Waterford Airport.

road_high · 05-10-2017 10:48am

Teebor15 wrote: »

Is it though? I'm not having a go at you I would have thought this too but are there actually figures to support this? I suppose probably historically, people who moved years ago travelling back to visit relatives. If we are talking about people commuting to the UK to find work. I know the South East has above the national average unemployment with Waterford city suffering the highest unemployment out of all the cities.

Traditionally far higher. In the south east we at least had some manufacturing and strong agriculture. Of my extended family back a few generations, hardly anyone left. In places like Mayo this was a given to go to England or the USA. There isn't a big history of migration from Waterford, Kilkenny or Wexford so there's less of a pull in

Kotek Besar · 05-10-2017 11:06am

road_high wrote: »

There isn't a big history of migration from Waterford

I dunno, in Newfoundland, Canada, they all have Waterford accents. Every sentence is punctuated with "boy".

CelticRambler · 05-10-2017 12:38pm

Teebor15 wrote: »

with easy passage, low car parking charges, no shuttle bus from car park, no 2 mile walk through the terminal, no crowds, no M50 congestion would become much more attractive for thus sustaining the larger aircraft now operating. To offer similiar fares, you need the carriers with larger aircraft, to facilitate the larger aircraft you need a bigger runway!

If only the real world worked like that. My local airport here in France has a 3.5km runway, toll-free motorway right beside it, free parking, free urban bus service, a 2 minute walk through the terminal and no crowds.

The "no crowds" is a big problem, and explains why the airport has passenger flights to a grand total of two destinations - Nice (twice a week during the summer) and Corsica (once a week during the summer, shared with another nearby airport).

We can (and do) see the A380 and the Antonov 225 drop in regularly for training and cargo operations respectively, so the "runway length" argument can be comprehensively rejected.

As long as the supporters of Waterford remain fixated on the idea of making it "Dublin Lite" (or even "Knock Lite" :rolleyes: ) there'll never be any business case for regular operations there. Coming up with (or supporting) an alternative model of regional airport activity, though, would have every chance of success ... and not need even one extra metre of runway.

JCX BXC · 05-10-2017 1:00pm

Teebor15 wrote: »

They do, and are still able to compete with Shannon which is closer to the main population centre (Galway City) than Knock. Why? because they offer a similiar service because they have low cost carriers utilising they're Jet Runway.

Is that why Flybe operate daily flights to Edinburgh, Manchester and Birmingham from Knock to compete?

road_high · 07-10-2017 4:54pm

Another thing people forget re Knock is a huge part of its development was funded locally and though the west of Ireland diaspora. Many people gave small amounts and there was a large fundraising drive driven by emotion and sentiment. There is no way this would happen in the SE as we live in different times and a very different region to the west.

fuzzy dunlop · 07-10-2017 6:24pm

road_high wrote: »

Another thing people forget re Knock is a huge part of its development was funded locally and though the west of Ireland diaspora. Many people gave small amounts and there was a large fundraising drive driven by emotion and sentiment. There is no way this would happen in the SE as we live in different times and a very different region to the west.

Exaggerated! It's not the outlay that got Knock going it is the huge government PSO support. When you say it would never happen in the South East what you really mean is it couldn't possibly happen in my neck of the woods so I don't want it anywhere.

JCX BXC · 07-10-2017 6:27pm

fuzzy dunlop wrote: »

Exaggerated! It's not the outlay that got Knock going it is the huge government PSO support. When you say it would never happen in the South East what you really mean is it couldn't possibly happen in my neck of the woods so I don't want it anywhere.

We can keep denying the simple realities, however regardless of what we say on here, the outcome is quite clear.

Waterford has a VERY limited market, and at best, will see limited services resume into the future. That's the bottom line really, regardless of whether you agree or not.

fuzzy dunlop · 07-10-2017 6:36pm

JCX BXC wrote: »

fuzzy dunlop wrote: »

Exaggerated! It's not the outlay that got Knock going it is the huge government PSO support. When you say it would never happen in the South East what you really mean is it couldn't possibly happen in my neck of the woods so I don't want it anywhere.

We can keep denying the simple realities, however regardless of what we say on here, the outcome is quite clear.

Waterford has a VERY limited market, and at best, will see limited services resume into the future. That's the bottom line really, regardless of whether you agree or not.

So it's a reality whether we agree with you or not? Nah don't so. Pretty much every airport in Ireland is or has been dependent on vast capital grants. Its the usual nonsense about how we define things. Cork's market was Shannon's market until it was built. So the question is has Cork some God given right to have an airport without competition? They certainly did not think this for Shannon. So why should we?

road_high · 07-10-2017 7:45pm

fuzzy dunlop wrote: »

Exaggerated! It's not the outlay that got Knock going it is the huge government PSO support. When you say it would never happen in the South East what you really mean is it couldn't possibly happen in my neck of the woods so I don't want it anywhere.

Nah id love to have a proper airport in the SE closer than dublin but reality is there isn't the business to support it. If there was the market would have steeped in long ago. It's unfortunate there's so many airports in the west and just two along the east coast, one with no service at present.

JCX BXC · 07-10-2017 7:51pm

road_high wrote: »

Nah id love to have a proper airport in the SE closer than dublin but reality is there isn't the business to support it. If there was the market would have steeped in long ago. It's unfortunate there's so many airports in the west and just two along the east coast, one with no service at present.

Belfast is much more on the east coast than Waterford is. That has 2 airports!

road_high · 07-10-2017 7:59pm

JCX BXC wrote: »

Belfast is much more on the east coast than Waterford is. That has 2 airports!

Waterford is east coast for all intents and purposes. Belfast has two with limited enough services- just like wat, dublin pulls in a lot of the travel business

fuzzy dunlop · 07-10-2017 8:06pm

road_high wrote: »

fuzzy dunlop wrote: »

Exaggerated! It's not the outlay that got Knock going it is the huge government PSO support. When you say it would never happen in the South East what you really mean is it couldn't possibly happen in my neck of the woods so I don't want it anywhere.

Nah id love to have a proper airport in the SE closer than dublin but reality is there isn't the business to support it. If there was the market would have steeped in long ago. It's unfortunate there's so many airports in the west and just two along the east coast, one with no service at present.

Yeah just as I thought! Closer to Dublin meaning Kilkenny. How predictable your answer is! How do you know their isn't the business to support it? You don't.! Demographically it is almost compatable to the South West and nifger than the others .From the point of view of nearly every town in the South East Waterford is the equidistant point and all of the Road links radiate from there. Much to your contant disapointment. It doesn't stop you posting here all the same ðŸ˜›

JCX BXC · 07-10-2017 8:07pm

road_high wrote: »

Waterford is east coast for all intents and purposes. Belfast has two with limited enough services- just like wat, dublin pulls in a lot of the travel business

Limited enough service? You mean more passengers than Cork, Shannon, Knock, Kerry, Donegal and Derry combined in BFS alone?

road_high · 07-10-2017 8:11pm

JCX BXC wrote: »

Limited enough service? You mean more passengers than Cork, Shannon, Knock, Kerry, Donegal and Derry combined in BFS alone?

Belfast airports are poor! Outside of UK flights they are limited.

road_high · 07-10-2017 8:15pm

fuzzy dunlop wrote: »

Yeah just as I thought! Closer to Dublin meaning Kilkenny. How predictable your answer is! How do you know their isn't the business to support it? You don't.! Demographically it is almost compatable to the South West and nifger than the others .From the point of view of nearly every town in the South East Waterford is the equidistant point and all of the Road links radiate from there. Much to your contant disapointment. It doesn't stop you posting here all the same &#55357;&#56859;

Ok I think you misunderstood what I was saying bad you want to turn it into a kk vs wat thing. Go you! There isn't the business because dublin amply serves it already. Unless someone wants to develop wat to compete for that dublin business that's where it'll stay for the foreseeable. If there was sufficient business why did so many airlines leave after short periods?

fuzzy dunlop · 07-10-2017 8:33pm

road_high wrote: »

fuzzy dunlop wrote: »

Yeah just as I thought! Closer to Dublin meaning Kilkenny. How predictable your answer is! How do you know their isn't the business to support it? You don't.! Demographically it is almost compatable to the South West and nifger than the others .From the point of view of nearly every town in the South East Waterford is the equidistant point and all of the Road links radiate from there. Much to your contant disapointment. It doesn't stop you posting here all the same ��

Ok I think you misunderstood what I was saying bad you want to turn it into a kk vs wat thing. Go you! There isn't the business because dublin amply serves it already. Unless someone wants to develop wat to compete for that dublin business that's where it'll stay for the foreseeable. If there was sufficient business why did so many airlines leave after short periods?

You're having a laugh right? You have been peddling your Wat v Kk **** here for years.You practically live here which is odd considering you obviously resent the place The airlines that failed had less to do with Waterford than their overall financial positions with the same PSO funding. Why do you think Dublin is amply serving the East and South East? Based on what? Based on the fact that they to have build another runway? Based on the fact that they have to pile on infrastructure costing billions to sustain it? The case for the South is exceptionally strong for the half a million less congestion joirneys alone. But lets not risk it in case it goes to Waterford.

JCX BXC · 07-10-2017 8:37pm

Yano, we were having a proper respectful debate in here! Angrily barking isn't a discussion!

Can we please get back to the topic at hand and act like adults, somewhat at least? I'm not a mod, but Jaysus!

fuzzy dunlop · 07-10-2017 8:42pm

JCX BXC wrote: »

Yano, we were having a proper respectful debate in here! Angrily barking isn't a discussion!

Can we please get back to the topic at hand and act like adults, somewhat at least? I'm not a mod, but Jaysus!

You're right your not a mod!

JCX BXC · 07-10-2017 8:55pm

road_high wrote: »

Belfast airports are poor! Outside of UK flights they are limited.

Eh, not really. They have both Stewart (NY state) and Providence (Near Boston), a Virgin 747 to Orlando on the US front, connectivity all over mainland europe, granted it's a little less for an airport of its size however better than places like Cork, Knock, Shannon (excluding US front).

road_high · 07-10-2017 9:04pm

JCX BXC wrote: »

Yano, we were having a proper respectful debate in here! Angrily barking isn't a discussion!

Can we please get back to the topic at hand and act like adults, somewhat at least? I'm not a mod, but Jaysus!

That's his style. A chip on his shoulders the size of Tramore beach bless him/her. The type you could imagine screeming and roaring on a picket line achieving nothing bar attempting to antagonise people that aren't particularly interested in petty arguments.
What they don't realise is that I'm actually quite pro wat airport but don't have this blind them up in dublin vs us tiresome mantra to justify it as a business because I accept that will never work as a strategy

road_high · 07-10-2017 9:13pm

fuzzy dunlop wrote: »

You're having a laugh right? You have been peddling your Wat v Kk **** here for years.You practically live here which is odd considering you obviously resent the place The airlines that failed had less to do with Waterford than their overall financial positions with the same PSO funding. Why do you think Dublin is amply serving the East and South East? Based on what? Based on the fact that they to have build another runway? Based on the fact that they have to pile on infrastructure costing billions to sustain it? The case for the South is exceptionally strong for the half a million less congestion joirneys alone. But lets not risk it in case it goes to Waterford.

See here we go again, off on your little assumptions. There's nothing more I'd like to see than a proper runway but which budgets etc shall we be funding it from? Of course Dub amply serves the region- as does Cork. Nowhere is more than two hours from either. Where does your strategy for .5k passengers fit between those two because I'm all ears. Unless the product is on par or superior to both it'll be on shaky ground
Dub is self financing and certainly doesn't require "billions to sustain it"- are you making this up or have you hard figures to support this?

road_high · 07-10-2017 9:18pm

fuzzy dunlop wrote: »

You're having a laugh right? You have been peddling your Wat v Kk **** here for years.You practically live here which is odd considering you obviously resent the place The airlines that failed had less to do with Waterford than their overall financial positions with the same PSO funding. .

See that's the beauty of the internet- people can have opinions that you may not always agree with but most adults accept that as part of life. You probably should try it, it might lower the blood pressure too rather the continual blind rage avd spitting fire thing which you must find a little exhausting

nuac · 07-10-2017 10:24pm

Deise Vu wrote: »

Back in the 80's there used to be voluntary deductions you could make out of your wages in a lot of Waterford factories which was then forwarded on. One was the Kitui partnership in Kenya (I wonder how they're doing these days?).

Another was for the City Council to develop badly needed sports facilities. The council put this to good use starting the facilities that are now the RSC. Then Lotto millions came along and the Govt decided there should be 8 regional sports centres dotted around the country (again I wonder how the other 7 are getting on). The RSC was given £500K because it already was partly developed, the rest were given £1.5M. Our Govts have always been big on self-help and matching funds...... until there are goodies to be distributed.

It probably would be no harm to point out that the original airport was also built from funds raised locally while Knock, for example, was 100% a gift from Charlie to the people of Mayo.

Re Knock

A substantial amount has been provided in Mayo and in the West

road_high · 07-10-2017 10:29pm

nuac wrote: »

Re Knock

A substantial amount has been provided in Mayo and in the West

Knock was substantially funded by Mayo people and west of Ireland disspora who saw merit in the project as a gateway for returning emigrants and also a catalyst to improve things. Back in those days, it could have easily taken 5 or 6 hours to travel from Dub to Mayo and much of Connacht.
There is absolutely no comparison to this level of isolation and the modern day motorway served Waterford and south east

TheQuietFella · 08-10-2017 7:21pm

nuac wrote: »

Re Knock

A substantial amount has been provided in Mayo and in the West

Maybe we need a little 'divine' intervention!

notharrypotter · 08-10-2017 8:11pm

nuac wrote: »

Re Knock

A substantial amount has been provided in Mayo and in the West

Horan convinced the Taoiseach, Castlebar-native Charles Haughey, who approved the £10m funding,

Fianna Fáil's defeat in the November 1982 general election saw the funds cut

Horan was forced to stage a Jumbo Raffle and travel to the US and Australia to raise the £4m necessary to complete the work

So minimum of 6 million from the state at that time was far more substantial and by any measure in the early 80's a significant chunk of cash.

Deiseen · 14-11-2017 1:58am

News and star have it on their front page that fligts will be starting over Christmas.

Literally says one sentence about that but has a few paragraphs on the road through the apple market...

Anyone hear anything?

Max Powers · 14-11-2017 1:13pm

Deiseen wrote: »

News and star have it on their front page that fligts will be starting over Christmas.

Literally says one sentence about that but has a few paragraphs on the road through the apple market...

Anyone hear anything?

Article on it in Munster express

Kotek Besar · 14-11-2017 1:33pm

www.aersoutheast.com is down.

mooseknunkle · 14-11-2017 1:49pm

Deiseen wrote: »

News and star have it on their front page that fligts will be starting over Christmas.

Literally says one sentence about that but has a few paragraphs on the road through the apple market...

Anyone hear anything?

A Waterford Councillor says he has some concerns about potential scheduled commercial flights from Waterford Airport to London Luton.

BackBone Aviation – based in Denmark are set to provide the service, initially for the Christmas and New Year period, and extend to a more permanent arrangement into 2018.

There have been no regular scheduled services from the Airport since June 2016.

Independent Councillor Joe Conway says he welcomes any movement towards getting the facility back up and running but he has questioned Backbones ability to provide a suitable service in Waterford.

The first centres around operational capability. BackBone Aviation is currently listed as having just two aircraft – both regional jets with a typical passenger capacity of about 50. They have an average age of around eighteen years – one 20 and the other 16. They are thus considered ageing and reliability is a function of this.

Their take-off distance required is around 5,500 feet and because Waterford has a maximum runway length of 4,700 feet the current aircraft stock of BackBone could not operate out of Killowen.

Councillor Joe Conway says the critical date for central government subvention, is December 1st.

Transport Minister Ross has stated that no further money is going to be made available to an airport with no flights, and he thinks this may well be a contributing ingredient to the arrangement to lever central funds once again for the facility.

http://www.wlrfm.com/2017/11/14/councillor-joe-conway-expresses-concern-about-new-flights-from-waterford-airport/

Waterford Airport.

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