Website - questions on CMS development

Humblepie

Hi Folks - a few questions:

Our website was designed some years ago and it is adequate. However, there is no CMS , so no control for us. Every little change we make we are handsomely charged for. Also charged 350 per annum to developer for hosting which is alot I think. Have been quoted about €950 for a CMS from same developer.
So questions as follows:
1. We want a CMS developed (preferably not by the developer) but are we as well to shell out to him and have him do it as he is familiar with te set up etc? (he might even have it built in already) - I really want to get this done as fast as possible and with as little hassle as possible and not sure I want to go jumping into Wordpress etc as I wouldnt know where to start tbh.
We have had very bad service from the web developer and basically he doesnt care but my gut is telling me to pay out for the CMS and then change hosting provider so we have no ties whatsoever.
2. He has developed the websitesite and if he developed a CMS and gives us control, is there anything stopping us moving hosting to a different cheaper host? Any recommendations? PM me please.

I want to get this set up properly before we do any proper SEO work on the site.
So, thats it. Any replies / suggestions gratefully received.
H

sheesh

So its a flat HTML structure?

is there E-commerce involved?

It really depends on what you are getting for your €350

if there is an e-commerce part to your site you will be paying for a security certificate, hosting, and a payment gateway it wouldn't be alot but you would have to pay someone to look after it.

Also the 950 to convert it to a cms: it depends on the site with alot of content the developer will be recreating the site in the cms which could take 1-3 days. copying and pasting the content for a day or 2. he can also create training document have a day training the end user.

listen, in case you think I am saying 'You are wrong and your IT guy is great' I am not I am just saying it depends on the size of your site.

if you are not happy with the service you are getting from you Developer try to establish who owns the domain name and start looking for another website guy.

so that is approximately a weeks work including VAT and tax. 950 is about right for a professional setup. and when I say a weeks work it takes more than a week to do it could take about a month to accomplish that kind of thing in reality but there would be only a weeks worth of billable time.

KonFusion

May I ask what is the website?

My advice: If you're not happy with the work being done, and the service being provided, make sure you own the domain name, and find another designer/developer.

Especially if you intend to generate a large volume of sales via the website, and sell items via the website.

Has he mentioned what CMS he intends to implement?

There is a wealth of great talent in this country. Don't waste time with someone who doesn't care about your project as much as you do, and provides an inadequate service.

You wouldn't continue to go to a shoddy mechanic just because he was familiar with your car.

Fanny Cradock

sheesh wrote: »

it depends on the site with alot of content the developer will be recreating the site in the cms which could take 1-3 days

Without knowing the CMS or the site (we don't know what features it has, for example) those figures should come with a caveat. It might take 1 - 3 days, but it might take longer. If the dev is doing content population and there are a lot of pages then this can take an age. It's all dependent on what the site currently has and what it is going to have. The same goes for the price that has been quoted.

@Humblepie
There is nothing stopping you from moving to new hosting, but you need to understand what you are moving to and if this new server fulfils your requirements. Don't, for example, move to a Windows based server just because you happen to use Windows 7 on the office computer. Your new site will determine what you need and whoever is building that will be able to advise you on this. If you own the domain name then moving will be a much easier process.

As KonFusion has already said, if you are unhappy with your service then you should look to move. Unless you know better (e.g. you think that this developer is going to pull out all the stops to keep you sweet) there is no sense in getting more work done before you move. What makes you think it would be any better?

You need to look at the various CMS options out there and see what is best for you. There isn't a perfect CMS out there and they all have their pros and cons. Some are geared to specific types of sites (blogs, shopping cart etc.), some have steep learning curves, some are licensed and come at a cost and so on. Look at the most popular ones and see what fits - e.g. http://www.makeuseof.com/tag/10-popular-content-management-systems-online/

In my personal experience, MODx is the most user friendly CMS and it's free. The down side is that it is not as popular as Joomla, Wordpress etc.

sheesh

Fanny Cradock wrote: »

Without knowing the CMS or the site (we don't know what features it has, for example) those figures should come with a caveat. It might take 1 - 3 days, but it might take longer. If the dev is doing content population and there are a lot of pages then this can take an age. It's all dependent on what the site currently has and what it is going to have. The same goes for the price that has been quoted.

@ Humblepie I agree with the above too.

basically I don't know if you are being ripped off or not. i would need more info which you are probably not willing to say for reasons of confidentiality (good reason too)

[/QUOTE]

In my personal experience, MODx is the most user friendly CMS and it's free. The down side is that it is not as popular as Joomla, Wordpress etc.[/QUOTE]

Also I use modx as an easy to use cms as well.

Humblepie

KonFusion wrote: »

May I ask what is the website?
QUOTE]

Id rather not say online here but thanks for the info. very helpful.

Humblepie

Fanny Cradock wrote: »

Without knowing the CMS or the site (we don't know what features it has, for example) those figures should come with a caveat. It might take 1 - 3 days, but it might take longer. If the dev is doing content population and there are a lot of pages then this can take an age. It's all dependent on what the site currently has and what it is going to have. The same goes for the price that has been quoted.

@Humblepie
There is nothing stopping you from moving to new hosting, but you need to understand what you are moving to and if this new server fulfils your requirements. Don't, for example, move to a Windows based server just because you happen to use Windows 7 on the office computer. Your new site will determine what you need and whoever is building that will be able to advise you on this. If you own the domain name then moving will be a much easier process.

As KonFusion has already said, if you are unhappy with your service then you should look to move. Unless you know better (e.g. you think that this developer is going to pull out all the stops to keep you sweet) there is no sense in getting more work done before you move. What makes you think it would be any better?

You need to look at the various CMS options out there and see what is best for you. There isn't a perfect CMS out there and they all have their pros and cons. Some are geared to specific types of sites (blogs, shopping cart etc.), some have steep learning curves, some are licensed and come at a cost and so on. Look at the most popular ones and see what fits - e.g. http://www.makeuseof.com/tag/10-popular-content-management-systems-online/

In my personal experience, MODx is the most user friendly CMS and it's free. The down side is that it is not as popular as Joomla, Wordpress etc.

Thanks. So, the site is straightforward, no flash or any fancy stuff. Title page, page per product, all the standard stuff, have a "contact us" page that gives us the majority of sales. To confirm, we pay yearly domain subscription to BT Ireland so i guess we own the domain?? I dont know what it was coded in but I guess my 2 questions now really are:
1) If I contact the developer and tell him I want to move the site off his servers (or wherever he hosts it on our behalf), what do I need to do here?
2) If I do that, can someone else do the CMS ONLY (leaving the site as is)

thanks

Humblepie

sheesh wrote: »

So its a flat HTML structure?

is there E-commerce involved?

It really depends on what you are getting for your €350

No E-Commerce, nothing like that. Its straightworward - text, pics and a few movies.

thx

tricky D

If it's a simply constructed site, you could have a look at something like PageLime or CushyCMS. They're pretty easy to setup and use. Developing a custom CMS for a simple site is unnecessary imo considering there are plenty of existing CMSs out there.

dahamsta

Humblepie wrote: »

To confirm, we pay yearly domain subscription to BT Ireland so i guess we own the domain?

Probably, but you should check the Registrant here to be sure it's in your name or your company's name. You'll be paying through the nose for it with BT though, you should transfer it out to another Irish registrar. If the domain is an IE, all you need to do is send a signed letter on headed notepaper to your new registrar, and they can take it from there. Unfortunately BT set themselves as the admin contact for COM/NET/etc domains, so you'll need to contact them to tell them to: a) put the Administrative contact in your name, b) unlock the domain, and c) provide an authorisation code. Your new registrar will then be able to walk you through the process.

1) If I contact the developer and tell him I want to move the site off his servers (or wherever he hosts it on our behalf), what do I need to do here?

Some developers are very dodgy about this unfortunately, they may refuse access or tell you that their system is proprietary and your content can't be exported. With this in mind, your first step should be to take a backup of your site. I'd recommend contracting a developer immediately, one capable of mirroring your site and using the resultant mirror to create a theme for your chosen CMS. If they're competent, they should be able to show you the mirror on a temporary hostname, and this mirror should be complete -- that is, all links should work, all media should be there, etc.

When your site is backed up, then ask your current developer for FTP access, as the original source files are always better than mirrored files. If they refuse, tell them you want an export of the site, as you want to take your business elsewhere. If they refuse again, I'd suggest walking away because you won't get anywhere from that point forward.

2) If I do that, can someone else do the CMS ONLY (leaving the site as is)

Usually yes, however just so you're clear, it's not just a matter of firing up a CMS and throwing content at it. If you want to retain your current design, a theme will need to be created for the CMS, which invariably involves moving media files around, regenerating the site layout, and of course entering the content and making sure everything is linked up correctly. Some adjustments may need to be made to suit the CMS, and then retain your Google-Fu. It could take anything from an hour to a couple of days, they will need to review and cost.

I'd strongly recommend WordPress for your site, given what you've written so far. I agree that MODx is an excellent CMS, but I think it's more suited to larger, more complex websites. WordPress is perfect for compact simple websites that can be improved slowly and comfortably from their plugin directory. It's very easy to use, and there's thousands upon thousands of developers out there if you decide to move again.

Plus it's portable, if you do need to go that route -- export, import, done!

HTH,
Adam

Humblepie

dahamsta wrote: »

Probably, but you should check the Registrant here to be sure it's in your name or your company's name.

Thanks Dahamsta, by checking the registrar, what am I looking for to confirm that it is in our name?

dahamsta

You should be looking for a Registrant or Owner field. The Administrative contact is important too though, that's the person with /control/ of the domain in most cases.

You can PM the domain to me if you'd like me to take a look.