So, I'm back to getting a dog...

tk123

Wibbs wrote: »

Oh sure a crate can be a great aid TK, but they're not always practical for all. There's also a touch of the current meme to them IMHO. I've raised a good few dogs and all but one were crateless and they were fine after a while. My current guy is the first I've used a crate with and it helped, but TBH if had the time again I'd be 50/50 on getting it. For me anyway it wasn't that much of a benefit. There's also the danger IMHO again that the crate can be used in a lazy way, by sticking the dog in one for convenience sake, even with the best of intentions frustration can come up. Again MHO and again YMMV.

I agree some people use them as a jail/incorrectly but separation anxiety isn't always as straight forward and simple as other things to deal with - there's only so long you can expect your neighbours to put up with a dog barking and crying outside before they complain? Dealing with emotional issues/anxiety in a dog can be extremely time consuming and frustrating and a lot of owners (not aiming this at you Wibbs) don't appreciate how difficult it is or that dogs can even have issues until they've experienced it themselves. Changing the routine for example - this would have the opposite affect on my dog - he'd be freaked out but every dog is different!
The crate doesn't have to be forever - it's just an option while the dog settles in and finds his feet and learns the rules of the house.

DeVore

So today has been up and down. He's being willfully bold at times now and he clearly knows it (going into areas he knows he's not to be in but looking to see if I'm around first before doing so and scarpering before I catch him (I have a web cam on him sometimes now).

Our new routine is that I let him out at 9 and he he plays a bit in the backgarden with me, then we both get fed and I get a few things sorted out and get ready for the walk. We have an hour walk till about 10.30 and then he gets put out the back and I start my days work. He's NOT impressed with this separation but I need him to be ok with the garden because thats where he's going to be when I'm not in now. He has a shelter shed with a bed, vet-bed and dog flap if it rains or he wants to be in there (which he doesnt, the vet bed gets pulled out) and some outdoor toys. I go out and play with him a bit every hour or two but he still spends the rest of the time either running around sniffing, whining at the door or throwing himself bodily at the door and doing a sort of backflip off it.

At 4ish he comes in (when it gets dusky) and he spends the rest of the evening mostly napping which I try to disturb so that he will sleep through the night. We do some training for treats to make him wake up.

I'll video the leaping at the backdoor and let you see it. So long as he sees me he just whines a little and does this leaping thing. If it cant see me then he barks but he stops after about 20 minutes if he doesnt hear me move upstairs.

Today was exhausting and I'm trying to do a million things at once and Josh wasnt particularly helpful. Then again, he's just a dog doing dog stuff.

fits

Thats a foxhound! You mentalist for taking one on. They're lovely dogs like, but you'd see very few as pets. Usually kept in packs. They can travel long distances in a day. Huge stamina and energy.

He's lovely, so good luck with him.

ISDW

DeVore wrote: »

So today has been up and down. He's being willfully bold at times now and he clearly knows it (going into areas he knows he's not to be in but looking to see if I'm around first before doing so and scarpering before I catch him (I have a web cam on him sometimes now).

Our new routine is that I let him out at 9 and he he plays a bit in the backgarden with me, then we both get fed and I get a few things sorted out and get ready for the walk. We have an hour walk till about 10.30 and then he gets put out the back and I start my days work. He's NOT impressed with this separation but I need him to be ok with the garden because thats where he's going to be when I'm not in now. He has a shelter shed with a bed, vet-bed and dog flap if it rains or he wants to be in there (which he doesnt, the vet bed gets pulled out) and some outdoor toys. I go out and play with him a bit every hour or two but he still spends the rest of the time either running around sniffing, whining at the door or throwing himself bodily at the door and doing a sort of backflip off it.

At 4ish he comes in (when it gets dusky) and he spends the rest of the evening mostly napping which I try to disturb so that he will sleep through the night. We do some training for treats to make him wake up.

I'll video the leaping at the backdoor and let you see it. So long as he sees me he just whines a little and does this leaping thing. If it cant see me then he barks but he stops after about 20 minutes if he doesnt hear me move upstairs.

Today was exhausting and I'm trying to do a million things at once and Josh wasnt particularly helpful. Then again, he's just a dog doing dog stuff.

Sorry, I know its been said before, but he's not being wilfully bold at all, he's a dog, as you say in your last paragraph, they live in the now. he's not doing anything to annoy you. he's looking around possibly because he's scared of being roared at. There is a very good reason for the saying "let sleeping dogs lie", waking a dog up so that he'll sleep through the night doesn't make any sense, and you run the risk of waking him up and him snapping at you.

Can I please ask you to take on board DBB's advice, or get a local behaviourist to help you understand how his mind works.

Fair play for giving him a chance and taking him on, but he's a dog, not a little person deliberately winding you up, I'm not sure if its because you're the boss on here, so everyone posting is being very polite and nice, but the more this thread goes on, the more I worry about your dog, and how this is all going to end. Please, talk to a behaviourist, and take on board what they say, so that the pair of you can have a very long and happy life together.

littlebug

What does he do if he's in the same room with you while you work? Is there any reason why he can't be with you?

I'll admit that the first 3 weeks with my dog were sheer hell and it was still a fairly slow process after that. Improvement only came after we got a trainer in. We still have our moments

I mostly work from home and even after two years my dog will want to be in whatever room I'm working in and she'll follow me around and generally lie reasonably quietly close to me. Outside for more than a short while, if we're not out there with her, isn't an option as she'll bark at everything and anything. If she's being particularly narky inside and I really need to concentrate on work she goes in to her bed in the utility room for a while with some stinky chewy thing (which she doesn't touch til she comes out again:rolleyes:). She's generally calm and quiet while in there and is fine in there when i'm gone. I suppose it's our crate equivalent.


The structure of our day has sort of evolved over time and we're a good fit now but it took time.

she is walked 3 times , the middle walk might only be as far as the school for the kids and back so we're only out of the house for as little as 15 minutes but I think it makes a difference.

Stheno

I used work from home, and my dogs used come in and out of my "study" every day and it settled them to be able to wander in and out.

My dogs very quickly settled into a routine of realising that I was distracted, one used spend half the day asleep at my feet the rest came in and out and were seriously bored after a while, but they had the contact.

Wibbs

ISDW wrote: »

Fair play for giving him a chance and taking him on, but he's a dog, not a little person deliberately winding you up, I'm not sure if its because you're the boss on here, so everyone posting is being very polite and nice, but the more this thread goes on, the more I worry about your dog, and how this is all going to end.

No offence I, but maybe a little dramatic? The guy is "just" going through the "ohmyfecknewdog" phase and yea that can be a PITA for both. I dunno colour me odd here, but maybe, just maybe there's an element of over thinking going on about the subject at times, with a side order of current memes ilike crating and all that. Roll back twenty years, or roll forward twenty years and the advice would change. Hell I remember Barbara Woodhouse and chokechains and SIIIIIT and all that and that was considered the way to go not so long ago.

D's got a dog and dogs have been part of our lives for a very very long time and both we and them adapted with each fashion and each new dog/owner goes through the "phase" of mutual WTF and the vast majority of owners going back many thousands of years have generally come to a mutual balance in pretty short order. It's got feck all to do with D being the "boss on here" either. IMH He was just looking for input and advice and a place to say "oh FFS what's the little fecker up to now".

Raminahobbin

Stheno wrote: »

I used work from home, and my dogs used come in and out of my "study" every day and it settled them to be able to wander in and out.

My dogs very quickly settled into a routine of realising that I was distracted, one used spend half the day asleep at my feet the rest came in and out and were seriously bored after a while, but they had the contact.

Yeah, I have to say- if I worked from home I'd just let the dog wander around. You'd probably find they'd adjust to this quicker than adjusting to being outside alone. Most dogs are reasonably content once they're not alone and have been walked. I follow a few writers on facebook who have dogs, and they all just snooze next to or under the desk as the person is writing.

ISDW

Wibbs wrote: »

No offence I, but maybe a little dramatic? The guy is "just" going through the "ohmyfecknewdog" phase and yea that can be a PITA for both. I dunno colour me odd here, but maybe, just maybe there's an element of over thinking going on about the subject at times, with a side order of current memes ilike crating and all that. Roll back twenty years, or roll forward twenty years and the advice would change. Hell I remember Barbara Woodhouse and chokechains and SIIIIIT and all that and that was considered the way to go not so long ago.

D's got a dog and dogs have been part of our lives for a very very long time and both we and them adapted with each fashion and each new dog/owner goes through the "phase" of mutual WTF and the vast majority of owners going back many thousands of years have generally come to a mutual balance in pretty short order. It's got feck all to do with D being the "boss on here" either. IMH He was just looking for input and advice and a place to say "oh FFS what's the little fecker up to now".

Well, you've just proved my point IMH if he wasn't "the boss on here" he would have had a helluva lot more forcible replies than he's got. But you're dragging the thread off topic, I can see a dog thats getting confused, thats being woken up from a sleep for absolutely no reason, and if that dog acts like a dog and snaps when woken up, it could end badly for the dog. The dog is my concern, not trying to be liked by someone who owns an internet forum.

anniehoo

Wibbs wrote: »

No offence I, but maybe a little dramatic? The guy is "just" going through the "ohmyfecknewdog" phase and yea that can be a PITA for both.

Yeah that's true,he is, but I agree with ISDW.I don't want to drag the thread OT either ok,but it has to be said. It's very rare (actually probably the first thread ever in here tbh) where i haven't seen a few fireworks by now. Dev has been giving a blow by blow account everyday about owning this dog and while it's fantastic reading about how they're getting on, i think it's time to space the posts out a bit more now and just go for it, like all newbie owners do. He'll make mistakes, Josh'll make mistakes, both will piss each other off,but they're at a crucial learning stage now and i think he just need to go with his gut instinct for a little while.

There is definitely an element of "tip toeing" going on, which is very interesting to watch.Readers of the forum everyday will know why i say this. I often give out some newbies are shot down within a few posts and you never see them again,if this was the same i don't know if we'd still be this far in and still being civil. :cool:

DeV it's only been a few weeks, but you're doing great and are experiencing all of the fun,crazy,headwrecking things about pet ownership, but i think it might be a good idea to just "let it be" for awhile.I would hate to see this great positive thread descend into a negative one.I know this sounds cynical but knowing this forum and the opinionated (and rightly so) posters on here, it wont be long before our "softly softly" approach will wear thin.

The more you post, the more we also invest ourselves too remember that and both you and Josh seem to ROCK so far

/constructive criticism that's all (who am i to argue with the boss)

hadook

I'd second the recommendation for a behaviourist and/or classes for your own sanity during the post-honeymoon settling in phase Dev. I'm a fairly experienced dog owner and I've still been in back to back obedience classes with my rescue shep for months because he's a high energy dog with issues and I need to be 2 steps ahead to keep him motivated and challenged. Class has been invaluable for us in having the trainer there to ask "dumb" questions (and it's amazing how everyone else comes closer to hear the answer), other owners to share horror stories with and, my guilty pleasure, getting to watch someone with a dog they've had since a puppy wrestle with the same issues.

One of the best bits about class though is the fact that they're shattered after. You can't put a price on that mental workout

DeVore

Very quick answers because I'm busy today. When I said "wake him up" I didnt mean go over and shake him awake... I meant when I see the droppy eyes start I stand up and go to the kitchen side of the room and like a shot he's over to see what I'm doing. Then we do some training (Sit/Stay/liedown/bed) which he loves (because he gets Coachies!) and then back to doing what I was doing. Rinse and repeat every hour or so. I'm not going over and shaking him awake... I'm not thick like

I would hope that this thread would constitute the norm on the forum. I dont want to see uncivil or short answers so if thats not the case, well... theres a new dog in town and things will change. Theres no reason we cant be polite and still disagree.

I have already made plans to go to a behaviourist class (see, I do listen) and things are working out better at least in the evenings now. I left him alone last night for 4 hours and nothing was chewed except his new Kong

I've talked to maybe 2 dozen reasonably experienced dog owners, handlers, vet/nurses and so I have about 1.5 dozen different suggestions and recommendations as a result, many of them contradictory. Bear with me while I work out what works for us, but things are better then maybe I've made them seem, Josh is a great dog with some separation anxiety issues but that will just take time and reliable structure to his day imho. Josh is very happy and is having a ball. I need to adjust my life to accommodate this new ball of energy and Josh needs to understand there are rules and he's not the boss but we're getting there.

I'll post the good side of things in a while, rather than focusing on the negatives always.

beertons

The kong is king. There's no way he can obliterate that. Best of luck to the two of you!

bleary

Well done and i'm enjoying the posts. Reminding me of all the work involved in a dog which is so easy to forget. I think hounds are stunning dogs but when i looked into them they are high energy and really crave company.
Its probably a bit early to think of an addition to your brood but maybe you could think about fostering a rescue dog for a few weeks and see if this helps.
He would have company and possibly it might wear him out a bit,
Everyone says it is the same amount of work as having one.
Good luck

kylith

bleary wrote: »

Well done and i'm enjoying the posts. Reminding me of all the work involved in a dog which is so easy to forget. I think hounds are stunning dogs but when i looked into them they are high energy and really crave company.
Its probably a bit early to think of an addition to your brood but maybe you could think about fostering a rescue dog for a few weeks and see if this helps.
He would have company and possibly it might wear him out a bit,
Everyone says it is the same amount of work as having one.
Good luck

It's double the food, vets bills, poo cleaning, and training, but no extra walking. I'd recommend thinking of getting a second one alright; it's good to know that they have some company when you're not around, but it might be a bit early yet.

DeVore

So everyday things get a little bit better and easier. Today he knew we should be going for a walk and was a bit of a tearaway until I put my coat on, but he then more or less behaved great.

Training him has been great fun too. He's a little lawyer in the making ... when I tell him to "go to bed" he goes over about half way and then turns back to see if that was enough... I dont give in an tell him "no.. *bed*!" and he goes and jumps in and out of his bed like "I went, alright?! You never specified a duration... I now demand the treats we have agreed as part of this contract!". So I tell him to go to bed and then to lie down (so that he has to wait for the command and makes him understand the relationship). This worked like a charm... right up to when he began to anticipate it and he would then run over, jump into the bed, lie down briefly and then race back to claim his treat.

Needless to say, I'm not playing his game

He's a fox hound / beagle cross it seems and supposedly should be good at retrieving things... well I think Josh missed that gene in the cross! He will run straight past the ball. Or just ignore it. Or pick it up and then get distracted by something else. Or my personal favourite, pick the ball up, head back to me holding the treat, get SOOO excited at the thought of the treat that everything else is excluded from his mind, drop the ball because he's drooling so much at the thought of the treat and run on without the ball at all. *slaps head*.

He's a pretty lazy dog when it comes to doing anything I want unless he thinks theirs a treat in it for him. He will actually walk over to me, check both my hands and then saunter off like "what have you done for me lately!?". I've never been zeroed by an animal before! I get my own back on him now, I put the treats in my pocket ... now he doesnt know if he'll get a treat for doing what I say or not and he generally takes the chance cos most often I do. I'm lowering the frequency of success though

I didnt think I would say this (especially after the first week or two of war!) but I was patting him a few nights ago and he just rolled over, snuffled and went to sleep and I really felt responsible for him. He's only a pup and he genuinely just wanted to play (ALL OF THE TIME) but we're working things out...

Lizabellem

Get a rescue greyhound - they make the best pets.

Animal shelters are run by animal lovers who know their animals and this ensures that you get the right animal for you.

Greyhounds are fab dogs, no grooming and they don't have the usual dog smell.

Visit <snip> for more info

Mod note: Lizabellum, as per the forum charter, please do not post names to individual rescues in the forum.

westies4ever

Lizabellem wrote: »

Get a rescue greyhound - they make the best pets.

Animal shelters are run by animal lovers who know their animals and this ensures that you get the right animal for you.

Greyhounds are fab dogs, no grooming and they don't have the usual dog smell.

Visit <snip> for more info

????? He's already got a dog???

grey_so_what

I didnt think I would say this (especially after the first week or two of war!) but I was patting him a few nights ago and he just rolled over, snuffled and went to sleep and I really felt responsible for him. He's only a pup and he genuinely just wanted to play (ALL OF THE TIME) but we're working things out... [/QUOTE]

Just felt lovely and warm reading this.........

What a lovely post...:):):)

westies4ever

grey_so_what wrote: »

I didnt think I would say this (especially after the first week or two of war!) but I was patting him a few nights ago and he just rolled over, snuffled and went to sleep and I really felt responsible for him. He's only a pup and he genuinely just wanted to play (ALL OF THE TIME) but we're working things out...

Just felt lovely and warm reading this.........

What a lovely post...:):):)[/QUOTE]


i had exactly the same reaction

so happy that this lovely dog has a lovely home for christmas

DeVore

So... this was the last thing I thought I would be posting but... He's a completely lazy git it seems!! Now all he wants to do is have his walk in the morning play some ball in the back (he's gotten the hang of bringing the ball back for treats now, but he gets bored of that game after about 7 runs, (even for treats!) and gets distracted). After that its snooze time and he sleeps for the rest of the day, getting up to plod around the place and wander over for rubs. Not that I'm complaining, I have a lot on my plate right now with the SSF etc


So, since we're getting along well enough now, I'm going to bring him to the vets, get his shots sorted out, get him chipped and try him out in the local dog-park... its a big step but we'll see how it goes!

JustAThought

Brillo!!how fab for Josh to have such a lovely new home & second chance at life for Christmas!

Don't forget his first family who he knew all his little loyal life lost/abandoned him & somewhere in his little head he might be thinking you'll do that too - if he looses sight of you.

Mine was supposed to be an outdoor dog but would not co-operate. So I let her stay in! peace! She usually trots from room to room happily stalking me if it's early day - if later & she's tired she'll snooze & shoot open an eye if she thinks she's missing out or that there might be some activity or possible food sighting that might need her immediate assistance! Otherwise she'll be past walk reassured & lazy & let it go!

I put treats ( coaching mixed with coachie size bits of toast !!) into a squashed coke bottle & fido LOVES to chase it about & shake the treats from it - big and tiring success! Might be worth a try!

My top tip for trouser sanity - get a pair ( or two of your feeling rich) of proper fleece lined waterproof skipants. Best money I ever spent. Just don't buy white ones!! Nice navy or black! Looks semi respectable, DRY and WARM, they wash & tumble dry, lovely and warm, and you don't end up endlessly washing & replacing proper trousers! Bonus!

Stheno

DeVore wrote: »

So... this was the last thing I thought I would be posting but... He's a completely lazy git it seems!! Now all he wants to do is have his walk in the morning play some ball in the back (he's gotten the hang of bringing the ball back for treats now, but he gets bored of that game after about 7 runs, (even for treats!) and gets distracted). After that its snooze time and he sleeps for the rest of the day, getting up to plod around the place and wander over for rubs. Not that I'm complaining, I have a lot on my plate right now with the SSF etc


So, since we're getting along well enough now, I'm going to bring him to the vets, get his shots sorted out, get him chipped and try him out in the local dog-park... its a big step but we'll see how it goes!

Refer to my devil dog post

Right on schedule

DeVore

And boy is that coming true... a few days ago he was great, very well behaved when I put him outside and worked upstairs. Last night I took him to the vets and he was absolutely as good as gold, not a bother on him at all (he got shots and chipped). Today, any separation from me and he's barking and throwing himself at the back door again. Lots of whinging and "distress". I spent all morning with him, took him on two walks and then put him out the back to get some work done at 2pm.... at 3.30pm he's still barking, whinging and jumping.

I dont want to go down and react to the behaviour for fear of "rewarding" it. But I dont want this to continue either. I'm kinda at a loss today as for the last week he's been pretty good.

He's well fed, watered and looked after... he's just going to have to learn that daddy-dev cant be there all the time.

toadfly

Have you left anything with him Dev to keep him occupied? If you havent heard of stag chews have a look at the thread on them. Meant to be fantastic for keeping dogs entertained.

DeVore

Yep a big black Kong stuffed with cheese and dry food, kept him occupied for about 15 minutes and then he was back to the same thing...
Also several bone parts he likes to pick over.

Stheno

Replace the cheese with the likes of peanut butter and freeze it?

tk123

Stheno wrote: »

Replace the cheese with the likes of peanut butter and freeze it?

Soak the food too and let it go mushy and then pack it in. I'd leave it in the fridge overnight and not freeze it at this stage - he might loose interest if it's too difficult? This should be one of his meals btw - he'll soon take an interest when he's hungry!

DeVore

So, what a big week for Josh and me.

Firstly, I took him to the vet and got him his shots, a chip implanted and worming tablets. I was expecting world war three but Josh couldnt have been better. Even the shots didnt bother him. He wasnt wild about the squirt up the nose but he liked the treat afterwards

So, having been chipped and trained to fetch a ball and come back, I took him with a friend to Dollymount strand and took a deep breath and took him off the leash. Well, a happier dog you have never seen. He didnt know which to play with first, the other dogs, the wide open spaces, the sea, the dunes, me, all of them together.... We had no problem with him at all. I had a few heart attacks when he disappeared a few times into the dunes for a minute and we couldnt see him, but he popped up every now and then to make sure he could see us.
He was easily the fastest dog there too. Boy is he fast. He went for a run down the beach and he was a little brown blur and went so far that I was sure I had lost him for good but he rocketed back, straight past me and as far the other direction.

Even still he had bundles of energy and wanted to play all day (as usual)! I could harness that dog and pay all my electricity bills with him...

ulyssescohen

I hope you took out a pet insurance policy

DeVore wrote: »

So, what a big week for Josh and me.

Firstly, I took him to the vet and got him his shots, a chip implanted and worming tablets. I was expecting world war three but Josh couldnt have been better. Even the shots didnt bother him. He wasnt wild about the squirt up the nose but he liked the treat afterwards

So, having been chipped and trained to fetch a ball and come back, I took him with a friend to Dollymount strand and took a deep breath and took him off the leash. Well, a happier dog you have never seen. He didnt know which to play with first, the other dogs, the wide open spaces, the sea, the dunes, me, all of them together.... We had no problem with him at all. I had a few heart attacks when he disappeared a few times into the dunes for a minute and we couldnt see him, but he popped up every now and then to make sure he could see us.
He was easily the fastest dog there too. Boy is he fast. He went for a run down the beach and he was a little brown blur and went so far that I was sure I had lost him for good but he rocketed back, straight past me and as far the other direction.

Even still he had bundles of energy and wanted to play all day (as usual)! I could harness that dog and pay all my electricity bills with him...