Splitting South eastern hospitals

Dunmoreroader

Good man Mr Fennell, bet you weren't thinking along those lines when CIT got to join the WIT University bandwagon. Anyway, thats why I think a poll would be useful - to see how many in Carlow & Kilkenny have turned their back on the Southeast. Is it all the Dubs that have moved to Carlow and don't have any concept of 'the Southeast' and treat the place as a satellite of the Big Smoke or what?

road_high

Dunmoreroader wrote: »

Good man Mr Fennell, bet you weren't thinking along those lines when CIT got to join the WIT University bandwagon. Anyway, thats why I think a poll would be useful - to see how many in Carlow & Kilkenny have turned their back on the Southeast. Is it all the Dubs that have moved to Carlow and don't have any concept of 'the Southeast' and treat the place as a satellite of the Big Smoke or what?

Well you've to look at it from a Carlow person's POV. In Carlow town you are what equidistant between Dublin and Waterford? Carlow has much more stronger links with the Kildare/Dublin region. A lot of CW work in that area. Apart from KIlkenny, there is nowhere else in the SE they would be as closely linked with.
While they wouldn't like to see WRH downgraded, I doubt the WRH proposal bothers too many people in Carlow overly much or feel it affects them all that hugely as compared to somebody it South KK or Waterford itself.

Dunmoreroader

mfitzy wrote: »

Well you've to look at it from a Carlow person's POV. In Carlow town you are what equidistant between Dublin and Waterford? Carlow has much more stronger links with the Kildare/Dublin region. A lot of CW work in that area. Apart from KIlkenny, there is nowhere else in the SE they would be as closely linked with.
While they wouldn't like to see WRH downgraded, I doubt the WRH proposal bothers too many people in Carlow overly much or feel it affects them all that hugely as compared to somebody it South KK or Waterford itself.

I suppose so. Maybe the joint Uni campaign will change attitudes if it ever happens, but that will be too late for saving regional medical specialties. At the risk of sounding like a broken record; keep it in the region.

road_high

Not sure if that's a wider Carlow view but the Fennell guy wanted St. Lukes to be linked with a Dublin hospital and he represents his area so he surely must be tune with the view locally being as such. In fairness he had a point about HSE South. Whatever about Kilkenny, Carlow has no link to faraway counties like Limerick/Cork/Kerry but yet we are all lumped into HSE South.
Only half caught the discussion but Bagenalstown was mentioned also and some councillor there was fully supportive of St. Lukes (naturally) but again echoed Fennell's view on joining Dublin.

I think there will be more tomorrow on the Sue Nunn show.

Dunmoreroader

mfitzy wrote: »

Not sure if that's a wider Carlow view but the Fennell guy wanted St. Lukes to be linked with a Dublin hospital and he represents his area so he surely must be tune with the view locally being as such. In fairness he had a point about HSE South. Whatever about Kilkenny, Carlow has no link to faraway counties like Limerick/Cork/Kerry but yet we are all lumped into HSE South.
Only half caught the discussion but Bagenalstown was mentioned also and some councillor there was fully supportive of St. Lukes (naturally) but again echoed Fennell's view on joining Dublin.

I think there will be more tomorrow on the Sue Nunn show.

This is cracked. Forget Cork, Bagnalstown is an hour from WRH less if an ambulance in a hurry.

road_high

Dunmoreroader wrote: »

This is cracked. Forget Cork, Bagnalstown is an hour from WRH less if an ambulance in a hurry.

That's true but it's obvious the county is not comfortable in the Southern HSE and I cannot blame them.
All the counties surrounding them (bar KK and Wex) are part of the Dublin East HSE area. Rightly or wrongly there is a perception in Carlow that they are an after thought in such a set up. That is where Fennell is coming from.
That would be a belief in Kilkenny to a big extent also, as I know someone working in healthcare area that has had to go to regional meetings down in Cork and constantly talked about it being non sensical.

I think Carlow/KK's worst nightmare would be to be linked in with WRH (which makes sense) but then WRH being subsumed into Cork anyhow and St. Lukes ending up as some far away outpost of Cork with half it's patients from even further away and having to go all the way to Cork for treatments.

redtelephone

mfitzy wrote: »

While they wouldn't like to see WRH downgraded, I doubt the WRH proposal bothers too many people in Carlow overly much or feel it affects them all that hugely as compared to somebody it South KK or Waterford itself.

That's very true I think. I also think many people in Carlow would regard it as s waste of time and resources to have to go to Dublin via Kilkenny for certain treatments e.g. orthopaedics. Better to go straight to Dublin.
Also if this comes to pass, an ambulance leaving Carlow in an emergency will have to make a very quick decision on whether to turn for DN or KK

road_high

I believe Phil Hogan was on Sue Nunn this morning to discuss this very issue. Anyone hear what he said?

road_high

http://kclr96fm.com/the-sue-nunn-show/minister-phil-hogan-st-lukes-hospital-and-household-charge-letters/

Dunmoreroader

Is it possible that Hogan with O'Reillys help is playing some class of long game whereby they frighten the life out of WRH with threatened (but not realistic) downgrade so WRH doesn't attempt to subsume some of St Luke's services as happened in other regions e.g. Mid-West Regional & Nenagh & Ennis?
Listening to him, he doesn't sound like one of the only two govt. ministers from the Southeast assuaging the fears of the people of the Southeast. He just sounds like a local TD saying "I'll make sure our hospital is OK". Yes I know its KCLR but he knows it will be picked up all over the region.

road_high

Of course he was going to say St. Lukes is his priority. He represents Carlow/KK and that's where his votes come from!!
He didn't say it but reading between the lines he supports a move away from WRH

Dunmoreroader

mfitzy wrote: »

Of course he was going to say St. Lukes is his priority. He represents Carlow/KK and that's where his votes come from!!
He didn't say it but reading between the lines he supports a move away from WRH

Ok, so know where Hogan the St Luke's hospital candidate stands. We also know J.P. Phelan has threatened voting against the govt if a WRH downgrade is on the cards. What about Ann Phelan, McGuinness and Deeering? Any of them made a declaration?

Bards

mfitzy wrote: »

Of course he was going to say St. Lukes is his priority. He represents Carlow/KK and that's where his votes come from!!
He didn't say it but reading between the lines he supports a move away from WRH

..and how many people in South Kilkenny voted for him, Surley it would be a mistake for him to ignore the electorate in Mullinavat, Mooncoin, Ferrybank, Slieverue etc. who are only circa 15 mins away from WRH?

....do Kilkenny people really think they will be better looked after with shorter waiting times etc. in a larger? (WRH is larger than Tallagh, Crumlin etc.) hospital in Dublin with an increased population to look after?

...or is it a case of Bitting off your nose to spite your face. Do Kilkenny people (Hogan supportes) really hate Waterford that much? or is it a case of If we can't have it than neither should Waterford?

how many other services can Waterford afford to loose (IDA, ESB, Bord Gais, Mail Sorting,VEC,City Status,Ambulance Service, etc, etc) how many Kilkenny Jobs does Waterford support?

The City is right on the Border with Kilkenny FFS, it's not as if it is 30 odd miles away from the border, and could do with a bit of help from our very near neighbours, and supporting the regional capital,otherwise we (S.E) will all be loosers.

Cullen made sure the M9 went through Kilkenny, he could have taken the easy option and routed it through New Ross, Enniscorthy etc as that is what the Dubs and Wexford politicians wanted.

But he saw the benefits routing it through the heart of the S.E for the majority of the population.

Cork has about the same amount of TD's as the whole S.E. but they are united behind Cork City. Unfortunately the same cannot be said for our representatives in the S.E. Divide and Conquer seems to be the order of the day and all it actually does is to help Cork, Dublin & Galway, grow stronger at our expense. just have a look through some media reports over the last 12 months. Where has all the new (1,000's) jobs gone? How many did the S.E get in comparision?

catbear

I'll throw this out once more for consideration, wouldn't redistricting of the current political boundaries make more sense? Therefore avoiding conflicts of interest when ensuring services are evenly spread.
I know some are strongly attached to their "county" identity but this is the 21st century! Then again after what happened in Galway I wonder if Ireland is still a feudal fiefdom subservient to a medieval church idea of the world.

Dunmoreroader

catbear wrote: »

I'll throw this out once more for consideration, wouldn't redistricting of the current political boundaries make more sense? Therefore avoiding conflicts of interest when ensuring services are evenly spread.
I know some are strongly attached to their "county" identity but this is the 21st century! Then again after what happened in Galway I wonder if Ireland is still a feudal fiefdom subservient to a medieval church idea of the world.

I agree, a Waterford City & District Council should include everything from Carrick to New Ross to Tramore which is basically its commuter belt. But look at the stink when Waterford City Council applied for a boundary extension of a few thousand acres into KK which was mostly de facto part of urban Waterford already. Remember the Kilkenny People and their Nazi comparisons and Big Phil manning the barricades!
The regional authorities are only talking shops too but if given powers, the SE HQed in Waterford and equitably funded vis-a-vis Cork, Limerick & Galway would rectify the inter-county bun fights and investment bypass of the region for the benefit of ALL the region including KK.
We can only dream.

wellboytoo

catbear wrote: »

I'll throw this out once more for consideration, wouldn't redistricting of the current political boundaries make more sense? Therefore avoiding conflicts of interest when ensuring services are evenly spread.
I know some are strongly attached to their "county" identity but this is the 21st century! Then again after what happened in Galway I wonder if Ireland is still a feudal fiefdom subservient to a medieval church idea of the world.

It is too hot a political potato for politicians to handle , leave the boundaries alone and set up a Municipal Authority that ignores them, same as Britain did thirty years ago, and no bother everybody gets to wear the jersey they want but gets good economic services , (might be pushing at bit there?)

Captain Havoc

Dunmoreroader

Jeez,
Goodwin’s Law??? That’s the 2nd time in a month I've had that thrown at me. What a great way to kill a debate. Need I remind who raised that ugly reference...I was going to post a link but then I’d be accused of perpetuating it.
Keep your kitty-cat pictures on your mantelpiece please.:)

Bards

Exactly - a Moderator should know Better, Please delete that offensive post

wellboytoo

I have posted this on another thread but it is worth having a look at, for everybody in the Southeast if Phil has his way there will no longer be a Southeast region, see page twelve.


http://www.environ.ie/en/Publication...d,31310,en.pdf

Captain Havoc

Dunmoreroader wrote: »

Jeez,
Goodwin’s Law??? That’s the 2nd time in a month I've had that thrown at me. What a great way to kill a debate. Need I remind who raised that ugly reference...I was going to post a link but then I’d be accused of perpetuating it.
Keep your kitty-cat pictures on your mantelpiece please.:)

I was making humor of your Nazi reference. I think comparing anyone in this country to national socialism is comical, I know you were referencing it and not making the comparison.

Bards wrote: »

Exactly - a Moderator should know Better, Please delete that offensive post

If you find that offensive, I think you should avoid the internet and perhaps most other media. I think you have an idea of moderators that is distant from what we are, don't become someone who tries to "get one" over a mod. If you have a problem with a post, report it. If you have a problem with a mod or mod action please report it to one of the category mods.

Dunmoreroader

Captain Havoc wrote: »

I was making humor of your Nazi reference. I think comparing anyone in this country to national socialism is comical, I know you were referencing it and not making the comparison.


If you find that offensive, I think you should avoid the internet and perhaps most other media. I think you have an idea of moderators that is distant from what we are, don't become someone who tries to "get one" over a mod. If you have a problem with a post, report it. If you have a problem with a mod or mod action please report it to one of the category mods.

Fair enough Captain , i can't speak for Bards but I don't have any problem with Mods. But I do prefer rockers.

wellboy76

wellboytoo wrote: »

I have posted this on another thread but it is worth having a look at, for everybody in the Southeast if Phil has his way there will no longer be a Southeast region, see page twelve.


http://www.environ.ie/en/Publication...d,31310,en.pdf

He's tieing up a few loose ends first though


http://www.kilkennypeople.ie/news/local/st-luke-s-is-safe-hogan-1-4475804

road_high

wellboy76 wrote: »

He's tieing up a few loose ends first though


http://www.kilkennypeople.ie/news/local/st-luke-s-is-safe-hogan-1-4475804

And your point being what exactly? Really great way there to KK/CW people on WRH's side by skitting a much needed investment in our General Hospital.

road_high

wellboytoo wrote: »

I have posted this on another thread but it is worth having a look at, for everybody in the Southeast if Phil has his way there will no longer be a Southeast region, see page twelve.


http://www.environ.ie/en/Publication...d,31310,en.pdf

What's this, link not working for me?

Dunmoreroader

mfitzy wrote: »

And your point being what exactly? Really great way there to KK/CW people on WRH's side by skitting a much needed investment in our General Hospital.

Interesting how the Wexford People newspaper 'gets it' about threatened loss of REGIONAL services at WRH affecting their county unlike Kilkenny People. No "We're only concerned with our general hospital, fcuk the consequences elsewhere" type coverage. They seem to see that breaking up SE hospitals group and linking Wex. Gen.with Vincent's brings more negatives than positives for Wexford.

road_high

Dunmoreroader wrote: »

Interesting how the Wexford People newspaper 'gets it' about threatened loss of REGIONAL services at WRH affecting their county unlike Kilkenny People. No "We're only concerned with our general hospital, fcuk the consequences elsewhere" type coverage. They seem to see that breaking up SE hospitals group and linking Wex. Gen.with Vincent's brings more negatives than positives for Wexford.

Simple. Don't read it if it doesn't go along with your own opinion!! Also, I don't believe that's far from the only opinion in wexford on the proposals which their 150k people are perfectly entitled to do as far the biggest county in the se.

Dunmoreroader

mfitzy wrote: »

Simple. Don't read it if it doesn't go along with your own opinion!! Also, I don't believe that's far from the only opinion in wexford on the proposals which their 150k people are perfectly entitled to do as far the biggest county in the se.

I'm reading the various other regional papers to see if everyone has the same KK People partisan approach of 'lets cut off our nose to spite our face'. Seems not.

comeraghs

There is another protest march in Waterford City on Dec 8th for those that are interested in keeping services in the South-East.


http://www.savewaterford.com/

Dunmoreroader

comeraghs wrote: »

There is another protest march in Waterford City on Dec 8th for those that are interested in keeping services in the South-East.


http://www.savewaterford.com/

Apparantly the consultants in St. Luke's have voted overwhelmingly to secede from the Southeast hospital network. This has nothing to do with clinical excellence or the best interests of patients in Carlow/Kilkenny, it's all politics. The knock on negative effects at WRH will be enormous despite Reilly's weasel words of reassurance.
Shame on them.
Ok silent majority in Kilkenny, time to get off your arses and protest!