Household Charge Mega-Thread [Part 3] *Poll Reset*

Aquarius34

bgrizzley wrote: »

thanks but i was thinking more about the 1997 one that Fianna fail also abolished.
makes you wonder why FG bother...:(

Why don't people get it.
It doesn't matter what party is in office, they all work together, even when they are up against each other. There is a pub in the Dail for a reason you know. Two party system, is an illusion of choice. Two varieties of bread is still bread!

If FF were instead of FG/LAB, the property tax would be on the agenda. It doesn't make a pile of difference. Just as your vote doesn't count either. It's all rigged from the start, because corruption breeds this system.
When the greens were in, they became the opposite of what they were initially about.. When they were in power they never followed up on their "green" agenda. Money infects people like a plague does.. Does anyone in their right minds think minister Gormly gives a f*ck about the environment? No he doesn't, he likes his pay cheque. This whole topic just makes me so sick.

bgrizzley

Any fool can make a rule, and any fool will mind it.

thoreau

Slick50

dxhound2005 wrote: »

Which is the last thing the property owing classes should want to see happening.

Freudian slip?

dxhound2005 wrote: »

There is no inviolable right to own a piece of the earth and build a house on it, that only comes with a system of law and order.

When will this "law and order" be applied to white collar crime.?

dxhound2005 wrote: »

All the legitimate challenges have failed, wait until the next election and vote a Sinn Fein government to get rid of the tax.

When were ALL the challenges heard?

dxhound2005 wrote: »

One of the most disastrous bits of gombeen politics. I don't think there is another country in the world that abolished it's local property tax. This aberration could never continue.

http://www.irishtimes.com/newspaper/opinion/2012/0901/1224323459735.html

Once upon a time, Ireland had a widespread property tax. It was called domestic rates. They were famously abolished in 1977. The question of abolishing domestic rates was one of the central issues in the 1973 general election.
In their “14-point” joint manifesto for that election, Fine Gael and Labour, who were then in opposition, promised the “progressive abolition of domestic rates”. The then Fianna Fáil government initially argued that this promise was “nonsensical” until, in the last week of the campaign, taoiseach Jack Lynch, fearing accurately that his party was losing, suddenly announced that it would abolish rates after all.
Fine Gael and Labour did not keep their promise during their subsequent three-year term in government but repeated it for the 1977 election, as did Fianna Fáil. In government Fianna Fáil, unfortunately, proved true to its word and abolished rates in the 1978 budget.

So who were the gombeens?

"Fine Gael and Labour did not keep their promise".... some things never change.

dxhound2005 wrote: »

People with persecution complexes think they are being persecuted.

And there's none more blind than those that won't see.

dxhound2005

bgrizzley wrote: »

thanks but i was thinking more about the 1997 one that Fianna fail also abolished.
makes you wonder why FG bother...:(

We have had property tax for many more years than not. I make a prediction that it is back to stay. You can rely on FF or SF or anyone else you want to but get their promises in writing.

Aquarius34

dxhound2005 wrote: »

We have had property tax for many more years than not. I make a prediction that it is back to stay. You can rely on FF or SF or anyone else you want to but get their promises in writing.

Who said you decide. Are you the taxman here? You're wasting your time here, if you're trying to get money out of people here!

darkhorse

donalg1 wrote: »

I dont know of many around here that are in favour of this tax, I cant imagine there would be too many people that would be happy paying more tax.

So should we take that to mean that you are proud to be one of the foremost proponent,s of this tax on family homes, or have I been reading you wrong all these months.

HabeasCorpus

This is an excellent short, youtube video I referred to previously. It shows a different viewing point from that which we are force fed by the Irish media. Maybe not 100% related to the Property Tax, more to the environment which bred it,and backing up what people are saying here about the gravy train.

In particular it clearly gives information on Noonan, taxation, repaying Bonds, and how there is an unrelenting attempt at brainwashing the Irish taxpayer.

May be of interest. ( that reminds me, interest on last year's Household charge brings it up to 130 euros this month.)

https://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=Q-_IR_yNg7c

darkhorse

donalg1 wrote: »

I would imagine if the Govt were to introduce a new tax on tin foil ownership you guys would rush away from this thread and start an actual protest

By the same token, if the government brought in legistation to tax it, you would be advocating that people pay it, because it's the law.

Cathyht

Slick50 wrote: »

Freudian slip?
When will this "law and order" be applied to white collar crime.?
When were ALL the challenges heard?

http://www.irishtimes.com/newspaper/opinion/2012/0901/1224323459735.html
So who were the gombeens?

"Fine Gael and Labour did not keep their promise".... some things never change.

And there's none more blind than those that won't see.

https://fbcdn-sphotos-h-a.akamaihd.net/hphotos-ak-snc6/189122_4132344620386_2048091710_n.jpg

darkhorse

donalg1 wrote: »

Who are the "ones" you refer to, like I said earlier I don't think anyone here is promoting it. Why would anyone want to pay more tax?

Is it possible that there two donalg1's on boards. Maybe I shoulda went to Specsavers.:eek:

Cathyht

HabeasCorpus wrote: »

This is an excellent short, youtube video I referred to previously. It shows a different viewing point from that which we are force fed by the Irish media. Maybe not 100% related to the Property Tax, more to the environment which bred it,and backing up what people are saying here about the gravy train.

In particular it clearly gives information on Noonan, taxation, repaying Bonds, and how there is an unrelenting attempt at brainwashing the Irish taxpayer.

May be of interest. ( that reminds me, interest penalties on last year's Household charge brings it up to 130 euros this month.)

https://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=Q-_IR_yNg7c

FYP

dxhound2005

HabeasCorpus wrote: »

This is an excellent short, youtube video I referred to previously. It shows a different viewing point from that which we are force fed by the Irish media. Maybe not 100% related to the Property Tax, more to the environment which bred it,and backing up what people are saying here about the gravy train.

In particular it clearly gives information on Noonan, taxation, repaying Bonds, and how there is an unrelenting attempt at brainwashing the Irish taxpayer.

May be of interest. ( that reminds me, interest on last year's Household charge brings it up to 130 euros this month.)

https://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=Q-_IR_yNg7c

That was posted in the thread at least 3 times before. The mouthpiece from Moscow hasn't made the law go away.

Cathyht wrote: »

https://fbcdn-sphotos-h-a.akamaihd.net/hphotos-ak-snc6/189122_4132344620386_2048091710_n.jpg

That was posted in the thread at least 33 times before. Quoting Enda from 1994 hasn't made the law go away.

HabeasCorpus

dxhound2005 wrote: »

That was posted in the thread at least 3 times before. The mouthpiece from Moscow hasn't made the law go away.



That was posted in the thread at least 33 times before. Quoting Enda from 1994 hasn't made the law go away.

Many apologies but I have recently joined boards and thought it MAY have been of interest.

The point is the 'mouthpiece' speaks without Irish media censorship. So I would rather hear his genuinely free speech several times, detecting and analysing inaccuracies therein for myself. Than ingest the Irish spin doctors' daily offerings to keep us in line.

There is an interesting prevalence in Ireland where pensioned, ex media employees are now Government Advisors, or press officers for state and semi state organisations. There is coverage on everything, with a Government slant. There is almost fanatical emphases on subservience, unquestioned acceptance of new laws, and they engender FEAR at the thoughts of not paying any new taxes, the sooner the better. Total propaganda and we are all subjected to it if we use Irish media or information from these sources.

Again thank you for the abacus type recording of a repeat posting.

I see now Darkhorse had dug up the link for me when I referred to it and DH posted it a few pages back. Unfortunately I had missed that post amidst the wealth of information on the Northern Ireland tax etc. Hence my repetition.

Thanks to Darkhorse

darkhorse

dxhound2005 wrote: »

The mouthpiece from Moscow hasn't made the law go away.

Who the fcuk is from moscow, hound. It's time to stop eating them horse burgers, cause they're messing with yer brain.

Aquarius34

darkhorse wrote: »

Who the fcuk is from moscow, hound. It's time to stop eating them horse burgers, cause they're messing with yer brain.

The world truly has had it! I can't think of anything else to say at this point, but you know usual story where someone comes to your door selling you shiit. and you immediately pull the blinds down on his/her arrival (to let them know you're not interested) and they sill don't get it? it's like they just assume you will submit or something.

Or the scene, where the salesman will keep knocking on the door smiling in hope that you'd answer it. Still not catching on?

Well people need to take the hint at this rate, because the more they push this the more outrageous and silly this issue becomes. Pay tax on a house you own? I can't even believe my eyes and ears.

Ghandee

dxhound2005 wrote: »

That was posted in the thread at least 33 times before. Quoting Enda from 1994 hasn't made the law go away.

Maybe quoting Leo from 2008 will?

July 19th, 2008

Fine Gael Enterprise Spokesman Leo Varadkar TD has called on Taoiseach Brian Cowen to rule out the introduction of a property tax, following the controversial proposal from the National Economic and Social Council (NESC).

“The National Economic and Social Council (NESC) is a Government body under the aegis of Brian Cowen’s Department. The Council consists of the great and the good from the Social Partnership system along with the Taoiseach’s right hand men and women. It is funded by the Department of the Taoiseach and is chaired by Dermot McCarthy, the Secretary General of the Department of the Taoiseach. The Deputy Chairperson, Mary Doyle is also a senior official in the Taoiseach’s Department. Other members include trade union bosses David Begg, Peter McLoone and Jack O’Connor, IBEC’s Turlough O’Sullivan, Fr Sean Healy, Sean Gorman (Secretary General of the Department of Enterprise, Trade and Employment) and the Taoiseach’s special advisor, Peter Clinch.

“Fine Gael in Government abolished the Residential Property Tax and is not in favour of re-introducing it. A property tax would further depress the housing market and would plunge Ireland even deeper into recession.

http://www.leovaradkar.ie/?p=130

donalg1

darkhorse wrote: »

So should we take that to mean that you are proud to be one of the foremost proponent,s of this tax on family homes, or have I been reading you wrong all these months.

Clearly you have been reading me wrong if you think I am promoting the HHC or am a supporter of it.

darkhorse wrote: »

By the same token, if the government brought in legistation to tax it, you would be advocating that people pay it, because it's the law.

Yes I would because it would be the law, you see unlike some I am not one to continuously move the goal posts when it suits me.

darkhorse wrote: »

Is it possible that there two donalg1's on boards. Maybe I shoulda went to Specsavers.:eek:

No just the one, but since you clearly have been reading me wrong for months as outlined above a trip to specsavers may be in order for you.

Ghandee

donalg1 wrote: »

Clearly you have been reading me wrong if you think I am promoting the HHC or am a supporter of it.

Yet you paid it?

donalg1

Ghandee wrote: »

Yet you paid it?

Yep I sure did as its the law Ghandee as I have explained umpteen times here.

I dont like any tax yet I pay them but that doesnt mean I support them.

Ghandee

donalg1 wrote: »

Yep I sure did as its the law Ghandee as I have explained umpteen times here.

I dont like any tax yet I pay them but that doesnt mean I support them.

How might unjust, wrong and unfair 'laws' be overturned Donal?

I'll give you a hint, not bending over blindly in compliance is usually a good starting point.
Too late for those who wrote the govt a blank cheque by volunteering their details up, that's for sure.

Before you say 'its not working, or won't work' do you remember what happened the last time water charges were nearly introduced here?

donalg1

Ghandee wrote: »

How might unjust, wrong and unfair 'laws' be overturned Donal?

I'll give you a hint, not bending over blindly in compliance is usually a good starting point.
Too late for those who wrote the govt a blank cheque by volunteering their details up, that's for sure.

Before you say 'its not working, or won't work' do you remember what happened the last time water charges were nearly introduced here?

I would say I am far too young to remember those things Ghandee.

As for laws being overturned well that is not something that happens a whole lot in this country that I am aware of anyway, are there any examples of laws being overturned here that one could use as a guide to getting the HHC overturned. (not that I think there is any chance of the HHC being overturned or the LPT for that matter)

I like the part where you imply that people that paid the HHC bent over blindly, tis very easy for someone that is not liable to pay the HHC to say such a thing.

Ghandee

donalg1 wrote: »

I would say I am far too young to remember those things Ghandee.

As for laws being overturned well that is not something that happens a whole lot in this country that I am aware of anyway, are there any examples of laws being overturned here that one could use as a guide to getting the HHC overturned. (not that I think there is any chance of the HHC being overturned or the LPT for that matter)

I like the part where you imply that people that paid the HHC bent over blindly, tis very easy for someone that is not liable to pay the HHC to say such a thing.

I was liable to register Donal, liable to register so my details were on a data base for the property Tax.

I've done as much as I can do, if only others who 'opposed' it would have followed suit.

donalg1

Ghandee wrote: »

I was liable to register Donal, liable to register so my details were on a data base for the property Tax.

I've done as much as I can do, if only others who 'opposed' it would have followed suit.

But the consequences for you not registering are far different than the consequences for someone actually liable to pay the hhc and not registering. So slating someone for paying a tax they were liable to pay is a bit rich coming from someone that is not liable to pay it.

Ghandee

donalg1 wrote: »

But the consequences for you not registering are far different than the consequences for someone actually liable to pay the hhc and not registering. So slating someone for paying a tax they were liable to pay is a bit rich coming from someone that is not liable to pay it.

As it stands, I'm liable and currently running penalties without my 'waiver' which I'm never going to get (as I'm never going to register for it)

I'm quite entitled to give my opinion/input on something that will affect me Donal.

Just like you slate people on other forums for ridiculing pay in the ps and the CPA, even though (according to you) you're not directly affected by either.

Hypocritical on your end, no?

donalg1

Ghandee wrote: »

As it stands, I'm liable and currently running penalties without my 'waiver' which I'm never going to get (as I'm never going to register for it)

I'm quite entitled to give my opinion/input on something that will affect me Donal.

Just like you slate people on other forums for ridiculing pay in the ps and the ps, even though (according to you) you're not directly affected by either.

Hypocritical on your end, no?

No not at all, I simply slate people for not having their facts right regardless of the subject, you see I dont understand how anyone can have a proper debate on a subject when one side has all thier facts wrong. But that is neither here nor there as this forum is about the HHC and there have been many a warning about referencing to other threads here.

And yes you are quite entitled to give your opinion of course ghandee doesnt mean I have to agree with it though.

And seriously how in the name of god are you running penalties, you arent liable for the tax you have nothing for the penalties to be added to. What is 0 + 0 Ghandee?

Ghandee

donalg1 wrote: »

What is 0 + 0 Ghandee?

0 is the amount I'll pay for property tax or the hhc.
0 is the services I'll receive, separate from the ones I pay for already.

Sounds like a fair deal to me.

donalg1

Ghandee wrote: »

0 is the amount I'll pay for property tax or the hhc.
0 is the services I'll receive, separate from the ones I partly pay for already.

Sounds like a fair deal to me.

FYP;)

Hijpo

http://www.irishexaminer.com/ireland/42-of-europes-banking-crisis-paid-by-ireland-219703.html

Ireland has paid 42% of the total cost of the European banking crisis, at a cost of close to €9,000 per person, according to Eurostat.

The average banking crisis debt across the EU is €192 per person, and the figure of €9,000 for each Irish person does not take into account the €18bn put in from the National Pension Reserve Fund.

After Ireland, the German people at €491 per person have shouldered the next biggest cost of bailing out their big regional banks, which invested heavily in hedge funds.

the drifter

How much is the charge and late payment fines at the moment?

Ghandee

the drifter wrote: »

How much is the charge and late payment fines at the moment?

Tbh, who cares?