PAYE workers facing €3,000 tax hit after Budget

RobbieTheRobber

leonidas83 wrote: »

Yes lets look at everything but leave out one of the biggest expenses of all. Lets go after the vulnerable & needy in our society so we can protect our bloated public sector & their high wages. The greed our so called public service show in protecting their own interests over the common good of the country never ceases to disgust me.

The good thing is there isnt a chance its going to last. I for one hope the IMF take more control of our finances (sooner rather than later) & take an axe to that agreement & public sector pay. And if ye dont like it, there's flights out of this country everyday to anywhere in the world. Don't let the door hit ye on the way out

Vulnerable & needy, who are they exactly?
Are they those on welfare.

Why do you refer to the public services as the "so called public service"?

http://dictionary.reference.com/browse/disgust The PS disgust you? really this is how we have a discussion is it?

The IMF seize control, I cant wait for that day too, hilarious!


As for your final line, if a massive chunk of this countries population (300,000 PS) disgust you why dont you take one of those flights your suggesting for others?

Idbatterim

I think the people who fancy themselves as economists need to look elsewhere for the cause of this problem..social welfare,asylum seekers,overseas aid,rent allowance,NAMA,teh bank gurantee and the millions upon millions paid to private law firms to go through the motions of telling us whats wrong with the country.

Frankosw, while a huge amount of people have gripes with the CPA agreement etc, I can assure you that nearly the exact same amount of people also have a gripe with the welfare system...

Yes lets look at everything but leave out one of the biggest expenses of all. Lets go after the vulnerable & needy in our society so we can protect our bloated public sector & their high wages.

for vulnerable and needy you can also insert spongers / wasters / degenerates for a small but significant amount of the "vulnerable / needy" assuming these are relating to those on welfare. Here im talking about the generation of wasters who spawns another generation of wasters and so on and so forth...

RobbieTheRobber

Idbatterim wrote: »

Frankosw, while a huge amount of people have gripes with the CPA agreement etc, I can assure you that nearly the exact same amount of people also have a gripe with the welfare system...

I would say a much larger portion of the population couldnt care less about the CPA etc than are actively angered by it.

leonidas83

RobbieTheRobber wrote: »

Vulnerable & needy, who are they exactly?
Are they those on welfare.

Why do you refer to the public services as the "so called public service"?

http://dictionary.reference.com/browse/disgust The PS disgust you? really this is how we have a discussion is it?

The IMF seize control, I cant wait for that day too, hilarious!


As for your final line, if a massive chunk of this countries population (300,000 PS) disgust you why dont you take one of those flights your suggesting for others?

Who do you think they are, I suppose living in your little public sector bubble you become oblivious to the troubles of others. How about the children trying to learn in bigger classroom sizes now, how about the people with disabilities having their payments cut, how about more people being left on trolleys in our hospitals, hospitals being closed down, are you aware of any of these & or many other issues that the public now have to face.

And yes the IMF taking a greater control in this country would be a great thing because we wouldnt have spineless politicians kicking the can further down the road anymore. Cuts would be made to the areas that need them & I can hazard a guess at what would be top of theirs and most other peoples lists.

As for your final line, I wont be leaving this country anytime soon, the day I let some greedy minority of our country push me out would be a very sad day for me personally. On the other hand if our new terms & conditions for your work dont suit you when they arrive in time make sure you have a look at how the public sector get on in other countries

Idbatterim

Who do you think they are, I suppose living in your little public sector bubble you become oblivious to the troubles of others. How about the children trying to learn in bigger classroom sizes now, how about the people with disabilities having their payments cut, how about more people being left on trolleys in our hospitals, hospitals being closed down, are you aware of any of these & or many other issues that the public now have to face.

I think it is a very valid question, j mayo posted the below on another thread. this was related more to the economically vulnerable rather than soically vulnerable though.

But who exactly are the most vulnerable ?
Are they the ones in massive debt that they can never pay back ?
Are they the ones who are in massive debts that they feel they shouldn't have to pay back because banks were reckless in lending to them and besides their property is no longer worth what they borrowed for it ?
Or are they actually the ones who continue to try repay their debts ?
Or are the ones who are meant to face higher charges, taxes, etc because they are meant to cough up for the ones who can't be ars*d trying to repay their debts ?

another category would be those on welfare

leonidas83

Idbatterim wrote: »

Frankosw, while a huge amount of people have gripes with the CPA agreement etc, I can assure you that nearly the exact same amount of people also have a gripe with the welfare system...

for vulnerable and needy you can also insert spongers / wasters / degenerates for a small but significant amount of the "vulnerable / needy" assuming these are relating to those on welfare. Here im talking about the generation of wasters who spawns another generation of wasters and so on and so forth...[/QUOTE]

I fully agree with this, social welfare needs to be looked at in a big way aswell but this doesnt mean we should ignore the public service & keep their pay & entitlements the same

RobbieTheRobber

leonidas83 wrote: »

Who do you think they are, I suppose living in your little public sector bubble you become oblivious to the troubles of others. How about the children trying to learn in bigger classroom sizes now, how about the people with disabilities having their payments cut, how about more people being left on trolleys in our hospitals, hospitals being closed down, are you aware of any of these & or many other issues that the public now have to face.

And yes the IMF taking a greater control in this country would be a great thing because we wouldnt have spineless politicians kicking the can further down the road anymore. Cuts would be made to the areas that need them & I can hazard a guess at what would be top of theirs and most other peoples lists.

As for your final line, I wont be leaving this country anytime soon, the day a let some greedy minority of our country push me out would be a very sad day for me personally. On the other hand if our new terms & conditions for your work dont suit you when they arrive in time make sure you have a look at how the public sector get on in other countries

A whole lot of rhetoric and mis-directed anger. Almost to laughable levels.
There is nothing of substance in this post at all!

Am I the greedy minority you refer to?

Tell me Leo how do the Public sector get on in other countries?

sean200

leonidas83 wrote: »

PAYE workers will be hit with tax hikes of more than €3,000 in next month's Budget.
A new property tax, a higher universal social charge and the lowering of pensions tax relief will suck thousands of euro out of the average household, projections from consultancy firm Grant Thornton show.
Although income tax rates will remain unchanged, other levies and charges mean that next month's Budget will be one of the worst of the past five.
The firm also predicts property tax will be applied at 0.25pc on the value of a home.
But next year the Government has indicated that the property tax will only apply from the second half of the year.
This would mean a €400,000 house would end up costing €600 next year, made up of €500 in property tax for the half year and €100 for the household charge. Environment Minister Phil Hogan refused to give a pre-Budget leak on the amount householders will pay in property taxes next year, citing his past resignation over similar leaks.
The minister refused to put a cost on the property tax when he appeared before the Oireachtas Environment Committee.
He resigned as Minister of State at the Department of Finance in 1995 when Budget details were sent to to a journalist before it was announced.
Partner with Grant Thornton, Peter Vale, said he also expects Finance Minister Michael Noonan to hike the top rate of the universal social charge (USC) from 7pc to 8pc.
Pensions
A new 8pc USC rate will cost a couple with a joint income of €80,000 an extra €690 a year.
Grant Thornton says employee PRSI – currently levied at 4pc – will be extended to non-employment income such as dividends and rents from property investments.
A reduction in tax relief on pension contributions from 41pc to 20pc, will cost €2,520 a year for a couple on €80,000.
And Grant Thornton also expects increases to motor tax rates, higher deposit interest retention tax (DIRT), and levies on cigarettes and alcohol.
Mr Vale said: "With at least €3.5bn being sought from expenditure savings and tax increases, we will all be feeling considerably less well off on December 5."
The expected Budgetary hikes will cost a family on €40,000 an extra €3,250. Those on €80,000 will be hit for €5,410, while a family earning €150,000 will be €8,750 out of pocket.
Meanwhile, figures from the Central Bank show average debt for every man, woman and child is now €38,938. But net wealth – made up of the value of houses and financial assets, minus borrowings– stands at over €90,000.
- Charlie Weston and Treacy Hogan

http://www.independent.ie/national-news/paye-workers-facing-3000-tax-hit-after-budget-3293727.html

I know this is probably just more scaremongoring from this spineless government before the real budget but If they go ahead with PAYE increases of anywhere near that amount I think It will be the straw that breaks the camels back.

There is genuine disdain for alot of the policies this government have pursued over the last 18 months & if they survive this budget I will be surprised.

There has been no genuine reform in the HSE, only disaster after disaster, no re-negotiation of the Croke Park deal, something which badly needed to be looked at, no deal as yet on the bank debt despite promises otherwise along with a series of other failures. The only thing this government has been successful at is raising taxes for middle income people but this is even debatable after the debacle that was the property tax.

They are an utter disgrace

Moan moan moan
At 9.38 am you must be on the dole

sean200

leonidas83 wrote: »

Contribute something useful to the thread or dont contribute at all. I have no issues whatsoever with social welfare being cut, I would actually encourage it. Re negogiation of the croke park deal is something that will have to happen one way or the other, deal with it.

And it will happen but paycuts will not form part of croke park 2 so u will still be moaning
Now go get a job

jmayo

frankosw wrote: »

At the same time they will draw on public services when it suits them and demand better service for less outlay..teh sort of people who wouldnt be able to work in teh PS themselves yet begrudge people a day's pay.

Ehh you do get that public services are there for the public and not just to provide often cushy jobs for a certain class of person ?
That comment shows nothign but fooking contempt for the public.

Perish the thought a taxpayer who has been paying taxes for years should avail of public services like hospital care, emergency services when they need it.
And God forbid that they might like a decent level of public service. :rolleyes:

No one begrudges hardworking people a decent level of pay, especially those who do damm hard jobs, but sooner or later someone has to draw attention to the fact that most of the public sector don't do damm hard work and don't do anything special.
The sacred cows are dragged out to hide the admin staff who hide in the background.
For every front liner like doctors, nurses, Gardaí, firemen you can drag into this, I can probably find yet another background admin person who does nothing special and often does the bare fooking minimum.
In my experience you can also come across a fair few front line workers who drag their ar** on every task they are meant to perform.

frankosw wrote: »

I think the people who fancy themselves as economists need to look elsewhere for the cause of this problem..social welfare,asylum seekers,overseas aid,rent allowance,NAMA,teh bank gurantee and the millions upon millions paid to private law firms to go through the motions of telling us whats wrong with the country.

If over 2/3rds of the two biggest spending departments goes on staff costs then sooner or later one has to take a look at this if the massive spending is to be tackled.
Or would you rather than the health budget cuts targets the sick or the education budget cuts targets the kids.
And just because I draw attention to it doesn't necessarily mean I want the social welfare budget to continue as is.

hyperborean

sean200 wrote: »

And it will happen but paycuts will not form part of croke park 2 so u will still be moaning
Now go get a job

Months wages says pay cuts are an integral part of post CPA agreement?

sean200

Head The Wall wrote: »

It would be interesting to hear your explanation for why the CPA shouldn't be scrapped. There was a clause where unforeseen budgetary circumstances should have ended it.

Seemingly a bailout from the IMF doesn't constitute an issue, although when there is still the same muppets in the Finance dept doing the maths there shouldn't be too much expected.

But the IMF are very happy with the croke park deal
You should be more worried about the private sector Muppets in the banks that were getting bigger bonuses the more they got a person in to debt who F***ed up this country
Or have u forgot who caused the problem?

RobbieTheRobber

jmayo wrote: »

If over 2/3rds of the two biggest spending departments goes on staff costs then sooner or later one has to take a look at this if the massive spending is to be tackled.
Or would you rather than the health budget cuts targets the sick or the education budget cuts targets the kids.
And just because I draw attention to it doesn't necessarily mean I want the social welfare budget to continue as is.

2/3rds doesnt really mean a lot though its a fraction and not an explanation.

Seeing as in relation to health and education spending, this forum only talks in percentages, can someone tell me what percentage of the budget is acceptable or normal?

RobbieTheRobber

hyperborean wrote: »

Months wages says pay cuts are an integral part of post CPA agreement?

What?

hyperborean

RobbieTheRobber wrote: »

What?

The new signup (see post) ranting about people on the dole stated that there will be no paycuts in CPA2 , I was just making a very sure bet that there will be pay cuts in any agreement post CPA.

Do you think differently?

sean200

leonidas83 wrote: »

PAYE workers will be hit with tax hikes of more than €3,000 in next month's Budget.
A new property tax, a higher universal social charge and the lowering of pensions tax relief will suck thousands of euro out of the average household, projections from consultancy firm Grant Thornton show.
Although income tax rates will remain unchanged, other levies and charges mean that next month's Budget will be one of the worst of the past five.
The firm also predicts property tax will be applied at 0.25pc on the value of a home.
But next year the Government has indicated that the property tax will only apply from the second half of the year.
This would mean a €400,000 house would end up costing €600 next year, made up of €500 in property tax for the half year and €100 for the household charge. Environment Minister Phil Hogan refused to give a pre-Budget leak on the amount householders will pay in property taxes next year, citing his past resignation over similar leaks.
The minister refused to put a cost on the property tax when he appeared before the Oireachtas Environment Committee.
He resigned as Minister of State at the Department of Finance in 1995 when Budget details were sent to to a journalist before it was announced.
Partner with Grant Thornton, Peter Vale, said he also expects Finance Minister Michael Noonan to hike the top rate of the universal social charge (USC) from 7pc to 8pc.
Pensions
A new 8pc USC rate will cost a couple with a joint income of €80,000 an extra €690 a year.
Grant Thornton says employee PRSI – currently levied at 4pc – will be extended to non-employment income such as dividends and rents from property investments.
A reduction in tax relief on pension contributions from 41pc to 20pc, will cost €2,520 a year for a couple on €80,000.
And Grant Thornton also expects increases to motor tax rates, higher deposit interest retention tax (DIRT), and levies on cigarettes and alcohol.
Mr Vale said: "With at least €3.5bn being sought from expenditure savings and tax increases, we will all be feeling considerably less well off on December 5."
The expected Budgetary hikes will cost a family on €40,000 an extra €3,250. Those on €80,000 will be hit for €5,410, while a family earning €150,000 will be €8,750 out of pocket.
Meanwhile, figures from the Central Bank show average debt for every man, woman and child is now €38,938. But net wealth – made up of the value of houses and financial assets, minus borrowings– stands at over €90,000.
- Charlie Weston and Treacy Hogan

http://www.independent.ie/national-news/paye-workers-facing-3000-tax-hit-after-budget-3293727.html

I know this is probably just more scaremongoring from this spineless government before the real budget but If they go ahead with PAYE increases of anywhere near that amount I think It will be the straw that breaks the camels back.

There is genuine disdain for alot of the policies this government have pursued over the last 18 months & if they survive this budget I will be surprised.

There has been no genuine reform in the HSE, only disaster after disaster, no re-negotiation of the Croke Park deal, something which badly needed to be looked at, no deal as yet on the bank debt despite promises otherwise along with a series of other failures. The only thing this government has been successful at is raising taxes for middle income people but this is even debatable after the debacle that was the property tax.

They are an utter disgrace

The best part about this is that any change in the tax relief on pension contributions from 41pc to 20pc will not effect the public sector
This is so unfair

RobbieTheRobber

hyperborean wrote: »

The new signup (see post) ranting about people on the dole stated that there will be no paycuts in CPA2 , I was just making a very sure bet that there will be pay cuts in any agreement post CPA.

Do you think differently?

What I think would probably get me banned from this forum, so I wont post it.

Instead I'll ask why you would call this a "very sure bet"?

I also very much doubt that there will be further cuts to public servants wages.

hyperborean

sean200 wrote: »

The best part about this is that any change in the tax relief on pension contributions from 41pc to 20pc will not effect the public sector
This is so unfair

there will be a pay equalization process after the CPA and everything is on the table,

We have a budget deficit and a service reduction will not close the gap, pay and social welfare are going to have to give.

RobbieTheRobber

hyperborean wrote: »

there will be a pay equalization process after the CPA and everything is on the table,

We have a budget deficit and a service reduction will not close the gap, pay and social welfare are going to have to give.

I just had a look in my crystal ball and your wrong!

sean200

hyperborean wrote: »

The new signup (see post) ranting about people on the dole stated that there will be no paycuts in CPA2 , I was just making a very sure bet that there will be pay cuts in any agreement post CPA.

Do you think differently?

Open your ears
They have said that Pay cuts will be a last resort
They want a longer working week
Today across Europe you have country’s shut down due to strike action but Irelandis open for business and this government will continue to avoid strike action.

hyperborean

RobbieTheRobber wrote: »

What I think would probably get me banned from this forum, so I wont post it.

Sorry to hear that, its sad that you cannot articulate yourself without fear of the banhammer

RobbieTheRobber wrote: »

Instead I'll ask why you would call this a "very sure bet"?

Its 100%, I will expand on this later,

RobbieTheRobber wrote: »

I also very much doubt that there will be further cuts to public servants wages.

The public sector pay and pensions costs are one of many area's that will have to be cut, we cannot live in Germany's pocket forever!

hyperborean

sean200 wrote: »

Open your ears
They have said that Pay cuts will be a last resort
They want a longer working week
Today across Europe you have country’s shut down due to strike action but Irelandis open for business and this government will continue to avoid strike action.

If Madrid and Rome are what you call across europe then yes I am aware of the austerity marches,

sean200

hyperborean wrote: »

there will be a pay equalization process after the CPA and everything is on the table,

We have a budget deficit and a service reduction will not close the gap, pay and social welfare are going to have to give.

And when that happens you will have about 600k on the dole

Welcome to Greece boys

Head The Wall

Gurgle wrote: »

€5.351bn is spent on salaries out of €8.063bn... that's 66% according to my calculator.

€3.213bn spent on teachers salaries, so 39.8% of the Department of Education budget is spent on paying the people who do the educating.

€2.1bn on salaries to non-teachers.
Has anyone got an explanation for this?

6.45 is spent on pay and pensions which makes it 79.9% on my calculator.

Don't forget that part of the plan to cut costs was to get people to retire early with a larger pension.

leonidas83

RobbieTheRobber wrote: »

A whole lot of rhetoric and mis-directed anger. Almost to laughable levels.
There is nothing of substance in this post at all!

Am I the greedy minority you refer to?

Tell me Leo how do the Public sector get on in other countries?

Well I'll enlighten you since you seem incapable of researching anything yourself, there's accountability, there isnt automatic pay increments irrespective of how rubbish you are at the job, the pension isnt topped up to ridiculous levels over their private sector counterparts, their pay doesnt form a ridiculous amount of the overall budget, they provide a decent service (not close @ 12pm for lunch, open @ 2pm & finish at 4pm), they work harder, longer hours, dont get a day off to go shopping for xmas, dont get nearly 5 months holidays in the year, dont get ridiculous allowances such as eating their lunch at their desk & on & on.

And go on keep laughing, we'll see how happy you are when the government are forced to get rid of that ridiculous agreement & slash this bloated & overpaid sector of Irish society.

hyperborean

RobbieTheRobber wrote: »

I just had a look in my crystal ball and your wrong!

I see why you are afraid of saying what you think, but I have rarely seen anyone banned for trying to be funny?

The fact is we need to reduce the budget deficit and Public Sector pay and pensions are one of if not the biggest output excluding social welfare....

We cannot live beyond our means forever,

This is like a SF economical broadcast

sean200

hyperborean wrote: »

If Madrid and Rome are what you call across europe then yes I am aware of the austerity marches,

belgium
Spain
italy
Greece
portugal
france

http://www.cnbc.com/id/49815329

jh79

sean200 wrote: »

Open your ears
They have said that Pay cuts will be a last resort
They want a longer working week
Today across Europe you have country’s shut down due to strike action but Irelandis open for business and this government will continue to avoid strike action.

A Labour minister was hardly going to say ps wage cuts are on the way while still trying to implement the CPA

How else are the savings going to be made every year for the next decade or more?

hyperborean

sean200 wrote: »

And when that happens you will have about 600k on the dole

Welcome to Greece boys

Can you not read? I said pay reduction, not staff reduction!

RobbieTheRobber

hyperborean wrote: »

Sorry to hear that, its sad that you cannot articulate yourself without fear of the banhammer

I know you are but what am I :P Childish

hyperborean wrote: »

Its 100%, I will expand on this later,

Oh FFS :rolleyes:

hyperborean wrote: »

The public sector pay and pensions costs are one of many area's that will have to be cut, we cannot live in Germany's pocket forever!

Indeed they are and pay has been reduced for new entrants which will lower the cost of staff into the future.
Also the Redundancy scheme to be offered in the new year will further reduce the overall PS cost!
So as you can see they government continues to look at ways to reduce the cost of the PS without the need to tackle the wages of existing staff.

sean200

leonidas83 wrote: »

Well I'll enlighten you since you seem incapable of researching anything yourself, there's accountability, there isnt automatic pay increments irrespective of how rubbish you are at the job, the pension isnt topped up to ridiculous levels over their private sector counterparts, their pay doesnt form a ridiculous amount of the overall budget, they provide a decent service (not close @ 12pm for lunch, open @ 2pm & finish at 4pm), they work harder, longer hours, dont get a day off to go shopping for xmas, dont get nearly 5 months holidays in the year, dont get ridiculous allowances such as eating their lunch at their desk & on & on.

And go on keep laughing, we'll see how happy you are when the government are forced to get rid of that ridiculous agreement & slash this bloated & overpaid sector of Irish society.

LOL
It is good to talk and let it all out
Now get a job and you will feel better

RobbieTheRobber

leonidas83 wrote: »

Well I'll enlighten you since you seem incapable of researching anything yourself, there's accountability, there isnt automatic pay increments irrespective of how rubbish you are at the job, the pension isnt topped up to ridiculous levels over their private sector counterparts, their pay doesnt form a ridiculous amount of the overall budget, they provide a decent service (not close @ 12pm for lunch, open @ 2pm & finish at 4pm), they work harder, longer hours, dont get a day off to go shopping for xmas, dont get nearly 5 months holidays in the year, dont get ridiculous allowances such as eating their lunch at their desk & on & on.

And go on keep laughing, we'll see how happy you are when the government are forced to get rid of that ridiculous agreement & slash this bloated & overpaid sector of Irish society.

Is this your routine for a comedy sketch?
You and I both know the above does not apply to the majority in the PS so why you would post I dont know except for comic purposes!

Leo i asked you earlier about what percentage of health and education budgets should be allocated for wages can you please respond to that?

sean200

hyperborean wrote: »

Can you not read? I said pay reduction, not staff reduction!

Pay cuts be it in public sector or welfare will lead to job losses all across the private sector

hyperborean

RobbieTheRobber wrote: »

I know you are but what am I :P Childish


Oh FFS :rolleyes:



Indeed they are and pay has been reduced for new entrants which will lower the cost of staff into the future.
Also the Redundancy scheme to be offered in the new year will further reduce the overall PS cost!
So as you can see they government continues to look at ways to reduce the cost of the PS without the need to tackle the wages of existing staff.

Its not enough, the math doesn't match. The economy is not expanding, if anything there will be a slight deflation in the next 2 years.

do you think that in a static economy with an enormous budgetary deficit that the PS pay and pensions can be left alone? Do you think that the 100,000 + PS sector workers earning in excess of 50k per annum will be left alone? all the cuts will come have to from SW if that is the case, severe cuts at that, I'm sure the guy living on €188 per week will be happy to know that he has contributed when he see's 10-20% of his weekly help gone?

sarumite

RobbieTheRobber wrote: »

2/3rds doesnt really mean a lot though its a fraction and not an explanation.

Seeing as in relation to health and education spending, this forum only talks in percentages, can someone tell me what percentage of the budget is acceptable or normal?

http://www.guardian.co.uk/news/datablog/2012/sep/11/education-compared-oecd-country-pisa

According to the above article, the EU21 Average for education spending is 5.81% of GDP and Ireland spends 6.5% of GDP (for 2009 or 2010...the article doesn't explicity state which year).

It also states that (discounting Luxembourg due to the very expensive nature of the country - their rationale, not mine) then Germany has the highest paid teachers and Ireland is second.

Not sure about when the data is from for spending as a % of GDP ( Its either 2009 or 2010), the salary details are from 2010.

hyperborean

sean200 wrote: »

Pay cuts be it in public sector or welfare will lead to job losses all across the private sector

There is an argument for that, but how does the status quo help with our deficit, we have to make the cuts....


Or do we borrow another 100bn and invest in jobs?

frankosw

sean200 wrote: »

Moan moan moan
At 9.38 am you must be on the dole

The sort of peoplw who whinge at that level usually are on the dole alright.

They usually come out of college thinking the world owes them a living because they studied something or other.

Now they're all experts on the economy despite contributing nothing towards it.

The beauty of all this ranting and raving is taht nobody in Govt takes a blind bit of notice of the vitriol from the online warriors..the value of a well-paid and motivated public service far outweighs the cost of paying them...whereas the dole bums (many of them in thier third year of Govt benefits but still calling themselves "newly unemployed") contribute exactly nothing.


A cessation of the CPA allowing a work to rule in govt departments such as welfare would show the spongers that the PS doesnt get paid for sitting on its hole.

frankosw

hyperborean wrote: »

all the cuts will come have to from SW if that is the case, severe cuts at that, I'm sure the guy living on €188 per week will be happy to know that he has contributed when he see's 10-20% of his weekly help gone?

He could always,y'know get a job?

Farmer Pudsey

It amazes me the way some public service posters have turned on the unemployed. Most of us that have issue's with PS pay have also issue's with social welfare rate's and benifits for the unemployed. Most also believe that it is higher earners in the PS that should be targated and high levels of pensions.

I for one do not believe that just cutting PS pay will solve the issue's it will be part of the solution as will cutting welfare benifits to unemployed. As will higher rates of tax enforcment if it is possible. And yes we will have to have some of the bank debt taken on by europe and I believe that we should reduce bankers pay and pensions.

But just thinking that we can spend our way out of this recession is stupid.

frankosw

Farmer Pudsey wrote: »

It amazes me the way some public service posters have turned on the unemployed..

Whats so amazing abouut it?

We're paying them to do nothing after all.

I personally work one week in four for nothing..all given away to the govt.

Dont forget administering the Social Welfare system is a PS job whereby they get to see for themselves the entitlements and benefits paid to people on welfare...the demanding of allowances,the allocation of free accomadation,medical cards,heating allowances then the planning of holidays (which they get paid for whilst away)the sheer brass neck of some of these people.

There are many,many people in the PS who see the unemployed as being better off financially then they are.

murphaph

ardmacha wrote: »

The introduction of a tax structure comparable to other West European nations is going to happen one way or the other, deal with it.

But can you promise me the same levels of services and infrastructure as them?

Pharaoh1

sean200 wrote: »

The best part about this is that any change in the tax relief on pension contributions from 41pc to 20pc will not effect the public sector
This is so unfair

I don't know about this maybe someone could clarify.

As far as I am aware a pension contribution whether it is to a DB company scheme, PS superannuation or Pension levy, Semi State superannuation, a self employed or PAYE persons PRSA, a company DC scheme or whatever are treated exactly the same for tax relief purposes.

How could the govt reduce the tax relief for specific groups and exempt some others? I know the 0.6% levy applies only to pensions where there is a "pension pot" but at least it applies to all such pensions. It could not be applied to PS schemes as there is no pot.

Thats why I don't think there will be major changes here - the % contributions by public servants are relatively high (as they should be given the nature of the pension) and a major reduction in tax relief would hit public servants hardest as their contributions are mandatory.
Unless they come up with a system where tax relief is reduced and say the % PS pension levy is also reduced to ensure there is no net loss to the employees sort of similar to the 1995 PRSI scam.

I don't think something like that would wash in the current climate.

Head The Wall

You are correct in this, it will hit PS more - Godge mentioned this in a post a few days ago.

K-9

Thread just seems to be a chance to air a good ould rant about whatever section of society posters don't like. Unless there's a change in the posting style I can't see it wasting much more bandwidth.

woodoo

sean200 wrote: »

They want a longer working week

I would like more info on this. I work long enough and have no intention of working any longer.

woodoo

leonidas83 wrote: »

there isnt automatic pay increments irrespective of how rubbish you are at the job, the pension isnt topped up to ridiculous levels over their private sector counterparts, their pay doesnt form a ridiculous amount of the overall budget, they provide a decent service (not close @ 12pm for lunch, open @ 2pm & finish at 4pm), they work harder, longer hours, dont get a day off to go shopping for xmas, dont get nearly 5 months holidays in the year, dont get ridiculous allowances such as eating their lunch at their desk & on & on.
.

I think you are on a wind up.

sarumite

woodoo wrote: »

I would like more info on this. I work long enough and have no intention of working any longer.

I do think anyone who is only working 35 hours a week could be reasonably be brought up to 39-40 hours a week is which is (from what I have seen at least) a more standard working week in IReland

woodoo

sarumite wrote: »

I do think anyone who is only working 35 hours a week could be reasonably be brought up to 39-40 hours a week is which is (from what I have seen at least) a more standard working week in IReland

A big NO to that i'm afraid. I'm happy with my 9 to 5.

Stheno

woodoo wrote: »

A big NO to that i'm afraid. I'm happy with my 9 to 5.

Do you only work 9-5 including lunch?

RobbieTheRobber

sarumite wrote: »

I do think anyone who is only working 35 hours a week could be reasonably be brought up to 39-40 hours a week is which is (from what I have seen at least) a more standard working week in IReland

Will there be an allowance for that?