The role of The Seanad..

wagonwheel05

Can anyone tell me does the Seanad play a part in the executive branch of government? If so, what role does it play?

Bare with me, only a novice here

ResearchWill

wagonwheel05 wrote: »

Can anyone tell me does the Seanad play a part in the executive branch of government? If so, what role does it play?

Bare with me, only a novice here

No the Seanad is the legislative branch.

coylemj

The Seanad has no role in the election of the Taoiseach, nor are they required to approve the Taoiseach's nominations for the various cabinet posts.

No more than two members of the Seanad can be members of the Government (cabinet) and neither of them can be Tanaiste or Minister for Finance. In that case they would be entitled to be heard in the Dail since all ministers can be heard in either house.


28.7.1 The Taoiseach, the Tánaiste and the member of the Government who is in charge of the Department of Finance must be members of Dáil Éireann.

28.7.2 The other members of the Government must be members of Dáil Éireann or Seanad Éireann, but not more than two may be members of Seanad Éireann

28.8 Every member of the Government shall have the right to attend and be heard in each House of the Oireachtas.


The last time a senator was appointed to the cabinet was in 1981 when Garret Fitzgerald nominated Prof. Jim Dooge to the Seanad (as one of the Taoiseach's eleven) and he was then appointed Minister for Foreign Affairs though he held the office for less than six months as that Government fell in February 1982.

In the UK a member of the House of Lords is not allowed to appear and/or be heard in the House of Commons (and v.v.), hence no senior cabinet post has been given to a sitting peer for several years. Lord Carrington was Maggie's Foreign Secretary at the time of the Falklands invasion, I think he was the last holder of one of the 'big three' (Foreign Sec./Chancellor/Home Sec.) offices of state who was not a member of the House of Commons.

burnaby

There are three arms of the Irish government -

The Judiciary - Courts
The Executive - Government (cabinet Ministers)
The Legislature - Dail, Seanad and President

All three are separate, and have discrete roles, although members of the Executive are appointed by the President on the nomination of the Taoiseach (Prime Minister) and following approval of that nomination by the Dail.

Marcusm

coylemj wrote: »

The Seanad has no role in the election of the Taoiseach, nor are they required to approve the Taoiseach's nominations for the various cabinet posts.

No more than two members of the Seanad can be members of the Government (cabinet) and neither of them can be Tanaiste or Minister for Finance. In that case they would be entitled to be heard in the Dail since all ministers can be heard in either house.


28.7.1 The Taoiseach, the Tánaiste and the member of the Government who is in charge of the Department of Finance must be members of Dáil Éireann.

28.7.2 The other members of the Government must be members of Dáil Éireann or Seanad Éireann, but not more than two may be members of Seanad Éireann

28.8 Every member of the Government shall have the right to attend and be heard in each House of the Oireachtas.


The last time a senator was appointed to the cabinet was in 1981 when Garret Fitzgerald nominated Prof. Jim Dooge to the Seanad (as one of the Taoiseach's eleven) and he was then appointed Minister for Foreign Affairs though he held the office for less than six months as that Government fell in February 1982.

In the UK a member of the House of Lords is not allowed to appear and/or be heard in the House of Commons (and v.v.), hence no senior cabinet post has been given to a sitting peer for several years. Lord Carrington was Maggie's Foreign Secretary at the time of the Falklands invasion, I think he was the last holder of one of the 'big three' (Foreign Sec./Chancellor/Home Sec.) offices of state who was not a member of the House of Commons.

Mandelson would likely argue that holding the titles First Secretary of State, Lord President of the Council and Secretary of State for Business etc would rank as a senior cabinet post - he was effectively deputy prime minister.

Cody Pomeray

wagonwheel05 wrote: »

Can anyone tell me does the Seanad play a part in the executive branch of government? If so, what role does it play?

Article 28.7.2 which envisages a Cabinet with two Senators has already been mentioned, but arguably the Seanad exerts a greater potential control over the Executive of a practical nature. It is this.

The Seanad is a legislative body comprised of many TDs who do not belong to Government parties, or who do not harbour political ambitions, at least as it relates to Dáil Éireann. Only 50% of Irish Senators are attached to Government parties, many of them do not aspire to higher office. They are also less dependent on their respective parties for funding at election time.

Therefore, the Seanad is arguably more 'immune' from cabinet pressures and from the party whips than is Dáil Éireann. Although their relative immunity is under-utilized, this is some, limited safeguard against Cabinet hegemony in Leinster House.

Therefore, the role the Seanad plays in the Executive branch is a restraining role, although (i) the extent of this restraint is time-limited and (ii) Senators have traditionally been reluctant to exercise this restraining role.

coylemj

Backbench TDs belonging to the parties currently in Government have virtually no role to play in the executive branch so any suggestion that Senators have any kind of role or oversight is pure fiction. Dubin SE TD Eoghan Murphy covered this topic as recently as the MacGill Summer school a few weeks ago, he reiterated what we all know about Govt. backbenchers - they are lobby fodder and nothing else. Members of the Seanad are even further removed from the action.

Nice try but if you want to campaign for the retention of the Seanad, I'm sure there's a thread on the topic somewhere else.

Cody Pomeray

coylemj wrote: »

Backbench TDs belonging to the parties currently in Government have virtually no role to play

You have totally misunderstood.

Backbench TDs almost always aspire to Ministerial office, Committee, or other form of political promotion.

With the exception of the Montessori Senators, most Senators, being literally part-time workers, do not tend to share higher-office expectations. They tend to have more immediate concerns - for example they may be 'single policy' or 'niche' representatives. They may be retiring. They are not reliant on the party funding their Seanad electoral campaigns, and Senators do not (officially) even represent their parties. Therefore they have greater relative immunity from executive influence than do their Dáil counterparts. This is a fact.