Star Wars: The Force Awakens [** SPOILERS FROM POST 4472 ONWARD **]

Relikk

SarahBM wrote: »

And as a lover of film scores I have to mention the soundtrack. Absolutely amazing. Still carries the main themes from the saga buy lots of new rich sounds in there. Haven't stopped listening to it since I got it! And John Williams is 83! And still conducting and writing. Oscar for him I think. No other score has really stood out for me this year.

That's one aspect of the film I wasn't entirely happy about as I thought the soundtrack was pretty ordinary with regard to Star Wars. Even the opening vamp of the main theme was weaker than every other version that came before it. It's missing something. There was no big Kettle Drum or Cymbal crash. I thought it was really underwhelming.

One strong point about the prequels when seeing them the first time is that they did have very memorable themes but, TFA... I don't know. Rey's theme is the only thing that I have a clear memory of.

david75

Yeah the skelig shots took me out of it too but that's to be expected.

Skellig sets have been built at Pinewood for more filming this month. The whole ball starts rolling on episode 8 this month actually.

david75

Speaking of balls rolling

david75

Relikk wrote: »

That's one aspect of the film I wasn't entirely happy about as I thought the soundtrack was pretty ordinary with regard to Star Wars. Even the opening vamp of the main theme was weaker than every other version that came before it. It's missing something. There was no big Kettle Drum or Cymbal crash. I thought it was really underwhelming.

One strong point about the prequels when seeing them the first time is that they did have very memorable themes but, TFA... I don't know. Rey's theme is the only thing that I have a clear memory of.

I wasn't impressed with the score either but then after seeing the film a few times I realised it does what great scores do, it's subtle in the right places and when it needs to be. That can be more effective than overbearing declamatory fanfares etc.
And he does tie in old familiar themes but in a unique way that works, again in a subtle sense.

Reys theme and the Jedi steps/finale are both excellent.

SarahBM

david75 wrote: »

I wasn't impressed with the score either but then after seeing the film a few times I realised it does what great scores do, it's subtle in the right places and when it needs to be. That can be more effective than overbearing declamatory fanfares etc.
And he does tie in old familiar themes but in a unique way that works, again in a subtle sense.

Reys theme and the Jedi steps/finale are both excellent.

Having listened to the other Star Wars soundtracks over the last few weeks (basically on repeat) I find that certain parts of the Prequel soundtracks can be unique but in places very over bearing. The Darth Maul Lightsaber battle scene is amazing thought.
I agree about TFA being more subtly. Rey's theme is fabulous. Maybe I just love it because I have been listening to it on its own.
I love the music over the X fighter battle scenes in TESB and ROTJ though and I missed that a little in TFA X fighter battle at Maz's gaff.

thegreengoblin

Dricmeister wrote: »

Ah come on. Anyone would think that you are talking about a cameraman on Phantom Menace. You're talking about George Lucas! He dreamed it all up. He created Darth Vader FFS!

The prequels aren't as bad as people make out. A trendy industry has sprung up giving out about Jar Jar Binks and the like. Revenge of the Sith is excellent for example.

Couple of days late but I have to respond to this (even though one of my NY resolutions was to avoid talking about the prequels!).
A trendy industry? People have been giving out about Jar Jar Binks from that first awful, toe-curling moment he was set loose upon cinema audiences. He is by some distance the worst 'character' I've ever seen in a film. George Lucas should be eternally ashamed for having inflicted this abomination on us and the same goes for his yes men like Rick McCallum who didn't have the balls to say 'No, George.'

And just because ROTS is the least worst of the prequels does not make it an excellent film!

TerrorFirmer

Yeah, I wasn't enthusiastic about the soundtrack either - even the Phantom Menace, after the first viewing, impressed me with it's diverse and memorable soundtrack, particularly loved the menacing theme for the appearance of the droid army...now one of my favorite Star Wars pieces. Duel of the Fates of course as well is one of the finest in the entire franchise as well.

Sometimes subtle is good, but in this instance I personally feel they could have done so much more with the soundtrack. It was a considerable departure from the original and prequel trilogies and I felt it's lack of punch considerably.

TFA suffers from having no particularly memorable stand-out scenes that are greatly enhanced by a supporting soundtrack - think Duel of the Fates, for example, the Asteroid field in TESB or the Endor Battle in ROTJ is another good one as well, or Anakin vs. Obi-Wan in ROTS.

It can't be said enough that it's a good film but it's just not the Star Wars film I really wanted or was really hoping for.

upinthesky

Really disappointed in this film, cast where average, have no idea where all these great reviews came from, the power of social media i suppose, Harrison ford looked like he had no interest at all, and looks like he is about to drop dead..

Liamario

upinthesky wrote: »

Really disappointed in this film, cast where average, have no idea where all these great reviews came from, the power of social media i suppose, Harrison ford looked like he had no interest at all, and looks like he is about to drop dead..

I think you're confusing the movie with Enders Game.

The Golden Miller

Great film, pretty engrossing, but way to many plot holes and too much of a rerun of the original film.

Why on earth would Luke go into hiding because Kylo Ren "ruined everything" anyway? What does all this "going into hiding" business achieve exactly? And that Kylo Ren was useless. Can't align him with the rest of the Skywalkers at all. Seems out of place and weak

david75

He didn't go into hiding. He went looking for the first Jedi temple.

Plus that was Harrison fords best performance in anything in years. Baffled how anyone couldnt have loved what he gave us. It was his best performance as Han since Empire imo

pixelburp

Whatever other reservations I had about the film, Harrison Ford's performance was his most engaged, animated and lively in years. I was genuinely worried he'd be as comatose as his other recent performances - as mentioned, Enders Game was a particularly noteworthy piece of autopilot work work for him - but he did a great job re-capturing the sparkle in the eye of his younger iteration of Han.

I mean sure, the guy's in his mid 70s and in some scenes it really showed with some doddery movements here & there, but he was definitely game otherwise, I would have no complaints about him overall.

Tony EH

Ford's been on auto pilot since 1983.

It was actually nice to see him put a bit of effort in.

The Golden Miller

david75 wrote: »

He didn't go into hiding. He went looking for the first Jedi temple.

Plus that was Harrison fords best performance in anything in years. Baffled how anyone couldnt have loved what he gave us. It was his best performance as Han since Empire imo

Why choose that moment to go before taking out Ren and the first order though?

david75

He didn't 'choose that moment to go'


He's been missing for years. You should read the crawl again.

Sad Professor

We don't know why Luke disappeared. Maybe he was so broken and guilt-ridden about what happened with Ben that he lost the will to fight. It's possible that Kylo wasn't the only student he lost to the dark side. The rest of the Knights of Ren may have been his former pupils as well. Maybe he and Snoke faced off and he lost.

Tony EH

Yeh, I think, the next film may reveal that Luke has really buggered up something and has taken himself out of the equation.

Wibbs

The Golden Miller wrote: »

Great film, pretty engrossing, but way to many plot holes and too much of a rerun of the original film.

I found it to be a reboot not too far off the style of the Star Trek Abrams outings only using more original series cast members to anchor it to the past franchise. The script had so many homages/blatant rip offs to the 1977 flic that it almost beggared belief. It was like looking at a remake gussied up for the 21st century and a wider audience. The original film was universal in appeal, but mainly with boys. At the time I knew almost no girls my age who were into it, or would admit it. Far from it. That seemed to come later. Now they've got all bases covered. The ultimate four quadrant film made flesh and in Lego. In fairness I want a BB-8, so I am sorely conflicted. Now they have covered all bases to get Disney a return on its investment. It goes from money shot to money shot, the 1977 film updated for the next generation (with enough to keep the nostalgia on side) with louder bangs and more visuals. Which were well done.

And no matter which way we cut it Rey is a helluva lot closer to a "Mary Sue" than Luke ever was. Maybe in these days of arcs and spoilers and bluRay extras and expanded universessesess/media and backstory, that's how this works now? If Luke had come across the way she does I genuinely don't think the original flic would have been nearly so groundbreaking or successful, or have endured so long(and the first one was a standalone film). He followed the hero's journey, the warriors path(like pretty much every hero ever, including some religious figures), she just doesn't. Luke became the hero over time, Rey just has to be to get hero status. The Force was seen as this mystical energy(liberally ripped off from Eastern philosophy and Dune) that with training and work a blessed adept could harness it to become more powerful in the force. With Rey and TFA it has become a superpower that just happens like, if the force is strong in you. That weakens the concept in a big way. It also weakens the whole light/dark side concept, which relies on the fact that the dark side is easier, quicker and more seductive as Yoda put it. Unless you're Rey and by just vibing out you get instantly Light side and kick Dark side arse all over the place. Why bother training in either, why choose the Dark when you can just do it outa the box? Where's the dilemma of choice? Where's the progress? Oh and her gender means jack to me, if it was a bloke called Ray I'd be still calling WTF all over the place.

Speaking of that other female role that was commented upon, Phasma. More WTF going on. Powerful character that was seriously underused. I really hope she survived the Death Star blowing up(note to the baddies, stop building them, they're shíte). Oh and on that score, she goes from serious badass, to someone who just drops the Death Star shields because she's threatened with a gun. Eh… part 2. Eh.. part 3; how can she on her own, someone out of the main command loop, drop the entire shields for a planet? These empire dudes have really crap security protocols in place. For all its space opera hokiness the first one was much more believable on that score.


That said I did enjoy it. It didn't outstay its welcome and it certainly worked my nostalgia buttons. The special effects were very good, loved seeing the Falcon again and had a nerdgasm when I saw the square satellite dish that replaced the original one lost in Return of the Jedi while blowing up another Death Star(no really lads, enough). The dialogue was sharp too. Just a pity it was a remake. It's be interesting to see what the next flic has to offer, now that they've mined 1977 down to the bedrock.

The Golden Miller

david75 wrote: »

He didn't 'choose that moment to go'


He's been missing for years. You should read the crawl again.

I think you've taken "choose that moment to go" too literal. There's absolutely no credible reason for him to go anywhere at any point. And even if he went at a time where there was peace in the galaxy, there's no credible reason why he wouldn't turn up sooner when the imperials were on the rise again and before they wiped out millions. Surely Luke of all people could "sense a disturbance in the force". Not only that, it's highly uncharacteristic for him not to be there when anything "bad" is going down

Falthyron

The Golden Miller wrote: »

I think you've taken "choose that moment to go" too literal. There's absolutely no reason for him to go anywhere at any point

Here's a reason: when Kylo and the Knights of Ren take over, Luke is outnumbered and being the last of the Jedi if he was to die, who would rebuild the Jedi? So, he goes into hiding to preserve his knowledge and share it with someone when the time is right and when they have a chance to deal with the Sith.

The Golden Miller

Falthyron wrote: »

Here's a reason: when Kylo and the Knights of Ren take over, Luke is outnumbered and being the last of the Jedi if he was to die, who would rebuild the Jedi? So, he goes into hiding to preserve his knowledge and share it with someone when the time is right and when they have a chance to deal with the Sith.

Don't buy it. He could have taken 12 amatures by himself, or picked them off over time. How many Jedi did Vader wipe out by himself after Episode 3? Not to mention, the rest of the Knights wouldn't even be as strong as Ren, who isn't even very well trained himself. Sidious could take out 3 top Jedi without breaking a sweat in Episode 3, so I can't see how Luke (the strongest Jedi/force user of all time along with Anakin) would have too many problems with a bunch of these lads

Falthyron

The Golden Miller wrote: »

Don't buy it. He could have taken 12 amatures by himself, or picked them off over time. How many Jedi did Vader wipe out by himself after Episode 3? Not to mention, the rest of the Knights wouldn't even be as strong as Ren, who isn't even very well trained himself. Sidious could take out 3 top Jedi without breaking a sweat in Episode 3, so I can't see how Luke (the strongest Jedia/force user of all time along with Anakin) would have too many problems with a bunch of these lads

We didn't see the attack. We don't know how many turned on Luke and whether or not a powerful Sith like Snoke was there as well... Considering Luke's hand has gone back to a very unsophisticated robotic version perhaps he lost his hand again? Luke is also quite old now, not too far off Obi Wan's age in A New Hope - he didn't stand much chance against Vader. Wait and see what Episode VIII shows us. If it is ridiculous then ridicule it, but there are many reasons why Luke was forced to go into hiding/search for answers.

Oh and the Jedi Anakin killed were children, hardly a competition. :P

Riddle101

The Golden Miller wrote: »

Don't buy it. He could have taken 12 amatures by himself, or picked them off over time. How many Jedi did Vader wipe out by himself after Episode 3? Not to mention, the rest of the Knights wouldn't even be as strong as Ren, who isn't even very well trained himself. Sidious could take out 3 top Jedi without breaking a sweat in Episode 3, so I can't see how Luke (the strongest Jedi/force user of all time along with Anakin) would have too many problems with a bunch of these lads

I'm pretty sure doing something like that would be more akin to the dark side. Hunting down a bunch of amateur Jedi/sith to kill them? That's not Luke's style. Keep in mind that Vader and Sidius were both Sith lords when they do those acts. But I guess all the answer will come in the next movie.

Mickeroo

That's a lot of assumptions to make about a character who's aged over 30 years since you last heard him speak, Id imagine most of that stuff will be addressed in the sequel? We know next to nothing about Luke's reasons for disappearing beyond conjecture and the little bits of info we got in the film.

david75

Kasdan has said the next film will be a 'weird thing' and nothing like anystar wars we've yet seen-this makes sense of using this one to push all the nostalgia buttons now so they can take us there.
He also said this film will focus on Luke and Leia. They have a lot to do so let's see.

As someone else said, (or Possibly Kasdan) you don't hire Rian Johnson to make a happy film. This will be a family drama played out large scale.

ancapailldorcha

Why do people insist on bashing the prequels? They're nowhere near as bad as they're being made out to be on the last few pages of this thread.

aaronjumper

ancapailldorcha wrote: »

Why do people insist on bashing the prequels? They're nowhere near as bad as they're being made out to be on the last few pages of this thread.

I think some of the dialogue can be a bit cringey at times but overall I liked them.

ancapailldorcha

aaronjumper wrote: »

I think some of the dialogue can be a bit cringey at times but overall I liked them.

Same here but some of the posts here would make them out to be a crime against film as a media.

pixelburp

ancapailldorcha wrote: »

Why do people insist on bashing the prequels? They're nowhere near as bad as they're being made out to be on the last few pages of this thread.

Because they're terrible films; yes the Internet over eggs the criticism pudding and then some, but you'll be sorely pressed to find a better marriage of amateur script and Hollywood level of budgeting and investment.

I tried re watching the prequels recently and frankly, they're even worse than I remember.

ancapailldorcha

pixelburp wrote: »

Because they're terrible films; yes the Internet over eggs the criticism pudding and then some, but you'll be sorely pressed to find a better marriage of amateur script and Hollywood level of budgeting and investment.

I tried re watching the prequels recently and frankly, they're even worse than I remember.

I don't know about this. When I went home for the holidays, I saw them on a dedicated Sky channel and they seemed more or less ok.