extent is very similar in attitude to foreigner nationals.
I am glad to hear your half Japanese friend has not been subject to these such prejudices but I have witnessed it on several occasions with American mix raced acquaintences while I was in Japan.

I'm not saying it doesn't exist. My wife's grandmother was, by all accounts, not favourable towards Americans. I dread to think of what she would have made of my grandfather, who fought against the Japanese in Okinawa

I have experienced one or two incidents in East Asia (Japan, Korea, Taiwan) but not so much as to make me condemn the peoples of these countries. Elsewhere on boards, I'm pretty sure I mentioned they mayor of one Japanese city who has/had a habit of appealing to the lowest common denominator voters by stating that us foreigners brought in disease, crime and violence. Sounds depressingly familiar, eh?

In the meantime, let those who wish to try and denigrate someone's retirement dream continue to their hearts content. I know of plenty of people who wish to come to Ireland and retire; why would I spoil their dreams?

I will say though, I am slightly wary of posts calling for Ireland to be kept "white" and do wonder what kind of poster these threads attract. Overall, though, such posters epitomise the far right & why their vile ways will never catch on. Reading these posts confirms their all too evident achilles heel - misinformed, misanthropic and mutton headed.

It's all about education. I can't stress that enough.

Sappa

old hippy wrote: »

Sappa wrote: »

It's well known that this prejudice exists,you could live in Japan for 50 years but your still a foreigner in their eyes and many practices and customs are hidden from non Japanese.
I have to say while there are many things I like about Japan it really is a complex society full of idiosyncratic mannerisms but also with old school prejudices prevalent in all aspects of life there.
This is not just solely common to Japan but South Korea to an extent is very similar in attitude to foreigner nationals.
I am glad to hear your half Japanese friend has not been subject to these such prejudices but I have witnessed it on several occasions with American mix raced acquaintences while I was in Japan.

I'm not saying it doesn't exist. My wife's grandmother was, by all accounts, not favourable towards Americans. I dread to think of what she would have made of my grandfather, who fought against the Japanese in Okinawa

I have experienced one or two incidents in East Asia (Japan, Korea, Taiwan) but not so much as to make me condemn the peoples of these countries. Elsewhere on boards, I'm pretty sure I mentioned they mayor of one Japanese city who has/had a habit of appealing to the lowest common denominator voters by stating that us foreigners brought in disease, crime and violence. Sounds depressingly familiar, eh?

In the meantime, let those who wish to try and denigrate someone's retirement dream continue to their hearts content. I know of plenty of people who wish to come to Ireland and retire; why would I spoil their dreams?

I will say though, I am slightly wary of posts calling for Ireland to be kept "white" and do wonder what kind of poster these threads attract. Overall, though, such posters epitomise the far right & why their vile ways will never catch on. Reading these posts confirms their all too evident achilles heel - misinformed, misanthropic and mutton headed.

It's all about education. I can't stress that enough.

Not trying to knock your retirement plans at all just sending words of caution that it's no utopia over there.
Although I do see myself living in Asia again in a couple of years and if I am lucky enough to reach retirement then it is always an option to build our home there but appealing and all as it is I am well aware of the negatives.
My other half is Asian and I just ignore these nut jobs calling for a White society as she clearly is not White and they probably see me as mixing with there enemy but stuff them.
What info find as a general rule in Asia as opposed to Ireland/Europe is at present the amount of negativity here compared to there with attitudes and outlook,it's a breath of fresh air when we visit each year.

Herb Powell

jfallon wrote: »

A very interesting point was made earlier regarding when exactly do we draw the line with regards to Immigration, In the past 12yrs almost 500,000 immigrants have joined us here in Ireland placing a massive strain on our health, education and housing budgets. Immigration can greatly benefit an area if it's regulated properly, if it's not controlled it can be disastrous.. Akin to putting too many people into an already sinking boat.

It's a point, but not a very good point, because it assumes that none of the immigrants are employed or paying taxes. Which anyone with a bit of cop on would know is utter bolloccks

not yet

Herb Powell wrote: »

It's a point, but not a very good point, because it assumes that none of the immigrants are employed or paying taxes. Which anyone with a bit of cop on would know is utter bolloccks

It may be utter boollocks as you call it but we still have 100,000 non Irish nationals on the dole.I'm well aware they paid their tax's etc etc but how long should they receive this dole ? when their stamps run out do people feel they are still entitled to Job seekers allowance etc.

Can anybody please explain to me the reason so many non European nationals are here taking minimum wage jobs. I'm asking a serious question and don't need to lazy answer of didn't we go everywhere etc.

MadsL

not yet wrote: »

It may be utter boollocks as you call it but we still have 100,000 non Irish nationals on the dole.I'm well aware they paid their tax's etc etc but how long should they receive this dole ? when their stamps run out do people feel they are still entitled to Job seekers allowance etc.

Can anybody please explain to me the reason so many non European nationals are here taking minimum wage jobs. I'm asking a serious question and don't need to lazy answer of didn't we go everywhere etc.

100k non-Irish nationals with the right to live and work here. Just as millions of Irish have the right to up sticks and go work in Germany.

Are you proposing that numbers should be adjusted according to how well the economy is doing? Each time we take a dip, round up another 10,000 random non Europeans and kick them out? Their employers and spouses might have something to say about that.

not yet

MadsL wrote: »

100k non-Irish nationals with the right to live and work here. Just as millions of Irish have the right to up sticks and go work in Germany.

Are you proposing that numbers should be adjusted according to how well the economy is doing? Each time we take a dip, round up another 10,000 random non Europeans and kick them out? Their employers and spouses might have something to say about that.

No, but what I am saying is as a small country on the edge of Europe, going trough the worst recession in living memory we need to stop issuing pps numbers to 1000s of non Europeans each year.

I think It's incredible that 1000s of Pakistanis enter this country each year to work in jobs when They come here on student visas.

Pherekydes

not yet wrote: »

I think It's incredible that 1000s of Pakistanis enter this country each year to work in jobs when They come here on student visas.

According to the CSO, the number of Pakistanis living in Ireland increased from 2,939 in 2002 to 6,847 in 2011, a net increase of 3,908, which equates to less than a 500 per year increase. So where are these thousands each year you speak of?

not yet

Pherekydes wrote: »

According to the CSO, the number of Pakistanis living in Ireland increased from 2,939 in 2002 to 6,847 in 2011, a net increase of 3,908, which equates to less than a 500 per year increase. So where are these thousands each year you speak of?

A quick check shows me in 2011 795 were issued, even allowing that figure as a point of reference do you believe this is acceptable whilst 20-28 year old's cannot find work.