Michael Carrick

markesmith

I've a mate who reckons that Michael Carrick is useless. Now this mate's footballing opinions are never held in high regard, but this has gotten my goat.

I'm a Spurs fan, and was a big fan of Carrick when he was with us. His passing, interceptions, and general calmness on the ball were a joy to behold beside the roaring mini-tiger Edgar Davids.

My mate's one of those Harlem Globetrotter united fans, who won't be happy until a time-machined-back-to-23 Xavi and Iniesta are in their midfield.

He just doesn't see Carrick as good enough, can't understand how he gets in the United team, and doesn't know how United have won leagues with him being a regular.

What's your opinion on this, boardsies?

dahat

He is is no Bebe!

General Relativity

Fits their system perfectly. Does a thank-less job week in week out.

T-K-O

I was shocked when Utd bought Carrick. I fell off the chair when I heard the price.

At that level your friend is correct he is useless.

Chancer3001

carrick is very composed and has a great passing range, winning mentality and is decent at interceptions.

he is not however world class, or barely good enough for the English team (which isnt great)

He lacks speed, tackling, goals, aggression, more of an engine

G.K.

Is as bad as some make out? By no means whatsoever.

Is he good enough for the absolute top level? Sadly not.

LuckyLloyd

Thanks OP, fascinating topic. I'm shocked it hasn't come up for discussion before tbh.

Will I Amnt

Does his job without standing out too much but gets found out when not given the space.

Red Crow

Not a great player there Bill

MD1990

Eli Manning wrote: »

Not a great player there Bill

does he track back though?

eagle eye

A regular starter in United teams that have won 4 EPL titles and a Champion's league. He must be doing something right.

My own opinion of Carrick is that he is asked to play in a role that doesn't suit him, he is normally deployed in a deep lying, holding midfield role. He has played centre-half as well when needed. For me Carrick is more the box to box type who would look much better in a more attacking role but he does whats asked of him and doesn't complain. A real team player who doesn't worry about personal glory. I think he is top class and gets a lot of unwarranted stick.

GavRedKing

He's like Mikel for us, he has a job and does it well and it largely goes un-noticed until they f**k up and their pin pointed for unfair criticism.

Liam O

eagle eye wrote: »

A regular starter in United teams that have won 4 EPL titles and a Champion's league. He must be doing something right.

My own opinion of Carrick is that he is asked to play in a role that doesn't suit him, he is normally deployed in a deep lying, holding midfield role. He has played centre-half as well when needed. For me Carrick is more the box to box type who would look much better in a more attacking role but he does whats asked of him and doesn't complain. A real team player who doesn't worry about personal glory. I think he is top class and gets a lot of unwarranted stick.

I'm actually of a similar opinion, United look a far better team when he gets forward and he has a very underrated shot. He'd stand out more in a 3 man midfield where he's in the middle of a DM and an AM imo.

Pro. F

Ah I can't resist...

Imo he's very reliable defensively and the fact that he doesn't give away many fouls is an added bonus. But he is very poor on the ball for a central midfielder. His good long passing comes nowhere near making up for his terrible close control. He'll cruise through the majority of PL games, but gets found out whenever the opposition press up the pitch.

Hank Scorpio

I don't really rate at all anymore sadly, far too slow pace wise and on the ball. Decent range of passing, but I'd much prefer a fit Fletcher starting in midfield as he has an excellent engine and gets about people more effectively

Corvo

I like him to a certain extent. As far as the Premier League goes, he is pretty much as good as anything outside of Manchester City and Chelsea (that's not saying much), though Lucas for Liverpool and Luka Modric when at Spurs would have been good shouts.

Every team (especially the league winning teams) usually have a player who splits the fanbase and has the thankless job of keeping the team ticking over while the other players get the plaudits. (I'd also group John Obi-Mikel and Gareth Barry into this category)

For me it was always Darren Fletcher, who I always felt was slightly overrated, but I've come to realise that these players are vital to the side.

So yeah, I like Carrick. He does a decent job in the league.

Outside of that however, where European sides do not afford you as much space (Please refer to Barcelona over the two finals and Atletico Madrid last year) he is really shown up as he simply does not have the technique and speed (like say Sergio Busquets) to make space for himself.

Still think he could do a decent job for the English national side, especially in a 4-2-3-1 formation.

bassy

hes a headbanger bill

Corvo

bassy wrote: »

hes a headbanger bill

"He's on acid Bill"

bmcc10

Probaly the most annoying thing i hear in the pub every single United game saying he's an awful player when clearly he isn't very underrated in my opinion , All sorts out there i suppose a friend the other day saying Gerard and Lampard are/were better than Scholes.

Pro. F

Griffin1988 wrote: »

I like him to a certain extent. As far as the Premier League goes, he is pretty much as good as anything outside of Manchester City and Chelsea (that's not saying much), though Lucas for Liverpool and Luka Modric when at Spurs would have been good shouts.

Add Britton, Ki, Dembele, Sandro, Diaby, Wilshire, Arteta, Allen and Fellaini to that for a start.

Gbear

He's got great technique and is an all-round good footballer.

If left in space he'll do well. Aggressive midfields are something Utd struggle with in general and he's one of the reasons.

Corvo

Pro. F wrote: »

Add Britton, Ki, Dembele, Sandro, Diaby, Wilshire, Arteta, Allen and Fellaini to that for a start.

Britton has had one full season. I'll hold judgement

I like Ki, Dembele and Sandro, but feel they are different players.

Diaby I have never seen consistently.

I'll give you Wilshereband Arteta alright.

Allen plays far more forward, recent games aside.

Fellaini the same, usually.

passremarkable

I think he is very average..he is not terrible terrible but he isnt that hectic either...like most games you wouldn know hes there..its his lack of pace and aggresion that is his biggest downfall!!when playing united you need just that little bit more

Cantona's Collars

If we had bought a midfielder in the Summer he'd be warming the bench at best.

Too many times he just doesn't provide the cover as a player in his position is expected to do which leads to our back 4 being too exposed as our midfield gets stretched.Runners leave him static & out of the game too easily.Maybe a more combative midfielder beside him which allows him to play more as a CM than a DM would get the best out of him.
Fergie has him as a round peg in a square hole and his game suffers.

When he pushes forward he's more than capable of picking a pass but the game he has to play restricts this & it infuriates the hell out of me watching him take the easy option when he is capable of better.

bmcc10

zerks wrote: »

If we had bought a midfielder in the Summer he'd be warming the bench at best.

Too many times he just doesn't provide the cover as a player in his position is expected to do which leads to our back 4 being too exposed as our midfield gets stretched.Runners leave him static & out of the game too easily.Maybe a more combative midfielder beside him which allows him to play more as a CM than a DM would get the best out of him.
Fergie has him as a round peg in a square hole and his game suffers.

When he pushes forward he's more than capable of picking a pass but the game he has to play restricts this & it infuriates the hell out of me watching him take the easy option when he is capable of better.

You reckon? If a midfielder was brought in who would you partner with him?

markesmith

Pro. F wrote: »

Add Britton, Ki, Dembele, Sandro, Diaby, Wilshire, Arteta, Allen and Fellaini to that for a start.

He's won more leagues than all of them put together.

Not that that counts for anything

Cantona's Collars

Dembele went to Spurs & I am puzzled as to why United didn't make a move for him.He monstered our midfield last season.

The_Kew_Tour

Good player. Not great player.

Chucky the tree

He's solid, nothing more really. He does his job well and in Uniteds system they don't really need great midfielders. He's better then a lot of teams midfielder but there also a lot of better individual premier league midfielders.

Pro. F

Griffin1988 wrote: »

Britton has had one full season. I'll hold judgement

I like Ki, Dembele and Sandro, but feel they are different players.

Diaby I have never seen consistently.

I'll give you Wilshereband Arteta alright.

Allen plays far more forward, recent games aside.

Fellaini the same, usually.

They are all central midfielders so you can compare them all that way. Since you mentioned Modric I thought it was all fair game. If you want to only talk about defensively reliable central midfielders then it does get a bit more complicated. In that case I would include Wilshere, Britton, Sandro, Allen and Fellaini (even though he rarely plays deep any more) and possibly Ki.

I don't know how it takes you a season and more to judge a player tbh. There's plenty enough evidence to have made your mind up about Britton one way or the other at this stage.

zerks wrote: »

If we had bought a midfielder in the Summer he'd be warming the bench at best.

Too many times he just doesn't provide the cover as a player in his position is expected to do which leads to our back 4 being too exposed as our midfield gets stretched.Runners leave him static & out of the game too easily.Maybe a more combative midfielder beside him which allows him to play more as a CM than a DM would get the best out of him.
Fergie has him as a round peg in a square hole and his game suffers.

He covers the defence very well. That's the one thing he really can't be criticized for.

I used to think he could do with more bite in his tackling, but when you realise how many free kicks and cards he saves the team from it becomes obvious that that is a good thing on balance for his defending.

Ares

zerks wrote: »

Dembele went to Spurs & I am puzzled as to why United didn't make a move for him.He monstered our midfield last season.

He'd also destroyed United's midfield twice by the end of September this season.

A great player.

kitakyushu

zerks wrote: »

Great pass. The receiver only had to take 11 steps to adjust to it.

Cantona's Collars

Pro. F wrote: »

He used to cover the defence very well. That's the one thing he really can't be criticized for.

I used to think he could do with more bite in his tackling, but when you realise how many free kicks and cards he saves the team from it becomes obvious that that is a good thing on balance for his defending.

Lately it's become more noticable that teams playing us have figured out how to put him out of the game.A runner from deep more often than not leaves him ambling back as our defence gets exposed.
When we are on top in games he gets a free ride as the opposition don't really get a chance to attack but if they do break then his failings become apparent.
I simply don't get how you hold him in such high regard,he's average at best.

Pro. F

zerks wrote: »

Lately it's become more noticable that teams playing us have figured out how to put him out of the game.A runner from deep more often than not leaves him ambling back as our defence gets exposed.
When we are on top in games he gets a free ride as the opposition don't really get a chance to attack but if they do break then his failings become apparent.
I simply don't get how you hold him in such high regard,he's average at best.

Jaysis, me holding Carrick in high regard?! Far from it! I would agree that he is average at best too. I just think his defending is fine. All his serious problems lie on the other side of the ball for me.

He does not have any problem tracking runners at all imo. He is usually extremely diligent in that regard.

homerjay2005

one of the most underated players in top level football.

he has averaged 40 games plus a season in a team that in the 6 season he has played, has won 4 league titles, finished second twice, played in 3 european finals and 3 domestic finals.

vital player for United.

eh i dunno

Am i only one who hardly notices he's on the pitch? Similar to Darron Gibson but 32 times the price

T-K-O

Thought he retired a few years back

SantryRed

He does a job against the poor teams who happily sit back and invite United on.

He struggles big time against any team who presses him on possession.

Irish94

Carrick is United's most important player apart from Vidic and Rooney. One of the first names on the team sheet always. If he ever got injured United would be fúcked in midfield. It's a shame really that the majority of football fans don't appreciate the role Michael Carrick and others like him play in a team.

SantryRed

Irish94 wrote: »

Carrick is United's most important player apart from Vidic and Rooney. One of the first names on the team sheet always. If he ever got injured United would be fúcked in midfield. It's a shame really that the majority of football fans don't appreciate the role Michael Carrick and others like him play in a team.

What absolute condescending rubbish.

I appreciate the role he does alright. Any time they play a semi decent team, he can't control the ball at all. He's not one of those players that's brilliant at protecting the back four. He's ok at it.

Pro. F

Irish94 wrote: »

Carrick is United's most important player apart from Vidic and Rooney. One of the first names on the team sheet always. If he ever got injured United would be fúcked in midfield. It's a shame really that the majority of football fans don't appreciate the role Michael Carrick and others like him play in a team.

The only reason United would be fúcked without Carrick is because there is no other established CM who is defensively reliable at the club. Carrick does a job that any number of average CMs could do, he defends well and he passes it forward when given space. He just so happens to have a manager that doesn't appreciate how much more a CM with real skill could do for the team in that position.

Pinturicchio

Statistically, he's one of the best passers in Europe. I saw some figures recently and he was up there with the likes of Pirlo, Xavi and Arteta.

bmcc10

Pro. F wrote: »

The only reason United would be fúcked without Carrick is because there is no other established CM who is defensively reliable at the club. Carrick does a job that any number of average CMs could do, he defends well and he passes it forward when given space. He just so happens to have a manager that doesn't appreciate how much more a CM with real skill could do for the team in that position.

Which skillful CM could you get to do the job Carrick does?

Corholio

Irish94 wrote: »

Carrick is United's most important player apart from Vidic and Rooney. One of the first names on the team sheet always. If he ever got injured United would be fúcked in midfield. It's a shame really that the majority of football fans don't appreciate the role Michael Carrick and others like him play in a team.

Says more about Fergie's recent stubborness with the midfield tbh. He is a good player, but he's a player who has been solid against a lot of teams, but really struggles against a quality midfield, and when your playing 'top level' that is going to happen a lot. He find's it tough when he plays against centre midfielder's who close him down quickly, he struggles to think fast enough.

Irish94

SantryRed wrote: »

What absolute condescending rubbish.

I appreciate the role he does alright. Any time they play a semi decent team, he can't control the ball at all. He's not one of those players that's brilliant at protecting the back four. He's ok at it.

He consistently breaks down play, before spreading the ball to the flanks to help draw the opposition out and open up space elsewhere on the field. He may not beat players, or score spectacular goals, but he does his job.

Behind more attacking players like Cleverley, Anderson, Kagawa or even Rooney, Carrick holds the midfield together, and is disciplined enough to allow attacks to go on around him, and cover those who go further forward, such as the full backs, to make sure United are not exploited on the counter attack.

Paul Scholes - "I feel comfortable alongside him. He's got all the capabilities of a top midfielder."

Bryan Robson - "He reads the game so intelligently and protects the back four with interceptions rather than crunching challenges. I think that goes unnoticed sometimes, but he brings a lovely sort of balance to more attacking players like Rooney, Scholes, Giggs and Nani. He allows them to go on and get on with attacking, while he takes care of everything else."


Yeah he's pretty mediocre alright.

T-K-O

Utd players bigging up one of their own. That's me convinced

The_Kew_Tour

T-K-O wrote: »

Utd players bigging up one of their own. That's me convinced

eh?

T-K-O

Forgot to quote irish 94 ...doh!

Pro. F

bmcc10 wrote: »

Which skillful CM could you get to do the job Carrick does?

Britton, Wanyama, Fellaini, Strootman, Hector Herrera, M'Vila are some options that are gettable at the moment, skillful and able to defend. There have been plenty more who have moved over the years that Fergie has ignored.

Irish94 wrote: »

He consistently breaks down play, before spreading the ball to the flanks to help draw the opposition out and open up space elsewhere on the field. He may not beat players, or score spectacular goals, but he does his job.

Behind more attacking players like Cleverley, Anderson, Kagawa or even Rooney, Carrick holds the midfield together, and is disciplined enough to allow attacks to go on around him, and cover those who go further forward, such as the full backs, to make sure United are not exploited on the counter attack.

The defending is fine. The "spreading the ball out to the flanks" bit is the issue. All he is capable of is hitting passes when the opposition stand off him. Central midfielders building attacks by getting the ball to the wingers does not draw the opposition out and open space. Central midfielders need to be able make room for themselves with a touch and a turn and link up short passes even when pressed. That's what draws the opposition out. Carrick can't do that.

Shanotheslayer

Pro. F wrote: »

Add Allen to that for a start.

Allen has been awful all season unless you're referring to him at Swansea?

Red Crow

Speaking of M'Vila he's just been banned from the NT for 2 years!