5 ways to improve Irish Rugby long term

twinytwo

rrpc wrote: »

You don't appear to have much experience of GAA if you can say that. Progression in GAA countrywide is a jokeshop. You see it time and again where the selectors and coaches pick lads from their own clubs and haven't the first clue (even if they were bothered) about how to select the best players.

In GAA it's all about who you know, not what you know.

Or even worse, coaches picking their own kids, who they consider to be gods gift even though they are actually ****e

Swiwi

twinytwo wrote: »

we also need to protect our players better. we have all seen that one guy with freaky skills, or that unfit version of SOB that teams cant handle so they eventually "take him out".

This is unfortunately common place in all our sports

You mean Richie McCaw:)

twinytwo

Swiwi wrote: »

You mean Richie McCaw:)

big difference between being taken out because you are good and taken out because your messing around on the wrong side of the ruck;)

Swiwi

twinytwo wrote: »

big difference between being taken out because you are good and taken out because your messing around on the wrong side of the ruck;)

Oh, I didn't see that coming

Jawgap

rrpc wrote: »

You don't appear to have much experience of GAA if you can say that. Progression in GAA countrywide is a jokeshop. You see it time and again where the selectors and coaches pick lads from their own clubs and haven't the first clue (even if they were bothered) about how to select the best players.

In GAA it's all about who you know, not what you know.

I don't - which is why I was writing about perception, not the actuality of the situation as it may or may nor exist in the administration and management of either sport or their respective governing bodies.

There's not much point in correcting the reality, if the perception remains unchanged.

Fishooks12

rrpc wrote: »

You don't appear to have much experience of GAA if you can say that. Progression in GAA countrywide is a jokeshop. You see it time and again where the selectors and coaches pick lads from their own clubs and haven't the first clue (even if they were bothered) about how to select the best players.

In GAA it's all about who you know, not what you know.

twinytwo wrote: »

Or even worse, coaches picking their own kids, who they consider to be gods gift even though they are actually ****e

Yes, because that kind of thing never happens in rugby

Get real lads

Klunk_NZ

Bonus point system at all levels. Seriously it makes a huge difference in attacking mindsets.

medicicosmo

Big thumbs up.

mfceiling

Brendan97 wrote: »

Selective breeding?

You mean like ferris and katie taylor getting it on!!

ormond lad

Jawgap wrote: »

As a coach I'm on my second run - taking a team from U7 through to U19. I'm at the U16/17 stage at the moment - based on that, my experience is that kids / lads perceive that unless you are playing schools rugby at a decent level (FGC or JCT) then the higher levels of the game are closed off to you, regardless of ability. Again, rightly or wrongly that's the perception among the groups I've worked with.

Saying that, I'd like to think that ability will shine through, but if a 14 year old has a choice between GAA and rugby and perceives that by staying in rugby the best he can hope for is a place on the club's 1st XV he may opt to go for GAA where progression is more readily discernible.

Generally, players good at rugby tend to be good at other sports and there's plenty of competition for early teen players of talent. The problem can be trying to get him to hang on in rugby for another two seasons until the development squads can have a look at him.

So what to do? Well, for all my criticism of the schools system, it definitely works (even if it is wasteful on some levels) when you see the quality of player that comes through from a fairly narrow player base. I think elements of the system should be brought into the club youth set up, starting with an intensification and broadening of the competitions at U13 to U15 level.

And while we're at it - we could do away with one personal bugbear of mine - the difference in regulations between school and club rugby when it comes to lifting. If a player is old enough to do it in school he should be old enough to it in the clubs.

I dont agree with you when you say kids percieve that unless you are in a decent school you cant "make it". Thats from my experience playing with friends etc whove played interpro the past few years
I dont think thats true at all that unless you go to "x" or "y" school that the top levels of the game are closed off and dont think many in my club or others close to us think that way either.
Schools rugby is very wasteful with the numbers that drop off between 16-19 years old. clubs and schools need to work together better to keep kids playing the sport.
Your sentence "Generally, players good at rugby tend to be good at other sports and there's plenty of competition for early teen players of talent" can easily be turned around and that players good at soccer/gaelic/hurling tend to be good at rugby.
What exactly do you want to change about competitions at u13/15 level?

Only difference between youths and schools wit regard to lineout lifting is in schools rugby at junior cup level you can lift as its u16 level while in youths rugby most clubs only tend to field at the main age groups which are 15s and 17s and at 15s level there is no lifting while at 17s there is lifting.

Jawgap

ormond lad wrote: »

I dont agree with you when you say kids percieve that unless you are in a decent school you cant "make it". Thats from my experience playing with friends etc whove played interpro the past few years
I dont think thats true at all that unless you go to "x" or "y" school that the top levels of the game are closed off and dont think many in my club or others close to us think that way either.
Schools rugby is very wasteful with the numbers that drop off between 16-19 years old. clubs and schools need to work together better to keep kids playing the sport.
Your sentence "Generally, players good at rugby tend to be good at other sports and there's plenty of competition for early teen players of talent" can easily be turned around and that players good at soccer/gaelic/hurling tend to be good at rugby.
What exactly do you want to change about competitions at u13/15 level?

Only difference between youths and schools wit regard to lineout lifting is in schools rugby at junior cup level you can lift as its u16 level while in youths rugby most clubs only tend to field at the main age groups which are 15s and 17s and at 15s level there is no lifting while at 17s there is lifting.

I refer the honourable gentleman to the answer I gave some moments ago.....

"I think elements of the system should be brought into the club youth set up, starting with an intensification and broadening of the competitions at U13 to U15 level."

these competitions should run to national level.

There's much more participation in rugby now so more clubs are running teams at year intervals rather than two year intervals (U15, U16 etc instead of U15 and U17). My own club has two teams at U14, U15 - we've no U16, but we've three teams at U17.

Lifting is allowed @ U15 in Ulster Schools Competitions.

its_phil

ormond lad wrote: »

Only difference between youths and schools wit regard to lineout lifting is in schools rugby at junior cup level you can lift as its u16 level while in youths rugby most clubs only tend to field at the main age groups which are 15s and 17s and at 15s level there is no lifting while at 17s there is lifting.

The Leinster Junior cup is u15.

ormond lad

Jawgap wrote: »

I refer the honourable gentleman to the answer I gave some moments ago.....

"I think elements of the system should be brought into the club youth set up, starting with an intensification and broadening of the competitions at U13 to U15 level."

these competitions should run to national level.

There's much more participation in rugby now so more clubs are running teams at year intervals rather than two year intervals (U15, U16 etc instead of U15 and U17). My own club has two teams at U14, U15 - we've no U16, but we've three teams at U17.

Lifting is allowed @ U15 in Ulster Schools Competitions.

sorry thought junior cup was 16s.
No i dont think u13 to u15 competitions need to go to national level. why should they?
Leave it at regional level. in munster at these age groups there isnt even provincial competitions. there is only u13/14/15 regional competitions.
Some clubs can field at every age group but not all and most need to go 15s/17s/19s to field and cant field at 14s/16s as well
the kids at these age groups get enough games without going on to provincial/national level