Mailing list

thecommander

I'm putting together a mailing list for a monthly newsletter that we're going be sending out. I've gathered the addresses from mails I've sent/received in the last 2 years, then filtered out the ones I don't want or weren't suitable.

Just looking for a bit of guidance on if it's ok to send past customers a newsletter. They have neither signed up to the list, or opted out. Unsubscribing will be simple.

It happens me every day that I get newsletters from companies that I've dealt with. Just want to check if it was a norm or against spamming laws.

mneylon

Do you / did you have a business relationship with them? ie. were they your customers

thecommander

Blacknight wrote: »

Do you / did you have a business relationship with them? ie. were they your customers

Some are ongoing clients, others were one off customers.

mneylon

You should be "ok", but I'd add something in the email footer to explain why they're getting the email eg. "You're getting this email as either a current or former client of X. If you do not wish to receive further emails from us please click on the unsubscribe link below"

thecommander

Blacknight wrote: »

You should be "ok", but I'd add something in the email footer to explain why they're getting the email eg. "You're getting this email as either a current or former client of X. If you do not wish to receive further emails from us please click on the unsubscribe link below"

Was going to send out a first mail to say that I'm starting a newsletter and if you don't want to be a part of it then click unsubscribe or mail me back. The second mail a week or so later will be the actual newsletter.

TsuDhoNimh

thecommander wrote: »

It happens me every day that I get newsletters from companies that I've dealt with. Just want to check if it was a norm or against spamming laws.

Technically, from my own reading of the rules (and I'm very open to correction here), I'd view it as a non obvious secondary use of my information (I provided the email addy for whatever business dealing we had, not for any newsletter/marketing signup) and unless your terms and conditions covered it to be in breach of the rules.

In reality, I wouldn't have actually read your terms and conditions before carrying out the business dealing (nobody ever does until they're looking for stuff like this) and assuming the mail was relevant to the previous business dealing and did provide a clear/easy opt out I'd personally be ok with it.

If you want to ensure you're 100% within the rules, I'd suggest contacting the data protection commissioners office and getting their input (www.dataprotection.ie - possible that it's already covered in detail on the site, but I'm not aware of it if it is). I'd assume their reply will be to update your privacy policy/terms and conditions to cover this scenario (which would only provide you with the right to do it for 'future' email addresses, not backdated).

Peterdalkey

You should have concerns with past customers with whom you have had dealings in the past two years. I would highly recommend that you use a proper mailing programme/service. On the recommendation of several boards.ie posters we have been using mailchimp. Keep rack mailing under 2000 records and it is free, you can do multiple mailings of 2000 but from memory you need to keep a week between them and save the used lists offline.
The programme automatically manages bounces and ubsubscibes and meets all EU and US ANTI- spam regulations. It is so good, we subscribe to the paid service.

The reports are very good too!

Cheers

Peter

thecommander

Peterdalkey wrote: »

You should have concerns with past customers with whom you have had dealings in the past two years. I would highly recommend that you use a proper mailing programme/service. On the recommendation of several boards.ie posters we have been using mailchimp. Keep rack mailing under 2000 records and it is free, you can do multiple mailings of 2000 but from memory you need to keep a week between them and save the used lists offline.
The programme automatically manages bounces and ubsubscibes and meets all EU and US ANTI- spam regulations. It is so good, we subscribe to the paid service.

The reports are very good too!

Cheers

Peter

Thanks for that. Will be done thru Campaign Monitor, have used for other projects and it works a treat. It meets the anti spam regulations when it comes to unsubscribing etc but I wanted to make sure the addresses I put into it are ok. I'll give the data com a call tomorrow.

Peterdalkey

thecommander wrote: »

Thanks for that. Will be done thru Campaign Monitor, have used for other projects and it works a treat. It meets the anti spam regulations when it comes to unsubscribing etc but I wanted to make sure the addresses I put into it are ok. I'll give the data com a call tomorrow.

Initially we just used it to clean our databases in 2k record chunks, but continued using it as it was so good. Free is a great price.

Cheers

Peter

thecommander

Found this on their site

Electronic Mail

Electronic mail includes text messages (SMS), voice messages, sound messages, image messages, multimedia message (MMS) and email messages.

Individual and Business Customers

Where you have obtained contact details in the context of the sale of a product or service, you may only use these details for direct marketing by electronic mail if the following conditions are met:

the product or service you are marketing is of a kind similar to that which you sold to the customer at the time you obtained their contact details
At the time you collected the details, you gave the customer the opportunity to object, in an easy manner and without charge, to their use for marketing purposes
Each time you send a marketing message, you give the customer the right to object to receipt of further messages
The sale of the product or service occurred not more than twelve months prior to the sending of the electronic marketing communication or, where applicable, the contact details were used for the sending of an electronic marketing communication in that twelve month period.
NOTE: In relation to 4 above, if the subscriber fails to unsubscribe using the cost free means provided to them by the direct marketer, they will be deemed to have remained opted-in to the receipt of such electronic mail for a twelve month period from the date of issue to them of the most recent marketing electronic mail.

Individuals (“Natural Persons”) who are not Customers

If an individual is not a customer, you may not use electronic mail to send a marketing message to their contact address unless you have obtained the prior consent of that individual to the receipt of such messages – a consent that can be withdrawn at any time.

Business Contacts (Customers and non Customers)

You may not use electronic mail to send a marketing message to a business contact address/number if the subscriber has notified you that they do not consent to the receipt of such communications.

SUMMARY

The following table summarises the rules that apply. “Opt-in” means you can only market an individual where you have their explicit consent to do so. “Opt-out” means that you can market an individual provided you have given them the option not to receive such marketing and they have not availed of this option. For a electronic communication to a business, an option to unsubscribe must be included.

TsuDhoNimh

I'd view "At the time you collected the details, you gave the customer the opportunity to object, in an easy manner and without charge, to their use for marketing purposes" as the most relevant part of that post to your specific scenario.

What that actually means in practise is fairly questionable. I'd assume a brief note in the privacy policy saying they can opt out with a brief note in any mail communications would be enough for compliance, but if I intended on adding mail addys in the manner suggested I'd want to be on firmer ground than an assumption like that.

Peterdalkey

thecommander wrote: »

Found this on their site

Email marketing is a legitimate business practice, but you would think it bordering on criminal to read the above. From our experience, clean your lists, use a proper mailing client and you will have no issues. If you obey the spirit of the law, you will be in the clear. In the hugely unlikely event of any approach from the data comms office, you are always afforded a chance to put things in order to their tune. They have enough on their plates with real personal data being exposed carelessly.

Peterdalkey

TsuDhoNimh wrote: »

I'd view "At the time you collected the details, you gave the customer the opportunity to object, in an easy manner and without charge, to their use for marketing purposes" as the most relevant part of that post to your specific scenario.

What that actually means in practise is fairly questionable. I'd assume a brief note in the privacy policy saying they can opt out with a brief note in any mail communications would be enough for compliance, but if I intended on adding mail addys in the manner suggested I'd want to be on firmer ground than an assumption like that.

And as to what exactly Marketing Purposes are is very much open to question and interpretation especially when the OP is talking about a newsletter in this instance. He doth worry too much, methinks!

TsuDhoNimh

Peterdalkey wrote: »

And as to what exactly Marketing Purposes are is very much open to question and interpretation especially when the OP is talking about a newsletter in this instance.

No. It's quite clear. If the communication is for anything other than the completion of the initial business arrangement it would fall under a marketing exercise. There's no ambiguity or issue there.

Peterdalkey wrote: »

He doth worry too much, methinks!

Me? I don't worry at all.

There's a big difference between figuring out what the requirements are under the law (it's a fairly black and white issue) and then deciding how you want to go about it for your business. The two won't always be and frequently aren't the same thing for many businesses, but that doesn't mean there isn't an advantage to knowing what the requirements are.

OU812

Use mailchimp.com for your mailings & give an unsubscribe option in every mail.

Business domains are ok to send unsolicited email to, private (inc hotmail & gmail) are not.

With the first email explain that they've done business with you before & you have a special offer for them as a valued customer.

Peterdalkey

In my view industry news, for one, is not marketing and I can think of several other examples.

I completely agree with familiarising oneself with the regulations and rules and then making a reasonable judgement call. The business/entrepreneurial dynamic should always seek to test the elasticity of the "rules". From memory the Revenue Commissioners lose over 35% of their own rulings in higher appeals. It is not the exclusive domain of those charged with enforcing rules and regulations to interpret them.

For clarity, My smart ass comment was not directed at TsuDobhNibh.

Cheers

Peter

thecommander

Thanks everyone, know what I'm going to do now.