Republic of Ireland v Germany - 12/10/2012 - 19:45 - RTE2/SS2

Father Damo

LuckyLloyd wrote: »

Hoping we kick them off the pitch and sneak an undeserved win. One time!

You woluld really want to get rid of "The Voice of Reason" title under your username :pac:

Seriously though. We are playing Germany, one of the finest, if maybe underachieving, squads of the last 20 years, and you see names like McShane, O Dea and Whelan in the line up, it is just not funny.

I reckon this will be the first time in the Trap era (to my knowledge) that we hear booing at the end. The good grace of singing away in defeat vs Spain, the time has passed, a woeful performance on Friday will mean it is time for the lads in the crowd to be vocal. Trap has to go.

If we go backs to the wall, a sloppy one nil to Germany. If we concede early it will be a cricket score, we will fall apart.

LuckyLloyd

El Spearo wrote: »

LuckyLloyd wrote: »

Hoping we kick them off the pitch and sneak an undeserved win. One time!

even the most ambitious of us LFC fans can't possibly hold any hope?

This is Ireland in Landsdowne Road. We haven't been beaten by two clear goals in a home qualifier since 1995.

Those predicting a hammering are crazy. We don't get hammered in these scenarios. We absolutely have a chance imo.

Banjaxed82

LuckyLloyd wrote: »

This is Ireland in Landsdowne Road. We haven't been beaten by two clear goals in a home qualifier since 1995.

Those predicting a hammering are crazy. We don't get hammered in these scenarios. We absolutely have a chance imo.

I agree more than likely we'll get hammered to death 2 or 3 nil at most. On the other hand, this is the worst performing Irish team, with the worst first 11 and the worst morale level in years. I wouldn't doubt a demolition if everything goes tits up.

helimachoptor

2-0 against one of the best teams in the world is not a hammering

Banjaxed82

helimachoptor wrote: »

2-0 against one of the best teams in the world is not a hammering

A hammering in all but goals is what I meant.

applehunter

LuckyLloyd wrote: »

This is Ireland in Landsdowne Road. We haven't been beaten by two clear goals in a home qualifier since 1995.

Those predicting a hammering are crazy. We don't get hammered in these scenarios. We absolutely have a chance imo.

Russia hammered us in 2010 and we are not as strong now as we were then.

Germany are a superior side to Russia.

TaosHum

sugarman wrote: »

applehunter wrote: »

LuckyLloyd wrote: »

This is Ireland in Landsdowne Road. We haven't been beaten by two clear goals in a home qualifier since 1995.

Those predicting a hammering are crazy. We don't get hammered in these scenarios. We absolutely have a chance imo.

Russia hammered us in 2010 and we are not as strong now as we were then.

Germany are a superior side to Russia.

3-2 is barley a hammering now! Yes, they played us off the field, but a hammering?

4/5-0 is a hammering.

They were 3 nil up and then got complacent. If Germany go 3 up dont expect them to relax like Russia did.

ionadnapokot

Clark called up for Ireland
http://http://www.irishtimes.com/sports/soccer/2012/1008/1224325038014.html

Mikeyt086

Was having a chat with a German friend about the game and he asked me who I was worried about. I said:

Absolutely terrified: Marco Reus, Ozil, Khedira, Gomez and Goetze if he plays.
Worried about: Neuer being too good, Hummels, Boateng, Lahm, Schwienstieger, all of the bench.

I asked him who he was worried about. He said:

"Duff is doing good for Fulham."

klose

That's the biggest troll face I've ever seen!

I always watch Ireland games and go in with high hopes but we're in for a serious lesson here as Germany don't hold back, didn't they beat some country 11or 13 nil a few years back In qualifiers? Ozil could probably light a fag at the half way line and waltz his way through us while taking a drag.

Aenaes

Hummels is out, Westermann called up to replace him.

http://www.breakingnews.ie/sport/soccer/westermann-called-into-german-squad-569795.html

kitakyushu

Mikeyt086 wrote: »

Was having a chat with a German friend about the game and he asked me who I was worried about. I said:

Absolutely terrified: Marco Reus, Ozil, Khedira, Gomez and Goetze if he plays.
Worried about: Neuer being too good, Hummels, Boateng, Lahm, Schwienstieger, all of the bench.

I asked him who he was worried about. He said:

"Duff is doing good for Fulham."

I'd almost post the obvious "I wish Duff would come back for this game" except I think he's already suffered enough having to play in this system for four years.

Banjaxed82

http://www.rte.ie/sport/soccer/international/2012/1008/340780-clarke-called-into-ireland-squad-for-germany-clash/

So where does that leave the Midfield...especially if Trap goes for 3?

At least we know McCarthy is a certain starter now.

Rekop dog

I mean it's such a mismatch it frightning WHOEVER we pick, we've just a grand total of 1 player in Europe this season between the Champs League and Europa league which puts us really down with the dregs of European nations in terms of number of players participating at that level, and if anything we're hugely overachieving in comparison to these nations. I'm in the minority who thinks a more expansive tactics/players would only leave us further exposed, imo people are hugely over-rating the ability of players being sidelined to improve results beyond the current closely contending for qualification/qualifying standard that Trap has achieved during his reign.

Anyway i for one am looking forward to the game, COYBIG!

Boskowski

The discrepancy in pace, playing ability, skill, tactics etc will be pretty big if both teams play to their usual standard. I imagine it will be around the 70:30 mark wrt possession and attempts on goal.
However, Ireland does not get hockeyed especially not at home. It won't be pretty, but I wouldn't predict a landslide unless we get a couple of goals (unexpectedly IMO) in the first half.

Hoping for Germany to win obviously and without being arrogant I would be disappointed with a draw, but merely showing up won't be enough.
Germany will have to prove their ability of breaking down a most likely very defensive Irish side in a very crowded Irish half and Ireland not giving an inch and putting a lot of work into it. Can't see Ireland creating much themselves and putting us under pressure for any prolonged periods regardless how sympathetic I may feel about them. Even if they could/wanted to they're probably too scared of the fast breaks to come out in numbers in the first place.

Its going to be the usual bigger team smaller team storyline. The longer the 0:0 stands the more difficult it will get and if Ireland somehow manage to go ahead it will get worse even. Goal in the first half would obviously help since Ireland will have to open up a bit to get something out of this.

2:0 Germany

Pro. F

Rekop dog wrote: »

I mean it's such a mismatch it frightning WHOEVER we pick, we've just a grand total of 1 player in Europe this season between the Champs League and Europa league which puts us really down with the dregs of European nations in terms of number of players participating at that level, and if anything we're hugely overachieving in comparison to these nations. I'm in the minority who thinks a more expansive tactics/players would only leave us further exposed, imo people are hugely over-rating the ability of players being sidelined to improve results beyond the current closely contending for qualification/qualifying standard that Trap has achieved during his reign.

Anyway i for one am looking forward to the game, COYBIG!

Qualifying ahead of Armenia and past Estonia is not overachieving for a country with a player pool like ours.

Playing Green or Whelan in centre mid and Cox or Keogh on the wing does not make a team less exposed than playing the likes of Steven Reid, Gibson, McCarthy, Fahey, McClean, Coleman.

Playing long ball to two short strikers also does not make a team more solid defensively.

keith16

Germany have a superb record in qualifying, they will beat us, comfortably.

simongurnick

Pro. F wrote: »

Qualifying ahead of Armenia and past Estonia is not overachieving for a country with a player pool like ours.

Playing Green or Whelan in centre mid and Cox or Keogh on the wing does not make a team less exposed than playing the likes of Steven Reid, Gibson, McCarthy, Fahey, McClean, Coleman.

Playing long ball to two short strikers also does not make a team more solid defensively.[/QUOTE

In fairness none of the lads you mention are word class. Reid has just been ruined by injuries, Gibson flatters to deceive, McCarthy has real potential, Fahey is so-so, McLean is a good prospect but still very green and Coleman has actually declined a little from his blustering performances last year.
Puts Trap between a rock and a hard place, stick mainly to the players he knows, or roll the dice with guys who play for mid table EPL teams.

Gringo180

Does anybody think maybe if the Fai ploughed a few quid into the domestic game the national team would be in a better state? I mean 1 player in the squad playing european football is alarming to say the least.

I wonder whats the difference in what the winner of the LOI gets and what Traps salary is?????

token101

Would love to be optimistic and say we could get a point, but I reckon we'll get beaten 3 or 4 nil here.

Oat23

Gringo180 wrote: »

I wonder whats the difference in what the winner of the LOI gets and what Traps salary is?????

Trap is on €1.5m, add in his coaching staff and it's €2.5m per year for them all.

Airtricity League winners get €100k.

Xavi6

Wonder what the crowd will be like, glamour tie and all that.

DazMarz

It'll be a capacity crowd or damn near it, I'd say. For that reason; it's a glamour tie.

Pro. F

simongurnick wrote: »

In fairness none of the lads you mention are word class. Reid has just been ruined by injuries, Gibson flatters to deceive, McCarthy has real potential, Fahey is so-so, McLean is a good prospect but still very green and Coleman has actually declined a little from his blustering performances last year.
Puts Trap between a rock and a hard place, stick mainly to the players he knows, or roll the dice with guys who play for mid table EPL teams.

Why are you talking about anybody being world class? That comment is completely irrelevant to the discussion.

All the players I mentioned are streets ahead of Green and Keogh in the respective positions they play for Ireland. It is not a gamble to be picking players that are so much better. Enough of this nonsense about rolling dice.

simongurnick

Pro. F wrote: »

Why are you talking about anybody being world class? That comment is completely irrelevant to the discussion.

All the players I mentioned are streets ahead of Green and Keogh in the respective positions they play for Ireland. It is not a gamble to be picking players that are so much better. Enough of this nonsense about rolling dice.

The point is they're not great players. It's replacing average players with above average players.

RayCon

simongurnick wrote: »

It's replacing average players with above average players.

Surely thats an improvement no ?

by the way, Coleman has been excellent for Everton in the last 3 games and looks to be getting some of his 10/11 form back.

Rekop dog

Xavi6 wrote: »

Wonder what the crowd will be like, glamour tie and all that.

Attendances have been excellent right through his reign, even some massive gates for friendlies due to the ferver created by being in contention for things. Bad football doesn't affect attendances nearly as much as not contending for things does, i'd actually argue it doesn't affect it at all, people go and have a good moan throughout yes, but they're there, they wouldn't be if we regularly sat off the pace in these groups not matter how attractive our football would be on the eye. Of course if we drop off the pace in this group the attendance will drop hugely, people will cite the neg football and a managerial protest as the reasons they're not attending but that's a complete falsity whether they realise it or not!

ionadnapokot

Gringo180 wrote: »

Does anybody think maybe if the Fai ploughed a few quid into the domestic game the national team would be in a better state? I mean 1 player in the squad playing european football is alarming to say the least.

I wonder whats the difference in what the winner of the LOI gets and what Traps salary is?????

Its a good point.
Realistically we should have 5 former LOI players starting on a regular basis for Ireland: Doyle, Fahey, Houlihan, Coleman and Ward.
Imagine what could happen if the FAI invested more money and time into the league. Their short sightedness is maddening.
As for Trap selecting the likes of Green and Cox ahead of the players mentioned above, well thats just mad!

carlop

ionadnapokot wrote: »

Its a good point.
Realistically we should have 5 former LOI players starting on a regular basis for Ireland: Doyle, Fahey, Houlihan, Coleman and Ward.
Imagine what could happen if the FAI invested more money and time into the league. Their short sightedness is maddening.
As for Trap selecting the likes of Green and Cox ahead of the players mentioned above, well thats just mad!

Green is awful, but Cox has generally done well for us and is playing pretty well for Forest, even throwing in the odd wonder goal too.

IRISHSPORTSGUY

Andy Keogh has 6 assists this season, quite excellent that as a striker. Stats a winger would be proud of.

Francie Barrett

ionadnapokot wrote: »

Realistically we should have 5 former LOI players starting on a regular basis for Ireland: Doyle, Fahey, Houlihan, Coleman and Ward.

Ward is one of the worst full backs we have ever had, we should be playing Wilson instead.

Kingp35

I agree, Ward is beyond awful. As for Keogh and Cox, I'm not saying either should be in the team but it's incredibly harsh to call both of them rubbish considering neither of them, especially Keogh, are ever played in their proper position which is as a forward.

Francie Barrett

Trap may finally see sense and opt for 451 at least.

http://www.rte.ie/sport/soccer/international/2012/1008/340780-clarke-called-into-ireland-squad-for-germany-clash/

Banjaxed82

Not playing 3 in midfield will be insane. Though if we do play 3, Trap will still insist on Keane up front by himself. Crazy stuff. He'll probably stick Walters on the wing and get him to support Keane when he can, but all that does is somewhat contradict putting the extra man in midfield. We need a lone striker who doesn't need to be subsidised.

We're only going to score from a set piece or a counter attack, so Shane Long should be the lone striker.

Pro. F

simongurnick wrote: »

The point is they're not great players. It's replacing average players with above average players.

If you are saying that S Reid, Fahey, McCarthy, Gibson, Meyler, McClean and Coleman are not streets ahead of Green and Keogh in their respective Irish team positions then you are lying.

To describe playing those players instead as a risk that might leave us more open is nonsense.

IRISHSPORTSGUY wrote: »

Andy Keogh has 6 assists this season, quite excellent that as a striker. Stats a winger would be proud of.

Keogh is fine for what he is, a reasonably talented, hard working and versatile player. As a winger he is nowhere near McClean or Coleman.

Mocha Joe

Westwood

Kelly
O'Shea
O'Dea
Ward

McGeady
McCarthy
Andrews
Cox
Walters

Keane


That's my guess. Wilson instead of Ward and Long instead of Keane and I'd be happy enough we were giving ourselves a half-decent chance.

Banjaxed82

Mocha Joe wrote: »

Westwood

Kelly
O'Shea
O'Dea
Ward

McGeady
McCarthy
Andrews
Cox
Walters

Keane


That's my guess. Wilson instead of Ward and Long instead of Keane and I'd be happy enough we were giving ourselves a half-decent chance.

Playing both of these is essentially playing 4-4-2. It's a given that Trap will be playing 3 orthodox centre mids. Sure that's what he's doing in training.

Mocha Joe

Banjaxed82 wrote: »

Playing both of these is essentially playing 4-4-2. It's a given that Trap will be playing 3 orthodox centre mids. Sure that's what he's doing in training.

Meyler instead of one of them? That's the only option I see. Fahey won't start.

Aenaes

Mocha Joe wrote: »

Meyler instead of one of them? That's the only option I see. Fahey won't start.

Why won't he? I would have guessed McCarthy, Andrews and Fahey.

Banjaxed82

Aenaes wrote: »

Mocha Joe wrote: »

Meyler instead of one of them? That's the only option I see. Fahey won't start.

Why won't he? I would have guessed McCarthy, Andrews and Fahey.

Ah c'mon! Of course Meyler is gonna start. Did you not hear what Trap said? ...Meyler is tall.

Nalz

Banjaxed82 wrote: »

http://www.rte.ie/sport/soccer/international/2012/1008/340780-clarke-called-into-ireland-squad-for-germany-clash/

So where does that leave the Midfield...especially if Trap goes for 3?

At least we know McCarthy is a certain starter now.

Hmmmmm, so we're going with the below you reckon?

Westwood
Kelly O'Shea O'Dea Ward
Walters McCarthy Andrews Fahey McGeady
Keane

Banjaxed82

Trilla wrote: »

Hmmmmm, so we're going with the below you reckon?

Westwood
Kelly O'Shea O'Dea Ward
Walters McCarthy Andrews Fahey McGeady
Keane

Don't get your quoting my post from last night but....I'd say Meyler over Fahey. Probably needs that little bit more grit.

super_furry

Can't ever remember this much pessimism before such a big home game.

The_Kew_Tour

super_furry wrote: »

Can't ever remember this much pessimism before such a big home game.

Agree maybe bar Czech Republic game in 2006.

kitakyushu

The_Kew_Tour wrote: »

Agree maybe bar Czech Republic game in 2006.

What a night! Went in expecting the worst. Came away with a draw and a new future world class centre-back called Paul McShane.

Jayob10

Westwood

Kelly
O'Shea
O'Dea
Ward

Meyler
Andrews
McCarthy

Walters
Long
McGeady

That would be my first XI going on what we have.

Banjaxed82

super_furry wrote: »

Can't ever remember this much pessimism before such a big home game.

Understandably so. This German team is BY FAR the best team we've faced in a qualifier since.........before the Trap era anyway.

Given the state of the team, it's hard not to be pessimistic.

Leiva

Banjaxed82 wrote: »

Understandably so. This German team is BY FAR the best team we've faced in a qualifier since.........before the Trap era anyway.

Given the state of the team, it's hard not to be pessimistic.

i fear another schooling is on the cards

celt262

Jayob10 wrote: »

Westwood

Kelly
O'Shea
O'Dea
Ward

Meyler
Andrews
McCarthy

Walters
Long
McGeady

That would be my first XI going on what we have.

Is Wilson not fit?

IRISHSPORTSGUY

Conor Clifford called up according to Ken Earley on Newstalk !!

Jeff Hendrick (defensive midfielder playing week in/out for Derby) would have the more obvious one, but it's a square filler I don't think he will play a minute.