What would help the Irish Language In Todays Media?

DyldeBrill

People always have mixed thoughts when it comes to this subject, some positive, some negative, and that will forever live!

If the Irish language is to succeed, what do you think would help it within the media world?And people who don't speak Irish, what are your thoughts on the language in relation to how its portrayed? Is there not enough advertisement done? Or is it the fact that there is plenty of advertisement, its just the fact that it is not done right?

Would be interested in hearing people's views on this subject.

AnonoBoy

People using it more.

pickarooney

Ban it and then revive it in America

DyldeBrill

AnonoBoy wrote: »

People using it more.

Well people do speak it! yes would be great if we more people spoke it, but maybe you can elaborate on your comment instead of being so vague.

AnonoBoy

DyldeBrill wrote: »

Well people do speak it! yes would be great if we more people spoke it, but maybe you can elaborate on your comment instead of being so vague.

People using it more in public.

summerskin

Irish porn.

I've picked up a fair bit of French, Danish and German that way over the years.

" mmmm gibt Mir deine scheisse, herr fickenmeister" seems to mean " I really love and respect you as a human being", for example...

DyldeBrill

pickarooney wrote: »

Ban it and then revive it in America

haha now that'd be hard work with only just over 22,000 people speaking it within the US. Good number but not enough

4zn76tysfajdxp

DyldeBrill wrote: »

Or is it the fact that there is plenty of advertisement, its just the fact that it is not done right?

That's it. We need giveaways. "iPod Nano le chuile cúpla focail!"

humanji

Rename it "English".

DyldeBrill

AnonoBoy wrote: »

People using it more in public.

and in your view, what would increase the usage of Irish in public? It is used a lot within the public, just not enough

Red Pepper

less spit during pronunciation.

hooradiation

Fire. And lots of it.

DyldeBrill

Dawson Huge Skunk wrote: »

That's it. We need giveaways. "iPod Nano le chuile cúpla focail!"

Ohhh if the money was there!

Neewbie_noob

DyldeBrill wrote: »

People always have mixed thoughts when it comes to this subject, some positive, some negative, and that will forever live

If the Irish language is to succeed, what do you think would help it within the media world?And people who don't speak Irish, what are your thoughts on the language in relation to how its portrayed? Is there not enough advertisement done? Or is it the fact that there is plenty of advertisement, its just the fact that it is not done right?

Would be interested in hearing people's views on this subject.

Start teaching it properly in schools for a start.

we need to cut out things that cause people to harbour resentment towards it such as giving people "bonás pointí" for answering their "ardtheist" "as Ghaeilge".

Emeraldy Pebbles

What would help the Irish Language?

Letting it run its own course.

Dravokivich

Another thread about reviving the Irish Language.

Aside of that in all seriousness. People need to be motivated to take up something. I am not motivated to take up Irish. I've no interest in it. Actually, I have a great deal of the complete opposite of interest in the language. I can't think of any circumstances which'll make it appealing to me in anyway what so ever.

If the Irish language is to succeed, what do you think would help it within the media world?

There's already a well respected and highly acclaimed tv station. Unsure about the radio, but it does seem to be ticking along.

And people who don't speak Irish, what are your thoughts on the language in relation to how its portrayed?

I don't like that there's either an expectation one knows it, or wants to know it.

Is there not enough advertisement done? Or is it the fact that there is plenty of advertisement, its just the fact that it is not done right?

There's loads of advertisement and events, such as that "Seachtain na Geaglie" thing. As I've said before, it all comes down to motivation and the desire to learn it. You can seek out a target audience, or market to a specific base of people, but if they have no desire or want for it in the first place, that's the major hurdle to jump and all the advertisements you throw out won't make much of a difference.

DyldeBrill

Red Pepper wrote: »

less spit during pronunciation.

Maybe that's a problem with yerself

not so relevant though....

cml387

Force people to learn it in school?
Make all the road signs bilibgual?
Have a special television channel and radio station?
Spend millions translating all documents into Irish?

MJ23

Let it go. People are living in the past. It would much more beneficial to be taught European languages from an early age. What good would being able to speak Irish if you were working for a large multinational company?
Just let it go, in a few years, it'll be like Latin, only a handful of people able to speak it. And what for?

DyldeBrill

Dravokivich wrote: »

Another thread about reviving the Irish Language.

Aside of that in all seriousness. People need to be motivated to take up something. I am not motivated to take up Irish. I've no interest in it. Actually, I have a great deal of the complete opposite of interest in the language. I can't think of any circumstances which'll make it appealing to me in anyway what so ever.



There's already a well respected and highly acclaimed tv station. Unsure about the radio, but it does seem to be ticking along.



I don't like that there's either an expectation one knows it, or wants to know it.



There's loads of advertisement and events, such as that "Seachtain na Geaglie" thing. As I've said before, it all comes down to motivation and the desire to learn it. You can seek out a target audience, or market to a specific base of people, but if they have no desire or want for it in the first place, that's the major hurdle to jump and all the advertisements you throw out won't make much of a difference.

Yes I agree, people do need to be motivated to speak the language, but its also about having information there for people to actually have general interest in the language also. Yes TG4 is ticking along, whilst Radio is doing quite well too, especially Raidió Na Life.

There is a lot of advertisement, but my question is how could you make it better? Believe it or not there are people out there that want to learn Irish from scratch, now it may not be yourself but be open to the thought that other people do.

DyldeBrill

cml387 wrote: »

Force people to learn it in school?
Make all the road signs bilibgual?
Have a special television channel and radio station?
Spend millions translating all documents into Irish?

obviously not a fan, but thanks for your positive input

gobnaitolunacy

Wonder what would happen if all the funding 'crutches' were removed?

Would it walk or fall flat on its face?

IMO the whole Seacthain na Gaelige thing is preaching to the converted. There are a few good docus on TG4 (I'll just cheat and read the subtitles) but Radio Na G has diddy diddle music and little else anytime I scan thru.

DyldeBrill

MJ23 wrote: »

Let it go. People are living in the past. It would much more beneficial to be taught European languages from an early age. What good would being able to speak Irish if you were working for a large multinational company?
Just let it go, in a few years, it'll be like Latin, only a handful of people able to speak it. And what for?

Why let it go when indeed it is a growing language. What about the people who speak it? Just because you don't speak it doesn't mean that it doesn't exist.

I never asked your views on how its thought in schools or anything like that....

Your dealing with a different argument altogether.Maybe deal with the subject in hand.

ahnowbrowncow

cml387 wrote: »

Force people to learn it in school?
Make all the road signs bilibgual?
Have a special television channel and radio station?
Spend millions translating all documents into Irish?

Yeah not sure what more can be done to help a language that's past it's best before date.

As someone else said let it run it's own course and stop forcing it on people.

Dravokivich

DyldeBrill wrote: »

There is a lot of advertisement, but my question is how could you make it better? Believe it or not there are people out there that want to learn Irish from scratch, now it may not be yourself but be open to the thought that other people do.

I can only answer for myself and it was in that context that I did. Just as much as there are people with an interest to learn it from scratch, there are many people who don't like seeing it "being pushed upon them." I understand it's not always the intention, but it can be a consequence and impression that is easily picked up.

AnonoBoy

DyldeBrill wrote: »

and in your view, what would increase the usage of Irish in public?

Prizes?

An Coilean

DyldeBrill wrote: »

Yes I agree, people do need to be motivated to speak the language, but its also about having information there for people to actually have general interest in the language also. Yes TG4 is ticking along, whilst Radio is doing quite well too, especially Raidió Na Life.

There is a lot of advertisement, but my question is how could you make it better? Believe it or not there are people out there that want to learn Irish from scratch, now it may not be yourself but be open to the thought that other people do.

We have Seachtain na Gaeilge, but all to often that just promotes the Cúpla Focal culture, and tokenism.
I would like to see a Seachtain gan Béarla, like the campaign they run in UCD every year, people taking part refuse to speak English for the week, its along the lines of a 24 hour fast, except no English instead of no food.

That way the use of Irish would be much more visible around the country, even if only for a week.

SilverScreen

What would help the Irish language? Putting it out of it's misery. There's no point trying to save a dying language just for a false sense of national pride. The Irish language is about as useful as playing snooker with a rope at the moment.

Also instead of teaching kids Irish in school (and religion) more time could be given to teaching them more important stuff like science.

pablomakaveli

Stop trying to teach a language through the medium of ****e poetry and literature would be a good start.

cml387

DyldeBrill wrote: »

obviously not a fan, but thanks for your positive input

So you only want posts supporting your point? Best of luck with that.

Dravokivich

An Coilean wrote: »

We have Seachtain na Gaeilge, but all to often that just promotes the Cúpla Focal culture, and tokenism.
I would like to see a Seachtain gan Béarla, like the campaign they run in UCD every year, people taking part refuse to speak English for the week, its along the lines of a 24 hour fast, except no English instead of no food.

That way the use of Irish would be much more visible around the country, even if only for a week.

This would be an example of expecting people who don't speak Irish, wanting to be able to.

Making it an exclusive event does nothing to promote it.

speedboatchase

Why the hell do people even care about 'reviving' the Irish language when the country is in the absolute sh*tter for the forseeable future? What would this achieve other than anecdotally hearing two people converse in Irish the odd time and thinking: "Ah, isn't that nice?"

It's uncompetitive of us to teach it at a compulsory level for every single year of someone's pre-university education. We're broke, remember? And the cost of translating every single document etc is such an enormous waste of cash, nevermind the enormous waste of time that is having students read Irish poetry or write Irish letters in class.

Oh well, I'm sure there will be multiple deluded posters coming on here - who never bothered nearly the language in school but are feeling nostalgic - that will defend it on entirely unrealistic, wasteful, 'patriotic' reasons. Just remember though; the country is broke. Broke.

....also, we're broke.

An Coilean

Dravokivich wrote: »

This would be an example of expecting people who don't speak Irish, wanting to be able to.

Making it an exclusive event does nothing to promote it.

Nope, shocking as it might seem, this one's not about people who don't want to speak Irish.

Its for people who do want to. All everyone else is expected to do is respect their choice.

PopePalpatine

Send kids to areas predominantly populated with Irish-speake...oh wait.

Birroc

Seriously I am proud to be Irish but can we please please take all the millions (billions?) wasted on trying to promote Irish and spend it on these activities which are in my mind way more beneficial/worthwhile;
1) Promoting Hurling throughout Ireland (wonderful game only played to a high level in 8 counties)
2) Promoting Gaelic Football throughout Ireland - provide money to the struggling counties (e.g. Leitrim, Kilkenny, Clare) to help with facilities/coaching etc... Clubs and counties doing well in football brings so much joy/pride to communities
3) Promoting Irish music and Irish dancing - most people love music and dance

gobnaitolunacy

Birroc wrote: »

Seriously I am proud to be Irish but can we please please take all the millions (billions?) wasted on trying to promote Irish and spend it on these activities which are in my mind way more beneficial/worthwhile;
1) Promoting Hurling throughout Ireland (wonderful game only played to a high level in 8 counties)
2) Promoting Gaelic Football throughout Ireland - provide money to the struggling counties (e.g. Leitrim, Kilkenny, Clare) to help with facilities/coaching etc... Clubs and counties doing well in football brings so much joy/pride to communities
3) Promoting Irish music and Irish dancing - most people love music and dance

There's an organisation called the GAA who are supposed to do items 1 & 2 and are loaded with plenty funding.

For item 3 theres Ceoltas, and Riverdance

Tombo2001

Teach it as a foreign language. Teach it as a language full stop.

Dont tell kids that learning Irish "culture" is part of the package, if they want to learn the Irish language at school.

Dont force kids to learn crap melancholy Irish literature. It is so damn off putting.

Why the department of education has not figured this out is beyond me.

4zn76tysfajdxp

PopePalpatine wrote: »

Send kids to areas predominantly populated with Irish-speake...oh wait.

Oh wait, what?

Shenshen

DyldeBrill wrote: »

People always have mixed thoughts when it comes to this subject, some positive, some negative, and that will forever live

If the Irish language is to succeed, what do you think would help it within the media world?And people who don't speak Irish, what are your thoughts on the language in relation to how its portrayed? Is there not enough advertisement done? Or is it the fact that there is plenty of advertisement, its just the fact that it is not done right?

Would be interested in hearing people's views on this subject.

It's a language.
It needs to be spoken, not advertised.
I'm not Irish, but one thing I hear (and believe) is that the way it isi taught is simply outdated, counterproductive and a big waste of money. I learned Latin in the same way that people here are taught Irish, but the difference is that nobody ever expected me to talk Latin. The idea that Latin could be used in conversation was ridiculous to my teachers back then, and it would seem that it's just as ridiculous to Irish teachers here and now.

When I first came to Ireland, I actually thought about trying to learn it, but there were no beginner's evening courses for adults, and I couldn't afford one of those "Learn the language" holidays so popular with Americans.

If you want to revive the language, teach it as a language. Make it voluntary, and make it fun.
And don't start in schools, that's way too late. Incentivise parents to teach their children, provide creches that will teach it.

Tombo2001

Birroc wrote: »

Seriously I am proud to be Irish but can we please please take all the millions (billions?) wasted on trying to promote Irish and spend it on these activities which are in my mind way more beneficial/worthwhile;
1) Promoting Hurling throughout Ireland (wonderful game only played to a high level in 8 counties)
2) Promoting Gaelic Football throughout Ireland - provide money to the struggling counties (e.g. Leitrim, Kilkenny, Clare) to help with facilities/coaching etc... Clubs and counties doing well in football brings so much joy/pride to communities
3) Promoting Irish music and Irish dancing - most people love music and dance

ugh.......enough already.

The GAA is plenty strong.

(and thats coming from someone who's been at the last 8 hurling finals).

johnam

In my eyes, the resentment comes from the way it is taught. Despite what it says in the constitution, Irish is a "foreign" language to most people in Ireland. What I mean by that is that we don't use it in our day to day living. Yet, when we go to school, we get taught Irish like we teach English, not like we teach French or German. Instead of giving us the language we need to hold a conversation, we learn poetry and other rubbish we will never use. It says a lot when we spend 8 years in primary and 5 in secondary school getting Irish forced on us, and still come away with a better knowledge of which ever foreign language we have learned for 5 years in secondary than we have of Irish.

In my eyes being able to speak the language does not make you any more Irish than Joe down the road who doesn't speak it. Irish should be taught in Primary School, but it should only be an option in secondary school.
We should also teach German or some other foreign language in Primary school. I know kids from Poland and France can answer basic questions in English by the age of 5 and hold a fairly decent but basic conversation in English by the age of 10, yet we don't start to learn any European languages until the age of 12/13 and even then we only do it for 5 years.

Lord TSC

Can we not just link this back to the "How to Revive the Irish Language" topic that there was a few weeks back? Maybe let people read all the replies in there before they make a point that has been made a million, million times before? Or must we have ANOTHER topic whereby we go round and round in circular arguments over and over?

*Starts countdown until the discussion of compulsion vs obligatory begins*

These topics always end up the same; the people who claim to want to revive the Irish language don't want to hear the genuine criticisms there are, and the majority of people don't give a damn about it enough to ever do anything other than make the same case for the 1000th time.

Tombo2001

Dravokivich wrote: »

Another thread about reviving the Irish Language.

Aside of that in all seriousness. People need to be motivated to take up something. I am not motivated to take up Irish. I've no interest in it. Actually, I have a great deal of the complete opposite of interest in the language. I can't think of any circumstances which'll make it appealing to me in anyway what so ever.

This is a big country. Not trying to be smart, but there's more than just yourself in it.

There are four million people here.

I'd say there's maybe 200,000 tops who speak Irish fluently. That is, if you sat them down in front of Sean Ban Breathnach they could natter away to him in Irish for an hour or two.

So, there's 3.8 million people who dont speak fluently.

Of those, there's probably 2 million who could not care less about the Irish language. Maybe more. You are in the camp.

But I would wager that there is a sizeable number, maybe half a million, who would like to be able to speak it well.

In my view, this group has been actively discouraged from speaking it by the cultural zealots who created the Irish language syllabus for our school system.

Lord TSC

Tombo2001 wrote: »

I'd say there's maybe 200,000 tops who speak Irish fluently. That is, if you sat them down in front of Sean Ban Breathnach they could natter away to him in Irish for an hour or two.

So, there's 3.8 million people who dont speak fluently.

Of those, there's probably 2 million who could not care less about the Irish language. Maybe more. You are in the camp.

Jesus, you must be having trouble sitting down, given how painful it must have been to pull those numbers out of your ***. :pac:

Dravokivich

Tombo2001 wrote: »

This is a big country. Not trying to be smart, but there's more than just yourself in it.

There are four million people here.

And I've only claimed to speak for 1 of them. As I've mentioned, the main point is motivation to learn it. Using myself to say I've none and unless others have any, they won't be inclined to either. That is the focal point in looking to promote it. Otherwise there are plenty of options to get exposure to it, some of which I referenced and you cut out from my quote.

An Coilean wrote: »

Nope, shocking as it might seem, this one's not about people who don't want to speak Irish.

Its for people who do want to. All everyone else is expected to do is respect their choice.

It's not a matter of respect when you can't communicate with someone who refuses to speak with you on the same level. That is what I meant by exclusive.

Birroc

gobnaitolunacy wrote: »

There's an organisation called the GAA who are supposed to do items 1 & 2 and are loaded with plenty funding.

For item 3 theres Ceoltas, and Riverdance

Not enough funding.
There are many many counties without senior hurling clubs which is a disgrace. There are many football clubs in debt through building decent facilities.

Keeping people fit (especially young people) and encouraging team/community spirit way more important than speaking a dead language.

Birroc

Tombo2001 wrote: »

ugh.......enough already.

The GAA is plenty strong.

(and thats coming from someone who's been at the last 8 hurling finals).

Nonsense and you know it.
It is plenty strong in strong counties.
Galway are in Leinster ffs

DyldeBrill

Dravokivich wrote: »

I can only answer for myself and it was in that context that I did. Just as much as there are people with an interest to learn it from scratch, there are many people who don't like seeing it "being pushed upon them." I understand it's not always the intention, but it can be a consequence and impression that is easily picked up.

I see where you are coming from and yes I very much agree that it can be pushed upon people! How in your eyes does the Irish language do this in relation to Media.

But yes it can be shoved down peoples throats in schools!

DyldeBrill

An Coilean wrote: »

We have Seachtain na Gaeilge, but all to often that just promotes the Cúpla Focal culture, and tokenism.
I would like to see a Seachtain gan Béarla, like the campaign they run in UCD every year, people taking part refuse to speak English for the week, its along the lines of a 24 hour fast, except no English instead of no food.

That way the use of Irish would be much more visible around the country, even if only for a week.

You are on to something here! The only thing I would say is that Irish speakers would like people to speak Irish willingly, instead of sending out the image of "F**k English, Irish is our Language" because that's what some people pick up on.I'm all for people speaking English, we should get away from that argument,instead I'd like to see people wanting to join the Irish speaking community, and wanting to learn and speak Irish.

Undercover Elephant

Tombo2001 wrote: »

So, there's 3.8 million people who dont speak fluently.

Of those, there's probably 2 million who could not care less about the Irish language. Maybe more.

As an outside observer, I have to say that I don't agree with that. Most Irish people seem to regard the language with something between contempt and flat-out hostility.

I think it would help if we stopped pretending that it had some special status and that it is somehow inherently superior to English. Then at least people could approach it in its own terms - part of the history of the island, a real language of (a small number of) real people and the store of a valuable body of literature.

DyldeBrill

speedboatchase wrote: »

Why the hell do people even care about 'reviving' the Irish language when the country is in the absolute sh*tter for the forseeable future? What would this achieve other than anecdotally hearing two people converse in Irish the odd time and thinking: "Ah, isn't that nice?"

It's uncompetitive of us to teach it at a compulsory level for every single year of someone's pre-university education. We're broke, remember? And the cost of translating every single document etc is such an enormous waste of cash, nevermind the enormous waste of time that is having students read Irish poetry or write Irish letters in class.

Oh well, I'm sure there will be multiple deluded posters coming on here - who never bothered nearly the language in school but are feeling nostalgic - that will defend it on entirely unrealistic, wasteful, 'patriotic' reasons. Just remember though; the country is broke. Broke.

....also, we're broke.

Again that is your view completely, which I respect, but you are not dealing with the matter of this thread!

There is no arguing with people like you who have made their mind up, but what I was hoping to discuss in this thread, was how people view the Irish language within the media.

Instead of ranting on how Irish is such a waste of time, maybe put forth the reason you find it so useless within the MEDIA.