Yid army... or perhaps not

jaykay74

Don't know enough about how this is used to know if its offensive or not. Is it acceptable for a Jewish person to chant it but not others ?

Maybe the story is more about how the Society of Black Lawyers are positioning themselves as the guardians of football.

http://www.guardian.co.uk/football/2012/nov/07/tottenham-society-black-lawyers-abuse

Tottenham have defended their supporters after the Society of Black Lawyers threatened to make a complaint to police over claims that antisemitic abuse is taking place at White Hart Lane.
Although widely recognised as an insult, some Spurs fans proudly call themselves "Yids" or "Yiddos" and chant "Yid army" at games as an act of defiance to those who discriminate against the club's large Jewish following.
Peter Herbert, who chairs the Society of Black Lawyers, believes this is not acceptable. He said: "It does not make a difference if it is Tottenham fans doing the chants or away fans – if they continue to do it we will report it to the police. There has to be zero tolerance and if that catches out Spurs then so be it."

_blank_

The SBL should gtfo of football tbh.

Sticking their nose in where it's not wanted.

28064212

Does that mean they're going to start cracking down on black rappers using the word nigger?

GavRedKing

Just a friendly reminder from the updated charter :

Yid is an offensive term and users will be infracted as per the abuse section of the charter where it is used.

Just watch your words people.

_blank_

:eek:

SBL have been onto Boards.ie already!

intellectual dosser

I think SBL need to define what their goal is, whats their ultimate vision for football? I can accept that Yid is generally offensive term but do chants about Scouse people or Mancs also appear offensive to a minority? Should we all just sit quietly and clap on our team just to keep these folks happy?

I just wonder where this ends?

_blank_

intellectual dosser wrote: »

Should we all just sit quietly and clap on our team just to keep these folks happy?

I might get one of these boyos with a SBL logo on it

Leiva

Anyone got any background to this Society of Black Lawyers?

only time I hear about them is when they weigh in during a controversy.

jaykay74

28064212 wrote: »

Does that mean they're going to start cracking down on black rappers using the word nigger?

Closer analogy would be, can black football fans say it towards black players ?

_blank_

Leiva wrote: »

only time I hear about them is when they weight in during a controversy.

Or in this case, when there is no reason for them to comment.

Publicity seeking, attention seeking imbeciles.

jaykay74

Leiva wrote: »

Anyone got any background to this Society of Black Lawyers?

only time I hear about them is when they weigh in during a controversy.

Semes like they are opportunists to me.

.jacksparrow.

Imagine the uproar if there was a society of white lawyers.

GLaDOS

Unnecessary attention seeking imo.

keano_afc

I'm sure the Society of White Lawyers will have something to say about this. Oh, wait....

jaykay74

Leiva wrote: »

Anyone got any background to this Society of Black Lawyers?

only time I hear about them is when they weigh in during a controversy.

There is an interview with the guy who is the front for it below.

http://www.express.co.uk/posts/view/355458/Peter-Herbert-insists-police-have-part-to-play-as-he-pursues-a-zero-tolerance-

Caveman1

.jacksparrow. wrote: »

Imagine the uproar if there was a society of white lawyers.

+1

This is what annoyed me when there was talk of black footballers forming their own union, if white players suggested that we'd never hear the end of it.

_blank_

Whatever about the SBL being attention seeking loons, the absolute ignorance of comments like "if there was a SWL there'd be uproar" is pathetic.

mike65

The Society of Black Lawyers website is down for at least the last 24 hours so I can't check but I'm assuming this is a pretty new organisation out to make a name for itself.
If Spurs fans want to chant the name it seems I can't mention to take it back from opposition fans who are not past hissssssssssssssssing when Spurs play in their stadium I say fair play to them.

doncarlos

Is a society of black lawyers not in itself a racist organisation?

Red Crow

doncarlos wrote: »

Is a society of black lawyers not in itself a racist organisation?

Yes it is and one that's making a name for itself - As a joke.

keano_afc

doncarlos wrote: »

Is a society of black lawyers not in itself a racist organisation?

Of course not, as racism is something only committed by white people.

Sir Gallagher

You cant beat the aul "Im sick of being discriminated against for being white and middle class, wheres my white empowerment group?!?"

Dumbest arguement of all time.

dan1895

Sir Gallagher wrote: »

You cant beat the aul "Im sick of being discriminated against for being white and middle class, wheres my white empowerment group?!?"

Dumbest arguement of all time.

"Y'all don't know what its like,
being male, middle class and white"

Sir Gallagher

In relation to the topic in hand.

I understand that the spurs fanbase have adopted the word Yid rather than being made up of any discernable Jewish fanbase. I suppose it'd be like a club with links to Irish people years ago called themselves the paddy army. That wouldnt sit easy with me.

Benimar

dan1895 wrote: »

"Y'all don't know what its like,
being male, middle class and white"

Seems to be the only group in the world that couldn't take a case for discrimination!! Assuming the person is question is hetrosexual of course!!

GLaDOS

Sir Gallagher wrote: »

I suppose it'd be like a club with links to Irish people years ago called themselves the paddy army. That wouldnt sit easy with me.

Wouldn't bother me at all really, but I suppose it's a personal thing

Sir Gallagher

Sir Gallagher wrote: »

You cant beat the aul "Im sick of being discriminated against for being white and middle class, wheres my white empowerment group?!?"

Dumbest arguement of all time.

ScienceNerd wrote: »

Wouldn't bother me at all really, but I suppose it's a personal thing

I suppose if they keep seeing themselves as the yids it only serves to fuel as5holes who are fond of a bit of the aul anti-semetic chanting. So probably a bit of a viscious circle perhaps?

GLaDOS

Yeah I can see your reasoning there, assholes will be assholes one way or another though

Eirebear

Sir Gallagher wrote: »

I suppose it'd be like a club with links to Irish people years ago called themselves the paddy army. That wouldnt sit easy with me.

Or indeed "Fenian Army", while at the same time being offended by the term "Fenian"?

Sir Gallagher

Eirebear wrote: »

Or indeed "Fenian Army", while at the same time being offended by the term "Fenian"?

I was going to use Celtic as an example but there's a very strong Irish identity and fanbase there whereas i would guess that the links between Spurs fanbase and Jewish culture would be tenuous at best.

Eirebear

Sir Gallagher wrote: »

I was going to use Celtic as an example but there's a very strong Irish identity and fanbase there whereas i would guess that the links between Spurs fanbase and Jewish culture would be tenuous at best.

I'd have thought the only difference really is that Spurs don't play on the connections as a club or a business?
London has a massive jewish population, and i would assume that the link in terms of fanbase is fairly similar historically to that of Celtic and Ireland?

Jelle1880

There has been a historical link between Spurs and London's Jewish population for decades now, mainly due to it's location in North London (which has a large Jewish population).

Not to mention that people like Alan Sugar are Jewish too.

The same as with Ajax, whose fans too use that 'Yid' (or 'Joden' in Dutch) term, or my own local club (Antwerp, with it's big orthodox Jewish population).

Just another case of PC gone mad.

Sir Gallagher

Jelle1880 wrote: »

There has been a historical link between Spurs and London's Jewish population for decades now, mainly due to it's location in North London (which has a large Jewish population).

Not to mention that people like Alan Sugar are Jewish too.

The same as with Ajax, whose fans too use that 'Yid' (or 'Joden' in Dutch) term, or my own local club (Antwerp, with it's big orthodox Jewish population).

Just another case of PC gone mad.

I couldnt possibly comment on how the word yid would affect a jewish person as i dont know any jews, but the likes of David Baddiel who is one of the main voices in stamping it out seems to put forward a good arguement against.

What if the Arsenal faithful start calling themselves The ngger Army because of their huge black following? There'd be uproar for sure.

Just because something's been done for years i.e spurs fans calling themselves the yid army doesnt mean its "pc gone mad" to challenge it.

Jelle1880

N****r was first used as a derogatory term for black people.

I don't think Yid has the same history, especially since it was first used by Jews themselves if I'm correct.
Just look at 'Yiddish'.

Ares

GavRedKing wrote: »

Just a friendly reminder from the updated charter :



Just watch your words people.

Genuine question can a Spurs call themselves Yid? A comparison would be the way its cool for a black man to call a fellow black man a nígger but quite uncool for someone of other race to do so.

Or is it banned for Spurs fans as well?

Zebra3

I know a Spurs fan from London who refers to Spurs as the Yids.

I know a Spurs fan from Ireland and a Spurs fan from Sweden who get all insulted by the same term.

Wtf?

Jelle1880

Ares wrote: »

Genuine question can a Spurs call themselves Yid? A comparison would be the way its cool for a black man to call a fellow black man a nígger but quite uncool for someone of other race to do so.

Or is it banned for Spurs fans as well?

Tons of them call themselves Yids, and I doubt they'll stop because some obscure bunch of people say so.

It's the same with Ajax, their club and some people in the media have asked them to stop referring to themselves as Jews.

But it doesn't work, not even slightly.

markesmith

I hate the phrase 'political correctness gone mad', but...

It's cloudy logic, and that's not going to stop 36,000 fans in a stadium shouting 'Yid Army'!

This Association of Black Lawyers or whatever seem to be trying to divert attention away from Chelsea.

everdead.ie

Massive chants of yid army as spurs emerge from the tunnel and kick off the match.

Mr.Nice Guy

Some people seem to think the SBL have raised this issue. In fact the Kick it Out campaign have been trying to stop this for a while. Here's a video with Gary Lineker and Ledley King among others speaking out against it:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RIvJC1_hKt8

Jelle1880

Mr.Nice Guy wrote: »

Some people seem to think the SBL have raised this issue. In fact the Kick it Out campaign have been trying to stop this for a while. Here's a video with Gary Lineker and Ledley King among others speaking out against it:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RIvJC1_hKt8

Cringeworthy.

Using the Holocaust to make some people stop using 'the Y-word' (seriously ?), quite sad.

Jelle1880

Jelle1880 wrote: »

Cringeworthy.

Using the Holocaust to make some people stop using 'the Y-word' (seriously ?), quite sad.

The bit with Lineker instantly put Brass Eye in my head.

Also "The n-word", "the p-word", what are they going to do when there's 2 words that start with the same letter than they want rid of?

amiable

mike65 wrote: »

The Society of Black Lawyers website is down for at least the last 24 hours so I can't check but I'm assuming this is a pretty new organisation out to make a name for itself.
If Spurs fans want to chant the name it seems I can't mention to take it back from opposition fans who are not past hissssssssssssssssing when Spurs play in their stadium I say fair play to them.

I don't think they are that new as I think they were involved in the Stephen Lawrence murder trial

grenache

Oldham footballer Dean Furman, who is Jewish, has also told BBC Sport there should be a "zero tolerance" approach and fans using the chant should be immediately thrown out of stadiums.

........yet his bible states.......

Do not repay anyone evil for evil. Be careful to do what is right in the eyes of everyone. 18 If it is possible, as far as it depends on you, live at peace with everyone. 19 Do not take revenge, my dear friends, but leave room for God’s wrath, for it is written: “It is mine to avenge; I will repay,”[a] says the Lord. 20 On the contrary:

“If your enemy is hungry, feed him;
if he is thirsty, give him something to drink.
In doing this, you will heap burning coals on his head.”

The Tanakh (Jewish Bible)Romans 12:17-20 -

So surely the "racist" fans should be left to chant, given a free pint & pie, and it should be left up to God to sort them out.


Also spotted this online, trust the Daily Mail of all people to give a common sense view on things...

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/sport/football/article-2229788/Peter-Herbert-getting-wrong-Spurs-warning-Y-word.html?ito=feeds-newsxml

Herbert quite clearly hasn't a clue. As any idiot knows, it's not the words but the meaning behind them that counts. Spurs fans chant "Yid Army" as a defensive mechanism. Perhaps the most ironic thing of all is that the man isn't even what i or most would people would consider 'black'. He looks more white than black to me.

IvySlayer

fifpro say no to black union, fair play

http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/0/football/20276933

You know the thread has gone bananas when lads start throwing in quotes from the bible!

I'd trust the Daily Mail more

BhoscaCapall

It's not really any different to Celtic fans calling themselves Fenians. Words are offensive when used offensively, and not offensive when used non-offensively.

BhoscaCapall

BhoscaCapall wrote: »

It's not really any different to Celtic fans calling themselves Fenians. Words are offensive when used offensively, and not offensive when used non-offensively.

Do Irish people find the term Fenian offensive? No

Do Jewish people find the term Yid offensive? It seems so

POSSY

grenache wrote: »

........yet his bible states.......

Do not repay anyone evil for evil. Be careful to do what is right in the eyes of everyone. 18 If it is possible, as far as it depends on you, live at peace with everyone. 19 Do not take revenge, my dear friends, but leave room for God’s wrath, for it is written: “It is mine to avenge; I will repay,”[a] says the Lord. 20 On the contrary:

“If your enemy is hungry, feed him;
if he is thirsty, give him something to drink.
In doing this, you will heap burning coals on his head.”

The Tanakh (Jewish Bible)Romans 12:17-20 -

So surely the "racist" fans should be left to chant, given a free pint & pie, and it should be left up to God to sort them out.

Marge Simpson, Season 5, Episode 20

"Well Bart, your Uncle Arthur used to have a saying: "Shoot 'em all and let God sort them out." Unfortunately, one day he put his theory into practice. It took 75 Federal Marshals to bring him down. Now let's never speak of this again."

osarusan

POSSY wrote: »

Marge Simpson, Season 5, Episode 20

"Well Bart, your Uncle Arthur used to have a saying: "Shoot 'em all and let God sort them out." Unfortunately, one day he put his theory into practice. It took 75 Federal Marshals to bring him down. Now let's never speak of this again."

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Arnaud_Amalric

Arnaud (or Arnau) Amalric (died 1225) was a Cistercian church leader who took a prominent role in the Albigensian Crusade He is remembered for allegedly giving advice to a soldier wondering how to distinguish the Catholic friendlies from the Cathar enemies to just "Kill them all. For the Lord knows them that are His."

BhoscaCapall

rarnes1 wrote: »

Do Irish people find the term Fenian offensive? No

When someone is snarling at me calling me a "fenian bastard", then yeah, I do.