Referendum 15th Nov

Kelefants

Polar Ice wrote: »

Whoever started calling the area defined on the architects concept drawings entitled "Music Hub" as a "Nightclub" should win the award for helping fuel the "I think I'm informed, but I'm not actually informed" vote.

That one word appears to be, by far, the biggest label used by those who wished to vote no on the basis of cost as a way to articulate their reasoning for voting no. Voting no on the basis of cost is fair, but the associated arguments and discussion that stemmed from the word 'nightclub' appeared to typify the general misinformed nature of everything to do with the referendum.

This lead to an abundance of comments along the lines of "Why are they trying to build a nightclub when the WiFi doesn't work" or "The money should be spent on creating more study space instead of a Nightclub" or "The SU can't run its shops, how could it run a nightclub?"

Don't forget the mandatory 'why do we need a cinema when we've a perfectly good one up the road'... If those were the actual plans i may have sided with them...

Peter T

Well if thats the case the yes party made a sh*t effort to inform people. Money has a part to play too and having a second referendum in second semester is a sneaky way to pass votes while many will be on coop and wont even think of voting. And what is the service behind these function rooms that the stables, scholars or pavilion cant provide ? Music hub and night club are not exactly miles away from each other. Both play music, both are an area where people gather. If anything whoever did the drawings should get the reward for "useless architect that cant portray there idea's properly".

http://www.anfocal.ie/news/5364/landslide-needed-to-ensure-levy-referendum-victory Id also like to point out the Student president calling the music hub " a state of the art nightclub/venue" So ye can thank an focal, the su president and pretty much every other article iv read that calls it a nightclub/ bar/ restaurant and finally "music area"

Kelefants

Peter T wrote: »

Well if thats the case the yes party made a sh*t effort to inform people. Money has a part to play too and having a second referendum in second semester is a sneaky way to pass votes while many will be on coop and wont even think of voting. And what is the service behind these function rooms that the stables, scholars or pavilion cant provide ? Music hub and night club are not exactly miles away from each other. Both play music, both are an area where people gather. If anything whoever did the drawings should get the reward for "useless architect that cant portray there idea's properly".

What about the people this semester on Erasmus or Co-op? Are they less important than those who will go next semester?

The event venue could hold the Charity week acts (no more outdoor acts on makeshift stages), any number of conferences, possibly Drama soc performances, Trad Soc, Dance UL... And a whole lot more I'm sure, these were just ones I thought of on the spot.

I agree that the artist didn't portray the idea properly though, it led to the misunderstanding.

Polar Ice

Peter T wrote: »

Well if thats the case the yes party made a sh*t effort to inform people.

http://www.anfocal.ie/news/5364/landslide-needed-to-ensure-levy-referendum-victory Id also like to point out the Student president calling the music hub " a state of the art nightclub/venue"

I agree entirely. I was the person who started this thread. At the time, I started it to try consolidate all the information available because it was nearly impossible to find any details.

FamousSeamus

I voted no and I did so cause the SU ignores (and continues to do so) key points.

The CS building is needed by computer students and by removing them from here without replacing it with another building will reduce the credibility of these courses and effects students, so far the SU says 'its not our problem' overlooks the fact that students are affected (also some lecturers said they would strike if the CS building was lost). The SU is ignoring many students by not listening to those who use and need the CS building and these people will vote no.

Also the new student centre is not needed, how many poeple go to Drama soc events? or any event with a stage? we have 2 empty units in the court yard and the SU want more for shops?? Its even said in An Focal itself (that the majority of students don't use the SU building so why build a bigger one? and don't get me started on UL radio, who listens to that?

Finally the 2/3 vote wasn't reached, its only a problem cause the SU didn't win. If roles had been reversed and the SU won by such a close margin there would be no talk of a new vote. If another referendum is run then its should be 3 seperate votes (am I correct in saynig the decision to merge them was in a AGM that didn't reach the Quorum? I thought decision wouldn't stand unless it reached the 200 mark?)

Thats my 2 cents anyway, this trend was very pro-SU just wanted to add to the other side

reunion

FamousSeamus wrote: »

I voted no and I did so cause the SU ignores (and continues to do so) key points.

The CS building is needed by computer students and by removing them from here without replacing it with another building will reduce the credibility of these courses and effects students, so far the SU says 'its not our problem' overlooks the fact that students are affected (also some lecturers said they would strike if the CS building was lost). The SU is ignoring many students by not listening to those who use and need the CS building and these people will vote no.

The SU can't keep everyone happy, it wasn't ignoring or not listening to students. It had information nights, articles in an focal and a campaign which maybe didn't get off to the best of starts. Even now, they have a survey which is wanting feedback from the vote (http://www.markclass.com/surveys/websurvey.asp?ci=67&si=578).

As for the CSIS building, this is up to the college to house the CSIS department not the SU. I have heard rumours that the university was going to build a new Computer science building which would house all of the CSIS department into the one structure. This was only a rumour though as no official university plan has been made.

FamousSeamus wrote: »

Also the new student centre is not needed, how many poeple go to Drama soc events? or any event with a stage? we have 2 empty units in the court yard and the SU want more for shops?? Its even said in An Focal itself (that the majority of students don't use the SU building so why build a bigger one? and don't get me started on UL radio, who listens to that?

Finally the 2/3 vote wasn't reached, its only a problem cause the SU didn't win. If roles had been reversed and the SU won by such a close margin there would be no talk of a new vote. If another referendum is run then its should be 3 seperate votes (am I correct in saynig the decision to merge them was in a AGM that didn't reach the Quorum? I thought decision wouldn't stand unless it reached the 200 mark?)

Quite a number of people go to an event with a stage. Brocon (an annual convection run by anime & manga and the games societies) gets over 300 attendees each year, however other weekly events would attract a smaller number. Also the plans for the student centre were not even close to being finalised.

The current area where the shops are located would have become the student medical centre, thus leaving no place for the shops and they were going to be relocated into the new Student Centre.

Regarding if there would be a revote if the referendum got 66.7%, the answer would be a no. A revote wouldn't even be considered if 66.7% of people had voted no; however we are now left with the awkward spot of the majority of people saying they are in favour of the projects with a minority saying they aren't. this warrents considering another referendum.

No referendum has been planned or given the go ahead as of yet. It would need to be passed at a general meeting that makes quorum to allow an additional referendum on a similar topic. A referendum can be called by 200 signatures, a class rep council meeting or by a general meeting.

FamousSeamus wrote: »

Thats my 2 cents anyway, this trend was very pro-SU just wanted to add to the other side

This thread did become very aggressive about being pro-yes at one stage and tbh it's nice to hear the views from some people that voted no.

Did you have any views about the other two projects?

supackofidiots

FamousSeamus wrote: »

I voted no and I did so cause the SU ignores (and continues to do so) key points.

The CS building is needed by computer students and by removing them from here without replacing it with another building will reduce the credibility of these courses and effects students, so far the SU says 'its not our problem' overlooks the fact that students are affected (also some lecturers said they would strike if the CS building was lost). The SU is ignoring many students by not listening to those who use and need the CS building and these people will vote no.

Also the new student centre is not needed, how many poeple go to Drama soc events? or any event with a stage? we have 2 empty units in the court yard and the SU want more for shops?? Its even said in An Focal itself (that the majority of students don't use the SU building so why build a bigger one? and don't get me started on UL radio, who listens to that?

Finally the 2/3 vote wasn't reached, its only a problem cause the SU didn't win. If roles had been reversed and the SU won by such a close margin there would be no talk of a new vote. If another referendum is run then its should be 3 seperate votes (am I correct in saynig the decision to merge them was in a AGM that didn't reach the Quorum? I thought decision wouldn't stand unless it reached the 200 mark?)

Thats my 2 cents anyway, this trend was very pro-SU just wanted to add to the other side

agree with everything said here. scrap the student centre plans, put the levy at 50 - 70 euro. the student centre idea is crazy, i'd vote for pitches and arena and it would probably have passed if that crazy su centre wasn't included in the idea.

very poor campaign organised in the original week by the way.

Polar Ice

reunion wrote: »

The SU can't keep everyone happy
...
Even now, they have a survey which is wanting feedback from the vote (http://www.markclass.com/surveys/websurvey.asp?ci=67&si=578).

ChrisOF

I was in favour of all three projects, but I have to say the questions in that survey are distressingly biased twords a particular viewpoint.

Take Question 4 for example:

In the recent student levy referendum it was proposed to redevelop Maguires pitches which are in a poor state and often unusable. Is this a worthwhile investment for UL students?

While the bit underlined is perfectly true, including it in the question can only act to scew the feedback from those who voted no twords a more favourable position.