Do you support the Quinn family? (poll attached)

SafeSurfer

Its a stupid question and a stupid poll.

We could have a poll on

Do you support Anglo Irish Bank?

Its meaningless.

The Dagda

WileyCoyote wrote: »

There are still people on this earth who will argue that the Holocaust never happened, that the priests never raped the kids, that the earth is flat, that the world is controlled by giant lizards, and that the Quinn family are victims!
Thankfully they are few and far between!

You're comparing the people who support the Quinn family with holocaust deniers, priest raping kids deniers, flat earthers, and people who believe that lizards control the world?!

Rational.

donegal.

at the sound of the tone there will be exactly 36 trolls on boards.ie


beeeeeep.

Hogzy

SafeSurfer wrote: »

Its a stupid question and a stupid poll.

We could have a poll on

Do you support Anglo Irish Bank?

Its meaningless.

Youre right it is a stupid poll with a stupid question. It shouldnt even be a question. People shouldnt be supporting them considering they are criminals.

May aswell stick up a poll asking people do they support thieves.

Death and Taxes

The Dagda wrote: »

You're comparing the people who support the Quinn family with holocaust deniers, priest raping kids deniers, flat earthers, and people who believe that lizards control the world?!

Rational.

I am indeed, and I would say the the supporters of the Quinn gang are the least lucid and least rational of them all.

Pherekydes

The Dagda wrote: »

You're comparing the people who support the Quinn family with holocaust deniers, priest raping kids deniers, flat earthers, and people who believe that lizards control the world?!

Rational.

Yes, because the common factor is that they're all deluded.

Precious flower

No. People who support him talk about him like he's some kind of saint. I know he gave badly needed areas employment, but he wasn't thinking about the people who lived there, he was thinking about how much of a money maker it would be for him. And when it suited him he gambled those jobs.

Nailz

No, I'd not support then. Having said that, I'm not with them, but I'm don't necessarily have it in for them either.

B.A._Baracus

The whole sean quinn and family thing just shows what people really are deep down. He created a jobs in cavan so those people back him up. Doesnt matter what else he did.

Reminds me of the savage eye sketch:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cjl8OIZijjY

corkoian

Hogzy wrote: »

Youre right it is a stupid poll with a stupid question. It shouldnt even be a question. People shouldnt be supporting them considering they are criminals.

May aswell stick up a poll asking people do they support thieves.

If you don't like the poll, you know where you can go!

Hogzy

corkoian wrote: »

If you don't like the poll, you know where you can go!

Well done buddy, you have completely misinterpreted what I'm saying

SafeSurfer

Hogzy wrote: »

Well done buddy, you have completely misinterpreted what I'm saying

Go easy on him. He is from Cork after all.

Luap

Why arent the idiots who ran anglo irish bank sent to jail :mad:

mikeym

Luap wrote: »

Why arent the idiots who ran anglo irish bank sent to jail :mad:

Anglo Irish Bank has brought this country to its knees and one business man who foolishly bought shares in the bank goes to jail while the people who lent him the money get off WTF????

bigroad

All i want to know how much did the boob job cost for his sons wife ... same price as the cake maybe.

coolhull

mikeym wrote: »

Anglo Irish Bank has brought this country to its knees and one business man who foolishly bought shares in the bank goes to jail while the people who lent him the money get off WTF????

The people who lent him money haven't been convicted of contempt of court (yet) . But Quinn is in prison for that offence, not for borrowing money. I think there's a difference

repsol

bigroad wrote: »

All i want to know how much did the boob job cost for his sons wife ... same price as the cake maybe.

Yeah, but which one tastes better:p

bigroad

I never really liked cake.so.........

Joey the lips

No. Dont care about the jobs he provided. I will be paying a levy on my insurence for a long time, Extra tax in my wifes pay and cuts to services for my child.

So know i dont support him.

Mr Keek

No,

Month ago, years ago we were all looking for arrests and people to be put behind bars; well here you go...yes, this man is partly to blame for alot of crap in this country.

I hope this the start of things to come.

Any sympathy i might had for them was lost when they started playing around and acting thick about things and hidding assets. Man up and take it on the chin. The "I'm a farmers son" comment he made months ago just made me sick to the core. You are/were the ultimate success story, takes a very shrud cleaver person to do that.

solas111

No. I didn’t ask them to gamble billions they didn’t have in order to pursue their greed and put my name on the bill. The way some people are reacting you would think the Quinns and their likes are ready for sainthood. The reality is that no matter how much money they had stashed away it was not enough and their greed was their downfall. We are left to carry the can.

There are plenty of poor people in jail but Quinn won’t meet many of his buddies in there.

repsol

Joey the lips wrote: »

No. Dont care about the jobs he provided. I will be paying a levy on my insurence for a long time, Extra tax in my wifes pay and cuts to services for my child.

So know i dont support him.

You are supporting him Joey.You will be contributing to his B+B for the next 9 weeks!The guy is so out of touch he asked for compassionate release to attend a christening of the latest member of the clan.Bet the ****kickers in Cavan won't block the roads with tractors that day!He should have been sent to Mountjoy,not the training unit.That would have gave him wake up call:)

LizT

One of my friends from Fermanagh posted a pic on facebook of a sign saying

"Sean Quinn was never in my house. I would not be in it either only for him"

Things like that just make me despair.

repsol

LizT wrote: »

One of my friends from Fermanagh posted a pic on facebook of a sign saying

"Sean Quinn was never in my house. I would not be in it either only for him"

Things like that just make me despair.

Considering its probably worth 25% of the price she paid for it,he did her no favours.:D Its getting a bit like a cult up there.It reminds me of the old westerns were some guy "owns the town" and nobody will cross him.Pathetic really

Death and Taxes

mikeym wrote: »

Anglo Irish Bank has brought this country to its knees and one business man who foolishly bought shares in the bank goes to jail while the people who lent him the money get off WTF????

Those who ran the bank are facing serious criminal charges, they too will have their day in court.

Noreen1

WileyCoyote wrote: »

Those who ran the bank are facing serious criminal charges, they too will have their day in court.

They will. But when?

It would make more sense to try that case first, imo.

There should be a lot of evidence provided in that case that would throw more light on the Quinn case.

Since Fingleton (according to todays Independent), still hasn't agreed to a reduction in his pension, you'll forgive me if I question his arrogance, and wonder at the reason for it?

Meanwhile, the only person who has seen the inside of a jail cell in response to the financial collapse, is Sean Quinn. For contempt of court.

Personally, I'm a whole lot more interested in the big fish - the ones who have probably cost us more than the equivalent of the Quinn loans in pensions alone since the collapse.

http://www.independent.ie/business/irish/exboss-of-aib-caves-into-pressure-to-slash-his-500000-pension-in-half-3286136.html

THE man who oversaw the collapse of AIB has bowed to pressure to cut his €529,000-a-year pension.
Former chief executive Eugene Sheehy conceded the cut to €250,000

Executives in charge of the former Anglo Irish Bank and Irish Nationwide are understood to have examined the pensions of former managers, including Michael Fingleton, as part of their effort to tackle "legacy issue" at the banks, but so far without any results.
A spokesman for Bank of Ireland declined to comment.

I wonder how much Anglo have cost us in pensions since the collapse?
Will recovery of €500million cover it?

The Quinn loans are being used as a smokescreen to detract attention from much bigger issues.

sfwcork

Im surprised that he has not been suggested to join the department of the environment.His knowledge of potholes and fixing the roads is second to none

BrianBoru00

I don't think he should be in jail - Not so much from a supporting the Quinn family stance as the fact that it costs 100k per year to keep a prisoner in Ireland - and we're jailing people like Quinn and the Garlic/Apples guy.

We should really change legislation so that we can seize assets of these people and or income and hit them financially ala the C.A.B.

But I think its ridiculous to cost the state more money than is necessary.

sfwcork

Here is aV interesting Post on another thead

Whether you have an interest or not, Sean Quinn former business magnate and billionaire has been making the media headlines constantly over the past number of years.
The most recent headline – has been the rally and show of solidarity for Quinn and his supposedly beleaguered family.
However, the key question is, do these people really understand what they are supporting?
I will attempt to explain the downfall of Sean Quinn, without sounding condescending in layman terms, so joe public can make an informed decision.
The purpose of this article is to provide the FACTS only.
(1) Long before the banking crisis. In 2002 Sean Quinn signed over the majority of his assets (including companies Quinn Insurance, packaging, glass and cement) to his five children (to be divided equally among them).Whilst remaining an incredibly wealthly man, the “cash cow” highly profitable companies were under control of his children.
(2) Sean Quinn is not the victim of Anglo Irish “toxic” Bank blowing all his investment wrecklessly on crazy lending during the boom without him knowing.
(3) Mr. Quinn in 2006 only owned a small share of Anglo Irish Bank.
(4) Where things went badly wrong was when Sean Quinn entered into a highly risky bets called “contracts for difference”. Without boring you with the financial terms, it quite simply means that two parties place a wager against each other. One bets that the share price will rise of a company will rise by a certain date, the other person bets it will fall.
(5) Mr Quinn bet the price of Anglo Irish bank would rise, however as we all know the construction industry collapsed and Anglo’s share price quickly followed (quite simply because all the money it lent was into to the construction industry).
(6) Now the key thing of contracts for difference is that you don’t simply lose your initial bet. You are liable for the entire difference in share price, whether is rises or falls.
(7) For example. I place a stake that Facebook’s share will increase (go long) by a certain date. Another guys reckons it will fall (go short) by the same date. We quite simply place your bet. So I put my stake down (usually 20% of the current share price x by the number of shares I want. So I want 10 facebook shares. They are currently trading at £50 each. So that is £500 worth of share and I need to put up 20% of this, which is £100. The other guy does the same. Facebook’s shares take a big tumble and are trading at £25 per share now. This is really bad because it means that I owe the other guy the difference between the original share price and the price the shares are when then the contract for difference is up. This means I owe the other guy 10 x £25 – my original stake of £100= which means I owe the other guy £150.
(8) Sean Quinn made this same bet with another guy on Anglo only on a much bigger scale. So you recognise the amount he owes to the other party. Anglo share price was trading at a high over €10 a share. They now are worthless.
(9) The guy he made the contract for difference with is unknown.
(10) Now this is the really juicy bit. Once the share price collapsed. Mr. Quinn could have went bankrupt because quite simply he didn’t have enough money to cover his losses.
(11) But he chose not too for some really strange reason. He thought he could fix things. So he decided to buy these shares that he bet on previously (28% of Anglo in total) which would hopefully raise the price of the shares and recover some of his losses. However, as we know this was very poor advice he received as the construction industry was no way about to recover. But the key thing here is as we know from earlier Mr.Quinn did not have the wealth himself to purchase the share as remember he signed over all his companies to children in earlier years.
(12) He somehow convinced Anglo to loan him money to buy Anglo’s own shares which is completely illegal under company law.
(13) Realising the share price was not going to recover, he knew he had to offload the shares, but also realised that he couldn’t offloaded all of this shares all at once because speculators know when large amount of shares come under to the market all once that the company is in trouble.
(14) So he sold his shares to the following
(15) 15% of Anglo went to the Quinn family and children and the other 10% went to the maple ten, investors and friends of Sean Quinn.
(16) However, what he did was pretty much transfer the debt (that he owed Anglo from the loan he took from them to buy this share and from himself) to his children and friends and the Quinn companies which were pretty much debt free up and until now.
(17) With the downturn, the Quinn businesses such as cement and packaging were not performing as well as they were previously. The loan payments were due and the only Quinn company that could make payment was the insurance business.
(18) The family took €200 milllion from the insurance business to service the repayments for the anglo loan. However, this money was essentially from the insurance reserve, money kept in reserve to pay out claims on car accidents etc. The insurance regulator quickly recognised that if Quinn Insurance got an influx of large claims all once it didn’t have the money to pay them and stepped in and took control of the insurance arm.
(19) It meant that the Quinn family were left to service the anglo debt but were no longer in control of the cash cow insurance arm. Without this insurance company the Quinn family didn’t have a chance of repaying the anglo loans. And the rest is history. So when the Quinn family defaulted on the loan repayments Anglo took control of the remaining Quinn companies in an effort to recoup their losses
(20) The Quinns quickly moved to put their international assets, namely a Russian hotel among other outside of the control of Anglo, in a web of complex companies.


Points to Note.
You as the taxpayer have bailed out the banks. Now the banks are trying to repay back to the taxpayer these monies through clawing back as much as possible from the sale of assets from developers and other it has loaned money originally.Anglo is doing the same with Sean Quinn and is obviously is trying to claim back more money.

Quite simply, the less assets Anglo can recover the more the taxpayer has to fork out.

So by hiding assets in complex transactions, the Quinn family is costing the taxpayer more money. They are also disputing the legality of the money Anglo lent Sean originally to buy the shares. However, if the shares had have increased instead of dropped, they wouldn’t be disputing the legality of the loans.

So the question has to be asked, will you rally to support Sean Quinn and family knowing they are hitting your back pocket as they hid assets?

Why didn’t Sean Quinn go bankrupt instead of asking his children’s companies to take over his debt. If he went bankrupt before transferring the debt (the worthless shares) to his children and their companies, the Quinn Family would still be in control on the Quinn Group as the children did not owe the debt to Anglo, Sean did.

SafeSurfer

Interesting poll here too.

http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=2056799793

Very Interesting results. While 90% of people do not support what the Quinns did, 90% of people would do exactly the same thing, according to the respective polls.

blackwhite

Mr Keek wrote: »

Any sympathy i might had for them was lost when they started playing around and acting thick about things and hidding assets. Man up and take it on the chin.

This.

I think there are serious questions to be asked around the legality of the loans that were extended to buy the Anglo shares, but even if these were discounted the Quinn's are in the hock for €500m to IBRC, and by extension, to the taxpayer.

If they had surrendered whatever necessary to cover the €500m and then challenged the Anglo share loans then I'd have retained some small element of sympathy for them, but the bending over backwards to screw the taxpayer out of every last penny shows a large degree of contempt for everyone else, and a refusal to pay any price for their mistakes.


I don't have much time for those who try to blame the Quinn's for the current state of the economy, it was f***ed regardless. Blaming him for the €4bn is a bit of a smokescreen for Anglo's former management. They knew the shares were worthless, but still gave a loan secured on them - basically using Quinn as a patsy to set up a transfer of €4bn from Anglo (and ultimately the taxpayer) into the hands of the unidentified former shareholders who sold their shares to Quinn.....

None of this excuses what Quinn has done since then in trying to hide assets, and regardless of these loans he'd still be up the swannee for €500million of other debts.

sfwcork

Safesurfer do you have a rebuttle to my last post?

Pherekydes

SafeSurfer wrote: »

Interesting poll here too.

http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=2056799793

Very Interesting results. While 90% of people do not support what the Quinns did, 90% of people would do exactly the same thing, according to the respective polls.

Why don't you compare like with like? The other thread asks what people would do with their wealth. This thread is about Quinn putting wealth that is not his own out of reach of the state.

SafeSurfer

sfwcork wrote: »

Safesurfer do you have a rebuttle to my last post?

To be honest I didn't read it.

Pherekydes wrote: »

Why don't you compare like with like? The other thread asks what people would do with their wealth. This thread is about Quinn putting wealth that is not his own out of reach of the state.

No. The other poll asks would you hide your wealth from the bankers and the government which is exactly what Quinn is doing.

Pherekydes

SafeSurfer wrote: »

No. The other poll asks would you hide your wealth from the bankers and the government which is exactly what Quinn is doing.

No, Quinn is hiding wealth that is not his own from bankers and the government.

Zebra3

The same mongs who support the Quinns are the like the ones who love Healy-Rae, the Flynns and all the other parasites and their offspring undyingly.

Wake the f**k up.

Plazaman

Give us back our €500 million Quinn so we can build the Childrens Hospital ya bástard.

[Jackass]

Can one of the mods fix the poll please? I think it's meant to say "Are you from Cavan / Monaghan?".

Thanks.

SafeSurfer

Pherekydes wrote: »

No, Quinn is hiding wealth that is not his own from bankers and the government.

Eh no, he is hiding his wealth from IBRC. If by "not his own" you mean that technically some Ukrainian railway worker now controls the assets then I see what you mean.


Can you explain to me the difference between Quinn hiding his assets from bankers and the government and the poll question?

"Would you hide yo9ur wealth from bankers and the government?"

sfwcork

wrote:

SafeSurfer
Registered User



To be honest I didn't read it.

then why dont You

come on teach us the error of our ways

Read the article and tell us the truth!

or is it the case that you dont have any rebuttle and just choose to ignore instead of facing up

Pherekydes

SafeSurfer wrote: »

Can you explain to me the difference between Quinn hiding his assets from bankers and the government and the poll question?

"Would you hide yo9ur wealth from bankers and the government?"

He doesn't own the assets.

Noreen1

blackwhite wrote: »

This.

I think there are serious questions to be asked around the legality of the loans that were extended to buy the Anglo shares, but even if these were discounted the Quinn's are in the hock for €500m to IBRC, and by extension, to the taxpayer.

If they had surrendered whatever necessary to cover the €500m and then challenged the Anglo share loans then I'd have retained some small element of sympathy for them, but the bending over backwards to screw the taxpayer out of every last penny shows a large degree of contempt for everyone else, and a refusal to pay any price for their mistakes.


I don't have much time for those who try to blame the Quinn's for the current state of the economy, it was f***ed regardless. Blaming him for the €4bn is a bit of a smokescreen for Anglo's former management. They knew the shares were worthless, but still gave a loan secured on them - basically using Quinn as a patsy to set up a transfer of €4bn from Anglo (and ultimately the taxpayer) into the hands of the unidentified former shareholders who sold their shares to Quinn.....

None of this excuses what Quinn has done since then in trying to hide assets, and regardless of these loans he'd still be up the swannee for €500million of other debts.

They have challenged the share loans. For whatever reason, that case seems to be taking a lot longer to get to court than Anglos case against Quinn.

The second bolded bit, I agree with completely.

Finally, how much are the assets that Anglo have seized from Quinn to date, actually worth?
I keep hearing 2+ Billion, 4 Billion, and 500 million - but that would assume that Anglo have recovered nothing - and that's just not true.

Tom Joad

Nope don't support him and quite frankly am sick and tired pointing out to people that he doesn't have the undying unconditional support of most normal sane Cavan people..

sfwcork

wrote:

Noreen1
Registered User

.

The second bolded bit, I agree with completely.

Finally, how much are the assets that Anglo have seized from Quinn to date, actually worth?
I keep hearing 2+ Billion, 4 Billion, and 500 million - but that would assume that Anglo have recovered nothing - and that's just not true.

Sean Quinss wife and sons have challenged the IRBC over the loans.Not sean Quinn SNR

SafeSurfer

sfwcork wrote: »

then why dont You

come on teach us the error of our ways

Read the article and tell us the truth!

or is it the case that you dont have any rebuttle and just choose to ignore instead of facing up

I have read what you posted and there are a number of facts that I dispute.

My understanding is that:

1. The loan to Quinn from Anglo was to support Anglo's share price. This is illegal meaning that any personal guarantees or claims on assets to cover the loan are null and void.

2. The Maple 10 were not comprised of Sean Quinn's friends as you say but were a group put together by Anglo with the co operation of the minister for finance.

3. The civil case between Quinn and IBRC will be very interesting and will be as close to a banking enquiry as we are likely to get.

coolhull

[QUOTE=SafeSurfer;81629371

1. The loan to Quinn from Anglo was to support Anglo's share price. This is illegal meaning that any personal guarantees or claims on assets to cover the loan are null and void.

What a pity that Sean Quinn couldn't have afforded a solicitor to advice him that the stunt was illegal. I'm not a legal person or a businessman but even I could have smelled something rotten there.
And if it was illegal to offer the loan, was it not also illegal to accept it?

SafeSurfer

WileyCoyote wrote: »

Those who ran the bank are facing serious criminal charges, they too will have their day in court.

Are you aware that in the banks bailed out by the tax payer have head hunted some of the most senior members of the Garda corporate fraud squad?

Apart from frustrating the investigation into the banks how will this play out in court - former investigators giving evidence against their new employers?

sfwcork

I fail to understand a few points and so far I have yet to come across a quinn Licker that Can answer me

All i see or hear is that the books were cooked and that quinn was a businessman that flew by the seat of his pants so didnt always follow correct procedures

But what i fail to grasp are few points

1-If the books were cooked why have the EU not spotted it.The banks books are scrutinised heavily but yet the cooking hasnt been spotted?


How didQuinn spot the cooked books after the horse had passed the line?

If his investment had come out + would we be in this situation? considering the books are cooked

Korvanica

OP you should have made this poll public...

DARK-KNIGHT

Heard the Quinn family have downgraded cars from luxury sportscars to luxury Audi a8 diesel poor bastards!!

Can we see what users voted to support them?? Shame on whoever voted to support lol

To be fair the family members Sean transferred assets into their names should have been given custodial sentences as those actions were definitely criminal knowing what Sean senior was doing!!

I personally feel sorry for them I'm lucky if I have 100 euro to my name at months end while Quinn is down to his last half billion