Star Wars: The Force Awakens [** SPOILERS FROM POST 4472 ONWARD **]

johnny_ultimate

A few stray thoughts to add after a day's reflection:

• I love the visual fluency of this film. There's quite a few shots - most prominently Rey staring spacewards while wearing her scavanged helmets, or the the final few minutes (which are simply stunning) - that thrillingly articulate exactly what they need to without a word said. The script certainly isn't without it's shares of expository dialogue, but it achieves a confident balance between internalising and externalising what the characters are going through (it helps that, perhaps for the first time in the series, it feels like most of the lead actors can hold a close-up, and Abrams rightly goes wild on that front).
  
• I felt it comfortably achieved both being a standalone story and the opening chapter in a new trilogy, something I feel few franchise films pull off. There's a few lingering plot threads for sure - some potentially more fruitful than others - but reflecting on it almost every major character gets a satisfying, complete arc. All of them develop and move forward in their own distinct ways, while setting the stage for whatever happens next. Even taking the
  search for Luke as the film's core focus
  , it has a supremely gratifying and intoxicatingly cinematic pay-off,
  even if Hamill only gets a minute of screentime.
  . Like The Empire Strikes Back, even what's technically 'unresolved' doesn't feel like it's been cynically held back IMO, and instead is its own thing while being one act of a much bigger thing.
  
• There is probably a slight over-reliance on call backs and original trilogy homages, especially in the space battles (the film's weakest link, being merely competent). But **** it I think they earned most of them - it's been a long 33 years after all, and the filmmakers take full advantage of the thrill and inherent curiosity they know the audience will feel when a (now older) familiar face pops on screen. For a franchise that has always 'borrowed' liberally from its various sources of inspiration, it if anything seems poignantly fitting that it's now borrowing liberally from itself while still retaining an identity of its own. What I do hope is that they've gotten pretty much all of the nostalgic pandering out of the way, and Rian Johnson's film will be liberated as a result - now that the gang's all present and correct (more or less), there's more space to expand and subvert expectations.

Cantstandsya

bilston wrote: »

May 2017 I believe with Rogue One to keep us all occupied next year. I'm almost looking forward to that more than the new trilogy just because it has the potential anyway to be darker and maybe more of an adult (with a small a!!) Star Wars movie.

Why do people need more adult Star Wars movies? There are genuinely adult sci fi movies already.

It's like wishing for a kids' version of Ex Machina and Blade Runner?

Whyohwhy?

bilston wrote: »

You seem to be getting more down on the film with every post!

I know!! It's really annoying me myself, as it's really not as bad as I'm making it seem.

I... Hmm, just don't know at the moment. I'll be going to see it again soon, needs more analysis on my behalf.

I think I may be more pissed off that it's left me with more questions than answers. (which is a great hook, but I'll be watching everything that they release in anyway)

Possibly just annoyed that it's basically rehashing the OT in one movie and that they're disregarding the EU(unless it suits) there's so much great material there.

cork guitar player

Whyohwhy? wrote: »

As much of a huge fan that I am of star wars... That's a bit much. It would have been very hard to limbo under the low bar set by the prequels in all honesty.

Its an enjoyable addition to the franchise for sure, but hardly worthy of tears of joy imo. It's good, certainly not great though. I'm waiting for the "full cut" I don't care if it's 4 hours long, there's so much that must have been committed to film that we haven't seen, that will make it epic I feel

Im 41 and saw ROTJ on its release in cinema.

I saw all three movies in cinema when they were huge 1983/84

Thats why I shed a few tears.

I dont think you were there in the 80's with us by the sounds of it man...

cork guitar player

Whyohwhy? wrote: »

Anyone under 12,thats a star wars fan already(through whatever means) is gonna be blown away by this in the cinema. It's their "a new hope", (it's pretty much the same story, slightly tweaked, it's too fcukin similar, trench run, thermal weakness on the super weapon....)

But if people are weeping/tearing up over this film... I don't know, it's not that good, it certainly brought a smile to my face, but tears?!?

Jay us I dunno about that at all.

(I must add the caveat, people's experiences are different and their emotional attachment is subjective, I don't want to offend anyone, I just think that weeping etc, over this addition to star wars is silly. And I am a fcukin massive fan)

Jaysus your a cold one....

A-Train

Not long out I enjoyed but very much, it was good.

SimonTemplar

I like that it continues the Star Wars tradition of its final sequence being music only with no dialog and minimal sound effects. All previous 6 movies ended that way.

If I remember correctly, the final line of dialog was

Leia "May the force be with you".

uck51js9zml2yt

I'm pondering bringing my son to it..but at 5 I think he's a bit young still...any thoughts from parents ??

Myrddin

Just back from it now - thoroughly enjoyed it. It didn't quite live up to the steam-rolling hype-train behind it, but how could it?! It was a solid, solid Star Wars movie though, and definitely up there probably just a tad under Empire. I thought the new characters were all brilliant, energetic, believable, fun, relate-able, and engaging. The story was solid, and I think being a the first in the new trilogy, we're potentially in for a massive treat over the next two instalments with the way this has set the stage.

Look at the prequel trilogy, it used up two entire films setting the stage for the events that should have been at the start! This managed to set the stage, AND be a solid enjoyable SW film all at the same time. Yeah, I need to let it soak in but I left the cinema very happy with it. A few minor gripes:

1) There was no need, at all, to make the supreme leader/snoke a CG character. Not only that, but he looked crap I thought...like a CG character from ten years ago. There may be method in the madness, who knows, but I found him very jarring & not very original.

2) The CG Falcon looked good, but the way they had it crashing around banging into things all the time looked bad. That type of 'bouncing' is out of place with the way ships in SW appear I feel.

3) The score was fairly forgettable, which I found a let down. I was expecting much more of the music, but despite being passable, it never touched the prequels even.

4) I thought Rey's 'awakening' with the force was a bit, disconnected with what we've seen before. At the rate she's learning how to use the force, she'd be a Jedi Knight in a matter of weeks. However, I didn't find fault with her battling Ren, because we'd seen she was already very proficient with a staff...so substituting that for a light sabre, while facing a not fully trained Ren, balanced out for me. Fin fighting Ren was stretching it though, but I suspect given the storm troopers seemed to get sword fighting training as standard, it's perhaps not too much of a stretch - but is still a stretch!

5) Yeah, another death-star type weapon, another vulnerability, another "we have to get the shields down in order to attack" moment. Hard to deny it was very reminiscent of the original trilogy in that regard. I think they pulled it off very well regardless, but it did seem a tad 'safe'.

Actually speaking of that weapon, I've a question. Given it's powered by a star and drains that star in order to fire...is it only good for one or two shots? We seen it fire once, and then on the next charge the star died - but there's no indication the planet/weapon can move or reposition itself etc...so once the star it's near is drained is the weapon useless? I found that a bit confusing...

6) Also, why is the Republic allowing The First Order to build itself etc? Why are those against the Order called the resistance...as the Republic are the ruling government at the time. Should it not have been a war between the Republic and the Order? Calling it a resistance doesn't quite fit, given the Order aren't a governing body (or are they??)

johnny_ultimate

Whyohwhy? wrote: »

they're disregarding the EU(unless it suits) there's so much great material there.

It would be almost impossible to make a satisfying film while trying to stay loyal to the sprawling, convoluted extended universe.

Disregarding that pretty much entirely and letting the filmmakers explore the stories and characters they want to, without being tied down by hundreds of novels and comics, is the smartest move they could have made. The extended universe is still there for the people who want it. These films should and - for the vast majority of the audience who aren't familiar with the extended universe - must be their own things.

RoadhouseBlues

Saw it today. Really enjoyed it. Started smiling as soon as the Star Wars logo appeared and the music kicked in:-). Can't believe I just watched a sequel to Return of The Jedi:-):-):-). As someone else said, I thought Harrison Ford did a much better job, than in the last Indiana Jones movie. Just wondering about Snoke. People seem to be aware of the character. Is it from some of the spin off Star Wars books. Or is he a new edition to the saga. I thought the newcomers did a great job too. Also before I saw it, I thought BB droid was going to drive me mad. It was actually grand:-). Just on a side note. Its been a few years since I was at the cinema. When we were going through to the seating area, there were plastic type things stacked up outside the doors. I asked the person with me, were they basins in case children were excited and got sick. Don't ask me why I was thinking that. Apparently they were child booster seats......ahem ahem ahem:-):-):-)

Cantstandsya

Myrddin wrote: »

3) The score was fairly forgettable, which I found a let down. I was expecting much more of the music, but despite being passable, it never touched the prequels even.
)

Strongly agree with this. I had every intention of going to HMV or some such after the movie and picking up the soundtrack. The score was so forgettable that I just completely forgot I'd intended to buy it until I got back home. Not sure I'll bother.

cork guitar player

I think a whole lot of this movie was dealing with the cultural legacy of the films from 30/40 years ago.

JJ has now given all the nods and wink wink's to the old movies, bought back our old friends and introduced the new characters.

I was only really going to see this for Han, Luke , Chewie etc but to my surprise, I though the three new main characters were great,
I'm looking forward to seeing more of Poe, he is that young Han cockiness about him.

So I can now look forward to a fresh new Star Wars universe ,moving away from the three old protagonists and carrying on with these new characters, who, again I thought were fantastic.

Also , it was quite visceral, dark ,gritty and violent, love it

It goes to show how spectacularly wrong Lucas got it with the prequels. I understand he was doing his thing and its his baby but he flew right up his own arse with them.

I would LOVE to be a fly on the wall when Lucas first watches this, lol, I bet he is sick as a dog...

We have soem fantastic Star Wars films to look forward

Whyohwhy?

bilston wrote: »

May 2017 I believe with Rogue One to keep us all occupied next year. I'm almost looking forward to that more than the new trilogy just because it has the potential anyway to be darker and maybe more of an adult (with a small a!!) Star Wars movie.

I'm hoping that myself, it has serious potential. But being Disney it may not happen.
Even though SW is enough of a cash cow to support an adult theme, along with the kid friendly stuff.
Here's hoping...

geecee

Myrddin wrote: »

Just back from it now - A few minor gripes:

4) I thought Rey's 'awakening' with the force was a bit, disconnected with what we've seen before. At the rate she's learning how to use the force, she'd be a Jedi Knight in a matter of weeks. However, I didn't find fault with her battling Ren, because we'd seen she was already very proficient with a staff...so substituting that for a light sabre, while facing a not fully trained Ren, balanced out for me. Fin fighting Ren was stretching it though, but I suspect given the storm troopers seemed to get sword fighting training as standard, it's perhaps not too much of a stretch - but is still a stretch!

A lot of people are grumbling about

the Rey&Finn fight with Ren... but nobody seems to mention that Ren had just been shot moments ealrlier by Chewbacca and was bleeding quite profusely!
Remember Chewies Crossbow sent a stormtrooper hurtling backwards in an earlier scene... so it packs quite a punch!

Given this I think Ren put up a pretty decent fight

Whyohwhy?

cork guitar player wrote: »

Im 41 and saw ROTJ on its release in cinema.

I saw all three movies in cinema when they were huge 1983/84

Thats why I shed a few tears.

I dont think you were there in the 80's with us by the sounds of it man...

I'm not trying to my friend, knock your experience, I never can. (I was born in late '84) and I really do feel the emotional pull towards the movies, I've loved them, passionately since I got into them.

despite that, I just can't connect with this like that, I really did enjoy it, but just not to that extent myself. I'm not trying to to troll people it's just my opinion on it.
I'm really happy that people are enjoying it in this manner, it's what's makes it so special to you, me and so many others!

Wedwood

Just back from the cinema and delighted it was all I had hoped for.

The fun has returned to Star Wars.

Ps: I bet Daniel Craig played that stormtrooper who got 'Jedi mind tricked'

Thelomen Toblackai

I don't understand the movie. It's basically the script for a new hope with a couple tweaks. I actually preferred the prequel as at least it was something new.

Cantstandsya

Thelomen Toblackai wrote: »

I don't understand the movie. It's basically the script for a new hope with a couple tweaks. I actually preferred the prequel as at least it was something new.

If I have lobster for dinner tonight and dog food tomorrow is that better than having lobster twice?

cork guitar player

Thelomen Toblackai wrote: »

I don't understand the movie. It's basically the script for a new hope with a couple tweaks. I actually preferred the prequel as at least it was something new.

Lol, careful now

I get you a little bit, I think a certain amount of looking back had to be done before the movies can move forward.
The next one I think will be new ground totally..

Myrddin

cork guitar player wrote: »

It goes to show how spectacularly wrong Lucas got it with the prequels.

Very much so. Watching Ep1 side by side with this would be a startling comparison to make.

Thelomen Toblackai

Cantstandsya wrote: »

If I have lobster for dinner tonight and dog food tomorrow is that better than having lobster twice?

It's more like having steak then a burger and then reheating the leftover steak. Reheated steak ain't better than burger just cos it's steak.

Cantstandsya

Thelomen Toblackai wrote: »

It's more like having steak then a burger and then reheating the leftover steak. Reheated steak ain't better than burger just cos it's steak.

But it's not reheated steak, it's a new steak, just the same type of steak.

And the prequels were far closer to dog food than burgers.

Thelomen Toblackai

cork guitar player wrote: »

Lol, careful now

I get you a little bit, I think a certain amount of looking back had to be done before the movies can move forward.
The next one I think will be new ground totally..

It's wasn't just looking back. It's pretty much the exact same storyline as a new hope complete with rebels, empire, droid with the info, vader, death star, orphan from the desert.

It's good but I was hoping for an actual continuation not just a retelling of the original story

Thelomen Toblackai

Cantstandsya wrote: »

But it's not reheated steak, it's a new steak, just the same type of steak.

And the prequels were far closer to dog food than burgers.

Not it's the same steak in a different context so reheated. The prequels were far from dogfood.

cork guitar player

Thelomen Toblackai wrote: »

It's wasn't just looking back. It's pretty much the exact same storyline as a new hope complete with rebels, empire, droid with the info, vader, death star, orphan from the desert.

It's good but I was hoping for an actual continuation not just a retelling of the original story

I agree a little, but JJ gave us what we wanted after being so poorly treated with the prequels.

The next installment will have the chance to throw off the shackles of history and expectation a lot more.


I'll never watch the prequels again, I watched all of them once and it really broke my heart.

For younger folk who were introduced to Star Wars via the prequels I understand, a little, why some people rate the prequels.

Anyway this chestnut has been done to death and I think Mr. Plinkett drove the crucifix into the hearts of I,II & III with his in depth reviews.

Plniketts reviews were nearly worth the prequels being such a let down, Ive watched them about 10 times , hilarious, lol.

Whyohwhy?

cork guitar player wrote: »

Lol, careful now

I get you a little bit, I think a certain amount of looking back had to be done before the movies can move forward.
The next one I think will be new ground totally..

Get ya with that, but there's looking back and backtracking.
People don't need to be reminded really, there's dvd's etc for the newbies.

It should have been about advancing the narrative.

Declaring that the "canon" material since rotj was a bad move I think, so much good stuff there.

Whyohwhy?

Thelomen Toblackai wrote: »

Not it's the same steak in a different context so reheated. The prequels were far from dogfood.

The prequels were badly executed, not dogfood , more dog****.
Very hard to watch, they were not good movies.
The story was solid, presented terribly though. Can they be remade? Possibly, but will forever be tainted with the first presentation.

cork guitar player

Whyohwhy? wrote: »

Get ya with that, but there's looking back and backtracking.
People don't need to be reminded really, there's dvd's etc for the newbies.

It should have been about advancing the narrative.

Declaring that the "canon" material since rotj was a bad move I think, so much good stuff there.

For me, it was an emotional , self indulgent nostalgia trip, hence all the weeping.

Now thats done, I'd expect Disney's 'new' star wars to go forward from here.

Jeez, I remember posting here years ago under different handle with shock and horror that Disney had bought the rights. What a turn around..

JJ Abrams, Thank you so ,so much.

titan18

I liked it. Some dodgy moments at times, and was sort of a bit meh about the ending, as I was actually expecting more to happen (even if it was beautifully done)