Waterford Airport.

Harry Palmr

If that 5m spend brings in an aircraft maintenance company which employs 50-100 people directly will you still be complaining?

azimuth17 wrote: »

I seem to recall €9 million being spent by government on a new cinema in Galway? Did that make front page news?

To be fair it has been well covered how that became such a contentious matter. Galway as ever thinks it's a special cultural case "because they're worth it". Of course that money in a different dept spend could have revived their airport! :pac:

Max Powers

blue note wrote: »

Speaking as a proud Waterford, I find it very hard to defend this. Cork and Dublin airports are far too near to be able to justify an airport on waterford at all. I'd say the same of the other small regional airports.

€5m isn't all that much money in the scheme of things, but the real problem is that it just reeks of parish pump politics. From what I can see this is halligan getting out for waterford because he's mates with Shane ross. And if he's involved in that, I can see why others would assume things like the cardiac care issue or waterford University are the same.

The fact that private investors forking in for this a good percentage should be stressed though and it will allow the airport to come into use with a runway extension that other airports have already.

road_high

That Indo headline is very unfair and hugely misleading- using it as a political football to bash Ross.

mickger844posts

road_high wrote: »

That Indo headline is very unfair and hugely misleading- using it as a political football to bash Ross.

Slow news day if that deserves headline status. Took them a few days to cop on to it aswell. Poor journalism again from the Indo

fricatus

Well there's our proof that the runway extension is finally happening. Parties opposed to it have gone into full-on spin mode in a last-ditch attempt to stop it.

I remember the same thing when the M9 was due to be built. It was going to be a "white elephant", a "parish-pump" project, a "road to nowhere". I remember a Dublin taxi driver (who didn't know I was from Waterford) giving out about the M9, saying there was no toll on it "because no cars were using it".

Ten years later, granted it's not full up like the Santa Ana Freeway, but there's a good throughput of traffic on it now, and the road to Dublin is no longer hindering our development. Can you imagine if the volume of traffic now using the M9 had to go through Thomastown and Mullinavat again?

No you can't, so fcuk the begrudgers. Ten years from now, we won't be seeing A380 services to Dubai, and that's not what we expect or need. My prediction is that it will settle long term into about the same traffic levels as we see in Kerry or Knock, and that will mean that we're finally getting levels of service that other areas see as their due.

Dunmoreroader

The coverage in the national media, and even Independent in UK, STINKS.
Who's spinning against Waterford Airport hoping to kill this investment?
Cui bono?...........
Dublin Airport
Cork Airport
Same ol' same ol'.

C*NTS

Harry Palmr

Does anyone know if the airport will need to buy land? The both ends are tight enough to adjacent land (a road at the south end) and active fields which appear to be owned by someone else at the north.

road_high

I keep saying this but it really needs to be repeated The M9 motorway is as busy and busier than comparable stretches of M8, M7, M6 (naturally as it’s nearer to Dublin with a higher populated hinterland). Look up the NRA stats and it’s the figures are there in black and white. North of Carlow the figures are 20k plus daily- this is partly why the M7 is now such a disaster as you’ve a full M9 feed into it.
But because the end point wasn’t blessed Galway then it was a red herring in D4. Funny how they all enjoy using it all the same now it’s built!

Road-Hog

Dunmoreroader wrote: »

The coverage in the national media, and even Independent in UK, STINKS.
Who's spinning against Waterford Airport hoping to kill this investment?
Cui bono?...........
Dublin Airport
Cork Airport
Same ol' same ol'.

C*NTS

Can anyone tell me what are the passengers no’s and routes that fly out of donegal international airport....?

SweetCaliber

Road-Hog wrote: »

Can anyone tell me what are the passengers no’s and routes that fly out of donegal international airport....?

Passenger numbers in 2017 were 46,514. This is as far forward as I can go with the CSO.

Routes are Glasgow and Dublin flown by Loganair and Aer Lingus Regional.

mickger844posts

Road-Hog wrote: »

Can anyone tell me what are the passengers no’s and routes that fly out of donegal international airport....?

Don’t know about Pass. numbers but flight wise they have three flights a day. Two Aer Lingus flights to Dublin and one Logan Air to Glasgow.

curmudgeonly

Harry Palmr wrote: »

Does anyone know if the airport will need to buy land? The both ends are tight enough to adjacent land (a road at the south end) and active fields which appear to be owned by someone else at the north.

Planning and land acquisition done for south side (Tramore side) planning and cpo to be done for northern side,but documents and price agreement all in place.

road_high

SweetCaliber wrote: »

Passenger numbers in 2017 were 46,514. This is as far forward as I can go with the CSO.

Routes are Glasgow and Dublin flown by Loganair and Aer Lingus Regional.

Good bit less than the other regionals- even within co donegal it’s location is ridiculous- should have built it near Letterkenny or so.

notharrypotter

road_high wrote: »

- should have built it near Letterkenny or so.

Measure the distance from letterkenny town centre to Derry airport.

BBM77

blue note wrote: »

Speaking as a proud Waterford, I find it very hard to defend this. Cork and Dublin airports are far too near to be able to justify an airport on waterford at all. I'd say the same of the other small regional airports.

€5m isn't all that much money in the scheme of things, but the real problem is that it just reeks of parish pump politics. From what I can see this is halligan getting out for waterford because he's mates with Shane ross. And if he's involved in that, I can see why others would assume things like the cardiac care issue or waterford University are the same.

Why is Glanbia, Coolmore Stud, Dawn Meats as well as other investors investing then if this cannot be justified? Because companies like to give money away for the laugh?

How is it parish pump politics when the government’s own 2040 plan states they plan to invest in regional cities to drive regional economies?

I don’t doubt you are a proud Waterford person but don’t be so innocent when it comes to the motives of media stories like the one today.

Bards

Dubland and Cork feel threatened.... No other reason for that much press coverage over a non-event

Squidvicious

Bards wrote: »

Dubland and Cork feel threatened.... No other reason for that much press coverage over a non-event

While I think that the negative coverage in national media is ridiculous, I definitely don't think that it's because Dublin feels threatened, Dublin is way too big for Waterford to threaten it. Cork is unlikely to feel threatened either. I would say that it's simply a matter of a section of the media wanting to bash Ross and/or the current government.

Dunmoreroader

Squidvicious wrote: »

While I think that the negative coverage in national media is ridiculous, I definitely don't think that it's because Dublin feels threatened, Dublin is way too big for Waterford to threaten it. Cork is unlikely to feel threatened either. I would say that it's simply a matter of a section of the media wanting to bash Ross and/or the current government.

I've been thinking about this all day and I think I agree with you. Of course if that is it then it's almost worse in a way because we're just collateral damage in the big national political 'bash the incumbent government' media agenda. So what if by scoring a few points off that tool Ross, Waterford doesnt get its investment because of the heat they create...so what....who cares.. the 5th estate has done it's duty.

road_high

Squidvicious wrote: »

While I think that the negative coverage in national media is ridiculous, I definitely don't think that it's because Dublin feels threatened, Dublin is way too big for Waterford to threaten it. Cork is unlikely to feel threatened either. I would say that it's simply a matter of a section of the media wanting to bash Ross and/or the current government.

Cork defo feels threatened- they’ve even launched a ridiculous social media ad trying to get Kilkenny people to use it over Dublin so they’re desperate for passengers- the airport has really struggled so the last thing they’d want is more competition. Cork hasn’t a massive catchment bar cork city itself, delusions of grandeur but the passenger figures don’t lie.

Fox Uniform

road_high wrote: »

Cork defo feels threatened- they’ve even launched a ridiculous social media ad trying to get Kilkenny people to use it over Dublin so they’re desperate for passengers- the airport has really struggled so the last thing they’d want is more competition. Cork hasn’t a massive catchment bar cork city itself, delusions of grandeur but the passenger figures don’t lie.

Waterford won't do any real damage to Cork in the short term but they could knock their little % growth year on year.

Your right about all the advertising in Kilkenny and Waterford, they really need every bum on seats. The runway received a lot of PR yesterday - as Ryanair says all PR is good even the negative ones.

Bards

Latest article from Irish Independent Waterford Airport got €20m funds over decade

https://www.independent.ie/irish-news/waterford-airport-got-20m-funds-over-decade-38221015.html

alta stare

Bards wrote: »

Latest article from Irish Independent Waterford Airport got €20m funds over decade

https://www.independent.ie/irish-news/waterford-airport-got-20m-funds-over-decade-38221015.html

Firstly it appears someone is really trying to stop Waterford getting any funding and they are using the indo as a platform. Secondly if the airport did get 20 million over a decade someone out in the airport needs to explain where that went? The airport is falling apart out there so the money wasnt used for any upkeep.

Is that money used to keep the rescue helicopter/crew going or is that seperate funding?

Cosmo Kramer

fricatus wrote: »

My prediction is that it will settle long term into about the same traffic levels as we see in Kerry or Knock, and that will mean that we're finally getting levels of service that other areas see as their due.

Again, there's absolutely no chance of this happening. 365,000 passengers used Kerry Airport last year. Close to 50% of these were either using the Dublin flight, which Waterford won't gain due to its proximity to Dublin, or the German flights primarily for inbound tourists, which Waterford won't gain as German tourists won't go to the South East in sufficient numbers to sustain a route.

Waterford's catchment area is less than half of Knock's and almost all of Waterford's catchment is within 90 minutes to two hours of much larger airports so to suggest that Waterford can sustain three quarters of a million passengers a year as Knock does is simply absurd and can be based on nothing other than wishful thinking unfortunately.

alta stare wrote: »

if the airport did get 20 million over a decade someone out in the airport needs to explain where that went? The airport is falling apart out there so the money wasnt used for any upkeep.

Is that money used to keep the rescue helicopter/crew going or is that seperate funding?

Much of this money went into sustaining the old Aer Arann route network (and more recently VLM). Passengers weren't going to pay the actual amounts needed to make the routes profitable so the airport paid the airlines from subsidy money to make up the difference. You didn't think these airlines actually paid for the privilege of flying out of Waterford did you?

mickger844posts

The Independent can write what they like but funding has been approved. It’s now up to the Airport/investors to get this going and have everything in place for next Summer. Planning permission is in place for the Southern end of the runway so no reason not to start ASAP

sunnysoutheast

I certainly look forward to this level of media scrutiny over all State investments in future!

The bill for the bottomless pit that is the NCH is probably going up by €5m a week, what are we at now €2bn and it'll be a nightmare to get to. That's before we even start to look at the NBP which has been running for years.

vriesmays

Next up for Waterford: a zoo with no animals.

Fox Uniform

alta stare wrote: »

Firstly it appears someone is really trying to stop Waterford getting any funding and they are using the indo as a platform. Secondly if the airport did get 20 million over a decade someone out in the airport needs to explain where that went? The airport is falling apart out there so the money wasnt used for any upkeep.

Is that money used to keep the rescue helicopter/crew going or is that seperate funding?

Its easy to make it sound like Waterford got this big lump of 20M and wasted it, any money Waterford got the other regionals got similar. The main thing with most of this funding is that it was linked to safety and security. For all these projects their had to be a valid reason for the spend and it had to be approved by the DoT.

Aviation is not a cheap game - Upgrade of fire appliance around 2008 was 1.2 million.

Runway surface was overlaid in 2011. It is costing Knock 4.5 Million - As a guess Waterford is 1/2 the size so around 2.25 Million

Over the years there was been serious upgrading of lighting, landing systems and safety areas.

I'm sure somewhere on the DoT website there is a document everything has to be accounted for.

marno21

Another thing, people need to get real about this €5m. The idea that if it’s not spent on Waterford’s runway it’ll somehow be put to good use elsewhere is laughably naive. If it’s not spent on Waterford Airport, the region certainly will never see it again and it’ll likely be used by an accountant to plug a hole elsewhere

Fox Uniform

Cosmo Kramer wrote: »

Much of this money went into sustaining the old Aer Arann route network (and more recently VLM). Passengers weren't going to pay the actual amounts needed to make the routes profitable so the airport paid the airlines from subsidy money to make up the difference. You didn't think these airlines actually paid for the privilege of flying out of Waterford did you?

As far as I was aware airports cannot use government money to subside airlines - Against EU rules.

Fox Uniform

mickger844posts wrote: »

The Independent can write what they like but funding has been approved. It’s now up to the Airport/investors to get this going and have everything in place for next Summer. Planning permission is in place for the Southern end of the runway so no reason not to start ASAP

Best comment on this thread.

Its happening!! - All the huffing and puffing will be forgotten by Monday. Time for the Airport Board and Investors to get their fingers out.