Star Wars: The Force Awakens [** SPOILERS FROM POST 4472 ONWARD **]

faceman

Also. And this is just a nerdy peeve. The Jedi are cowards. When I was a child watching the OT I was enthralled by the Jedi and the mysticism and grandeur. But thanks to the prequels and now TFA, the cowards go into hiding every time the sh1t hits the fan!

TerrorFirmer

JonBon27 wrote: »

Also how's is your one suddenly savage with a light saber, in the other films there being trained since kiddos and Luke Skywalker is with obi wan. Too man holes didn't enjoy it at all and I'm a big fan

To be fair with that one, Kylo Ren was badly wounded, having been shot with the bowcaster and nicked by Fin a few times as well.

I think they could have handled it with more clarity, but the only reason Rey was able to best him was because he was so badly wounded in the first place.

Also she was already good with a staff so it isn't a stretch that she would be pretty good with any sort of weapon of the type in tandem with her natural force leaning (in the same way Anakin was able to pod race in TPM without any training).

quad_red

TerrorFirmer wrote: »

That's one of my big questions as well. Where are the republics armies? Why does the Rebel Alliance now appear to be far weaker than it ever was in the original trilogy? Why does the rebel alliance even still exist when it should have been absorbed into the republic?

And what exactly is this 'clone' army that Supreme Commander Snoke refers to? Is there a reserve army of clonetroopers still in operation as backup to the stormstroopers?

You could imagine that after the collapse of the empire, some of the rebel alliance may have splintered away. But it appears hugely reduced.

And separate to the Republic.

And if there is a clone army available, why would you ever use conscripts prone to requiring 'reeducation' (as Phasma described it).

Sad Professor

faceman wrote: »

Also. And this is just a nerdy peeve. The Jedi are cowards. When I was a child watching the OT I was enthralled by the Jedi and the mysticism and grandeur. But thanks to the prequels and now TFA, the cowards go into hiding every time the sh1t hits the fan!

What about Yoda a Jedi Master and former head of the Jedi Council hiding in a swamp in the OT? How is he any worse than Luke?

I also think Luke may turn out to be broken man after what happened with Kylo/Ben. The film ends with Rey holding out his lightsaber but we never see him take it. In fact, he looks pretty conflicted about it.

The Randy Riverbeast

TerrorFirmer wrote: »

And what exactly is this 'clone' army that Supreme Commander Snoke refers to? Is there a reserve army of clonetroopers still in operation as backup to the stormstroopers?

TerrorFirmer wrote: »

Also, there was a scene where Snoke made reference to using clones to get the job done, which was rebutted by General Huxx (or was it Ren...either way) who wanted to use his own stormtroopers - are we to understand that there is still an army of the original clonetroopers knocking about somewhere? It would be interesting to see how that comes into it down the line.

After the clone wars some clones were still part of the empire, new stormtroopers were trained or new clones made from various templates (jango was only 1 template)

I think kamino was attacked while the empire used it causing them to abandon clones completely but that might not be anon anymore or it was still functional. Any clones mentioned in TFA would be a new batch made up for them rather than clone wars clones, they would be ancient or dead by now.

budgemook wrote: »

Was Jedi celibacy just a prequel thing? ah right.



I think she must have had training and just didn't remember.

I think so, it came up in the old Republic as well but there was exceptions made.

Cantstandsya

TerrorFirmer wrote: »

And what exactly is this 'clone' army that Supreme Commander Snoke refers to? Is there a reserve army of clonetroopers still in operation as backup to the stormstroopers?

I don't remember Snoke referencing a clone army. The only line I remember is Ren goading Hux by saying something like "perhaps commander snoke should have used clones instead".

TerrorFirmer

Cantstandsya wrote: »

I don't remember Snoke referencing a clone army. The only line I remember is Ren goading Hux by saying something like "perhaps commander snoke should have used clones instead".

Yeah, sorry, it was a conversation between Kylo Ren and General Hux.

david75

Just had an idea!!

when Rey is scrubbing the parts shes scavenged on Jakku, she looks over at a really old weathered and withered woman who's kind of wrinkled and orange..perhaps that's the person she's left with whos hand we see holding her in the flashback?

Kiith

david75 wrote: »

Just had an idea!!

when Rey is scrubbing the parts shes scavenged on Jakku, she looks over at a really old weathered and withered woman who's kind of wrinkled and orange..perhaps that's the person she's left with whos hand we see holding her in the flashback?

I just assumed she saw herself in 50 years, or what she would become if things stayed as they were.

david75

well that too, but maybe this is the woman she's been left with?

faceman

Sad Professor wrote:

What about Yoda a Jedi Master and former head of the Jedi Council hiding in a swamp in the OT? How is he any worse than Luke?

Before the prequels came though all we knew was that he went into hiding. At the time I assumed it was because the Empire had got too powerful for the Jedi.

Sad Professor

faceman wrote: »

Before the prequels came though all we knew was that he went into hiding. At the time I assumed it was because the Empire had got too powerful for the Jedi.

Yeah but what’s different about Luke in TFA that makes him a coward?

WatchWolf

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mary_Sue

py2006

Jesus, some idiot as posted the

Han Solo

scene onto Youtube

py2006

Ok this might be interesting (or may be not).

Kathleen Kennedy at the premier in London:

"There will be a handful of new cast members in 'Episode VIII' but also all the cast members you see here tonight will be in it as well. We're excited to get back together. We start shooting 'Episode VIII' in January,

Harrison was there...





Edit: Having said that, I noticed in the cast press conference she nodded towards new cast saying that you will be back shooting in January. She had her back to Harrison and he shifted slightly in his seat as she kinda gave the spoiler away.

See from 4.46

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9Nn-zq-iisI

Hrududu

david75 wrote: »

Just had an idea!!

when Rey is scrubbing the parts shes scavenged on Jakku, she looks over at a really old weathered and withered woman who's kind of wrinkled and orange..perhaps that's the person she's left with whos hand we see holding her in the flashback?

I might be misremembering but when she has the flashback to her as a child it looks like the thing holding her by the arm might be the same thing she barters with for portions. But all you see is a hand so I could be way off. For some reason that's the conclusion I jumped to when watching it.

Sad Professor

I'm pretty sure the person holding her arm in the flashback is Unkar Plutt the scrap dealer.

johnny_ultimate

As trolls wage their futile, miserable little boycott against the film (because it has a female lead), it's worth celebrating how calmly, pleasantly progressive The Force Awakens is. While the more explicitly feminist themes and imagery of Mad Max: Fury Road are to be very much admired, we have a different beast here. This isn't a work that rubs its right-on-ness in your face, or feels like some act of liberal grandstanding. It merely offers up a universe where all the characters - regardless of their age, gender or race - have their own fair shot at being a hero or villain, a fascinating lead or a curious side character.

Not to overstate it or anything - not exactly like a transgender character is going to appearing on the Episode VIII posters :pac: - but given the franchise's previously wildly uneven spectrum when it comes to even the most basic diversity (as festive drinking game, rewatch the original trilogy and count the amount of speaking female characters - you'll almost be more sober than you were when you started) it's a pleasure to see the playing field as even here as it should be. But as said there's nothing remotely alienating or boundary pushing about it (obviously the trolls will still find cause for outrage, because that's what they do). It's simply a welcome development to see the biggest blockbuster of recent times driven by female and black lead actors, prominent & active older characters, and supported by all sorts of characters (human and non-human!) in between - and above all for the filmmakers to be confident enough to simply get on with it. That, in a sense, is a step beyond even the sort of explicitly 'politicsed' content seen in the likes of Mad Max.

py2006

johnny_ultimate wrote: »

As trolls wage their futile, miserable little boycott against the film (because it has a female lead), it's worth celebrating how calmly, pleasantly progressive The Force Awakens is. While the more explicitly feminist themes and imagery of Mad Max: Fury Road are to be very much admired, we have a different beast here. This isn't a work that rubs its right-on-ness in your face, or feels like some act of liberal grandstanding. It merely offers up a universe where all the characters - regardless of their age, gender or race - have their own fair shot at being a hero or villain, a fascinating lead or a curious side character.

Not to overstate it or anything - not exactly like a transgender character is going to appearing on the Episode VIII posters - but given the franchise's previously wildly uneven spectrum when it comes to even the most basic diversity (as festive drinking game, rewatch the original trilogy and count the amount of speaking female characters - you'll almost be more sober than you were when you started) it's a pleasure to see the playing field as even here as it should be. But as said there's nothing remotely alienating or boundary pushing about it (obviously the trolls will still find cause for outrage, because that's what they do). It's simply a welcome development to see the biggest blockbuster of recent times driven by female and black lead actors, prominent & active older characters - and above all for the filmmakers to be confident enough to simply get on with it. That, in a sense, is a step beyond even the sort of forward-thinking seen in the likes of Mad Max.

I got slightly worried when Rey said

"stop holding my hand"

that it was going to be a bit too feministy (if thats a word) but it kinda worked for her character and I loved her.

py2006

I am sure this question has been asked already but was C3P0's red arm explained as JJ said it would be in the movie???

McLoughlin

py2006 wrote: »

I am sure this question has been asked already but was C3P0's red arm explained as JJ said it would be in the movie???

Its explained in the comic books

Red King

johnny_ultimate wrote: »

As trolls wage their futile, miserable little boycott against the film (because it has a female lead), it's worth celebrating how calmly, pleasantly progressive The Force Awakens is. While the more explicitly feminist themes and imagery of Mad Max: Fury Road are to be very much admired, we have a different beast here. This isn't a work that rubs its right-on-ness in your face, or feels like some act of liberal grandstanding. It merely offers up a universe where all the characters - regardless of their age, gender or race - have their own fair shot at being a hero or villain, a fascinating lead or a curious side character.

Not to overstate it or anything - not exactly like a transgender character is going to appearing on the Episode VIII posters - but given the franchise's previously wildly uneven spectrum when it comes to even the most basic diversity (as festive drinking game, rewatch the original trilogy and count the amount of speaking female characters - you'll almost be more sober than you were when you started) it's a pleasure to see the playing field as even here as it should be. But as said there's nothing remotely alienating or boundary pushing about it (obviously the trolls will still find cause for outrage, because that's what they do). It's simply a welcome development to see the biggest blockbuster of recent times driven by female and black lead actors, prominent & active older characters - and above all for the filmmakers to be confident enough to simply get on with it. That, in a sense, is a step beyond even the sort of forward-thinking seen in the likes of Mad Max.

Oh god please leave that ****e somewhere else. Does every goddamn movie these days have to be politicised by the agenda brigade? Leave that crap to the yanks to argue with themselves about, Star Wars doesn't need it.

steve_r

McLoughlin wrote: »

Its explained in the comic books

Which books? Are they tie-ins to the movie, or just individual stories?

py2006 wrote: »

Jesus, some idiot as posted the

Han Solo

scene onto Youtube

I went on twitter after the film and there's a huge amount of people tweeting plot points. That would be such a crap way to get the movie spoiled on you. It's different if people are having a discussion about it, but these people were just tweeting plot points in isolation.

McLoughlin

There is a C3PO one off comic out in january which will cover what he has been up to since Return of The Jedi.

Red King

I can't wait to see it again.

Chewie was hilarious.

It is not flawless by any means but they hit all the right notes. Think I'd rank it behind Empire.

And once the trilogy is complete I think it will be considered in an even greater light.

Great ending and the Skelligs looked magnificent

py2006

Thinking of going to see it again at lunchtime on Monday but with all the kids off school it might be ruined with noisy obnoxious teens on their phones.

At least on opening night it was full of respectful fans

johnny_ultimate

Red King wrote: »

Does every goddamn movie these days have to be politicised by the agenda brigade?

Every single film is released into a cultural, political and social space - none are immune from that, whether it's a Christian movie, a Michael Moore polemic or indeed your average blockbuster! Obviously some more than others But given some of the conversations that are surrounding the film - from The Atlantic's article on its supposed feminist leanings to the whole #BoycottStarWars thing - it's just as valid a subject as plot speculation or anything like that.

Above all I believe its unobtrusive, level-headed but still sadly relatively uncommon open-mindedness when it comes to 'diversity' is one of the film's more under-appreciated and nuanced assets, and worth highlighting amid the continued picking apart of the film's narrative. Especially in a year where the year's other most noteworthy blockbuster was explicitly (obnoxiously or admirably, depending on one's point of view) ideologically-driven and feminist-leaning, it's worth putting it into context to see the approaches two very different filmmakers took when it came to introducing active female protagonists to series that have, more or less, been dominated by men thus far And as said there's more to Star Wars' diversity than just a female lead - even just within the fiction itself, things like giving a stormtrooper a face and a personality is extending the existing boundaries of the franchise in quite an admirable and dramatically intriguing way. It's a film that embraces the diversity of both 'the real world' and its own world in a more open way than ever before.

Red King

johnny_ultimate wrote: »

Every single film is released into a cultural, political and social space - none are immune from that, whether it's a Christian movie, a Michael Moore polemic or indeed your average blockbuster! Obviously some more than others But given some of the conversations that are surrounding the film - from The Atlantic's article on its supposed feminist leanings to the whole #BoycottStarWars thing - it's just as valid a subject as plot speculation or anything like that.

Above all I believe its unobtrusive, level-headed but still sadly relatively uncommon open-mindedness when it comes to 'diversity' is one of the film's more under-appreciated and nuanced assets, and worth highlighting amid the continued picking apart of the film's narrative. Especially in a year where the year's other most noteworthy blockbuster was explicitly (obnoxiously or admirably, depending on one's point of view) ideologically-driven and feminist-leaning, it's worth putting it into context to see the approaches two very different filmmakers took when it came to introducing active female protagonists to series that have, more or less, been dominated by men thus far And as said there's more to Star Wars' diversity than just a female lead - even just within the fiction itself, things like giving a stormtrooper a face and a personality is extending the existing boundaries of the franchise in quite an admirable and dramatically intriguing way. It's a film that embraces the diversity of both 'the real world' and its own world in a more open way than ever before.

Ugh leave it out, the yanks will do their best to drag Star Wars into the latest bull**** hashtag activism but all that crap leaves a bad taste in my mouth.

And if they have their way these nutters will happily poison Star Wars just to score a few points. Boycotts and instagram feminists can both **** off as far as I'm concerned. Bunch of arseholes.

Red King

py2006 wrote: »

Thinking of going to see it again at lunchtime on Monday but with all the kids off school it might be ruined with noisy obnoxious teens on their phones.

At least on opening night it was full of respectful fans

It is not just the teens. Couple in their 40's beside me heaving food into them like pigs and breathing away like Vader throughout before then loudly explaiming when Poe appeared again in his X-Wing - "Is that Luke Skywalker?"

Actually they reminded me of Jabba and that pig thing drinking out of the watrer trough on Jakku.

budgemook

What's this xenophobic "yank" talk all about?

In a thread about an American movie too :-D