Salthill Air Show

Storm 10

Amik wrote: »

Thunderbirds must have cost quite a bit to bring over.

US Govt you can thank for that I believe as they are the demo team for the USAF, I remember the US Hercules that landed at Galway, when they came it was piloted by a lady and she took the Aircraft on a sightseeing trip up to Clifden as her parents were from there.

Conmaicne Mara

So if it was finding that stopped it, how much do they need?

I would pay in to see the Salt Hill Airshow of old complete with - loud, fast, impressive and just really fcuking cool - so called war planes as they made the day everyday, the best I'd seen were the German Tornadoes that flew from the backs of the houses out over the bay and surprised everyone by not flying down the bay initially.

Sponge Bob

Tornados were great for noise. Mind you the B1 bomber was too.

BeardySi

*muttermutter*missedthatoneasiwasrunninglatethatday*muttermutter*

Salthill was arguably one of the best free airshows in Europe, always attracting something exciting to an otherwise (in aviation terms) quiet neck of the woods...

It's just a crying shame the the good businesspeople of Galway were all too happy to reap the benefit of the many thousands of visitors but not contribute to supporting it...

biko

I tried to find some numbers for the cost but there isn't any total costs I could find.
Apparently "every year the council allocated it €15,000, which is only a pittance in comparison to the real cost"

galwayrush

biko wrote: »

I tried to find some numbers for the cost but there isn't any total costs I could find.
Apparently "every year the council allocated it €15,000, which is only a pittance in comparison to the real cost"

I heard a figure of a little over 100K , no idea how true it is, but it seems such a small amount compared to the benefits.

Aerohead

From what I understand it cost in the region of 100k to run it, the Council only supported the event in the final few years giving it 10k and in its last year 15k, dont forget it started in 1992 so got very little support over those years, dont know how the managed to do it.

Conmaicne Mara

If everyone who went gave €2 or more you'd imagine it'd be more than do able, but how to collect it on the public street

jamesdiver

Its got to be a commercial event, pay entry, otherwise Galway will never have an airshow. The least we can hope for is if we get the VOR again, and they book a few jets. Im going to go back to my original idea of using a large private facility, such as an airport, and charging people in. Adult ticket prices to Dunsfold Wings and Wheels was £22. But there was serious bang for your buck there. I mean you didnt have time to get around and see all the cool stuff.

Wompa1

bluecode wrote: »

The airshow won't be back, neither will the Volvo Ocean race and it's seems Ironman. Same reason the airport lies empty and in danger of closing.

Money.

Money, Greed and Corruption.

Gambas

galwayrush wrote: »

I heard a figure of a little over 100K , no idea how true it is, but it seems such a small amount compared to the benefits.

I've yet to see any concrete set of figures for 'the benefits'. It seems most people are prepared to simply assume that the return to the city would justify the investment. And yet the people who they expect to pay for it, and would theoretically benefit the most, disagree.

Gambas

Wompa1 wrote: »

Money, Greed and Corruption.

Seriously? We have 2 international airports west of the Shannon and one city of less than 100k. Galway Airport might be able to sustain a (expensive) flight to London, but that is about it. The rest were totally dependent on subsidies. The Ironman is a minor event with little profile. The Ocean race heightened the city's profile nationally, but it is a non-event elsewhere. I would consider it a success both times, but can't see the value in bidding again a\s it is a case of diminishing returns as the novelty factor is gone.

Your comment is lazy and way off the mark.

jamesdiver

Gambas wrote: »

I've yet to see any concrete set of figures for 'the benefits'. It seems most people are prepared to simply assume that the return to the city would justify the investment. And yet the people who they expect to pay for it, and would theoretically benefit the most, disagree.

How about the benefit for the hundreds of families who can take their kids to a free family friendly event.

biko

Even though entertainment is a benefit to the families it's hard to say this alone is worth it for the businesses around the area.
They invest in the airshow in that they give money and expect a rise in sales in return that exceeds the investment. If this doesn't happen they would be reluctant to do it again, particularly with these hard economic times.

I suppose you could look at sponsoring from various major companies around Galway but without numbers it's difficult to say how many companies you'd have to approach.

jamesdiver

Yea, I do agree with these points, and Gambas above is probably the most realistic. Would need some big corporate sponsors. But corporate sponsors will want corporate hospitality. Perhaps some of the hotels along the prom could be bases for the corporate stuff, with good elevated views. I know ill be hiding out on Mutton Island myself watching it

Dan_Solo

jamesdiver wrote: »

How about the benefit for the hundreds of families who can take their kids to a free family friendly event.

This might be great for families with kids, but it doesn't really address the fact that a "free event" is exactly the problem. It costs money to run. Nobody wants to pay for it, even the local businesses who we have been told are allegedly benefiting from it.

bluecode

Some of you seem to making the argument to do nothing. Makes you wonder how other towns can manage to organise things. What's the story with Bray exactly. How is that paid for?

Similar shows are held at seaside towns all over the UK including Northern Ireland. Portrush a little seaside town organise an airshow every year. Apparently the people of Coleraine appreciate it enough to sponsor. Yet we here in Galway just wring our hands and say it isn't possible.

Never mind the airshow, we're going to lose the Volvo Ocean Race for good using much the same reasoning. Quote:'it's lost it's novelty value.':rolleyes: Yeah let's cancel the races, the arts festival and everything else. They're getting boring. What kind of attitude is that?

Some other place will pick it up and not make the monumental financial mess that was made in Galway.

What the hell is the problem with Galway? There's the airport that's threatened with closure even though everyone agrees it's good thing and even needed. Yet the much less busy Sligo Airport carries on apace?

Is there some strange self destructive instinct in Galway?

Laviski

there is no need for a commercial airport airport for galway. at most make it into a flight school and keep it for private charted planes also for emergency's. Galway chamber of commerce(majority stakeholder) have no one else to blame but themselves. in the boom time the government offered them the military lands to build a proper runway cause the one currently is too short which what makes the current airport nonviable commercially.
Any time i leave ireland its through dublin. I did however flew out of galway for lulz to london, but never again cause it was far too expensive. this is a tiny island of under 5 mill ppl. if things were done properly shannon should have being built near ennis/gort and knock airport in sligo.

Gambas

biko wrote: »

Even though entertainment is a benefit to the families it's hard to say this alone is worth it for the businesses around the area.
They invest in the airshow in that they give money and expect a rise in sales in return that exceeds the investment. If this doesn't happen they would be reluctant to do it again, particularly with these hard economic times.

I suppose you could look at sponsoring from various major companies around Galway but without numbers it's difficult to say how many companies you'd have to approach.

Numbers? You must be one of those cold-hearted, bean counters who knows the price of everything and the value of nothing! Can you not see the possibilities man!

biko

Call me Scrooge...

Gambas

bluecode wrote: »

Some of you seem to making the argument to do nothing. Makes you wonder how other towns can manage to organise things. What's the story with Bray exactly. How is that paid for?

Similar shows are held at seaside towns all over the UK including Northern Ireland. Portrush a little seaside town organise an airshow every year. Apparently the people of Coleraine appreciate it enough to sponsor. Yet we here in Galway just wring our hands and say it isn't possible.

Never mind the airshow, we're going to lose the Volvo Ocean Race for good using much the same reasoning. Quote:'it's lost it's novelty value.':rolleyes: Yeah let's cancel the races, the arts festival and everything else. They're getting boring. What kind of attitude is that?

Some other place will pick it up and not make the monumental financial mess that was made in Galway.

What the hell is the problem with Galway? There's the airport that's threatened with closure even though everyone agrees it's good thing and even needed. Yet the much less busy Sligo Airport carries on apace?

I'm afraid there are some gaps in your analysis.

Sligo airport has no scheduled flights.

Portrush/Colraine Airshow has recently been cancelled due to lack of funding (2010). In 2012 it had a headline sponsor - RSA.

And clearly the most important group of people don't agree with the need for Galway Airport either given that passenger numbers collapsed from 309,302 in 2007 to 160,000 in 2010. I won't even go looking for 2011 because things had got so bad by then that they probably aren't even comparable.

I know these are facts, and they probably won't deter you.

Galway is a very small city, with a summer full of festivals. Suggesting that it has a problem - lacks the desire or the capability to run/retain festivals/events is stretching it to say the least.

flazio

Maybe we should be looking at perhaps not making the air show an event in itself, but part of a bigger festival, like they did with the display on the Volvo race a few years ago. Say for example, we held an honour day for our military, bit like UK remembrance day in the UK but with perhaps more emphasis on current troops rather then sombre remembrance of fallen heros, you incorperate an aerial display into this event and there we go. Doesn't have to be military, it could be to honour Atlantic crossings, Emergency service displays you know, think bigger.

bluecode

Gambas wrote: »

I'm afraid there are some gaps in your analysis.

Sligo airport has no scheduled flights.

Portrush/Colraine Airshow has recently been cancelled due to lack of funding (2010). In 2012 it had a headline sponsor - RSA.

And clearly the most important group of people don't agree with the need for Galway Airport either given that passenger numbers collapsed from 309,302 in 2007 to 160,000 in 2010. I won't even go looking for 2011 because things had got so bad by then that they probably aren't even comparable.

I know these are facts, and they probably won't deter you.

Galway is a very small city, with a summer full of festivals. Suggesting that it has a problem - lacks the desire or the capability to run/retain festivals/events is stretching it to say the least.

I think you need to research your 'facts' a little more thoroughly.
Sligo airport only had two flights a day when Galway had quite a few more. Now they're gone and as far as I know there is no talk of closing it. It's open every day for any traffic and has a flying school and maintenance base and the rescue helicopter. Meanwhile Galway airport opens office hours during the week even in Summer and is closed to everyone except the flying club at weekends. But even during the good times it had a reputation for being unfriendly and expensive to visiting aircraft. It also antagonised Aer Arann on which is depended for business. Also it would close at odd times during the day. Unlike Sligo or indeed Waterford or indeed Kerry or indeed Carrickfin. Even now with it apparently in danger of closing any minute, this awkwardness has continued. I know this from personal experience.

Somehow or other a city the size of Galway cannot even keep a small airport going unlike all the others mentioned. All of them smaller than Galway.

I was puzzled at first by your 'fact' that Portrush was cancelled 2010. I seem to remember friends going to it. A quick google revealed videos from people who claimed to have been there. Were they deluded?

But in fact yes you are right, Portrush, it was cancelled in 2010 due to lack of funding. But oh wait, this happened:
http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/uk_news/northern_ireland/8546554.stm

Councillors in Coleraine have voted to hold the International Air Show after local businesses agreed to finance it.

Wow imagine that local businesses agreed to finance it. What were they thinking. I don't know but nothing like Galway business people. Their chamber of commerce apparently appreciated the influx of visitors. Then they held it in 2011 and 2012 and guess what next year again!

Maybe they should look at bringing to Volvo Ocean race to Portrush. They don't appear to have adopted the defeatist attitude demonstrated in Galway. Either they could offer advice to the Galway Chamber. Not that they'll listen.

I'm not suggesting Galway has a problem with organising things. I'm straight out saying it has a problem. The latest debacle of the Volvo race and it's disastrous financial issues being only the most recent example.

It's strange when you think about it.

Gambas

bluecode wrote: »

Somehow or other a city the size of Galway cannot even keep a small airport going unlike all the others mentioned. All of them smaller than Galway.

'Galway' doesn't own or operate Galway Airport. It is not Leisureland in Lydican.

If you are pining for the sort of service that Sligo airport provides, I'm afraid I can't help you, let alone agree that other peoples cash should be used for your hobby.

The sum total of your posts is that other people are not prepared to plough their cash into things that you'd like but they fail to see the value in. But clearly you see it differently. I can only assume you have approached Corrib Airport Limited with an offer of all of your savings in return for some equity? This time next year Rodders, you'll be a millionaire - and have saved Galway from the ignominy that the rest of us are intent on heaping on ourselves.

ben.schlomo

bluecode wrote: »

I think you need to research your 'facts' a little more thoroughly.
Sligo airport only had two flights a day when Galway had quite a few more. Now they're gone and as far as I know there is no talk of closing it. It's open every day for any traffic and has a flying school and maintenance base and the rescue helicopter. Meanwhile Galway airport opens office hours during the week even in Summer and is closed to everyone except the flying club at weekends. But even during the good times it had a reputation for being unfriendly and expensive to visiting aircraft. It also antagonised Aer Arann on which is depended for business. Also it would close at odd times during the day. Unlike Sligo or indeed Waterford or indeed Kerry or indeed Carrickfin. Even now with it apparently in danger of closing any minute, this awkwardness has continued. I know this from personal experience.

Somehow or other a city the size of Galway cannot even keep a small airport going unlike all the others mentioned. All of them smaller than Galway.

I was puzzled at first by your 'fact' that Portrush was cancelled 2010. I seem to remember friends going to it. A quick google revealed videos from people who claimed to have been there. Were they deluded?

But in fact yes you are right, Portrush, it was cancelled in 2010 due to lack of funding. But oh wait, this happened:
http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/uk_news/northern_ireland/8546554.stm

Wow imagine that local businesses agreed to finance it. What were they thinking. I don't know but nothing like Galway business people. Their chamber of commerce apparently appreciated the influx of visitors. Then they held it in 2011 and 2012 and guess what next year again!

Maybe they should look at bringing to Volvo Ocean race to Portrush. They don't appear to have adopted the defeatist attitude demonstrated in Galway. Either they could offer advice to the Galway Chamber. Not that they'll listen.

I'm not suggesting Galway has a problem with organising things. I'm straight out saying it has a problem. The latest debacle of the Volvo race and it's disastrous financial issues being only the most recent example.

It's strange when you think about it.

So what exactly is your problem with? You think an airport that isnt commercially viable or necessary should be kept open? Or is something to do with Galway holding the VOR at the expense of the metropolis of Portrush or is it something to do with the air show. I honestly cant make head nor tail of your ramblings.

bluecode

Gamas and ben.schlomo apart from indulging in a bit of ad hominen. I'm afraid you typify the attitude I'm critical of. Far to common in Galway it seems. The inability to see the value of anything. Other towns don't appear to suffer from the same mentality. They not only see the benefit in these events but are prepared to front up money in the expectation of a return.

You say a Galway airport isn't commercially viable. That's utter nonsense. You don't need airliners flying in an out to have an airport that's an asset to the community it serves. The fact is the owners of Galway airport are a shining example of how not to run an airport. Meanwhile even lowly Sligo stays open and shows no signs of closing.

As for other events like the airshow. You have to wonder at the mentality of business people who cannot see an event which brings tens of thousands to their town as something to be encouraged and nurtured. The business people of Coleraine thought it worthwhile and you can be sure it wasn't love of aeroplanes. Which isn't my 'hobby' by the way. It's my job.

The classic example now of course is the VOR. Even though it brought in less money than expected. It still brought in a lot of money, very little of which apparently found it's way to the organisers to they could pay their suppliers. So we won't be seeing the likes of it again.

You can be quite sure the replacement town will do quite nicely of it.

Wompa1

bluecode wrote: »

Gamas and ben.schlomo apart from indulging in a bit of ad hominen. I'm afraid you typify the attitude I'm critical of. Far to common in Galway it seems. The inability to see the value of anything. Other towns don't appear to suffer from the same mentality. They not only see the benefit in these events but are prepared to front up money in the expectation of a return.

You say a Galway airport isn't commercially viable. That's utter nonsense. You don't need airliners flying in an out to have an airport that's an asset to the community it serves. The fact is the owners of Galway airport are a shining example of how not to run an airport. Meanwhile even lowly Sligo stays open and shows no signs of closing.

As for other events like the airshow. You have to wonder at the mentality of business people who cannot see an event which brings tens of thousands to their town as something to be encouraged and nurtured. The business people of Coleraine thought it worthwhile and you can be sure it wasn't love of aeroplanes. Which isn't my 'hobby' by the way. It's my job.

The classic example now of course is the VOR. Even though it brought in less money than expected. It still brought in a lot of money, very little of which apparently found it's way to the organisers to they could pay their suppliers. So we won't be seeing the likes of it again.

You can be quite sure the replacement town will do quite nicely of it.

I agree with you for the most part. I believe these types of events do have a positive impact on the local economy and I can say that as somebody who worked in the retail and service industry in Galway for 10 years. The proof is in the till print out at the end of the day when you are cashing out for the evening.

Think about it from a small scale to a large scale. You work somewhere that sells soft ice cream cones. More families around, more ice cream sold. More people bringing their families into the city from commuter towns or other counties stopping into a local eatery or even just McDonalds or Supermacs. More money. People who may be enticed to Galway for the weekend because there's an event such as this to entertain their kids one one of the days of their trip. And then because we're a national of boozers. The pubs in Salthill would see an influx for the day I'd bet my bank balance on that one.

The issue when it comes to Galway is corruption.

Storm 10

flazio wrote: »

Maybe we should be looking at perhaps not making the air show an event in itself, but part of a bigger festival.

Thats how the Salthill Airshow Originally started.

TBH the Organisers built up such an excellent reputation about Salthill that it wasnt hard for them to attract Aircraft/Teams like the Thunderbirds, Marineflieger Tornado's, constant Red Arrows displays, B1 bombers the list is endless.

You would have a hard hard act to follow to even try to emulate them, it has been tried at elsewhere in Ireland but it has not to date ever attracted what The Organisers of The Salthill Airshow could.

bluecode

Storm 10 wrote: »

Thats how the Salthill Airshow Originally started.

TBH the Organisers built up such an excellent reputation about Salthill that it wasnt hard for them to attract Aircraft/Teams like the Thunderbirds, Marineflieger Tornado's, constant Red Arrows displays, B1 bombers the list is endless.

You would have a hard hard act to follow to even try to emulate them, it has been tried at elsewhere in Ireland but it has not to date ever attracted what The Organisers of The Salthill Airshow could.

The guys who organised Salthill were well connected. They had a good rep among the right people. But they had no money and their fatal flaw was to live in Galway where their enthusiasm and abilities amounted to nothing.


If you need evidence check out the thread on this very forum were the VOR people owe €690,000. Thank you Galway Chamber of Commerce. It's fairly obvious now why so many shops sit empty.

ben.schlomo

bluecode wrote: »

Gamas and ben.schlomo apart from indulging in a bit of ad hominen. I'm afraid you typify the attitude I'm critical of. Far to common in Galway it seems. The inability to see the value of anything. Other towns don't appear to suffer from the same mentality. They not only see the benefit in these events but are prepared to front up money in the expectation of a return.

You say a Galway airport isn't commercially viable. That's utter nonsense. You don't need airliners flying in an out to have an airport that's an asset to the community it serves. The fact is the owners of Galway airport are a shining example of how not to run an airport. Meanwhile even lowly Sligo stays open and shows no signs of closing.

As for other events like the airshow. You have to wonder at the mentality of business people who cannot see an event which brings tens of thousands to their town as something to be encouraged and nurtured. The business people of Coleraine thought it worthwhile and you can be sure it wasn't love of aeroplanes. Which isn't my 'hobby' by the way. It's my job.

The classic example now of course is the VOR. Even though it brought in less money than expected. It still brought in a lot of money, very little of which apparently found it's way to the organisers to they could pay their suppliers. So we won't be seeing the likes of it again.

You can be quite sure the replacement town will do quite nicely of it.

You might want to read up on Galway Airport if you think it was commercially viable, it was propped up for years by funding and as soon as it stopped it fell to pieces financially. As for the rest of your rants im not getting into it as you are just overtly negative. Galway clearly doesnt put any money into any events, doesnt attract any tourists and obviously has no tourism industry.:rolleyes: