Do developers insult gamers intelligence

snausages

ancapailldorcha wrote: »

Final Fantasy XIII is a particularly horrific offender that springs to mind. Final Fantasy VII did a great job by setting up 2 tutorial rooms that you could visit if you wanted to.

And then FFVIII came along with one of the most atrocious, inelegant tutorial systems ever made. Yes, even worse than FFXIII (okay, not really. But you get my point).

Anyway, I think it's absurd that games like Assassin's Creed Brotherhood need child-friendly tutorials. They're adult games ffs!

NotorietyH

snausages wrote: »

Anyway, I think it's absurd that games like Assassin's Creed Brotherhood need child-friendly tutorials. They're adult games ffs!

Plenty of adults have never played a console game too. It's nothing to do with age, it's experience of playing games. I have a friend who's around 27 who hadn't played video games since the PS1 days and I was trying to get him to play portal and it took him ages to get used to looking around with the right analogue stick, learning how much pressure to apply and all that, most of the time he would swing wildly in every direction and found it impossible to centre the view for ages, he won't even go near a faster paced game or something like Assassin's Creed at the moment, so he'd very much need the tutorial. Again you're looking at it from the point of view of someone who's played a lot of video games from a young age and maybe all your friends have too, which is fine for you to not like the tutorials, but to say they're not needed is the wrong assumption and missing the point of the tutorials I think.

snausages

NotorietyH wrote: »

Plenty of adults have never played a console game too. It's nothing to do with age, it's experience of playing games. I have a friend who's around 27 who hadn't played video games since the PS1 days and I was trying to get him to play portal and it took him ages to get used to looking around with the right analogue stick, learning how much pressure to apply and all that, most of the time he would swing wildly in every direction and found it impossible to centre the view for ages, he won't even go near a faster paced game or something like Assassin's Creed at the moment, so he'd very much need the tutorial. Again you're looking at it from the point of view of someone who's played a lot of video games from a young age and maybe all your friends have too, which is fine for you to not like the tutorials, but to say they're not needed is the wrong assumption and missing the point of the tutorials I think.

Fair enough, but I never said that tutorials were not needed. I'm just annoyed that a great part of games these days is taken up with explaining the most basic of things that can more easily be taught outside of the main game. There are more graceful ways to introduce players to the game's mechanics than 10 hour long introductions. Portal introduced new elements in every test chamber, the tutorial segment and the game itself were seamlessly merged together. Deus Ex put all its tutorial stuff in a separate option on the start-up menu. If you had to go through the practice mode every time you started up a new game it would be a pain. It just would be nice to have an option to skip most of this stuff

The abundance of context sensitive cues on HUDs annoys me as well. To it's credit AC usually lets you disable all of them. Other games don't though.

ancapailldorcha

snausages wrote: »

And then FFVIII came along with one of the most atrocious, inelegant tutorial systems ever made. Yes, even worse than FFXIII (okay, not really. But you get my point).

Anyway, I think it's absurd that games like Assassin's Creed Brotherhood need child-friendly tutorials. They're adult games ffs!

Never had a problem with FFVIII's myself. The junction system needed explaining and all the tutorials were both skippable and accessible at any time in the game's menu.

Canis Lupus

Retr0gamer wrote: »

Pro-tip: Unless it was fatalities, they were all in the manual.

I distinctly remember either 2 or 3 did not include special moves.

Edit: just looked at a manual. Only included 2 special moves a character. Left others to be discovered.

Grimebox

Considering you are reading and discussing this on a games forum on the internet, absolutely zero percent of us are the target audience for these tutorials

Agricola

Its just a case of being accessible to the widest audience. The more "noobs" that can pick up a game and be able to play it, the better it is for the dev/publisher.

Im not too bothered about it. A good game is one thats easy to pick up but difficult to master. If a game has a dopey tutorial that doesnt last too long, I dont mind as long as it eventually goes on to become something that is interesting and requires a bit of skill to complete.

NotorietyH

snausages wrote: »

Deus Ex put all its tutorial stuff in a separate option on the start-up menu. If you had to go through the practice mode every time you started up a new game it would be a pain. It just would be nice to have an option to skip most of this stuff

The abundance of context sensitive cues on HUDs annoys me as well. To it's credit AC usually lets you disable all of them. Other games don't though.

Yeah I'd be all for a skippable tutorial, would be the best of both worlds. Assassin's Creed 3's tutorial does seem excessively long, the trouble with them is they usually try to tie in the story into the tutorial too so it stops them making them skippable. Even having it as an option for a second playthrough would be something.

CastorTroy

I suppose it's as frustrating to gamers as the movie industry is to movie fans these days by insisting on PG rated sequels to 18 rated movies but I'll mention no Die Hards.

CruelCoin

richymcdermott wrote: »

Playing through assassin creed 3 and going through the tutorial mode i am noticing More and more that tutorials are so basic i believe that they are insulting our intelligence That we cant comprehend That moving forward means holding the analog stick forward.

I believe even a person who never picked up a controller before knows how to at least move forward.

There should be an option to skip the bull**** and just jump into the story mode

Games like the Call of Duty series are insulting. Mindless rollercoaster visual overload, where graphics is meant to replace genuine story and meaningfull choice.

gizmo

CruelCoin wrote: »

Games like the Call of Duty series are insulting. Mindless rollercoaster visual overload, where graphics is meant to replace genuine story and meaningfull choice.

Insulting to who?

ancapailldorcha

CruelCoin wrote: »

Games like the Call of Duty series are insulting. Mindless rollercoaster visual overload, where graphics is meant to replace genuine story and meaningfull choice.

If that's what people want. I hope you don't buy them.

CruelCoin

ancapailldorcha wrote: »

If that's what people want. I hope you don't buy them.

Its no better than sitting on your couch dribbling in front of the tv, and some mind-numbing ****ing game show.

I do buy them, but only for the multiplayer which up untill the black ops series was quite good.

gizmo

CruelCoin wrote: »

Its no better than sitting on your couch dribbling in front of the tv, and some mind-numbing ****ing game show.

I do buy them, but only for the multiplayer which up untill the black ops series was quite good.

And what about the people who would have referred to the multiplayer in the post-MW CoD games in a similar manner to which you've described above?

Grimebox

gizmo wrote: »

And what about the people who would have referred to the multiplayer in the post-MW CoD games in a similar manner to which you've described above?

I'd call them snobs

Overheal

Halo games don't give you meaningful choices either, and they recycled some of their levels quite a lot.

Still considered one of the best console series of all time