The root of the problems with Irish football

Owen_S

I went to see Man Utd play in the Champions League for about €80-90(travel, ticket and food included here). It would cost me close to €50 to go and watch the closest Airtricity League Premier Division team. Although it's not their fault that Bus Eireann is so expensive, there is simply no competition there for me between attending a LOI match and a Champions League match.

TerryTibbs!

Des wrote: »

I don't live close enough to an Irish football ground to support an Irish team, but see no problem with flying to the mainland to support a British team, like Celtic or Newcastle, which are further away.

It takes me an hour to get to my closest airport, to wait for an hour to get on a plane. My nearest LoI ground is a half hour away by car though.

*****************************

Des wrote: »

I wento a game once and it rained, so I didn't go again.

Des wrote: »

Some school aged kids were throwing shapes at each other, and I felt intimidated by them, so I hurried on past the ground on my way to the pub.

You should go into comedy. Seriously talented.

Pj!

CSF wrote: »

I was under the impression that football was a sport, not a product. Not in the Premiership of course, but elsewhere.

It's very much a product. And should be treated like one. Not like some sort of religion that people should visit regardless.

CSF

Owen_S wrote: »

I went to see Man Utd play in the Champions League for about €80-90(travel, ticket and food included here). It would cost me close to €50 to go and watch the closest Airtricity League Premier Division team. Although it's not their fault that Bus Eireann is so expensive, there is simply no competition there for me between attending a LOI match and a Champions League match.

But I mean 90%+ of the world don't have something comparable to Champions League football featuring a multiple previous winner.

But that's not how actual football support works or else all the rest of the clubs in the world should just pack it in, and join the rest of you gloryhunters out there.

CSF

Pj! wrote: »

It's very much a product. And should be treated like one. Not like some sort of religion that people should visit regardless.

Products are for consumers. Football clubs are for supporters. It's blatantly obvious which category you fall into. But sure to each their own.

dfx-

Ares wrote: »

I was two LOI games and to be quite frank I'd never go again.

What can you determine in two games? You might be able to work out which team is playing in red and which one is in blue, plus that the referee wears black. Not much else.

Pj!

CSF wrote: »

Products are for consumers. Football clubs are for supporters. It's blatantly obvious which category you fall into. But sure to each their own.

It's a very naive attitude.

Sure continue blaming the supporters and leave the product the way it is. Maybe one day they'll all come around. :rolleyes:

SantryRed

Owen_S wrote: »

I went to see Man Utd play in the Champions League for about €80-90(travel, ticket and food included here). It would cost me close to €50 to go and watch the closest Airtricity League Premier Division team. Although it's not their fault that Bus Eireann is so expensive, there is simply no competition there for me between attending a LOI match and a Champions League match.

where do you live?

sprinkles

Davidth88 wrote: »

Guys, Have to put a disclaimer in her

:eek:

Guy:Incognito

MRPRO03 wrote: »

Football is not about the quality, people in Ireland have got to get this thought out of their heads. It is about one area against another area, how is supporting a foreign team representing you and your locality, no fan of a foreign team can answer that, no matter how hard they try..

Do you have to cross a border to count as "foreign" in this sense? Travelling to teams not local to you is not something unique to Irish people. There's plenty of non scouse British accents in Anfield or non Macunian ones in Old Trafford. There's plenty of other nationalities represented too. Watching MOTD at the weekend there was a flag over the hoarding at Old Trafford with "German supporters club" on it. They have a top level European league but people still choose to support Utd.

People follow who they want to follow.

AgileMyth

SantryRed wrote: »

where do you live?

Far from a football ground but within walking distance of an airport it would seem.

gronemeyer

I've worked in a multinational company the last 5 1/2 years. So multinational i'm the foreigner in an office of 200 people let's say i'm being one of two Irish.

I've taken many of my colleagues to League of Ireland games (St Patricks) people from Italy, Spain, Portugal, and Greece

These lads were used to watching their local clubs before they came to Ireland, clubs like Napoli, Leece, Porto, Real Madrid etc etc

And to be honest bar a Spanish lad who was freezing in Tallaght stadium at the Hannover game, everyone one of them loved it and come back when they can (as their teams are on shift work).

They love the fact you are so close to the pitch, they love the prices, they love the fact people are so friendly and fans mingle freely with the exception of a few idiots, the loved the choice you have to stand up or sit down. They enjoyed the standard and have been back. They loved being so close to the field and the fact there is no fences.

One is even considering buying a season ticket next year, his last season ticket was with Napoli!

Trying to explain to him and others why so many people cross the water each week to watch teams in another country, yet wouldn't cross the street to watch their local team had them baffled considering how big at times the support for the national team is!

I'm not going to criticise or slag people off for making these trips! Plenty of LOI fans go to games abroad not involving their clubs. It's their money they're entitled to spend how and where they want.

What I would say though to these people spending across the water huge amounts of cash(a marketing campaign wouldn't go a miss either along these lines I reckon) , before they go spending a couple of hundred Euros on a trip to England, think for the same price or less they could have a season ticket for your local club, help keep local people in jobs, enjoy a football game minimum every 2 weeks in the flesh and who knows, they may find themself addicted!

And if not at least they've given it ago.

glenjamin

Going to see a bunch of part timers or watch some of the best players in the world play in the best league in world? Hmm....

I'd like to support an Irish club but it really doesn't appeal to me at all. It's not about the money it's about the entertainment that's on offer. If I had to pick going to a live LOI game or watching a Prem game on the telly then I'd pick the Prem game same as most people.

To all the people bitching about not supporting one of your own, do all these people shop in Dunnes rather Tesco? Buy Irish products rather than foreign? Holiday in Galway and not Spain? The difference, there ain't none.

Ares

AgileMyth wrote: »

Far from a football ground but within walking distance of an airport it would seem.

He could be from Knock or Farranfore.

CSF

Pj! wrote: »

It's a very naive attitude.

Sure continue blaming the supporters and leave the product the way it is. Maybe one day they'll all come around. :rolleyes:

I'm not blaming the supporters, I'm blaming those who aren't.

Pj!

CSF wrote: »

I'm not blaming the supporters, I'm blaming those who aren't.

And can you not see how silly that is?

Omackeral

glenjamin wrote: »

To all the people bitching about not supporting one of your own, do all these people shop in Dunnes rather Tesco? Buy Irish products rather than foreign? Holiday in Galway and not Spain? The difference, there ain't none.

If you can equate shopping in Dunnes or Tesco to supporting a football team, then you haven't got the first clue about supporting a team.

oldyouth

Facilities need to improve to attract the fans back
Facilities can't improve until fans return with their spending power to warrant the expenditure
The standard of football won't improve until there is more money in the game in order to improve training facilities, coaching, wages (or expenses for players taking time off from the day job)
Outside investment won't come in to the game until all of the above is in place

Basically, it is a vicious circle with no obvious solution. Oh, and replace every one of the current panel of referees and assistants

CSF

Pj! wrote: »

And can you not see how silly that is?

No, it's not silly. This whole thing where people have to 'support' good teams is ridiculous.

glenjamin

Omackeral wrote: »

If you can equate shopping in Dunnes or Tesco to supporting a football team, then you haven't got the first clue about supporting a team.

So what's the difference then? Tell me. I support an English club and watch English football because it's better and more entertaining than what's on offer here. Yet your arguement is I should support an Irish club because I'm Irish. Why should I support an Irish club? The leagues a mess, the FAI are a bunch of cnuts, and the players are average.

Pj!

CSF wrote: »

No, it's not silly. This whole thing where people have to 'support' good teams is ridiculous.

You're getting even sillier. Who mentioned supporting good or bad teams?

gronemeyer

glenjamin wrote: »

So what's the difference then? Tell me. I support an English club and watch English football because it's better and more entertaining than what's on offer here. Yet your arguement is I should support an Irish club because I'm Irish. Why should I support an Irish club? The leagues a mess, the FAI are a bunch of cnuts, and the players are average.

Do you support the national team?

born2bwild

glenjamin wrote: »

So what's the difference then? Tell me. I support an English club and watch English football because it's better and more entertaining than what's on offer here. Yet your arguement is I should support an Irish club because I'm Irish. Why should I support an Irish club? The leagues a mess, the FAI are a bunch of cnuts, and the players are average.

Not all English football is better than LoI - Leagues 1 and 2 are roughly LoI standard.

Hundreds of thousands of people support their local League 1/2 teams in England.

If I lived in Grimsby I'd support Grimsby, if I lived in Torquay I'd support Torquay - not Man Utd (I'd watch Man U on tv - why not?) - I'd rather support my local team, though.

GLaDOS

I can only assume everyone complaining about the quality doesn't watch Ireland play, because the level of entertainment from LOI clubs easily trumps what our national team is producing.

Francie Barrett

gimmick wrote: »

I wanted to support a local team, but my influences had no interest so I never got to get into it.

Don't you support Barcelona?

born2bwild

Francie Barrett wrote: »

Don't you support Barcelona?

I do tonight!

glenjamin

People should be allowed to support whatever team they want without being judged for it. If people want to support Man Utd or Millwall let them, regardless of where they live or why they support them. If someone supports a LOI team then fair enough. But just because they support Sligo or Derry doesn't give them the right to have a go at people for not supporting whichever club is closest to them. Kids growing up don't have a choice where they live so it shouldn't mean they don't have a choice on who they support. I'll just as much travel to England as I would travel to Monaghan if I felt attracted enough to support that club. I applaud people for supporting a LOI club, sticking with them through and thin, but fcuk off with your double standards.

Jayob10

joker77 wrote: »

Irish soccer fans spent €100m in UK

Probably closer to 100million in Irish pubs watching UK clubs

born2bwild

glenjamin wrote: »

People should be allowed to support whatever team they want without being judged for it. If people want to support Man Utd or Millwall let them, regardless of where they live or why they support them. If someone supports a LOI team then fair enough. But just because they support Sligo or Derry doesn't give them the right to have a go at people for not supporting whichever club is closest to them. Kids growing up don't have a choice where they live so it shouldn't mean they don't have a choice on who they support. I'll just as much travel to England as I would travel to Monaghan if I felt attracted enough to support that club. I applaud people for supporting a LOI club, sticking with them through and thin, but fcuk off with your double standards.

People are allowed to support who they want - it's not like there are cops scanning the departures for lads wearing English club scarves and rounding them up....we had a referendum on the right to travel about 20 years ago.

As for getting upset about fools passing judgement about you on the internet - you'll need to toughen up if you ever actually do go to a real football match.

glenjamin

born2bwild wrote: »

People are allowed to support who they want - it's not like there are cops scanning the departures for lads wearing English club scarves and rounding them up....we had a referendum on the right to travel about 20 years ago.

As for getting upset about fools passing judgement about you on the internet - you'll need to toughen up if you ever actually do go to a real football match.

Thanks, I can't stop crying. Hoping one day I'll be man enough to go to a football match.

**** off. No wonder most people hate the soccer forum. You go in for a debate and end up in a slanging match.

Omackeral

glenjamin wrote: »

So what's the difference then? Tell me. I support an English club and watch English football because it's better and more entertaining than what's on offer here. Yet your arguement is I should support an Irish club because I'm Irish. Why should I support an Irish club? The leagues a mess, the FAI are a bunch of cnuts, and the players are average.

Gee golly gosh where to start? For starters, you actually sound like you really do need me to tell you what the difference is. You cannot compare supermarket chains to football clubs. Imagine giving it the big one in Aldi at the top of your lungs ''Ye Dirty German W*nkers!!!''. It's a stupid point. End of.

Secondly, I never said you should support an Irish team, just said if you can equate supporting a team to retail outlets or vacations (actually, there is a nice irony in there somewhere) then you've zero business on a terrace.

Why I think people may enjoy supporting an Irish team is a different matter. Let me give you an example. A Dublin-based Liverpool fan watches the Reds beat Everton. Does it feel any more special to him than beating West Ham? My guess is no. Yet to the the Liverpudlian, this brings City bragging rights for the next few days that a Bohs fan will relate to after beating their own neighbours Shamrock Rovers. The Pool fan over here will have nobody to buzz off. Same goes for a Gunners fan toppling Spurs. You hate them? Why? Do you even know any Tottenham fans?

The average players debate is questionable when you consider that the likes of Wes Hoolihan, Kevin Doyle and Shane Long have come through our league. At the minute we have Chris Forrester and Mark Quigley running riot. You were probably crying into your pint when Trap wasn't picking James McClean!? I'll let you in on a little secret. He didnt magically become super killer awesome after he boarded a magical plane across the Irish sea.

Richard Hillman

TBH going to LOI games is just a load of hassle, rarely worth it. For myself, even as a Shelbourne fan for a long time it has become a chore. I'd much rather stay at home, have a few beers and watch a game on TV.

My average match day is to meet a couple of lads after work at about half 6. Navigate through the City Centre on a jam packed bus at Friday rush hour. Then walk down Abbey Street full of heroin addicts and beggars to get onto another bus to Tolka. When I get to Tolka, I have to queue up to give them €15 to get in. I have to have my bag searched each time I go to the turnstiles. After all my goods have been searched, I arrive though the turnstiles tp a plethora of people trying to get me to buy match programmes, raffle tickets, golden goal ticket (all the sellers are very nice in fairness but it seems like im guilt tripped at times).

I arrive to my shoddy seat in the main stand, trying to find a view where a pylon isnt in the way of both goals to the ghastly music of Papas got a brand new bag.

Then to the match. HOOF! HOOF! HOOF! HOOF! HOOF! Shels score. Half time. Todays half time entertainment is kids playing football number 586 (although some of the matches are fun). The second half commences. HOOF! HOOF! HOOF! HOOF! HOOF! opposition score HOOF! HOOF! HOOF! 3 minutes added on, HOOF! Opposition score again and its game over.

About an hour to get home on the bus, not even decent time to have a couple of pints.

All in all ive had a pants 4-5 hours and im about €25 out of pocket.

Sure give it a try :rolleyes:

Jayob10

Irish fans just jump on whatever bandwagon is hot. Its simple as.

I really respect the hardcore fans who support their LOI teams. I also respect the true fans of Liverpool and Man Utd who reside in Ireland.

The problem is the ones who are in between. One part of the year they are rugby fanatics. Then they switch to golf, then boxing, then back to football (if the Euros are on and the craic is flowing).

The best of all was the Olympics with Katie Taylor. You had event junkies telling you all about Ochigava and her strengths as a fighter, none of these guys could so much as tell you where the national stadium was. Yet the tickets for her fights were the hottest property of the games. Boxing promoters were creaming themselves thinking signing Katie would lead to 20,000+ fans in ireland turning up to watch her pro career fight after fight

Would they f*ck? Irish fans have no interest other than turning up at the party for the ultimate high. Its the very same with the soccer.

It even extends to LOI, so im not just having a pop at premiership following clubs. So many lifelong rovers fans went to their first games in years during the Europa run.

So many Athlone town natives (10,000 in fact) turned out to see Roy Keanes Sunderland in town, when we don't even get 200 at league games.

Irish fans are consumers to the very definition. They just want to view the best quality, or what someone has drummed into them is the best quality event, and most popular. And its not going to change, because deep down the love for the actual game is not actually there. People are just seduced by the popularity and hype surrounding it.

dan1895

For those that say the facilities are sh*t.....















What's wrong with those stands? I know some areas in some grounds are in a bad way but as a home fan there is nothing stopping you from going into any of those stands for almost any game.

Iang87

The root of the problems with Irish football is the absolute lack of interest from the FAI and a lot of football fans.

I'm not attacking those fans, if you don't want to go to league of ireland then dont go but the FAI want nothing to do with it or so it seems.


To blame irish fans supporting english clubs is lazy to be honest and also its a tired argument

applehunter

Ares wrote: »

I was two LOI games and to be quite frank I'd never go again.

Give you credit for at least going. Know plenty that have never been.

Ares wrote: »

First off the quality is second rate, really, really poor. The Oscar Traynor cup is much better to watch,local players with a real pride for where they're from battling it out to be the best in Ireland. Wonderful stuff.

Whatever about LOI, Oscar Traynor Cup is not going to compete with the problem in the OP.

Ares wrote: »

The games I attended, Shels vs Drogheda and Shels vs St Pat's, I felt extremely unwelcome, as if I was tresspassing on people's territory. Maybe it has something to do with Shelbourne itself, I don't know. I understand the Shelbourne has always been a working class club, perhaps that's why there was an unwelcome feeling.

Soccer is a working class game. Most clubs have a "tea & crumpets" section. Maybe you should have done your research.

Ares wrote: »

Also the quality of football in England is just so much better. Also you can go away for the weekend with your friends to a cosmopolitan English city enjoying, seeing a few tourist sites, a match and having a few beers. You just don't experience that going to Athlone on a Friday evening.

Think this only applies to London having been to Liverpool & Manchester.

Ares wrote: »

Until the LOI clubs upgrade their facilities then I don't see why people would travel to watch LOI. Why would you go 45 minutes in your car to a delapidated stadium to watch second rate action on a Friday night when one could watch a good Championship match on Sky from the comfort of your own sitting room. In reality, its an absolute no brainer.

That excuse doesn't hold down in Cork anymore. Could argue it up your way though.

Ares wrote: »

Maybe when clubs stop going to the wall and the LOI clubs get their collective act together financially we might see some of the improvements required. Hopefully soon. As it would be a shame to have the Irish clubs continually plod around European backwaters getting knocked out in the qualifying rounds of the Europa League and Champions League.

Europe and all that is all well and good but we need to get bums on seats to make those progressions.

BTW. You do realise Shamrock Rovers qualified for Europa League group stages last season.

Ferris_Bueller

I really, really wish more people cared about the league and went to games, I've given it much thought over the years how clubs could possibly get fans coming to games regularly but there really is no simple solution. For people who live outside of Dublin there are a lot less clubs to support, and although there might be a certain amount of clubs within driving distance of you, it takes a lot away from the atmosphere when you can't go for a few drinks without it costing you an absolute fortune (taxis/buses) or when you don't see too many familiar faces in the ground.

I am very much interested in the league and in Irish football in general, was a Kildare County regular. The past year now, I've tried to get going to Shamrock Rovers games regularly, but it hasn't happened as often as I'd like, possibly a situation similar to a lot of people; I don't really feel part of it, it's not quite the same cheering on a team from an area that isn't your own. When I go to games I don't know anyone in the crowd, judging by my accent they probably assume I'm an away fan rather than a home fan, can't throw in a few pints to the evening because I drive up, taxi would cost a fortune. It's just not as easy as some people are making it out to be.

I still enjoy heading up to the games mind, and I would consider myself a fan, would much rather support them than any overseas team, overall it's a very enjoyable experience going up to the games, but maybe the above reasons are why I haven't gone up to as many games as I would have liked, and I'm sure there are a lot of others out there like myself.

Gavin "shels"

Davidth88 wrote: »

You have to think of the scale of things , look at the current leaders in the Championship , Sligo , this is a town of what ... about 20-22 k people ? It's a large ' catchment ' area , but I find that Counties are very tribal , can you see people from Mayo/Leitrim or whatver supporting Sligo Town in any numbers ?

Add to this that clubs appear / disappear / change names etc , so local people feel very little connection to their local club , I would lay money if you asked 100 people in say Crumlin to name their local club 90 would struggle.

Read a thing the other day about a lad from the west side of Offaly travelling to Sligo every second week for the last few years to go to matches. Is it more tribal supporting a team from a different country over a diferent county?

People in Crumlin will stay several things, I know lads from Crumlin who support all four Dublin clubs (minus UCD). Rovers play up the road nowadays, Bohs play a bus journey away (Number 9 bus stops at Dalymount), Shels used to play down the road and Pats play fairly close. Fact is their all different DUBLIN clubs though.

Fr Tod Umptious wrote: »

1. The British leagues - The LOI exists in a tiny market right next to a huge market with two leagues that has been strong of over 100 years.

The League of Ireland was strong until TV came into the picture, and Irish "football fans" became lazy.

Ares wrote: »

The games I attended, Shels vs Drogheda and Shels vs St Pat's, I felt extremely unwelcome, as if I was tresspassing on people's territory. Maybe it has something to do with Shelbourne itself, I don't know. I understand the Shelbourne has always been a working class club, perhaps that's why there was an unwelcome feeling.

Also the quality of football in England is just so much better. Also you can go away for the weekend with your friends to a cosmopolitan English city enjoying, seeing a few tourist sites, a match and having a few beers. You just don't experience that going to Athlone on a Friday evening.

Until the LOI clubs upgrade their facilities then I don't see why people would travel to watch LOI. Why would you go 45 minutes in your car to a delapidated stadium to watch second rate action on a Friday night when one could watch a good Championship match on Sky from the comfort of your own sitting room. In reality, its an absolute no brainer.

Maybe when clubs stop going to the wall and the LOI clubs get their collective act together financially we might see some of the improvements required. Hopefully soon. As it would be a shame to have the Irish clubs continually plod around European backwaters getting knocked out in the qualifying rounds of the Europa League and Champions League.

What made the two Shels matches unwelcoming? Geniune question tbh.

Ofcourse English football is better, sure there's Blue Square stadiums that are in much better nick than LoI ones, because they have crowds to pay for it and available grants from the Government/FA. I seen an attendance in the Conference South of over 500, that's the 6th tier in England, which is probably on par with the LSL.

bullvine wrote: »

:

-The grounds aren't welcoming and feel intimidating and you feel out of place going to watch a game there.
-Advertizement is also a big issue, the average football fan who watches the premier league doesn't know the Irish games are on most of the time.
-Too many clubs in the Dublin area doesn't help, if they took a leaf from Rugby's book and had provincial teams it might help and entered into a Celtic League. (Never happen though)!

Intimidating in what way?

Clubs in the majority don't have the funds to largely promote matches, etc... as clubs are largely run by volunteers.

Dublin has a population of 1 million, 5 clubs means logically 200,000 with say 10% interest in football that's 2,000. I'd happily take a Shels support of 2,000.

Pj! wrote: »

It's very much a product. And should be treated like one. Not like some sort of religion that people should visit regardless.

Wrong, products are for consumers, ask people from all over the world who are passion fans and they'll they you it's much more than a product. To barstoolers and day trippers, it's a product!

glenjamin wrote: »

Going to see a bunch of part timers or watch some of the best players in the world play in the best league in world? Hmm....

I'd like to support an Irish club but it really doesn't appeal to me at all. It's not about the money it's about the entertainment that's on offer. If I had to pick going to a live LOI game or watching a Prem game on the telly then I'd pick the Prem game same as most people.

Will the LoI magically turn into a professional league over night with top notch facilites? It takes fans, to get sponsorship, to get noticed then by the government.

Entertainment? Again, sums you up as a football fan. There's a level of entertainment involved in supporting a team, but there's more to it than that. Why not support an Irish club on a Friday evening and watch the Prem matches on Saturday and Sunday?

Jayob10 wrote: »

Irish fans are consumers to the very definition. They just want to view the best quality, or what someone has drummed into them is the best quality event, and most popular. And its not going to change, because deep down the love for the actual game is not actually there. People are just seduced by the popularity and hype surrounding it.

Bingo!

Ares

Gavin shels wrote: »

What made the two Shels matches unwelcoming? Geniune question tbh.

The constant berating of their own players and the referee was not enjoyable.

There were a pair of young Shelbourne fans who called me and my companion a 'pair of knáckers' because we had the temerity to ask them why they kept abusing the linesman's family.

We then spoke to a pair of men to our other side at half time and they went on a rant about the government, the foreigners and generally being ignorant and unenjoyable company.

That happened the first time. The second game wasnt particularly better so I haven't gone since. As I said before maybe its the working class element of Shelbourne that makes it unappealing.

DazMarz

I've gone to a few games over the past few years; Bray Wanderers mostly but also St. Pat's and UCD (I was a student up there for 3 years and never went to a game while I was there! But have gone to a couple of matches since... go figure).

Of course everything is going to be of a 'lesser' standard in the LOI than in the Premier League; the money isn't there! When Premier League clubs can charge upwards of STG£50 for a ticket into their games, and you can get into LOI games for as little as €5 or €10, it's obvious. Add to that the lack of funding from television that is so rich for clubs in other top flight leagues and the problem of finances becomes apparent.

But at the same time, it's a bit of craic. I go with some of my friends, we have a bit of fun, get a live football fix, bit of banter and a feeling of 'belonging'. That last point is something that is nigh on impossible to get from watching a game on TV. There is a great feeling from being there that is hard to describe. You get it from being at a live game, regardless of the code. Nothing beats being there.

The main problem for me is promotion; there are times that I simply don't know when games are on! Bray Wanderers would be my closest club, and there is little/no promotion done. Nothing in the local papers that I can see, a Facebook page that is sporadically updated, etc. There is an advertising hoarding outside the Carlisle Grounds, but I'm rarely driving past that area.

Yeah, it's not as good as the Premier League, nor is it ever likely to be... but that doesn't mean it should be so neglected and forgotten. I can see the argument from both sides about the issues of quality, comfort, convenience, etc.

But it is really up to the guys at the top in the FAI to get up and sort it; their total focus is solely upon the national team and they pay little attention to the domestic league and treat clubs very badly (reading an article in the Times on Saturday in the Sport section was very revealing).

PhlegmyMoses

Ares wrote: »

The constant berating of their own players and the referee was not enjoyable.

There were a pair of young Shelbourne fans who called me and my companion a 'pair of knáckers' because we had the temerity to ask them why they kept abusing the linesman's family.

We then spoke to a pair of men to our other side at half time and they went on a rant about the government, the foreigners and generally being ignorant and unenjoyable company.

That happened the first time. The second game wasnt particularly better so I haven't gone since. As I said before maybe its the working class element of Shelbourne that makes it unappealing.

You're most likely working class mate.

Also, if you don't like hearing the officials being abused then attending any football match isn't for you. This most certainly isn't unique to a Shels match. I don't partake in it myself but I don't let others doing it bother me either.

DrumSteve

As a bohs fan and a liverpool fan I dont think they need to be mutually exclusive.

People cant be forced to like LOI. All the LOI can do is continue to promote its game in local communities and hope it seeds.

Gavin "shels"

Ares wrote: »

The constant berating of their own players and the referee was not enjoyable.

There were a pair of young Shelbourne fans who called me and my companion a 'pair of knáckers' because we had the temerity to ask them why they kept abusing the linesman's family.

We then spoke to a pair of men to our other side at half time and they went on a rant about the government, the foreigners and generally being ignorant and unenjoyable company.

That happened the first time. The second game wasnt particularly better so I haven't gone since. As I said before maybe its the working class element of Shelbourne that makes it unappealing.

Wow, just wow!

Aside from Shels matches have you even been to other matches? Berating players and the ref? Really?

Kids call you a name? Jesus!

Why did you continue listening to the pair of men? Should have just said you need to pop to the jacks.

Working class element? Christ on a bike, football for the majority was reared on lower/working classes. Even in the top levels in England they'd be "working class elements".

DazMarz

Abusing players and officials happens everywhere in football. England, Ireland, everywhere.

Also, it happens just as bad in the GAA too; if not worse sometimes.

Gavin "shels"

DazMarz wrote: »

Abusing players and officials happens everywhere in football. England, Ireland, everywhere.

Also, it happens just as bad in the GAA too; if not worse sometimes.

A court threw out a case today of a ref being assaulted on a pitch by a fan! Sticks and stones!

Captain Havoc

Ares wrote: »

Until the LOI clubs upgrade their facilities then I don't see why people would travel to watch LOI. Why would you go 45 minutes in your car to a delapidated stadium to watch second rate action on a Friday night when one could watch a good Championship match on Sky from the comfort of your own sitting room. In reality, its an absolute no brainer.

Stadiums have been done up recently, the Jodi stand in Dalymount is nice (I know the rest of the ground is kip), Turners Cross, Tallaght, The Showgrounds, UCD bowl, Athlone, Flancare Park, Eamon Deacy Park have been renovated or built recently to a good standard.

bullvine wrote: »

-The grounds aren't welcoming and feel intimidating and you feel out of place going to watch a game there.
-Advertizement is also a big issue, the average football fan who watches the premier league doesn't know the Irish games are on most of the time.
-Too many clubs in the Dublin area doesn't help, if they took a leaf from Rugby's book and had provincial teams it might help and entered into a Celtic League. (Never happen though)!

I think the intimidation can be from your own head. You've no knowledge of the teams and people have formed opinions on players, tactics etc... over a period of time. A LOI fan would probably feel the same watching EPL for the first time in a stadium over there.
Advertisement is a big issue.
I think the Dublin issue is there, you've got Cork, Derry and Sligo in the premier league away from the east coast, it doesn't really give it a national feel. Waterrford and Limerick will restore that a good bit next season.

CSF wrote: »

I was under the impression that football was a sport, not a product. Not in the Premiership of course, but elsewhere.

It's definitely a product (as well as a sport). The marketing mix a lot of people would have done in school applies.
Product, it's a good one but there are still a good few stadia that let the league down.
Price, €15 for premier and €10 for first division is reasonable.
Place, this lets the league down. My nearest LOI stadium from my work on a Friday is about 80km away (Carlow to Tallaght or Waterford), this would be true for a lot of people.
Promotion, another one that lets the league down. People need to stop asking "what's the FAI doing?" and start saying "This is how we are going to help our local club to grow". Clubs need to promote themselves better, blaming the FAI or barstoolers or anyone else isn't going to attract people to go to stadiums. A friend of mine got me back into LOI last season, I just got my driving license and then I was able to go to games, bring a friend to the last game of the season.

Sunday week is the FAI cup final in the Aviva, I assume tickets will be €10 in on the day. If you don't know the quality of the league, it'll cost you €10 to find out. On that note, I'm driving up from Kilkenny and should have space for one or two people in my car, if anyone is interested.

srfc19

DazMarz wrote: »

Feeling of 'belonging'. That last point is something that is nigh on impossible to get from watching a game on TV. There is a great feeling from being there that is hard to describe. You get it from being at a live game, regardless of the code. Nothing beats being there.

Bang on the money. I'm a Rovers fan from Sligo, have been all my life (Went to all home games and as many away games as possible).

Unfortunately I'm now living outside the country, watching the Pats game on TV I felt practically nothing when we won the league for the first time in my lifetime, and a long time before too.

It felt like I wasn't involved at all, and that is what supporting a team is about. You can't get it from watching a game on telly and anyone that thinks its even comparable is just straight up wrong.

If I can feel like this watching Rovers after moving away a few months ago, how can a United/Liverpool/Celtic fan have any sort of connection from visiting a city once every 3 years??

Blaming the standard is ridiculous, basically it comes down to being a fan of football or being a consumer of football.

DrumSteve

A fan or a consumer? Surely if you consider yourself a fan of a team it shouldnt matter how you follow them.

Personally speaking, Ive been going to dalymount since I was a baby, but I wouldnt denegrate anyone who chose to follow but not go to games. Each to their own.

batistuta9

CSF wrote: »

No, it's not silly. This whole thing where people have to 'support' good teams is ridiculous.

but if your reasoning is that people who support premiership clubs is: that people support good teams and it's ridiculous

then this can also be applied to the fans of the LOI clubs, who also support the teams at the highest level (in Ireland), surely it's also ridiculous that they support clubs at the highest level, for example if their Dubs who support pats and not their local LSL team or whatever club is closer

it's practically saying:

people who support one of best/biggest teams from the UK & Ireland = not real fans/event junkies/whatever

people who support one the best/biggest teams in Ireland = a great bunch of lads

_blank_

That guy who is dismissing football as "too working class" - embarassing, stick to the RDS and Leinster pal.

As for the "do you only buy Irish products and shop in Irish shops" thing.

Yeah, I try to as much as possible. I do most of my shopping in Dunnes, my veg is delivered weekly by a local start up, my drink of choice is Trouble Brewing's Dark Arts, an Irish brewery.

Now, I also eat pasta, rice or couscous, because they are delicious and usually nicer than cabbage, spuds and bacon. I also drink german dunkels, because they are amazing beers too. The fruit&veg man doesn't only deliver apples and strawberries, he also delivers pineapples and bananas, because the exotic fruits taste nice too.

But still, I go to watch Shelbourne play. I enjoy it, and I think if everyone went to five or six LoI games, in a row - instead of just picking one game here and there - then they'd also start to enjoy it. Learn the player's names, get to know the guy beside you, listen to the chanting, look at the flags, have a pint in the bar, start hating Shamrock Rovers.

I alos watch the EPL on the telly on a Saturday and Sunday, I watch the CL during the week with the lads and a few cans.

You can eat apples and oranges it seems. Just don't compare the two.