Advertisement
If you have a new account but are having problems posting or verifying your account, please email us on hello@boards.ie for help. Thanks :)
Hello all! Please ensure that you are posting a new thread or question in the appropriate forum. The Feedback forum is overwhelmed with questions that are having to be moved elsewhere. If you need help to verify your account contact hello@boards.ie

Household Charge Mega-Thread [Part 3] *Poll Reset*

Options
1…139140142144145…186

Comments

  • Options
    #4232
    donalg1
    Closed Accounts Posts: 3,513 ✭✭✭donalg1


    Corkbah wrote: »
    in the article it says that if you object to the valuation ...revenue would assess the property.

    at the moment we have a heat recovery unit installed in the house (which lowers the bills) and an extension out the back(which is not visible from the front of back of the house - due to being a semi-detached house and trees out the back .... how can revenue say that the place where I live is worth the same as my neighbours ??

    similarly - one of my neighbours had a house fire a few years ago and the entire interior was gutted and rebuilt - this would have affected the re-sale price, our own home was rebuilt 2yrs ago due to flooding....so all piping was extra lagged.

    Are you trying to say that revenue will take all this into consideration when creating an estimated value for the house ??? No they won't...so whatever estimation I get I will refuse and ignore - the place is prone to flooding - I doubt revenue will take this into consideration

    They may or may not take it into consideration, I would imagine they wont though but then I dont know. However, the bands are €50,000 which gives a lot of lee way when making valuations


  • Options
    #4233
    Bullseye1
    Closed Accounts Posts: 5,731 ✭✭✭Bullseye1


    So we will need to hire a valuer (cough.....what is Phil Hogan again.....cough) to produce a valuation if your not happy with Revenues estimation, which I'm sure will be a very very high percentage.

    The people who said it would be self assessment were talking through their ass. Government has already an idea what they want your house to be valued at. Its no different than commercial rates and having to make an argument as to why the valuation office has over valued the property.


  • Options
    #4234
    bettyswollocks
    Registered Users Posts: 20 ✭bettyswollocks


    What if I live in a rural area where every house is completely different, the last sale on the register was 2 years ago. How can I value my house.. theres no market value to compare it with. Also, if it accidently burns down, then the value is the cost to rebuild it, correct? .. which is now a lot less than the market value.


  • Options
    #4235
    Bullseye1
    Closed Accounts Posts: 5,731 ✭✭✭Bullseye1


    Revenue to decide value of homes for property tax.

    http://www.independent.ie/business/personal-finance/property-mortgages/revenue-to-decide-value-of-homes-for-property-tax-3343775.html

    LOL
    While owners will still be able to self-assess, those who deviate from the provided estimates face the prospect of checks, inspections and challenges from the Revenue.
    If the Revenue's valuation is used by a homeowner, they will not be challenged in future.

    However, estimates straying from the Revenue's own "property specific" values are more likely to be inspected and challenged, leading to possible fines and penalties.


    Some interesting points here. http://www.build.ie/construction_news.asp?newsid=156282
    I am equally concerned that property owners could be open to manipulation if they opt to rely on auctioneers or estate agents to value their property. Typically, estate agents will value a property for free. But considering a national property tax regime is being implemented for the first time, I suspect they may start to charge for the service.


  • Options
    #4236
    Ghandee
    Closed Accounts Posts: 6,653 ✭✭✭Ghandee


    Bullseye1 wrote: »
    Revenue to decide value of homes for property tax.

    http://www.independent.ie/business/personal-finance/property-mortgages/revenue-to-decide-value-of-homes-for-property-tax-3343775.html

    LOL






    Some interesting points here. http://www.build.ie/construction_news.asp?newsid=156282

    Making it up as that go along, incompetence in it's purest form.


  • Advertisement
  • Options
    #4237
    Bullseye1
    Closed Accounts Posts: 5,731 ✭✭✭Bullseye1


    Actually I would say its all going to plan for Hogan. He is planning for a future outside the dail and all those houses he can value for this tax.


  • Options
    #4238
    darkhorse
    Closed Accounts Posts: 2,274 ✭✭✭darkhorse


    donalg1 wrote: »
    Well lets see its your moral duty to pay your taxes now, however, over time when you become liable to pay the property tax you will be changing your moral stance on it being your duty to pay your taxes.

    You cant say Enda is unable to change his views if you are going to change yours too. Again no matter how you try sugar coat it or get out of it, it smacks of hypocrisy. I for one couldnt care less Ghandee what you do or dont do with your money, but less of the double standards would be great.

    If you were to read over your posts, in which you seem to think that Ghandee has changed his stance in any way, since this thread started, and then read over Ghandee's posts, you would find that Ghandee, (unlike Enda Kenny) never changed his morals or his stance in relation to this unjust, immoral, HHC/Property Tax, ever since day one of the discussion on this particular forum, which is well into its third thread. If fact, Ghandee has been blatantly consistent in his views and his stance in relation to the HHC/Property Tax, so I can't see where you you might come up with any reason to think that he may have changed his view on this.


  • Options
    #4239
    darkhorse
    Closed Accounts Posts: 2,274 ✭✭✭darkhorse


    donalg1 wrote: »
    In the North afair they are using valuations from 2005.

    Well, is'nt that grounds for appeal in the first instance?


  • Options
    #4240
    Grass between the tracks
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 122 ✭✭Grass between the tracks


    To whom would you appeal? The revenue who decide the value?


  • Options
    #4241
    darkhorse
    Closed Accounts Posts: 2,274 ✭✭✭darkhorse


    donalg1 wrote: »
    Because this isnt the North so I would imagine they are going to bring in a system that they believe suits us and is best for us based on our tax system.

    Because this isnt the North so I would imagine they are going to bring in a system that they believe suits the Troika and the Bondholders and is best for the Troika and the Bondholders based on whether or not the people have the ability to pay this most unequitable tax.

    You may as well tell the truth, donal


  • Advertisement
  • Options
    #4242
    dvpower
    Closed Accounts Posts: 9,183 ✭✭✭dvpower


    Grass between the tracks wrote: »
    To whom would you appeal? The revenue who decide the value?
    To the Revenue in the first instance. If you're not happy with that, then to the independent Revenue Appeals Commissioners.

    Then to the High Court...


  • Options
    #4243
    bgrizzley
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,641 ✭✭✭bgrizzley


    why would you appeal anything to anyone who was trying to charge you to live in your own property?


  • Options
    #4244
    darkhorse
    Closed Accounts Posts: 2,274 ✭✭✭darkhorse


    Bullseye1 wrote: »
    Revenue to decide value of homes for property tax.

    http://www.independent.ie/business/personal-finance/property-mortgages/revenue-to-decide-value-of-homes-for-property-tax-3343775.html

    LOL


    Some interesting points here. http://www.build.ie/construction_news.asp?newsid=156282[/QUOTE]

    Ya know what my biggest concern is. Its that this TD, along with many others in government, will be eligible for the big pension in less than two months, and we will not get them out before that. It really makes me mad, that fact that not only will a lot of these guys continue to be on a great salary, while a lot of the people that voted them in on the the strength of the lies that that told, may be struggling for years to come, but that they wil also be getting a lottery type pension(in comparson to what the majority will be receiving), is, to say the least, shameful.:mad:


  • Options
    #4245
    dvpower
    Closed Accounts Posts: 9,183 ✭✭✭dvpower


    bettyswollocks wrote: »
    What if I live in a rural area where every house is completely different, the last sale on the register was 2 years ago. How can I value my house.. theres no market value to compare it with. Also, if it accidently burns down, then the value is the cost to rebuild it, correct? .. which is now a lot less than the market value.
    ergo you have some idea of the market value.

    The market value isn't the rebuilding cost, but that's probably something you might use as a guide if you feel the market value is less than the rebuild cost. With wide 50k bands and the Revenue valuation, you'll probably be able to have a good stab at your own valuation.


  • Options
    #4246
    darkhorse
    Closed Accounts Posts: 2,274 ✭✭✭darkhorse


    Ghandee wrote: »
    Making it up as that go along, incompetence in it's purest form.


    Typically, estate agents will value a property for free.[/B][/SIZE][/S][/B] But considering a national property tax regime is being implemented for the first time, I suspect they may start to charge for the service.

    Does that mean that used to do it for free?


  • Options
    #4247
    Ghandee
    Closed Accounts Posts: 6,653 ✭✭✭Ghandee


    darkhorse wrote: »
    If you were to read over your posts, in which you seem to think that Ghandee has changed his stance in any way, since this thread started, and then read over Ghandee's posts, you would find that Ghandee, (unlike Enda Kenny) never changed his morals or his stance in relation to this unjust, immoral, HHC/Property Tax, ever since day one of the discussion on this particular forum, which is well into its third thread. If fact, Ghandee has been blatantly consistent in his views and his stance in relation to the HHC/Property Tax, so I can't see where you you might come up with any reason to think that he may have changed his view on this.

    Deflection DH, Enda/Eamon style.....


    Ironic thing, I was completely shocked when I learned my estate was to be given an exemption from the hhc. Did I hide the fact though?

    To carry in hiding the fact would have been hypocritical though.


  • Options
    #4248
    Ghandee
    Closed Accounts Posts: 6,653 ✭✭✭Ghandee


    dvpower wrote: »
    To the Revenue in the first instance. If you're not happy with that, then to the independent Revenue Appeals Commissioners.

    Then to the High Court...

    The FG party might have useful info available to citizens when it comes to appealing to revenue commissioners.


  • Options
    #4249
    darkhorse
    Closed Accounts Posts: 2,274 ✭✭✭darkhorse


    Grass between the tracks wrote: »
    To whom would you appeal? The revenue who decide the value?

    Is this a trick question?


  • Options
    #4250
    dxhound2005
    Registered Users Posts: 21,021 ✭✭✭✭dxhound2005


    Corkbah wrote: »
    really doesn't matter .... Enda/Ghandee .... its all the same !!

    most important point is that the government/revenue do not have the manpower to inspect houses if people object to the valuation given by revenue and given the current situation, by the time revenue processes the assessments house price/values will probably have dropped again, so their initial "assessment" will be out of date and incorrect.

    legally they cant give an exact assessment as every house has different attributes and character and a house is only valued at what a person will pay for it.

    simple test IF/WHEN revenue sends out an assessment ...someone puts their home up for sale at the "estimated value" as determined by revenue and if/when revenue object the home owner simply shows them no-one made an offer (and if its done by many people the sheer influx of houses for sale on the market will result in values fluxing so much that revenue's figures will be inaccurate.....so its impossible to actually give a proper value estimate of an individual house..so revenue's task is impossible)

    NOTE: If a person puts their home up for sale - they do NOT have to take any offers of asking price, they can simply put it up on Donedeal (not daft/myhome as I dont like them !!) and prove their case with the ridiculous low-ball offers they will receive.

    Are you qualified to give legal advice like this? If your advice is incorrect you are in danger of leading people into misguided actions. Have you read the legislation, particularly the sections which refer to assessment of value?

    http://www.oireachtas.ie/documents/bills28/bills/2012/10812/b10812d.pdf


  • Options
    #4251
    Le_Dieux
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,473 ✭✭✭Le_Dieux


    Ghandee wrote: »
    Lol......




    That's gas.

    So if revenue tell a homeowner his home is worth 400k, and after several years on the market and forced to pay property tax on this valuation, if the home owner only gets 250k can the homeowner then chase revenue for the shortfall?

    Only true way to value a home is to put it on the market and let the buyers decide its value.

    Revenue are crossing the line into a dictatorship here.

    Other points here also Ghandee:

    1) How are the Revenue able to get the address of every house in the State, yet Phil's department couldn't?

    &

    2) Where is the money coming from to pay for all this printed matter?


  • Advertisement
  • Options
    #4252
    darkhorse
    Closed Accounts Posts: 2,274 ✭✭✭darkhorse


    donalg1 wrote: »
    Exactly its Ghandee that is being hypocritical as he doesnt think Enda can change his opinion which is fair enough, but if Enda cant change his then Ghandee cant change his, if Ghandee maintains Enda cant change his while Ghandee changes his own then Ghandee becomes a hypocrite.

    Like I said very simple indeed. The issue isnt about morals or anything like that, its about blatant double standards.

    Ya know what I think. I think that you may have the same condition as some people that post on this thread, as well as a lot of people in our present government.
    The condition is known as not having emptied one's bowels in a long time.


  • Options
    #4253
    darkhorse
    Closed Accounts Posts: 2,274 ✭✭✭darkhorse


    dxhound2005 wrote: »
    Are you qualified to give legal advice like this? If your advice is incorrect you are in danger of leading people into misguided actions. Have you read the legislation, particularly the sections which refer to assessment of value?[/QUOTE]

    Watch Pat Rabbitte on the frontline to-night. I'd say he might give us some advice. Sure, is'nt that what ya do, tell 'em what they they want to hear.


  • Options
    #4254
    tayto lover
    Registered Users Posts: 51,926 ✭✭✭✭tayto lover


    Pat "bend over and take it lads and smile" Rabbitte. He is blaming everyone except those who sat on the opposition benches and never uttered a word in protest. Shameful man.


  • Options
    #4255
    Ghandee
    Closed Accounts Posts: 6,653 ✭✭✭Ghandee


    PROPERTY experts have cast doubt on the Revenue's ability to value every home in the country so it can tell the owners how much property tax it thinks they should pay.

    Ronan Lyons, an economist with property website Daft.ie, said the taxman's approach would lead to horror stories of people being given wildly inaccurate values. Letters to be sent out in the coming weeks will tell homeowners the "indicative value" the taxman has put on their property.

    While owners will still be able to self-assess, those who deviate from the provided estimates face the prospect of inspections and challenges.

    Anyone who hires a valuer – at their own expense – to assess the price of their home will go unchallenged.

    The Revenue has said that any value chosen by homeowners this year – including those it suggests – will apply for three years. This means that if a property is sold in a year or two at less than the value suggested by the Revenue, the seller will not be entitled to any tax refund.

    Remind me what the brains behind this whole fiasco does?

    Also, why on the institute of professional auctioneers and valuers does it list his constituency office details?

    I smell a rat.
    Hogan, Phil - MIPAV (HON) Constituency Office New Street Kilkenny

    Telephone : 056/7771490 Fax : 056/7771491 Email : philip.hogan@oireachtas.ie Website : www.philhogan.ie

    http://www.ipav.ie/Members/search_member.aspx?Region=Co.%20Kilkenny


  • Options
    #4256
    Bullseye1
    Closed Accounts Posts: 5,731 ✭✭✭Bullseye1


    I've been saying this all along. Hogan is planning for life outside the dail.


  • Options
    #4257
    Ghandee
    Closed Accounts Posts: 6,653 ✭✭✭Ghandee


    Bullseye1 wrote: »
    I've been saying this all along. Hogan is planning for life outside the dail.

    You'd think his lottery sized pension for life would be sufficient enough?

    Would that/could that not be considered as a conflict of interest?


  • Options
    #4258
    Bullseye1
    Closed Accounts Posts: 5,731 ✭✭✭Bullseye1


    I'd put it down to greed. The thing to remember is that estate agents and auctioneers were complicit in driving up prices of property.


  • Options
    #4259
    donalg1
    Closed Accounts Posts: 3,513 ✭✭✭donalg1


    darkhorse wrote: »
    Ya know what I think. I think that you may have the same condition as some people that post on this thread, as well as a lot of people in our present government.
    The condition is known as not having emptied one's bowels in a long time.


    Indeed, there are a lot of those on the anti side with this condition, namely those that declared that the HHC would be scrapped and that the Property Tax would never stand a chance of being introduced, there are then the others that claim to be protesting against the HHC by doing nothing!!! Oh and the others that claim they will burn their house down before paying a property tax.


  • Options
    #4260
    Bullseye1
    Closed Accounts Posts: 5,731 ✭✭✭Bullseye1


    Knowing Irish politics there is every chance the property tax could be scrapped if the opposition run on that platform to remove if they got re-elected.

    Sure didn't many of the pro side say that if your not happy wih it vote for another party to remove it. You cannot have it both ways.

    What is your opinion on a organisation, revenue, with no expertise sending out valuation letters?


  • Advertisement
  • Options
    #4261
    Ghandee
    Closed Accounts Posts: 6,653 ✭✭✭Ghandee


    Bullseye1 wrote: »
    What is your opinion on a organisation, revenue, with no expertise sending out valuation letters?
    donalg1 wrote: »
    It doesn't matter if they're qualified to do it or not!

    Its the law, the law cannot be broken.

    Saved you the bother Donal.;)


This discussion has been closed.
Advertisement