Republic of Ireland v Germany - 12/10/2012 - 19:45 - RTE2/SS2

briany

djpbarry wrote: »

I think they'd have to. Even looking at it from a purely business point of view, there would zero interest in the rest of the qualifiers if Trap stays on - that may well hurt the FAI coffers more than terminating his contract.

I don't think there'll be any mass boycott of the team. Crowd numbers slashed, absolutely. Half full stadiums, probably, but not the *cricket chirp..."Knock it long!"* scenario Dunphy would suggest. However, it's still not clear how or if this will force the FAI to act. They'll have to review the books and make a few phone calls. The former shouldn't be too hard with an organisation that his an accountant as their CEO, but would he recognise his own salary as a gross over expenditure?

kincsem

Torshavn, Faroe Islands

Weather forecast Tuesday 16/10/12 18:00
Wind speed 17/18 kph, gusts 20 kph
Air temp 8/9 degrees
http://www.windfinder.com/forecast/torshavn

Those wind speeds are among the lowest predicted next week.

Nalz

Trilla wrote: »

Apart from the RTE player, anyone know where I would get Dunphy and co's views on the game?

Anyone?

CSF

So many Germans here in Tolka tonight, such a fantastic country.

klose

kincsem wrote: »

Torshavn, Faroe Islands

Weather forecast Tuesday 16/10/12 18:00
Wind speed 17/18 kph, gusts 20 kph
Air temp 8/9 degrees
http://www.windfinder.com/forecast/torshavn

Those wind speeds are among the lowest predicted next week.

Jaysus with that wind going forward Westwood could end up scoring with the kick he has in him

Lumbo

CSF wrote: »

So many Germans here in Tolka tonight, such a fantastic country.

Bunch of barstoolers. Can they not follow football in their own country. They're not real fans RABBLE RABBLE RABBLE BLAH BLAH BLAH

simongurnick

djpbarry wrote: »

We both know that's nonsense, but the point is that the approach adopted by both sides is all about quick one and two-touch football.

Now, the likes of James McCarthy, Aiden McGeady, Keith Fahey and Seamus Coleman are good technical players, well above LOI standard. Then there's Wes Hoolahan who, for some absolutley mind-boggling reason, isn't even in the squad. I find it very, very hard to believe these guys are not capable of implementing a passing game at international level.

The point is, I don't buy the whole "we don't have the players" argument. Sure, we're lacking really top-class players at the moment, but we have a number of good premiership-level players who should be a hell of a lot better organised than what we witnessed last night.
Why not? Ireland were well organised and played decent football under Kerr. And his underage sides were actually pretty attack-minded - he just didn't have the players for a 4-3-3 with the senior side.

Can't believe people are talking about Kerr. He was a disaster.

simongurnick

briany wrote: »

What can Trap say to the team that will buoy them for this up coming game against the Faroes? I don't think there'll be one player who is particularly interested in what he has to tell them. They've made their minds up that his stewardship is untenable, as I think most of us have. I'm torn about the game. On the one hand, I'd never root against Ireland but what if something less than a win really did force the FAI to act (even though there's not much evidence that they can afford to in their current state)?



He will tell them that if the win they will probably finish the night 2nd in the group with a few months to our next game to allow players like Coleman, McCarthy, McLean and Brady develop at their clubs.

cgpg5

simongurnick wrote: »

Can't believe people are talking about Kerr. He was a disaster.

Remember thinking he was a little unlucky to be sacked? We only lost one game in the WC 06 qualifying campaign iirc. A wonderstrike by Henry

Although tbf we were very poor in the Euro 04 qualifiers, not as poor as now mind

Prick!

simongurnick wrote: »

Can't believe people are talking about Kerr. He was a disaster.

Was he? If I remember correctly he went for a winner at 1-1 at home v switzerland, we lost. Ultimately cost us qualification iirc.

Benimar

Prick! wrote: »

Was he? If I remember correctly he went for a winner at 1-1 at home v switzerland, we lost. Ultimately cost us qualification iirc.

That was Mick. Cost him his job.

simongurnick

Prick! wrote: »

Was he? If I remember correctly he went for a winner at 1-1 at home v switzerland, we lost. Ultimately cost us qualification iirc.

Stop man. I remember the Israel game at home when we went ahead and then threw the fcuking thing away. He was a nightmare.

Prick!

simongurnick wrote: »

Stop man. I remember the Israel game at home when we went ahead and then threw the fcuking thing away. He was a nightmare.

SO many **** ups in Irish footballing history. that israel game, JOS holding yer man up like. Shay Given not diving then.

cgpg5

One thing is for certain no-one had it easy against us under Kerr. Look at the qualification campaign that followed!

briany

cgpg5 wrote: »

Remember thinking he was a little unlucky to be sacked? We only lost one game in the WC 06 qualifying campaign iirc. A wonderstrike by Henry

Although tbf we were very poor in the Euro 04 qualifiers, not as poor as now mind

Good goal. Crucially though, he also sacrificed two leads against Israel due to negative tactics/mindset. A win in either of those games would almost have been enough to see them through to second place. Something was badly wrong at the end of that campaign where they had a home game against Switzerland and offered little in going for the required win. In some ways, a more depressing night than Friday. The Irish team just didn't try very hard to clinch second place against a fairly ordinary Swiss side.

FREETV

Good players are made and Ireland have very few of them, just about any amateur with two legs and a noggin would have achieved more than this pathetic excuse for a national team. If I had played as badly as they did then I would be ashamed of myself.

Even a lone striker would need to compete at midfield to support our lot there as they are hopeless and cannot supply any decent balls let alone hold on to the ball. It was like watching under Elevens lastnight. Where is the focus and vision needed at International level? :rolleyes:

Limestone1

FREETV wrote: »

Good players are made and Ireland have very few of them, just about any amateur with two legs and a noggin would have achieved more than this pathetic excuse for a national team. If I had played as badly as they did then I would be ashamed of myself.

Even a lone striker would need to compete at midfield to support our lot there as they are hopeless and cannot supply any decent balls let alone hold on to the ball. It was like watching under Elevens lastnight. Where is the focus and vision needed at International level? :rolleyes:

Don't be ridiculous - it's all Trap's fault and when he is gone things will be wonderful again...............

FREETV

Limestone1 wrote: »

Don't be ridiculous - it's all Trap's fault and when he is gone things will be wonderful again...............

No it won't it will take a few years at least. Most of them can barely play football, fact!

Carlos_Ray

No team of professionals should suffer such a humiliating defeat in this day and age. The players looked fearful and disjointed last night. That's 100% the managers fault. His stubbornness, lack of communication, and lets face it, lack of knowledge of Irish players has created the mess we currently find ourselves in.

In his four years of being manager of Ireland he has blooded absolutely no new players. He has merely sat on his hole in Milan picking the same team/system game after game. He had plenty of opportunities to give the likes of Coleman game-time in both friendly and competitive games but he didn't bother. He waits until injuries force his hand and then throws him in the deep end against Germany, playing in a makeshift defence.

He has continually disrespected the Irish people. Believing us to be living in the dark ages of football. However, in reality it is Trap who is living in the past. He's stuck in the early nineties and is totally out of his depth in the modern era. I'm convinced he knows about 14 Irish players and isn't interested in expanding his knowledge.

It comes down to economics at this stage but Irish supporters should vote with their feet and force the FAI's hand. Don;t contribute any more money to the destruction of Irish football and Traps retirement fund.

Aenaes

Carlos_Ray wrote: »

No team of professionals should suffer such a humiliating defeat in this day and age.

Man U 8-2 Arsenal? People said Arsenal were finished, Wenger might need to go, then they on to finish in a Champions League spot and Wenger is back to being hailed as genius, etc.

Man. City 6-1 Man U? Man United go on to finish 2nd.

Ireland could have lost 1-0 vs Germany and it still end up with 0 points, so the score doesn't really matter.

"Ireland were embarrassed/humiliated" No-one bar Irish people will remember the match.
If Ireland win versus the Faroes and Germany beat Sweden, then it's game on.

Two campaigns, two playoffs. Trappatoni deserves to finish this campaign or until it's no longer possible to qualify.

djpbarry

simongurnick wrote: »

Can't believe people are talking about Kerr. He was a disaster.

If Kerr was a disaster, then what the **** was Friday night?

simongurnick wrote: »

I remember the Israel game at home when we went ahead and then threw the fcuking thing away.

I remember that game too. Ireland were two up, then Israel scored a freak goal and a dodgy penalty. After that, Ireland did absolutely everything but score.

You’re really judging Kerr based on one game that Ireland drew but really should have won?

djpbarry

Aenaes wrote: »

If Ireland win versus the Faroes and Germany beat Sweden, then it's game on.

No, it isn't. Austria and Sweden will both play Ireland off the park. Anyone who thinks that Ireland have even a remote chance of qualifying with Trap in charge is seriously deluded.

noodler

djpbarry wrote: »

No, it isn't. Austria and Sweden will both play Ireland off the park. Anyone who thinks that Ireland have even a remote chance of qualifying with Trap in charge is seriously deluded.

What?

Qualify again you mean?

Felexicon

Aenaes wrote: »

Ireland could have lost 1-0 vs Germany and it still end up with 0 points, so the score doesn't really matter.

Of course the score matters. What if we miss out on a playoff spot due to goal difference?

It's not getting beaten that's annoying most, it's the manner of the defeat.
We were never going to go out and pass it around Germany, no matter who was manager or what tactics were used because they are a far superior side. What got me most was that we didn't control the controlables. By this I mean we didn't do anything the Germans couldn't affect, like putting pressure on the ball, making runs into space or keep our concentration and shape. It really looked like the players didn't care and that's not something that should ever happen when representing your country, regardless of if you agree with a tactical system or not.

djpbarry

noodler wrote: »

Qualify again you mean?

Qualify for the World Cup, yes.

RikkFlair

briany wrote: »

Good goal. Crucially though, he also sacrificed two leads against Israel due to negative tactics/mindset. A win in either of those games would almost have been enough to see them through to second place. Something was badly wrong at the end of that campaign where they had a home game against Switzerland and offered little in going for the required win. In some ways, a more depressing night than Friday. The Irish team just didn't try very hard to clinch second place against a fairly ordinary Swiss side.

It was a very ordinary group. France finished top despite winning just 5 of their 10 games. That group was there to be won by that Irish team and yet somehow finished 4th. People talk about Trap having no plan B, Kerr was equally clueless in that Swiss game....a MUST WIN game, and just hoofball with no imagination. Switzerland looked more likely to win that match, but the crowning glory was taking Robbie Keane off with about 20 minutes to go, I'll never forget the look on Keanes face as he slowly trudged off.

Kerr was shown to be out of his depth towards the end of that qualifying campaign, the early games were promising but at the business end he failed the test.

Felexicon

djpbarry wrote: »

No, it isn't. Austria and Sweden will both play Ireland off the park. Anyone who thinks that Ireland have even a remote chance of qualifying with Trap in charge is seriously deluded.

Incorrect.
Austria and Sweden are both really average teams at the moment and we could beat them both at home and realistically get draws away.
In no way am I backing Trap and his style but to call people deluded for thinking we have a chance to finish second is stupid.

Carlos_Ray

Aenaes wrote: »

Man U 8-2 Arsenal? People said Arsenal were finished, Wenger might need to go, then they on to finish in a Champions League spot and Wenger is back to being hailed as genius, etc.

Man. City 6-1 Man U? Man United go on to finish 2nd.

Ireland could have lost 1-0 vs Germany and it still end up with 0 points, so the score doesn't really matter.

"Ireland were embarrassed/humiliated" No-one bar Irish people will remember the match.
If Ireland win versus the Faroes and Germany beat Sweden, then it's game on.

Two campaigns, two playoffs. Trappatoni deserves to finish this campaign or until it's no longer possible to qualify.

Of course the score matters. Its quite possible second place could be decided on goal difference.

Taking the game out of context and comparing it to the defeats suffered by Arsenal and United is not a true reflection of reality. This is the fourth humiliating defeat we have suffered in our last 5 competitive games and even the one victory was embarrassing.

This defeat is not a freak result. Its the culmination of Trap's refusal to induct new players into the squad. His inability to adapt to circumstances i.e players getting old and retiring. Not to mention his outdated management style which has done nothing but instil fear and make our players nervous. He has openly criticised the players/team on a number of occasions and he routinely talks about how poor the players are. No wonder they are facing teams with no confidence in their own ability. Remember, we haven't beaten a team ranked higher then us in a competitive game under him.

A good manager can make an average group of players over-perform. Trap certainly hasn't done that.

We don't beat teams ranked higher then us. We usually draw with teams of similar rank. We scrape wins against lower ranked teams. Trap achieves all this while ignoring/alienating are best young players.

Losing to Germany is not the reason he should be sacked. Its merely a symptom of the reason.

SantryRed

simongurnick wrote: »

Can't believe people are talking about Kerr. He was a disaster.

:pac:

What absolute bollocks. We are the exact same under Trappatoni as we are under Kerr. Kerr was treated appallingly by the FAI. Should never have been sacked.

simongurnick

djpbarry wrote: »

If Kerr was a disaster, then what the **** was Friday night?
I remember that game too. Ireland were two up, then Israel scored a freak goal and a dodgy penalty. After that, Ireland did absolutely everything but score.

You’re really judging Kerr based on one game that Ireland drew but really should have won?

Not at all. It was just one example of his tactics being way off. Thinking of the top of my head here, but pretty sure he made changes in the game, we went completely defensive, at home against Israel! That was a poor group we should have qualified from. We drew so many games that we should have won.

simongurnick

SantryRed wrote: »

:pac:

What absolute bollocks. We are the exact same under Trappatoni as we are under Kerr. Kerr was treated appallingly by the FAI. Should never have been sacked.

We are the exact same? We qualified for a tournament and reached a play off. We have been in tougher groups with an inferior group of players.
This stuff is getting ridiculous!

Corholio

noodler wrote: »

What?

Qualify again you mean?

This group is infinitely stronger than the last one, an on the rise Sweden and Austria versus an average Slovakia. If your argument is that we qualified than your unfairly dismissing the bones of that campaign, which has led to where we are now.

But sure we qualified right?

SantryRed

simongurnick wrote: »

We are the exact same? We qualified for a tournament and reached a play off. We have been in tougher groups with an inferior group of players.
This stuff is getting ridiculous!

Yes we are the exact same.

The 2006 group was much more difficult than the one we qualified for under Trap for Euro 2012. The only difference between Kerr and Traapatoni is Trap has been luckier.

briany

SantryRed wrote: »

Yes we are the exact same.

The 2006 group was much more difficult than the one we qualified for under Trap for Euro 2012. The only difference between Kerr and Traapatoni is Trap has been luckier.

I'd say they were about even apart from France who were a class above.

Even though his tactics and game plan have well and truly been shown up now, I believe that in the first two campaigns or thereabouts, Trap had a team playing for him that had a resolve, a spirit, and a confidence in the plan. This counts for something. Don't get me wrong, the team was always playing bad football under the manager and they had luckily avoided any team that could really punish their shortcomings but I don't think a Kerr team would have been able to hold on for a Victory in Armenia, for example or been able to grind out a 2-1 victory over a confident Cypriot side in Nicosia. Even with the other results going as they did elsewhere in the group, it would have been a much tighter squeeze.

Kerr was looking at a pretty average group to get out of. At least some of the blame for failing to do so lays at failing to put games against lesser opposition to bed and not being able get the best out of the players he had at his disposal, who by most accounts would be considered quite a bit superior to what we have now, even counting the marginalised players.

simongurnick

briany wrote: »

I'd say they were about even apart from France who were a class above.

Even though his tactics and game plan have well and truly been shown up now, I believe that in the first two campaigns or thereabouts, Trap had a team playing for him that had a resolve, a spirit, and a confidence in the plan. This counts for something. Don't get me wrong, the team was always playing bad football under the manager and they had luckily avoided any team that could really punish their shortcomings but I don't think a Kerr team would have been able to hold on for a Victory in Armenia, for example or been able to grind out a 2-1 victory over a confident Cypriot side in Nicosia. Even with the other results going as they did elsewhere in the group, it would have been a much tighter squeeze.

Kerr was looking at a pretty average group to get out of. At least some of the blame for failing to do so lays at failing to put games against lesser opposition to bed and not being able get the best out of the players he had at his disposal, who by most accounts would be considered quite a bit superior to what we have now, even counting the marginalised players.

I'd agree. Kerr's teams drew games we should have won, whereas Trap (up until recently) ground out games we would have lost in the past.
If we had the basic organisation Trap brought to the team we could have qualified in 2006.Kerr was brutal and for anyone to suggest he was a better manager for us than Trap is off their head and caught up in the current "Trap out" frenzy.

KELTICKNIGHTT

Ireland need a leader on the field as well as better management
the players looked lost , for so called pro's

ronsgonawin

simongurnick wrote: »

ronsgonawin wrote: »

I agree with the back four alright, but I think Ireland need at least three in the middle.
But I do think he will play 4-4-2 and we will be again in danger of loosing again, but hopefully manage to scrape a result and hopefully the FAI can see sense and get someone in for march.

Our back 4 was terrible last night. Hope to god Dunney and Sledge are back soon.

I agreed with "rhys Essien" back 4. Some people on this board I'm surprised can even count

mark renton

SantryRed wrote: »

:pac:

What absolute bollocks. We are the exact same under Trappatoni as we are under Kerr. Kerr was treated appallingly by the FAI. Should never have been sacked.

The man hasnt a clue for God sake, go check the list of teams he has managed - as if things arent bad enough at the moment with Trap some people want to replace him with a below average manager who cant get a job in the npower championship...

niallo27

SantryRed wrote: »

Yes we are the exact same.

The 2006 group was much more difficult than the one we qualified for under Trap for Euro 2012. The only difference between Kerr and Traapatoni is Trap has been luckier.

It cant all be down to luck, saying it was only luck that was the reason the quailfied is an insult to the irish players like the likes of given, dunne, duff and keane who have given everythng for the country in their careers.

SantryRed

niallo27 wrote: »

It cant all be down to luck, saying it was only luck that was the reason the quailfied is an insult to the irish players like the likes of given, dunne, duff and keane who have given everythng for the country in their careers.

I didn't say it was ALL down to luck, what I did say is that the only difference between Kerr and Trappatoni as manager was Trappatoni has gotten the luck that Kerr didn't get.

SantryRed

simongurnick wrote: »

I'd agree. Kerr's teams drew games we should have won, whereas Trap (up until recently) ground out games we would have lost in the past.
If we had the basic organisation Trap brought to the team we could have qualified in 2006.Kerr was brutal and for anyone to suggest he was a better manager for us than Trap is off their head and caught up in the current "Trap out" frenzy.

I'm fcuking sick of this bollocks now.

I'm caught up in no 'Trap Out' frenzy. I think the FAI had to give him a new contract as he got us to the Euros, how couldn't you renew the contract of a manager who achieved his objective?

BUT, Kerr and Trappatoni were the exact same. Actually, we were much more organized under Kerr than we are under Trappatoni. We didn't spend the whole game under Kerr camped on the 18 yard line of our own box. The ONLY difference between the World Cup qualifying in 2006 and the South Africa 2010 one was a magical goal by Henry which made us lose 1-0 against France. Other than that we were pretty much the same. He most definitely should have gotten another group stage. People who say he shouldn't have been given another go at a group but Trappatoni shouldn't be sacked haven't a clue, as it is the same circumstances.

EDIT: We were set up class for the future under Kerr too, something Trappatoni could not give two fcuks about. The more I think about it the angrier I get that he was sacked.

Rekop dog

SantryRed wrote: »

I'm fcuking sick of this bollocks now.

I'm caught up in no 'Trap Out' frenzy. I think the FAI had to give him a new contract as he got us to the Euros, how couldn't you renew the contract of a manager who achieved his objective?

BUT, Kerr and Trappatoni were the exact same. Actually, we were much more organized under Kerr than we are under Trappatoni. We didn't spend the whole game under Kerr camped on the 18 yard line of our own box. The ONLY difference between the World Cup qualifying in 2006 and the South Africa 2010 one was a magical goal by Henry which made us lose 1-0 against France. Other than that we were pretty much the same. He most definitely should have gotten another group stage. People who say he shouldn't have been given another go at a group but Trappatoni shouldn't be sacked haven't a clue, as it is the same circumstances.

EDIT: We were set up class for the future under Kerr too, something Trappatoni could not give two fcuks about. The more I think about it the angrier I get that he was sacked.

Are you blissfully unaware that Kerr had Given Duff Keane and Dunne available at or close to their career peaks, without doubt our 4 best performers in the premier League and for the national side for the last ~10 years, none of those started on Friday, you can't compensate for losing that experience in such a short spell particularly in a squad so lacking in ability like ours.

SantryRed

Rekop dog wrote: »

Are you blissfully unaware that Kerr had Given Duff Keane and Dunne available at or close to their career peaks, without doubt our 4 best performers in the premier League and for the national side for the last ~10 years, none of those started on Friday, you can't compensate for losing that experience in such a short spell particularly in a squad so lacking in ability like ours.

It's Trappatonis fault that we aren't prepared when it was blatantly obvious that these players wouldn't be around much longer.

Rekop dog

SantryRed wrote: »

It's Trappatonis fault that we aren't prepared when it was blatantly obvious that these players wouldn't be around much longer.

I'm not seeing any great crisis relative to the strength of our squad, we've lost 4 of our last 5 competitive games against top 10 world ranked teams, which is a freakish run of difficult fixtures, and no way the norm in International football, even at a world cup. Also in that spell we ran into the greatest Spanish team of all time and the best German team in a long time. Have a fixture on Tuesday to put us into a position that any realistic fan would be very content with going into next years matches. Sweden aren't looking great, better quality than ourselves but it'll be close imo. I'm expecting 3rd in the group, and that wouldn't be underachieving at all, something Trap hasn't done during his spell in charge.

briany

SantryRed wrote: »

The ONLY difference between the World Cup qualifying in 2006 and the South Africa 2010 one was a magical goal by Henry which made us lose 1-0 against France. Other than that we were pretty much the same. He most definitely should have gotten another group stage. People who say he shouldn't have been given another go at a group but Trappatoni shouldn't be sacked haven't a clue, as it is the same circumstances.

EDIT: We were set up class for the future under Kerr too, something Trappatoni could not give two fcuks about. The more I think about it the angrier I get that he was sacked.

The two sickening draws against Israel, where two perfectly good leads were needlessly lost would have something to do with that as well. The French goal was lucky whereas the Israeli goals were invited through negative play. He could have had the team future proofed to perfection but it wouldn't matter if he couldn't get his teams to close out results.

Rekop dog wrote: »

I'm not seeing any great crisis relative to the strength of our squad, we've lost 4 of our last 5 competitive games against top 10 world ranked teams, which is a freakish run of difficult fixtures, and no way the norm in International football, even at a world cup. Also in that spell we ran into the greatest Spanish team of all time and the best German team in a long time. Have a fixture on Tuesday to put us into a position that any realistic fan would be very content with going into next years matches. Sweden aren't looking great, better quality than ourselves but it'll be close imo. I'm expecting 3rd in the group, and that wouldn't be underachieving at all, something Trap hasn't done during his spell in charge.

The team really shouldn't be getting beaten 1-6 no matter how depleted the squad may be. It's a pretty rare result in today's terms given the teams' relative closeness in ranking and it could have been more. If the players weren't questioning Trap's plan before that game, they'll certainly be doing so now and that will severely cripple, if not totally kill, their ability to enact it, with all it's flaws, with any real conviction - cue more half hearted performances and players complaining that they don't know what they were supposed to be doing, Trapattoni having more fallouts with players and that team limping out of that group with 3rd if they're lucky and Austria underperform, IMO.

noodler

briany wrote: »

The team really shouldn't be getting beaten 1-6 no matter how depleted the squad may be.

I think thats a fair point that everyone needs to keep in mind.

Results of that margin are not that common in competitibe games anymore between the minnows and giants.

I was expecting a loss of 2 to three goals at most.

Renn

I was expecting what happened on Friday night - just surprised it hasn't happened more often in the past few years. Defensively, Ireland are not at all solid. That may look a bit strange considering the number of clean sheets kept etc but if anyone actually looked at those games you could see that there was no 'system'. There was a method of sitting back, putting x amount of bodies in the final third and hoping that the opposition had a bad day. And lots of teams had bad days - it really was a crazy run of results (losing at home just the once to Russia in EQ). Teams created loads of chances vs Ireland but just were not scoring.

SantryRed

briany wrote: »

The two sickening draws against Israel, where two perfectly good leads were needlessly lost would have something to do with that as well. The French goal was lucky whereas the Israeli goals were invited through negative play. He could have had the team future proofed to perfection but it wouldn't matter if he couldn't get his teams to close out results.

.

I'm sorry but has Trappatoni ever closed out a result? Bulgaria home/away, Slovakia away.

He plays very negative too, the difference being we concede early when he's negative whereas we conceded late under Kerr. There isn't a difference.

briany

SantryRed wrote: »

I'm sorry but has Trappatoni ever closed out a result? Bulgaria home/away, Slovakia away.

He plays very negative too, the difference being we concede early when he's negative whereas we conceded late under Kerr. There isn't a difference.

Yes, the team has closed out results. Against Armenia, against Cyprus and against Macedonia, all lower seeded teams. The result against the fourth seed, Armenia, being particularly crucial. In Kerr's efforts against Ireland's fourth seed, Israel, they squandered two perfectly good leads, particularly the 2-0 lead they had in Dublin. This was with a squad that had a younger Keane, Duff, Andy Reid, Dunne and Given. There was Ian Harte in there, Kenny Cunningham and Steven Reid waiting on the bench, yet Kerr couldn't give his players the game plan to get it done. Ireland were certainly superior to Israel at that time but yet they allowed them to come back. That's not down to bad luck alone, which always plays a part but due to weak management when it was all in Kerr's hands.

SantryRed

briany wrote: »

Yes, the team has closed out results. Against Armenia, against Cyprus and against Macedonia, all lower seeded teams. The result against the fourth seed, Armenia, being particularly crucial. In Kerr's efforts against Ireland's fourth seed, Israel, they squandered two perfectly good leads, particularly the 2-0 lead they had in Dublin. This was with a squad that had a younger Keane, Duff, Andy Reid, Dunne and Given. There was Ian Harte in there, Kenny Cunningham and Steven Reid waiting on the bench, yet Kerr couldn't give his players the game plan to get it done. Ireland were certainly superior to Israel at that time but yet they allowed them to come back. That's not down to bad luck alone, which always plays a part but due to weak management when it was all in Kerr's hands.

Israel went through that group unbeaten. In 2008 we didn't beat Montenegro home or away. We were very lucky at home to Armenia too. I really don't think there's a difference between the two.