Advertisement
If you have a new account but are having problems posting or verifying your account, please email us on hello@boards.ie for help. Thanks :)
Hello all! Please ensure that you are posting a new thread or question in the appropriate forum. The Feedback forum is overwhelmed with questions that are having to be moved elsewhere. If you need help to verify your account contact hello@boards.ie
Hi there,
There is an issue with role permissions that is being worked on at the moment.
If you are having trouble with access or permissions on regional forums please post here to get access: https://www.boards.ie/discussion/2058365403/you-do-not-have-permission-for-that#latest
There is an issue with role permissions that is being worked on at the moment.
If you are having trouble with access or permissions on regional forums please post here to get access: https://www.boards.ie/discussion/2058365403/you-do-not-have-permission-for-that#latest
Irish Spring
Comments
-
Francis Murtagh wrote: »I never was good at maths
Maybe thats what got you where you are? And many others too I'm afraid.0 -
This was meant for AmaniJeanssFrancis Murtagh wrote: »ops i meant a few million !
I never was good at maths0 -
Francis Murtagh wrote: »Any bottom of the class bankers would be better than the lot we have now.
Why should they be paid higher than the President of the USA.? Its obsene.
Same old, same old excuses. I would go for it and see what calaber would apply. There are more things than money in a job. Some people are not greedy.
Its called supply and demand. If you have a good banker, banks will be willing to pay them more. I've yet to meet a banker who hated money!:cool:0 -
I sent my reply to another person by mistake . Apologies.ArmaniJeanss wrote: »OK, so we kick out everyone in the banks who earns over €150,000, replace those people with other people whose salary we limit to €150,000. And it doing so save a few billion.
OK, so I'm going to charitable to your figures and say 'a few' billion is 2 Billion.
In order for your figures to add up to a €2B saving there would need to be at this moment in time 5700 people earning €500K (we would save 5700 x €350K = €2B) or else 40000 people earning €200K (we would save 40000 x €50K which = €2B).
Sadly however there is actually only 124 people throughout the 4 main banks earning in excess of €200K, so your actual savings here would only be the slightest merest fraction of the few billion you suggest. http://irishindependent.newspaperdirect.com/epaper/viewer.aspx
I'm genuinely stunned by the way that you could qualify as a pharmacist which needs max points in your leaving cert and a great knowledge of maths to get through the course, and yet be so incredibly poor with big numbers.
Sadly my comment to you was
Ops i meant to say a million insted of a billion.
and thank you for pointing that out to me.
But there is no need to be mean and personal.
Attack what i say if you want, but not me please.
thank you.
Ps. I am of average intelligence and i would never consider myself to be good at Maths. I am not a great speller either !0 -
ArmaniJeanss wrote: »OK, so we kick out everyone in the banks who earns over €150,000, replace those people with other people whose salary we limit to €150,000. And it doing so save a few billion.
OK, so I'm going to charitable to your figures and say 'a few' billion is 2 Billion.
In order for your figures to add up to a €2B saving there would need to be at this moment in time 5700 people earning €500K (we would save 5700 x €350K = €2B) or else 40000 people earning €200K (we would save 40000 x €50K which = €2B).
Sadly however there is actually only 124 people throughout the 4 main banks earning in excess of €200K, so your actual savings here would only be the slightest merest fraction of the few billion you suggest. http://irishindependent.newspaperdirect.com/epaper/viewer.aspx
I'm genuinely stunned by the way that you could qualify as a pharmacist which needs max points in your leaving cert and a great knowledge of maths to get through the course, and yet be so incredibly poor with big numbers.Its called supply and demand. If you have a good banker, banks will be willing to pay them more. I've yet to meet a banker who hated money!:cool:
True true0 -
-
-
Francis Murtagh wrote: »Yes.
There was no subtext about you being let off the hook if you suddenly changed your mind was there?0 -
Francis Murtagh wrote: »I sent my reply to another person by mistake . Apologies.
Sadly my comment to you was
Ops i meant to say a million insted of a billion.
and thank you for pointing that out to me.
But there is no need to be mean and personal.
Attack what i say if you want, but not me please.
thank you.
Ps. I am of average intelligence and i would never consider myself to be good at Maths. I am not a great speller either !
I wouldn't worry about spelling too much as long as your posts are readable. Everyone makes typos etc.
Regarding the maths - to be honest you've come on quoting figures and saying this billion here shouldn't be repaid to the Troika and these vulnerable people with 100K loans should be forgiven and cutbacks needn't be made in the Budget because we can make savings of a few billion here ; I think the least you can do is have a cursory glance at the figures to see if what you suggested as savings even comes close to adding up and in this case it didn't.
Otherwise its just wishy washy nonsense of the 'oh wont someone please do
something' variety which isn't really suited to an economics forum (in my opinion).
No personal attack was meant anyway, in general I'm always surprised by how bad people are with big numbers, even educated people. So many debates with my colleagues end up in 'well, why don't they cut the RTE presenters and politicians salaries in half, that'll save a billion' territory.0 -
ArmaniJeanss wrote: »in general I'm always surprised by how bad people are with big numbers, even educated people. So many debates with my colleagues end up in 'well, why don't they cut the RTE presenters and politicians salaries in half, that'll save a billion' territory.
This is a problem with a lot of peoples thinking.
Many believed that by cutting consultants pay the problems with the HSE would be fixed.
Unfortunately its not that simple. When around 75% of your health budget goes on pay, the only way you'll get the necessary savings to maintain the vital services is by cutting wages of all staff.
The nurses, porters, administrators, carers, technicians, physios, pharmacists etc. will all have to take a cut in there wages before we have a sustainable health system.
Now obviously those at the top would lose a greater percentage than those at the bottom. But by just cutting those at the top, we won't see the savings necessary to keep our wards open and people of trollies.
Will it lead to strike? Id say no.
Strikes only work when there is public support. Also the last time the nurses went on strike properly, they ended up going in and working for free. Services may have been reduced but they still provided there duty of care to patients on their wards.0 -
Advertisement
-
-
ArmaniJeanss wrote: »
So many debates with my colleagues end up in 'well, why don't they cut the RTE presenters and politicians salaries in half, that'll save a billion' territory.
I agree with your friends. Billions and billions could be saved let cut all ps salaries in half . Billions , Barman another round please.0 -
I agree with your friends. Billions and billions could be saved let cut all ps salaries in half . Billions , Barman another round please.
Oh and theres a gazillion dollars worth of oil in the Atlantic robbed by shell?
Is there really? How come you haven't gone exploring yet?
One of my favorite ways to shut them up!:D0 -
-
There was no subtext about you being let off the hook if you suddenly changed your mind was there?
Thank you for that apology.ArmaniJeanss wrote: »I wouldn't worry about spelling too much as long as your posts are readable. Everyone makes typos etc.
Regarding the maths - to be honest you've come on quoting figures and saying this billion here shouldn't be repaid to the Troika and these vulnerable people with 100K loans should be forgiven and cutbacks needn't be made in the Budget because we can make savings of a few billion here ; I think the least you can do is have a cursory glance at the figures to see if what you suggested as savings even comes close to adding up and in this case it didn't.
Otherwise its just wishy washy nonsense of the 'oh wont someone please do
something' variety which isn't really suited to an economics forum (in my opinion).
No personal attack was meant anyway, in general I'm always surprised by how bad people are with big numbers, even educated people. So many debates with my colleagues end up in 'well, why don't they cut the RTE presenters and politicians salaries in half, that'll save a billion' territory.
As i said i meant to write a few million. unfortunately the b and the m are quiet close. I should have checked it before sending it.
My expertise is not in economics, i can rely on people like you to provide the figures.Yes I am speaking in general terms. But my points are relevant.
and Yes of course my figures did not add up as i had written a few billion when i should have written a few million. But you have provided the figures, which is great.
Thank you.0 -
Francis Murtagh wrote: »Here here !
How come as we own Every bank in Ireland ( except BI although we own a good chunk of that )that we don't simply advertise their top positions for 150,000 a year plus pension and kick out the rest.
No what was needed was to clean out the top tier, the cosy cartel boards, and those that had anything to do with lending policy.
For a start that would have meant a moron who thought 400 odd million for a few acres in D4 Dublin was a good idea would not end up heading up a major bank.
We can't exect someone decent to run a bank for 150k.
I would not mind paying a million for some guy who had f all to do with our cosy inbred banking, business and political system if he could at last clean up our banks.
See how the foreigner in IFSRA was able to take on Quinn and his dodgy running of an insurance company.
Would some homegrown muppet be willing to do the same ?
They never did in the past.Francis Murtagh wrote: »The Banking lobby has fooled us for generations that somehow they cannot be touched.
No what they did was grease the palms of those who regulated them.
That inlcuded politicans, dept of finance and Central bank.
Ever notice how the head of Central Bank (and later IFSRA) were usually homegrown or ex Dept of finance heads who were often going to end up with seats on some company boards once they finished their term.
Ever notice how the same faces appeared on each others company boards thus ensuring no one rocked the boat ?
It has always been a circle jerk with the poor smucks looking in ending up the ones covered in jism.
Ever notice how our banks engaged in dodgy accounting, overcharging, personal offshore slush funds, facilitated tax evasion, and dodgy owner/director behaviour long before the current mess ?
Yet not once was a banker/bank seriously hit with sanctions including prison.
If the system was revamped after the PMPA, Patrick Gallagher and Ken Bates fiascos we would probably never have had a seanie, fingers and drumm. :mad:Francis Murtagh wrote: »That somehow they are the only ones who understand banking.
Why don't you plural start a lobby group insisting that the state, which is you, should advertise for all the top positions in the state owned banks.
I would much rather start a lynch mob than a lobby group.
It will be the only thing that finally cleans the cute hoors out of this country.
As it is the quinns have shown we are still pretty much a nation of gombeens who not alone condone cute hoors, but actively campaign for them to continue cra**ing on us.Francis Murtagh wrote: »...
Brian Lenehan was in a very difficult situation that night and i bless the man and his family.
He was in a room full of overpaid and stuffed bankers. Their interest was not in the Irish Economy. Their interest was in themselves, and the shareholders who they were answerable to. Brian hadn't a chance.
ehh I had little respect for lenihan and even though he was under pressure from ECB I still haven't changed my opinion.
Lenihan had a guy beside him who had been at numerous private meetings with Anglo directors throughtout the spring and autumn and thus in all likihood had some prior knowledge of the situation.
Also the head honchos of the CB/IFSRA were probably about as much use at that meeting as tits on a bull.
After all those same individuals and institutions were always more interested in protecting the banks than in protecting the taxpayers of this country.
Lenihan through his subsequent utterances and condescending sh**e shows that not alone was he out of his depth, he failed to realise how far out of his depth he really was.Francis Murtagh wrote: »Anglo should have been let go. WE would be better off by 30 billion i think today.
Not alone Anglo, but also INBS - the good friend of the political, sporting and media fraternity.I am not allowed discuss …
0 -
OP, I feel sorry for your situation. But it is not fair to expect to be allowed to keep assets you can't afford just because you could afford them once. That only serves to create a new aristocracy of keeping the wealthy people wealthy at the expense of those who don't have those assets.
And while you describe your development of a post Office and Apartments as a "family business", they are only family businesses if your family is actively working in providing the Post Office services and running the apartments as a B&B/vacation rental type scenario.0 -
Apologies to scofflawed for another moronic rant. ( actually, bullox, i dont apologise )
Hi Francis,
I commend you on taking action and accepting flack from so called intelligent people of these boards. As a man who started an actual business and tried to create a community endevor with a craft shop and resturant and vets - albet the apartments were maybe pushing it a bit too much , but thats no neither here or there, i respect your sense of community and would not judge you as looking after yourself with a write down by staging this. A lot of people that brought a HOME not an investement property are now unable to do so due to the USC ( to pay the bail out ) and stealth taxes to try and close the gouverments defecit. Now without these charges they CAN cover their decison to by a HOME and pay their way and owe no one nothing and not as it would seem to ask the tax payer and their future children to cover wanna be developers costs. And thats not counting the unemployed who want to work.
Now it's coming to crunch time fast as this situation can not be put on the long finger forvever. the present gouvernment and quality of services are dire to say the least. If pay scale depicts quality of service then we would be stella / A+ / 100% efficent and no waiting lists and you would get your dole / rent allowance / docs appointments / ect, to you within 2 hours of leaving said service. But alais this is not the case. You are lucky to get a specialist appointment within 1year , dole maybe 12 - 28 weeks later ( same for rent allowance ) and all other services follow suit.
No comes my question . As the country is fooked and no one really has money to spend to egnite the ecomony then why do the bailed banks still seek a profit on morgages that they slung at people despite them being bailed out. Why is it not possible for the gouvernment to say " hey from the years of xxx to xxx when you were throwing money at people and disregarding the rules that you forego the profit on thoes loans, forget the wanna be developers and scammers but help real HOME owners. How about you only charge them for the loan and admin costs and forget making a profit from them. These guys bailed you out and without them you would have no job. "
Now is this possible ?
This way the country man that stays and pays in his chosen country has a bit of free cash to spend and thus business flows again. Also this does not expect the children of children to pay for others mistakes. No man should pay for others mistakes but a lot seem to begrudge people moving on at the expense of the country. Now if the situation continues your children will pay in one way or another and not in taxes. You will have worse services ( is that possible !! ) and most people would either default and leave the country, but hey you dident let your fellow man off the hook did you now.
I really despair that you fought for your freedom at the cost of blood and all you do is bicker and bend over and dont think for yourselves. Why your forefarthers fought for you i have no idea, they would turn in their grave if they could see you now.
Any country is a business and HAS to run at best even and no deficet, or a profit thats invested in infastructure . Any normal business would have closed by now . I really cannot get my head around the way things arn't being run. It's all very well and commendible being nice and paying generouse welfare / rent allowance / PS wages / pensions ( when they are no-where near retirement age !!! ), you need to get a grip.
I sometimes feel Ireland is like a child with a new toy . They abuse it, and break it, and then they learn it's true worth when it's gone. I'm not Irish bashing, and only in the last few years have become to feel the bitterness of living here that i dont want to feel . You are great people and i wouldent have moved here unless i liked you and your country , but when you are force fead ****e excuses and noddy politics you change.
Stop being nice and ahh sure it wasent his fault , tis be grand. GROW SOME BALLS AND PEACEFULL PROTEST EN_MASS.
* disclaimer*
I had a 60k discount on my home and in minimal negative equity and a decent deposit. I ask no man or woman or child to pay for my decisions. I also work in the so called golden untouchable IT sector and currently employed on a better than average wage, Missues also is in full time employment and we have no sprogs, although dog food can be expensive !
SO IM NOT ASKING FOR A FORGIVENESS - JUST FOR THE COUNTRY TO WAKE UP.0 -
WE are back to the Croke park agreement and how crazy it is to have this agreement still in place when the rest of the country is struggling to survive. Labour are protecting their own turf at the expense of the economy.This is a problem with a lot of peoples thinking.
Many believed that by cutting consultants pay the problems with the HSE would be fixed.
Unfortunately its not that simple. When around 75% of your health budget goes on pay, the only way you'll get the necessary savings to maintain the vital services is by cutting wages of all staff.
The nurses, porters, administrators, carers, technicians, physios, pharmacists etc. will all have to take a cut in there wages before we have a sustainable health system.
Now obviously those at the top would lose a greater percentage than those at the bottom. But by just cutting those at the top, we won't see the savings necessary to keep our wards open and people of trollies.
Will it lead to strike? Id say no.
Strikes only work when there is public support. Also the last time the nurses went on strike properly, they ended up going in and working for free. Services may have been reduced but they still provided there duty of care to patients on their wards.0 -
Advertisement
-
-
-
Francis Murtagh wrote: »WE are back to the Croke park agreement and how crazy it is to have this agreement still in place when the rest of the country is struggling to survive. Labour are protecting their own turf at the expense of the economy.
Good look with your business venture and expecting everybody else to pay for it.
It wont be public sector people who reposess your property..it wasnt them you borrowed the money from.
You're "struggling to survive" because of greed..no more no less.0 -
-
-
How is EVERY thread allowed to wind up the same way?
Its like an anti PS version of Stormfront.Frankosw you should invest in a sarcasm detector but now that you mentioned it the cost of PS pay is a budgetary problem.
Of course its a budgetary problem they are among the highest paid PS workers in the world but yet the efficiency is like a rabbit composing one of beethovens symphonys using a sanyo keyboard from 1980's.
If they were any way efficient then the public might be less on their backs,
but when the ponzi scam artists known as Unions are the tail wagging the dog in the government (labour),
what can be done?
And the sad thing nothing will change as gov union employees make up a huge voting bloc, if they rope their families into voting with them, then the election is decided.
Labour will be in the next gov.
And for the record all parties are as bad as each other. but labour is the one that gets under my skin the most
A few simple measures could be introduced that could help. Note: Im not saying its going to solve everything but its a start.
cut PS sector wage bill across the board. AND INCREASE EFFICIENCY.
Cut Social Welfare on a monthly or quarterly basis....while getting them into internships.
Cut College Funding, anyone who wants to go pays to go.
Take out min wage completely... It increases competition
Give help to start up businesses. Actually make it compulsory if you're on the dole that you have to go to classes on how to start a business. You never know, it may benefit one person who goes on to be the next O'leary.
Give extra help to small businesses that actually create something and export to the world.
This by the way brings money INTO the country. Existing businesses in Ireland only circulate money thats already here.
Once and for all build a nuclear reactor to solve our energy problems.
wind and solar is a pipe dream that greens are using to actually benefit corporations that are about as green as the snot from my nose...case in point, Al Gore.... and if nobody believes me, look it up yourself. Its not too hard to find.0 -
Advertisement
-
You had me untill the Christian bit....pity.0
-
Of course its a budgetary problem they are among the highest paid PS workers in the world but yet the efficiency is like a rabbit composing one of beethovens symphonys using a sanyo keyboard from 1980's.
If they were any way efficient then the public might be less on their backs,
but when the ponzi scam artists known as Unions are the tail wagging the dog in the government (labour),
what can be done?
And the sad thing nothing will change as gov union employees make up a huge voting bloc, if they rope their families into voting with them, then the election is decided.
Labour will be in the next gov.
And for the record all parties are as bad as each other. but labour is the one that gets under my skin the most
A few simple measures could be introduced that could help. Note: Im not saying its going to solve everything but its a start.
cut PS sector wage bill across the board. AND INCREASE EFFICIENCY.
Cut Social Welfare on a monthly or quarterly basis....while getting them into internships.
Cut College Funding, anyone who wants to go pays to go.
Take out min wage completely... It increases competition
Give help to start up businesses. Actually make it compulsory if you're on the dole that you have to go to classes on how to start a business. You never know, it may benefit one person who goes on to be the next O'leary.
Give extra help to small businesses that actually create something and export to the world.
This by the way brings money INTO the country. Existing businesses in Ireland only circulate money thats already here.
Once and for all build a nuclear reactor to solve our energy problems.
wind and solar is a pipe dream that greens are using to actually benefit corporations that are about as green as the snot from my nose...case in point, Al Gore.... and if nobody believes me, look it up yourself. Its not too hard to find.
I found myself agreeing with most of what you were proposing there until it came to the nuclear reactor bit, not because I'm anti-nuclear or anything, but can you imagine the government/ps overseeing the construction and running/regulating of a nuclear reactor.
Armageddon is the word that comes to mind.....0 -
Apologies to scofflawed for another moronic rant. ( actually, bullox, i dont apologise )
Hi Francis,
I commend you on taking action and accepting flack from so called intelligent people of these boards. As a man who started an actual business and tried to create a community endevor with a craft shop and resturant and vets - albet the apartments were maybe pushing it a bit too much , but thats no neither here or there, i respect your sense of community and would not judge you as looking after yourself with a write down by staging this. A lot of people that brought a HOME not an investement property are now unable to do so due to the USC ( to pay the bail out ) and stealth taxes to try and close the gouverments defecit. Now without these charges they CAN cover their decison to by a HOME and pay their way and owe no one nothing and not as it would seem to ask the tax payer and their future children to cover wanna be developers costs. And thats not counting the unemployed who want to work.
Now it's coming to crunch time fast as this situation can not be put on the long finger forvever. the present gouvernment and quality of services are dire to say the least. If pay scale depicts quality of service then we would be stella / A+ / 100% efficent and no waiting lists and you would get your dole / rent allowance / docs appointments / ect, to you within 2 hours of leaving said service. But alais this is not the case. You are lucky to get a specialist appointment within 1year , dole maybe 12 - 28 weeks later ( same for rent allowance ) and all other services follow suit.
No comes my question . As the country is fooked and no one really has money to spend to egnite the ecomony then why do the bailed banks still seek a profit on morgages that they slung at people despite them being bailed out. Why is it not possible for the gouvernment to say " hey from the years of xxx to xxx when you were throwing money at people and disregarding the rules that you forego the profit on thoes loans, forget the wanna be developers and scammers but help real HOME owners. How about you only charge them for the loan and admin costs and forget making a profit from them. These guys bailed you out and without them you would have no job. "
Now is this possible ?
This way the country man that stays and pays in his chosen country has a bit of free cash to spend and thus business flows again. Also this does not expect the children of children to pay for others mistakes. No man should pay for others mistakes but a lot seem to begrudge people moving on at the expense of the country. Now if the situation continues your children will pay in one way or another and not in taxes. You will have worse services ( is that possible !! ) and most people would either default and leave the country, but hey you dident let your fellow man off the hook did you now.
I really despair that you fought for your freedom at the cost of blood and all you do is bicker and bend over and dont think for yourselves. Why your forefarthers fought for you i have no idea, they would turn in their grave if they could see you now.
Any country is a business and HAS to run at best even and no deficet, or a profit thats invested in infastructure . Any normal business would have closed by now . I really cannot get my head around the way things arn't being run. It's all very well and commendible being nice and paying generouse welfare / rent allowance / PS wages / pensions ( when they are no-where near retirement age !!! ), you need to get a grip.
I sometimes feel Ireland is like a child with a new toy . They abuse it, and break it, and then they learn it's true worth when it's gone. I'm not Irish bashing, and only in the last few years have become to feel the bitterness of living here that i dont want to feel . You are great people and i wouldent have moved here unless i liked you and your country , but when you are force fead ****e excuses and noddy politics you change.
Stop being nice and ahh sure it wasent his fault , tis be grand. GROW SOME BALLS AND PEACEFULL PROTEST EN_MASS.
* disclaimer*
I had a 60k discount on my home and in minimal negative equity and a decent deposit. I ask no man or woman or child to pay for my decisions. I also work in the so called golden untouchable IT sector and currently employed on a better than average wage, Missues also is in full time employment and we have no sprogs, although dog food can be expensive !
SO IM NOT ASKING FOR A FORGIVENESS - JUST FOR THE COUNTRY TO WAKE UP.
At last ! you post is marvelous. Your last line says it all. I am personally encouraged by your submission. Because it has been very heavy going. You would think i was going on line to announce i was going to kill the President of the USA (Joke Joke- in case this thread is read by FBI ! ). I'm just asking people to express their anger in constructive ways as to how this 64,000,000,000 euro is being saddled on us all.
I fully agree that there are other important issues which need to be tackled in this economy. But my thing is this 64,000,000,000 loan.
I think i am nearly at the end of this post. If you have any questions you will find my answers in the replies.. Look back on what has been said.
Finally on a personal level, i am not the person who likes to carry a placard in public. I would run a million miles before i would step out like this. I am extremely nervous. The thought of speaking in in front 10 people sets me shaking. But guess what, i am driven to try and make a difference in this sad affair. And cheers to the begrugers.
I am frustrated that we are all complaining, but doing nothing. So I want to provide a forum for people to feel as i do to take a stand..and march.
and If nobody turns up, then i will feel i have done something. The worst that can happen is that il be made to look a fool. and a laughing stock. So what.
I will get over that too.
Thanks for your input and your feedback.
I need your support on the Bridge please.
Even if you are out there it would be a great help if you could let me know if you can support this initiative, or pass it on to any you think may be supportive. or need to have their voice heard.
Thanks
See you on O' Connell Bridge at 2pm and lets rock this country.0 -
No what was needed was to clean out the top tier, the cosy cartel boards, and those that had anything to do with lending policy.
For a start that would have meant a moron who thought 400 odd million for a few acres in D4 Dublin was a good idea would not end up heading up a major bank.
We can't exect someone decent to run a bank for 150k.
I would not mind paying a million for some guy who had f all to do with our cosy inbred banking, business and political system if he could at last clean up our banks.
See how the foreigner in IFSRA was able to take on Quinn and his dodgy running of an insurance company.
Would some homegrown muppet be willing to do the same ?
They never did in the past.
I can agree about most you say. the Question is are you willing to do something about it.?
That's the challange to myself. The time for talking is over. Because all the words in the world, in pubs, workplaces,, over coffee at tea breaks ( that's ironic ) at work gets us no where. Iv been there.
No what they did was grease the palms of those who regulated them.
That inlcuded politicans, dept of finance and Central bank.
Ever notice how the head of Central Bank (and later IFSRA) were usually homegrown or ex Dept of finance heads who were often going to end up with seats on some company boards once they finished their term.
Ever notice how the same faces appeared on each others company boards thus ensuring no one rocked the boat ?
It has always been a circle jerk with the poor smucks looking in ending up the ones covered in jism.
Ever notice how our banks engaged in dodgy accounting, overcharging, personal offshore slush funds, facilitated tax evasion, and dodgy owner/director behaviour long before the current mess ?
Yet not once was a banker/bank seriously hit with sanctions including prison.
If the system was revamped after the PMPA, Patrick Gallagher and Ken Bates fiascos we would probably never have had a seanie, fingers and drumm. :mad:
I would much rather start a lynch mob than a lobby group.
It will be the only thing that finally cleans the cute hoors out of this country.
As it is the quinns have shown we are still pretty much a nation of gombeens who not alone condone cute hoors, but actively campaign for them to continue cra**ing on us.
ehh I had little respect for lenihan and even though he was under pressure from ECB I still haven't changed my opinion.
Lenihan had a guy beside him who had been at numerous private meetings with Anglo directors throughtout the spring and autumn and thus in all likihood had some prior knowledge of the situation.
Also the head honchos of the CB/IFSRA were probably about as much use at that meeting as tits on a bull.
After all those same individuals and institutions were always more interested in protecting the banks than in protecting the taxpayers of this country.
Lenihan through his subsequent utterances and condescending sh**e shows that not alone was he out of his depth, he failed to realise how far out of his depth he really was.
Not alone Anglo, but also INBS - the good friend of the political, sporting and media fraternity.
I can agree with a lot you say. But words are no use any more. We have all been there, at coffee breaks, pubs, etc..all giving out about this situation. Its all hot air, sorry, if we do not put action behind those words...
THis is a small opportunity to DO something.0 -
Good look with your business venture and expecting everybody else to pay for it.
It wont be public sector people who reposess your property..it wasnt them you borrowed the money from.
You're "struggling to survive" because of greed..no more no less.
I don't agree with your interpretation of my situation.
I am making no excuses for my situation. I gave that information as a truthful expression of my past. Business, personal and otherwise.
people can judge me on that, or if they want to know me they have my name and e mail address. And i will gladly meet them.
I am hiding behind no body.
I gave that information for the sake of openess and transparency.
I am not looking for any bailout that puts one penny extra of a burden on the taxpayer.
Francis Murtagh.
Bye the way, do you think i am making any friends with the banks coming out as i am? think about that one and read the rest of my post.
and meet me and then write what you want about me.
and that invitation is open to all.
Thank you0 -
Advertisement
-
-
You had me untill the Christian bit....pity.
Yea i am a Christian. What does that mean to you.?
I am a believer. I believe that Jesus Christ is God and that He died on a cross to pay the penality for our sins. By believing that and accepting that then anything we have ever done is wiped out. The slate is wiped clean. We are loved.
So i try to live my life out of that Love that He has for me. And Love others with the same love. We receive the Holy Spirit when we personally accept Jesus in that way.
Religion has killed millions in the name of Jesus. The north is a prime example of this,,Protestant and Catholic killing each other..all in the name of Christ. The Crusades is another example of this. So i hate religion, whether it is catholic or protestant religion.
Jesus is a different man altogether. He is the one i try to follow. That why i call myself a Christian. Because it explains a little who i am. And for the sake of Transparency.
Jesus did not go around killing anyone in his name. He did not attack Muslims,Jews,Arabs,Gentiles (Us), Indians..
He Healed the Sick everywhere he went.
He went into the temple to scatter the moneylenders..the banks of his day.
He called the religious " You brood of Vipers ". The Pharisees were the priests and religious of His day..They are everywhere about today.
He has called us to bring in His Kingdom..( your kingdom come ).. that is living and thinking and acting in a way that is totally the opposite to the way of this world...
And to Love. That's the challange for me. i fail daily.
And i never thought of it before until i began to write this section..
I want to go into the place where the money changers are and have that same anger he had and upturn their tables.
I am not Jesus, but i am a follower.
Finally He always reached out to the poor,
He opened the eyes of the blind ( Many of us are spiritually blind even though we have physical sight)
He forgave the sin of the whole world,
He preached the Good news to the poor,
And he delares that this is the acceptable year of the poor.
Many of us have been hurt deeply so called christianity and religion, that we fail to see the the "Real thing. the real Person of Jesus.
I have left the catholic church when i was 17. I studied the scriptures and discovered there is huge error in doctrine and practice.
I went to Rome last year and i was shocked with the riches and grandiosity. The pope in no way reflects the Jesus i know through the Scriptures and through the Holy Spirit.
You may think this is another rant. I am Just revealing another piece of who i am.
I know you may think this has nothing to do with Economics..But it explains in another bit why i am doing what i am. And why i am so angry.
You were the only one to pick me up on that so i thank you for giving me the opportunity to explain.0 -
You had me untill the Christian bit....pity.
Yea i am a Christian. What does that mean to you.?
I am a believer. I believe that Jesus Christ is God and that He died on a cross to pay the penality for our sins. By believing that and accepting that then anything we have ever done is wiped out. The slate is wiped clean. We are loved.
So i try to live my life out of that Love that He has for me. And Love others with the same love. We receive the Holy Spirit when we personally accept Jesus in that way.
Religion has killed millions in the name of Jesus. The north is a prime example of this,,Protestant and Catholic killing each other..all in the name of Christ. The Crusades is another example of this. So i hate religion, whether it is catholic or protestant religion.
Jesus is a different man altogether. He is the one i try to follow. That why i call myself a Christian. Because it explains a little who i am. And for the sake of Transparency.
Jesus did not go around killing anyone in his name. He did not attack Muslims,Jews,Arabs,Gentiles (Us), Indians..
He Healed the Sick everywhere he went.
He went into the temple to scatter the moneylenders..the banks of his day.
He called the religious " You brood of Vipers ". The Pharisees were the priests and religious of His day..They are everywhere about today.
He has called us to bring in His Kingdom..( your kingdom come ).. that is living and thinking and acting in a way that is totally the opposite to the way of this world...
And to Love. That's the challange for me. i fail daily.
And i never thought of it before until i began to write this section..
I want to go into the place where the money changers are and have that same anger he had and upturn their tables.
I am not Jesus, but i am a follower.
Finally He always reached out to the poor,
He opened the eyes of the blind ( Many of us are spiritually blind even though we have physical sight)
He forgave the sin of the whole world,
He preached the Good news to the poor,
And he delares that this is the acceptable year of the poor.
Many of us have been hurt deeply so called christianity and religion, that we fail to see the the "Real thing. the real Person of Jesus.
I have left the catholic church when i was 17. I studied the scriptures and discovered there is huge error in doctrine and practice.
I went to Rome last year and i was shocked with the riches and grandiosity. The pope in no way reflects the Jesus i know through the Scriptures and through the Holy Spirit.
You may think this is another rant. I am Just revealing another piece of who i am.
I know you may think this has nothing to do with Economics..But it explains in another bit why i am doing what i am. And why i am so angry.
You were the only one to pick me up on that so i thank you for giving me the opportunity to explain.0 -
I found myself agreeing with most of what you were proposing there until it came to the nuclear reactor bit, not because I'm anti-nuclear or anything, but can you imagine the government/ps overseeing the construction and running/regulating of a nuclear reactor.
Armageddon is the word that comes to mind.....
me too. I like the idea of green energy. wind and wave etc0 -
Of course its a budgetary problem they are among the highest paid PS workers in the world but yet the efficiency is like a rabbit composing one of beethovens symphonys using a sanyo keyboard from 1980's.
If they were any way efficient then the public might be less on their backs,
but when the ponzi scam artists known as Unions are the tail wagging the dog in the government (labour),
what can be done?
.
Of course the private sector has shown itself a model of efficiency and trustworthyness.
Especially the banks,property developers,builders,solicitors,estate agents and publicans.
The PS are efficient enough to be still here sorting out the mess that the greedy arrogant fools in the private sector caused in an attempt to get themselves rich.
They blew the boom and now they are bellyaching about the people still working for a living.0 -
Of course the private sector has shown itself a model of efficiency and trustworthyness.
Especially the banks,property developers,builders,solicitors,estate agents and publicans.
The PS are efficient enough to be still here sorting out the mess that the greedy arrogant fools in the private sector caused in an attempt to get themselves rich.
They blew the boom and now they are bellyaching about the people still working for a living.
Are you trolling ?0 -
Of course the private sector has shown itself a model of efficiency and trustworthyness.
Especially the banks,property developers,builders,solicitors,estate agents and publicans.
The PS are efficient enough to be still here sorting out the mess that the greedy arrogant fools in the private sector caused in an attempt to get themselves rich.
They blew the boom and now they are bellyaching about the people still working for a living.
Really? Can you please give me an example of efficiency in the public sector.
Three men standing around a hole watching one man dig is not efficient!0 -
Really? Can you please give me an example of efficiency in the public sector. !
Well the people on the dole get thier "wages" regular as clockwork dont they?
The system for lifting the money from teh taxpayers pockets via PAYE is pretty effective too.
Shall i go on?Three men standing around a hole watching one man dig is not efficient!
But having hundreds of apartments built with Pyrite in the foundations and no fire retardent in the walls is efficient somehow?
http://www.independent.ie/national-news/judge-tells-cowboy-builder-to-pay-17000-damages-2929337.htmlA BUILDER, described in court as "fly-by-night", has been told to pay a retired nurse €17,000 after "vandalising her home".
Barrister Robert Beatty told Dublin Circuit Civil Court yesterday that Patrick Dunne had been described in newspaper reports as "a conservatory cowboy" who took deposits, started works but often abandoned them.
Retired psychiatric nurse Siobhan Buckley said she was only one of dozens of callers who rang RTE's 'Liveline', hosted by Joe Duffy, to complain about Dunne and his company, Dunne Construction.
Ms Buckley, of Castleknock, Dublin, told the court contacted Dunne, of Scrawtown, Prosperous, Co Kildare in 2004 to upgrade her conservatory.
Dunne visited her almost immediately, agreeing to replace her conservatory for €14,000.
She had paid him a deposit of €4,000 and, after some initial work, had paid him a further €1,600.
Hazard
Ms Buckley said Dunne had left the back of her house exposed following demolition of her old conservatory. She had difficulty contacting him and had brought in another builder.
Thomas Gallagher, a chartered surveyor and planning consultant, said Dunne had placed an 8ft-by-8ft concrete slab for the new conservatory on the grass of Ms Buckley's back garden, and partly over a manhole.
Dunne had also knocked down walls and ceilings in a utility room and boiler house, creating what Mr Gallagher had described as a fire hazard.
Ms Buckley had to replace the heating system and renew doors and ceilings, and ultimately had gone for a major extension by the new builder to the rear of her home.
Mr Justice Matthew Deery awarded Ms Buckley €17,000 damages for substantial inconvenience and upset as well as renewal works she had to have carried out as a result of Dunne's demolition work.
http://www.herald.ie/news/courts/cowboy-builders-must-pay-widow-84-3008623.htmlAN 84-year-old widow suffered from stress and anxiety because of the poor workmanship of a builder whom she had paid €23,000 to replace a small utility room in her home.
Kathleen O'Leary told the Circuit Civil Court she had suffered as the result of a litany of defects left behind by building company Cranlowe Ltd., run by father and son Patrick Cowzer and Patrick Jr.
When she had complained to Cowzer Sr about her house being flooded and electricity failures, he had become very aggressive and abusive.
Ms O'Leary said the work done by the Cowzers, whose company address was in Terenure, Dublin, had been very unsatisfactory. Shortly after the installation her house was flooded and the electricity failed. It had not been earthed.
Quantity surveyor Kevin O'Rafferty told the court Cranlowe Ltd had failed to properly insulate the room or fit sub floor ventilation at the house in Cherryfield Road, Walkinstown, Dublin.
A survey of underground piping revealed defects which resulted in foul water leaking into the surrounding soil.
Circuit Court President, Mr Justice Matthew Deery, awarded Ms O'Leary €14,912 damages against Cranlowe Ltd for necessary remedial work and added a figure of €3,500 compensation for her anxiety and inconvenience
http://www.herald.ie/news/priory-hall-families-may-never-return-3148498.htmlTHE Priory Hall apartments may no longer meet planning requirements, the Herald has learned.
Official government documents reveal the concerns surrounding the north Dublin fire trap go far beyond that of just fire safety.
Planning chiefs fear the complex no longer complies fully with planning permission or building regulations.
This means that even if the fire safety defects are repaired, it is highly unlikely the 261 displaced residents will return home in the foreseeable future.
The news indicates the scandal surrounding the complex is greater than originally thought.
Department of Environment documents also raise serious questions over the manner in which Dublin City Council allowed cowboy builder Tom McFeely to proceed in building the fire traps.
The documents reveal:
The Government's concerns go beyond 'fire safety'.
Priory Hall may no longer meet proper planning requirements or comply with building regulations.
Dublin City Council granted fire certificates to McFeely's company before a single brick was laid.
Despite imposing a number of conditions, council officials did not properly check the conditions were being met during or immediately after the homes were built.
concerns
The documents, obtained under the Freedom of Information Act, were provided to Housing Minister Jan O'Sullivan upon taking office on December 20.
The files state: "In addition to the fire safety concerns, Dublin City Council has further concerns in relation to compliance with planning permission and compliance with the requirements of the building regulations."
Today's revelations throw any hopes the families will some day return to the place they once called 'home' into doubt.
Tom McFeely claims he cannot afford the costs to rectify the defects, while the residents are currently in a mediation process with Dublin City Council in a bid to find a solution.0 -
Frank thats again a government decision to have self regulation and its a bloody joke, all new dwellings should have have an inspection and pay a fee to make sure all is up to scratch...But having hundreds of apartments built with Pyrite in the foundations and no fire retardent in the walls is efficient somehow?
http://www.independent.ie/national-n...s-2929337.html0 -
I found myself agreeing with most of what you were proposing there until it came to the nuclear reactor bit, not because I'm anti-nuclear or anything, but can you imagine the government/ps overseeing the construction and running/regulating of a nuclear reactor.
Armageddon is the word that comes to mind.....
Ok you got me on that one!
@frank.....no point wasting my time responding to you further0 -
Advertisement
-
Well the people on the dole get thier "wages" regular as clockwork dont they?
The system for lifting the money from teh taxpayers pockets via PAYE is pretty effective too.
Shall i go on?
But having hundreds of apartments built with Pyrite in the foundations and no fire retardent in the walls is efficient somehow?
http://www.independent.ie/national-news/judge-tells-cowboy-builder-to-pay-17000-damages-2929337.html
http://www.herald.ie/news/courts/cowboy-builders-must-pay-widow-84-3008623.html
http://www.herald.ie/news/priory-hall-families-may-never-return-3148498.html
Have you ever tried to claim back an overpayment in PRSI. I sent mine in last May. at the moment they're only processing ones from February!
On the matter of shoddy developments, where were the councils FIRE officers and planning inspectors etc while all of this was going on.
and you still havent explained to me how 3 people getting paid to watch another man dig is efficient.0 -
I would think that this is quite a misguided belief, as well as being ridiculously tribal to the point of credulity.Of course the private sector has shown itself a model of efficiency and trustworthyness.
Especially the banks,property developers,builders,solicitors,estate agents and publicans.
The PS are efficient enough to be still here sorting out the mess that the greedy arrogant fools in the private sector caused in an attempt to get themselves rich.
They blew the boom and now they are bellyaching about the people still working for a living.
You've had it pointed out to you as to why and in as simple terms as possible.
Whacking so broad a brush across such a intrinsic argument just doesn't cut the mustard, 'frank'.0 -
Getting back to the Irish Spring! Who are the individuals who are going to rise up? The unempoyed, the low paid. Student! They unions arent going to go for it to spoli their cushy number. It will be occupy Dame Street again!0
-
Paarthurnax wrote: »Getting back to the Irish Spring! Who are the individuals who are going to rise up? The unempoyed, the low paid. Student! They unions arent going to go for it to spoli their cushy number. It will be occupy Dame Street again!
Would you rise up in his Irish Spring if you found out he was a property developer and is now moaning at his loss.
Unfortunately you will find people who will join him. Just look at the loopy's up in Ballyconnel. I wonder have they relaised how much Sean Quinns recklessness has costs the irish tax payer. How much the collapse of Quinn insurance has cost us through the increase in insurance premiums for the forseable future.0 -
Have you ever tried to claim back an overpayment in PRSI. I sent mine in last May. at the moment they're only processing ones from February!.
Too busy you see..the departments have had thier staffing cut to ribbons...what do you expect?On the matter of shoddy developments, where were the councils FIRE officers and planning inspectors etc while all of this was going on..
Nothing whatever to do with teh council..private developments mean you pay people to do stuff like that,why would the council be involved?
Its amazing to watch you stretch things to try and suit yourself:)and you still havent explained to me how 3 people getting paid to watch another man dig is efficient.
Just saying "3 people are getting paid to watch another man dig a hole" doesnt make it the case.
Do you know anything about roadbuilding or are you just trotting out nonsense from an idea that you have in your mind?0 -
ArmaniJeanss wrote: »So basically you want the rest of us to take over your debt for you, whilst you continue to live in what is apparently your house.
And you want us to march on the Dail in support of this idea?
That's not nice.0 -
How is EVERY thread allowed to wind up the same way?
Its like an anti PS version of Stormfront.
Can you tone down the antagonism a bit, thanks, frankosw? I'm seeing too large a number of incidents of anti/pro PS trench warfare with you in one of the frontline trenches.
moderately,
Scofflaw0 -
Too busy you see..the departments have had thier staffing cut to ribbons...what do you expect?
Nothing whatever to do with teh council..private developments mean you pay people to do stuff like that,why would the council be involved?
Its amazing to watch you stretch things to try and suit yourself:)
Just saying "3 people are getting paid to watch another man dig a hole" doesnt make it the case.
Do you know anything about roadbuilding or are you just trotting out nonsense from an idea that you have in your mind?
So frank you are totally happy with efficiency of the PS. You can't see any reason why people are unhappy with the service?
As for pothole filling its a joke , two guys follow a little truck throwing a bit of stuff into a hole then the truck drives over it and on to the next hole. Why bother the next heavy rain and it's gone again. If they fixed them properly once they wouldn't reappear for years as they usually reappear in the same places all the time. In Germany I've seen they cut out a square alot bigger than the pothole to a a depth of at least 16 inches , 3/4 fill the hole with concrete reinforced with some steel mesh . Then finish it LEVEL with the road using Tarmac.0 -
Just saying "3 people are getting paid to watch another man dig a hole" doesnt make it the case.
Do you know anything about roadbuilding or are you just trotting out nonsense from an idea that you have in your mind?
Jesus can you get me a job in dcc where I can stand around and watch you dig a hole! Go by any council job and you will see this happening.
In the private sector this rarely happens. If it does happen the companies profits are less.
It isn't in the interest of dcc to make a profit. They know that if they make a loss the government will cover it through higher taxes!0 -
Advertisement
-
This discussion has been closed.
Advertisement