Using the Internet for Getting Business

martinn123

Hi Folks,

to set the scene, I am involved in Conservatories, Sunrooms etc. I am based on a great site North of Dublin, just off the Motorway, where Conservatories have been on display since 1977. I have a couple of Conservatories on display
Fantastic road frontage and passing traffic.

I have a Web-Site, and people searching for Conservatories at this location have no trouble finding the site.

In addition I am an agent for a well known Co, and sell Garden Sheds, Garages etc, again I have a great display, with the road frontage, they have their own Web-Site with my location displayed.

I also use Twitter, recently a local Co in marketing started sending Tweets to local Co's asking use to '' Follow'' each other.
This has increased my ''Followers'' but all local business's.

I have a business page on Facebook, and used the Thread here to get people to ''like'' my page, so now I am ''liked'' by a load of business's

So if I send out a '' Special Offer'' its just reaching other business's, who in turn send me their '' specials'' I am not reaching potential customers.

My question is, what else should I be doing to maximize the flow of inquiries from the Internet.

I have the feeling, its just insomniacs, who trawl the Internet and send out questions, look for prices etc, design ideas.
Bit like trawling through Carzone when you have no cash to buy a car, great fun but a waste of time really.

For example over the past week, I have been replying to an initial inquiry on a price.
I asked for their location, which was ignored, but got photo's, dimensions, and requests for design ideas. I gave information as best as I could without a site visit, suggested a price range etc

Turns out they are in South Co Dublin, where I will not go because of travel costs, etc and time eating into profit margins.

I have read threads, about maximizing the reach of your Web-site, and have made some inquiries.
Everyone claims they will bring me into the Top 10 of ''Google'' searches, but charge a fortune for this with no Guarantee of success, personally I think its a con.

I had a Rep recently who guaranteed me this, so I asked him to ''Google Search'' his own service, and he was nowhere, appeared on the 5th page
So if he can't do it for himself how the heck can he do it for me.

Anyway, Business is slow, I need to increase inquiries from potential customers locally, and more importantly increase the amount of visitors to my display.

any suggestions on an Internet strategy, at low cost.

cheers all

hytrogen

Without becoming Fergal Quinn would you not consider expanding the geography of your potential markets? As in cater for that south side client??
Perhaps your local market is saturated?
As regards online business get your friends friends to like & recommend your page / site / tweet in some way. Rumour has it FB is moving into the 'classifieds' marketing for advertising soon.

smash

martinn123 wrote: »

Turns out they are in South Co Dublin, where I will not go because of travel costs, etc and time eating into profit margins.

Personally I think this was a very silly move. Sounds like you could have done with the extra exposure. And I can't see costs rising beyond and extra €5 for petrol to be honest.

hytrogen wrote: »

Rumour has it FB is moving into the 'classifieds' marketing for advertising soon.

They're already there with Marketplace for facebook, but it's failing miserably.

highlandseoghan

I think you should be covering South Dublin too. If the business is there why not, It doesnt make sense to just stick with the Northside especially if you are just off the motorway.

What about running a competition on your facebook page. One lucky fb fan will win X by the end of the month all you have to do is like and share our page.

Peterdalkey

I had a look at your website and to be honest, that is the first thing you need to fix. It is very "1998" and clearly lacking in any design input. There is no point is expending money and effort to drive traffic to a site that will have them clicking away, asap!! You need to get professional design input, especially as your sector is one with much competition and mostly really proper websites.

If you want to stay local, then promote local, using local press and flyers, Consider changing your website name to North Dublin Conservatories and spell out your geographic limits.

Cheers

Peter

martinn123

Thanks for the input guy's much appreciated.
On the '' southside '' question, installing a Conservatory is much more that a single visit, so my Installers, builders etc would all have to travel and cost more, we would typically be at a location daily for 3/4 weeks.
Someone based on the Southside would not have to cover those costs, so I can't compete on price

Yes @peterdalkey, you are right about the Web-site, it was set up by my Son, who works in IT to save me cash, I will get him to re-vamp it.

I need to drive customers more towards my actual location, i.e visit my Display, rather than my Virtual Location.

Peterdalkey

I am afraid your son may be a great IT guy but he is clueless when it comes to design, get someone with design talent, it is a completely different skillset!

Cheers

Peter

martinn123

Peterdalkey wrote: »

I am afraid your son may be a great IT guy but he is clueless when it comes to design, get someone with design talent, it is a completely different skillset!

Cheers

Peter

Well he actually used one of those Templates available on T'Internet, so did not have too much design input, but I take your point.
Thanks again.

hytrogen

http://static.fail.me/uploads/fail.me/1352714199-Social-media-explained.png

micromary

What is the website Martin? I am setting up a online language school. I am going to a well known designer in Dublin and will spend over €3k on getting a very professional website done, he is also going to help re Facebook, twitter, linkedin etc. I went to Fingals Blackknight "Getting Irish Business Online" sessions but to be honest a site like these is like being in non-league football and playing in the Premiership where you get a proper site done.

You need to be s**t hot these days to stand out with a site which is easy to navigate, use and allows the customer understand what is happening. A number of language schools to be honest I have looked at and I am lost at what they are offering or have to search around for it. Having the right site which stands out could be the difference between staying in business and moving on or losing business to competitors

smash

martinn123 wrote: »

Thanks for the input guy's much appreciated.
On the '' southside '' question, installing a Conservatory is much more that a single visit, so my Installers, builders etc would all have to travel and cost more, we would typically be at a location daily for 3/4 weeks.
Someone based on the Southside would not have to cover those costs, so I can't compete on price

I think you need to look at your costings again then. People who want conservatories has to be a pretty small market, and limiting yourself to half a county wont really cut it. You don't see the likes of senator windows doing that.

martinn123

smash wrote: »

I think you need to look at your costings again then. People who want conservatories has to be a pretty small market, and limiting yourself to half a county wont really cut it. You don't see the likes of senator windows doing that.

OK I am getting some flack by not going Southside.

My Site is in Co. Meath close to the Dublin boundary, so I can cover the area from Dundalk, to North Dublin, and inland to all of Meath, Louth, Co Dublin, ( north)
My fitters travel from Co Louth, and my builders are in Co. Meath,

So no I do not have to look at my costs again, the travel time, and cost means I do not look for business Southside, I also steer clear of Wicklow, Wexford, Cork etc.
There is enough competition in all areas, so price is primary, and with the cost of travel, means my prices would not compete

Senator for your information operate Franchises all over the Country, and do not operate as a Franchisee, outside certain territories, despite that I am cheaper than Senator on Every Quote.

smash

So why not get some contractors in other counties?

martinn123

smash wrote: »

So why not get some contractors in other counties?

Well that sounds simple, doesn't it.

Yes contractors are two a penny at the moment, but getting Contractors you can trust, to work with little supervision, and build a base to match the Conservatory, is not so easy. Also to build to the current Reg's and not take shortcuts.

I am a one man business, I spend the day manning the office and Showgrounds, showing potential customers what I have on display, then I visit my sites to check progress, collect payments due, and insure the Conservatory when it arrives will fit the base, as built.
The Contractors I have, I have worked with for many years, and I trust them, with my reputation.
to be honest I posted this thread to seek advice on ''The Internet'' and having been 20 yrs in Conservatories, am not looking for advice on location.
There are enough people living between Dundalk and North Co, without me trying to take on Co's who are based on the Southside, or elsewhere throughout the Country.

Thanks all for input.

smash

Take on board the suggestions about a redesign. You wouldn't trust someone with 10yr old products in their showroom so treat the net the same. It's your shop window.

Dotsie~tmp

Have you considered the market maybe saturated right now. Margins are low all over construction, too low. Im offering a thousand euro alarm free with evey rewire and cant get any bites.

martinn123

Dotsie~tmp wrote: »

Have you considered the market maybe saturated right now. Margins are low all over construction, too low. Im offering a thousand euro alarm free with evey rewire and cant get any bites.

saturated, No, I see plenty of potential customers who are scared to make a purchase decision.

So hang in there, the cowboys are dissapearing off the scene, and when business starts to pick up,the last man standing will be in a strong position.

Also if the Budget does something to deter the '' off books'' economy, us registered and compliant co's may benefit.

martinn123

micromary wrote: »

What is the website Martin? I am setting up a online language school. I am going to a well known designer in Dublin and will spend over €3k on getting a very professional website done, he is also going to help re Facebook, twitter, linkedin etc. I went to Fingals Blackknight "Getting Irish Business Online" sessions but to be honest a site like these is like being in non-league football and playing in the Premiership where you get a proper site done.

You need to be s**t hot these days to stand out with a site which is easy to navigate, use and allows the customer understand what is happening. A number of language schools to be honest I have looked at and I am lost at what they are offering or have to search around for it. Having the right site which stands out could be the difference between staying in business and moving on or losing business to competitors

To be honest, I am a little skeptical of situations like this.

I can't afford 3K for a 'S**T Hot Website, I am not selling online, I just need something which will give my contact details, show pictures of my work, and directions to my Showgrounds.

I do take on board the comments posted regarding my site, being outdated, buy no-one buys a Conservatory on a Web-Site, and I can't justify/afford the kind of Fees, Web Designers are looking for.

Anyone recommend a site where I can download a Modern Template, and get some help in loading up my own details.

highlandseoghan

Who is your main customer? If there young professionals have you considered facebook ads? Some people get great business from facebook ads some don't but you can give it a try with a small budget and see if you get any new customers or enquirys from it.

If your customers are older have you considered Drogheda independent, Fingal independent and Dundalk democrat. You could run an ad for a set time.

There is the free newspapers but I have used these and friends have used these and the results have been very poor.

I find the advertising trailers great for gaining customers. You could buy your own trailer spend a few quid getting a good ad on it and it will advertise for you everytime it is out and about. The ad trailers I feel are also a great way of building your brand.

Kristopherus

Have a look at www.wix com for templates.

EIREHotspur

You do not need to spend 3k in this day and age to get a decent website but you do need to take the internet seriously or you are only wasting your time.

Go with the www.wix.com suggestion and get your son to upload your details.
You just want a bare bones job by the sounds of it.
Be prepared though to get one time visitors to the website.

If I am looking for anything in your line of Business and I don't see it on your bare bones website but all the details are on your competitors, who do you think I will contact and who do you think I will dismiss?

If I wanted your phone number I would look you up in the Golden Pages....if I visit your website I expect to see multiple examples of your work and lots and lots of detail.

The internet with websites done right is made for Business but far too many don't understand that it gives people choice....ultimate window shopping experience..you don't like what you see you can very quickly move onto the next.

I am not having a go at you, to each their own...it's just I take what I do seriously as I am sure you do in your Business.

tricky D

Of course you're not selling online. Your site has very little to help your sales and marketing efforts. No mere template will solve this.

Can't see the products
No price guideline
No before/after
No testimonials
..... and a lot more

You are seriously underestimating the power and value an investment in your website can deliver when it comes to doing business. Your investment costs would be recovered in good time. People definitely do at least research things like conservatories online for information which assists in purchase decisions. There's a great opportunity to beat your competition in this space if you take it. You could easily move your site up the search engine listings but you are right to be wary of anybody promising top positions. That said there is a great opportunity to outdo much of your competition in the SEO sphere.

Not serving south Dublin and even further afield also sounds like a mistake.

Cowboys disappearing is also an assumption which doesn't bear up to scrutiny, they come and go all the time, so the notion of last man standing in a strong position is also mistaken.

I'd suggest you redo a SWOT analysis (strengths, weaknesses, opportunities, threats) and see what you can learn from that.

martinn123

Ok, first many thanks to all who contributed here, I realise when you post on a public forum, you are going to get comments at all ends of the scale

So, the suggestions regarding my Web-site, are well recieved, regarding its content, or lack of content, many thanks.

With regard to generating sales from web-site, I wonder how many have experience of selling or buying a Conservatory at all.
The first Rule, that the only way to sell, is to visit a home, design a conservatory to suit the location, and present the design, price etc at the home

Second Rule, is never to indicate a price before visiting the home, everyones house is different

Two Examples
I gave an indication of a price for a 12 x 12 at 16k-18K, but on arrival at the house discovered 4/5 steps down from the back door to the garden, when I added in the cost of building up, i was met with '' but you told me it was 16K''

Today i spoke to a lady, who was angling for a price, eventually she told me she lived in a mid-terrace house with no back gate. so how do I get the Conservatory, in, and all the excavation material out.....Through the house in a wheelbarrow.........Price that, or hire a crane.


I mentioned in my Op, that I was looking for suggestions to attract, customers towards my showgrounds, where I can weed out the time wasters, and if a serious inquiry, arrange a home visit, I can't do that over the Internet.

On the Northside/Southside aspect, my mind is made up on that, thanks for suggesting I am wrong, but I have no intention of taking on Co's Southside



As I mentioned I have been selling Conservatories for close on 20 yrs, mainly from my present location, previously as Sales Manager for a guy who has since retired, and now on my own account


the Location, has great road frontage, and is well known as a Conservatory site, 4 yrs ago, I did no advertising, but had a good income from callers who knew the location. In the past 2 years, visitor numbers have collapsed, thanks to our recession.

finally, thanks to those who sent me PM's advertising their Web Development skills, if you havent got the message yet......I have no funds available to Invest in IT, hence my posting here looking for suggestions.


And finally, finally, a real thanks to the suggestions along the line of

I'd suggest you redo a SWOT analysis (strengths, weaknesses, opportunities, threats) and see what you can learn from that.

Really appreciated, but I missed that course.

EIREHotspur

martinn123 wrote: »

With regard to generating sales from web-site, I wonder how many have experience of selling or buying a Conservatory at all.

When why do you want a website if you don't think it is going to generate any sales for you.....what do you think advertising is for?

martinn123 wrote: »

I mentioned in my Op, that I was looking for suggestions to attract, customers towards my showgrounds, where I can weed out the time wasters, and if a serious inquiry, arrange a home visit, I can't do that over the Internet.

You have the option of the free templates website someone showed you.
The only way you will root out time wasters is if you put up all of your prices (my nephew did this on his website I built him and he cut half of the time wasters out)

martinn123 wrote: »

finally, thanks to those who sent me PM's advertising their Web Development skills, if you havent got the message yet......I have no funds available to Invest in IT, hence my posting here looking for suggestions.

martinn123 wrote: »

My question is, what else should I be doing to maximize the flow of inquiries from the Internet.

any suggestions on an Internet strategy, at low cost.

You obviously didn't read your first post again because you quiet clearly asked specifically about "Internet strategy, at low cost".
I wasn't one who sent you any quotes because I did get the message quiet clearly.
You need Business cards, yellow page adverts, signage.
You do searches in twitter and facebook to find similar people or ones who live in your locality who in turn will pass on to their friends.
You put facebook and twitter widgets on your homepage and you can update your website on the move.....lots of free easy ways to do it.

An "Internet strategy, at low cost". takes work.
Someone like you came to me one time looking for a website and they were willing to pay but I sent them to someone else because I wasn't going to take money for a website that would die after the first visit.

If you are not willing to learn a few simple skills to update a website then it is a waste of time and money.

martinn123

First, thanks again for your input, it is appreciated

EIREHotspur wrote: »

When why do you want a website if you don't think it is going to generate any sales for you.....what do you think advertising is for?

To direct potential customers to my Showgrounds where I have a display, and I can talk through options, that's why I have a Showgrounds

You have the option of the free templates website someone showed you.
The only way you will root out time wasters is if you put up all of your prices (my nephew did this on his website I built him and he cut half of the time wasters out)

I had a look at the Template site suggested, not impressed, but willing to look at other suggestions, I disagree on the price issue, what does your nephew sell?

You obviously didn't read your first post again because you quiet clearly asked specifically about "Internet strategy, at low cost".
I wasn't one who sent you any quotes because I did get the message quiet clearly.
You need Business cards, yellow page adverts, signage.
You do searches in twitter and facebook to find similar people or ones who live in your locality who in turn will pass on to their friends.
You put facebook and twitter widgets on your homepage and you can update your website on the move.....lots of free easy ways to do it.

Doing all that, I have the widgets on Web-Site.

If you are not willing to learn a few simple skills to update a website then it is a waste of time and money.

I suppose that's why I posted this thread, I am more than willing, in fact I am looking for suggestions like yours.

By an Internet strategy, '' at Low Cost'' I am struggling, like everyone else to meet my current overheads, so I am looking for ways , as I have said to attract people to my Showgrounds, using the tools I have, without incurring, for the moment, additional costs.
That may sound daft, but it's the reality in the current market, my biggest advertising strength, is my location, my display, passing traffic and the fact that the site is known as a Conservatory Showgrounds for many years.

The Banks are closed at the moment, for Investment Funds, so a meeting to say, I need to invest in a marketing/web based campaign, will get a short sharp No in reply.

Peterdalkey

http://www.gettingbusinessonline.ie/getstarted?utm_source=google&utm_medium=cpc&utm_campaign=ie-ha-skws&utm_term=%2Bwebsite%20%2Btemplates%20%2Bfree

Have a look at these or just Google free website templates. You should find something to suit that is a significant improvement to the existing site.

I will go back to what I posted earlier, you want local business then promote local with local advertising/flyers or even the ad trailer suggestions. Your new website will ASSIST in promoting your image, if it is good and the opposite if is not. It does not have to be huge, just good and clean and show professionalism. You need your potential customers to have confidence in you, a good site will help. Include customer testimonials and offer to introduce potential buyers to satisfied customers and let them see the quality of you work. Tell the site visitors about yourself and your experience. They will be dealing with you as a person, not an online vendor they never meet.

I assume your show area is pretty decent, so run promotions to get people to visit with the offer of a nice cup of coffee or a special weekend discounted promotion or some free garden furniture etc etc. It is all about creating activity and get people to visit the show grounds. Plenty of work but little cost.

Finally make a plan in writing with all the elements you need to do and a timeline and then tick them off as you do them. Helps to keep you focussed and on it!


Cheers

Peter

martinn123

Maybe I can widen the discussion here, and get away, from the Web-site issue to other Web Tools.

I have a Business Facebook page, now there is a thread on this forum to ''Promote each others Facebook page''

So far I have '' liked'' 140 odd pages through this and a previous thread, I have got back about 50 '' likes'' from personal pages, I can't tell how many Business Pages have liked back.
The problem is that when I post something, while it appears on the wall of those who have liked, unless they ' like' the post it does not go on, to their friends, so my 'Reach' as reported by Facebook is very small.

The thread is closed to chat, but I wonder if there is any way, to encourage those who participate in this via boards, to 'like' posts so as to widen the circulation, or have I got this wrong

I also have a Twitter account,

as I understand it, when I tweet, it appears on the timeline of anyone I Follow, who follows me.

So I counted the followers, of my followers and it comes to over 10,000.

So am I right in thinking if I tweet, it can appear on 10,000 timelines

If so should I tweet, say an offer regularly.Photographs, etc,
One Co I follow, sends out the same tweet, every hour, is that worthy of a try, I find it annoying but if it works I will give it a try, another Co a Letting Agency sends out about 20 tweets each listing a link to a different property

Any thoughts on this.....thanks

Maybe I should open a '' Promote a Business Twitter Account'' thread in this Forum, as the potential reach, appears much greater than F/B

thecommander

martinn123 wrote: »

Maybe I can widen the discussion here, and get away, from the Web-site issue to other Web Tools.

I have a Business Facebook page, now there is a thread on this forum to ''Promote each others Facebook page''

So far I have '' liked'' 140 odd pages through this and a previous thread, I have got back about 50 '' likes'' from personal pages, I can't tell how many Business Pages have liked back.
The problem is that when I post something, while it appears on the wall of those who have liked, unless they ' like' the post it does not go on, to their friends, so my 'Reach' as reported by Facebook is very small.

The thread is closed to chat, but I wonder if there is any way, to encourage those who participate in this via boards, to 'like' posts so as to widen the circulation, or have I got this wrong

I also have a Twitter account,

as I understand it, when I tweet, it appears on the timeline of anyone I Follow, who follows me.

So I counted the followers, of my followers and it comes to over 10,000.

So am I right in thinking if I tweet, it can appear on 10,000 timelines

If so should I tweet, say an offer regularly.Photographs, etc,
One Co I follow, sends out the same tweet, every hour, is that worthy of a try, I find it annoying but if it works I will give it a try, another Co a Letting Agency sends out about 20 tweets each listing a link to a different property

Any thoughts on this.....thanks

Maybe I should open a '' Promote a Business Twitter Account'' thread in this Forum, as the potential reach, appears much greater than F/B

If you have 10 followers and you post a tweet, it will appear on the 10 people's timelines. It won't appear on their followers timelines. Only people that have chosen to follow you will see your tweet.

Bombarding people's timelines with multiple tweets about the same thing will more that likely get you an unfollow. I know anyone that spams mine gets dumped fairly quickly.

Axwell

martinn123 wrote: »

Maybe I can widen the discussion here, and get away, from the Web-site issue to other Web Tools.

I have a Business Facebook page, now there is a thread on this forum to ''Promote each others Facebook page''

So far I have '' liked'' 140 odd pages through this and a previous thread, I have got back about 50 '' likes'' from personal pages, I can't tell how many Business Pages have liked back.
The problem is that when I post something, while it appears on the wall of those who have liked, unless they ' like' the post it does not go on, to their friends, so my 'Reach' as reported by Facebook is very small.

The main point here is that it comes down to your content, if you are posting something valuable then people are more likely to 'like' or share it. If you are just posting irrelevant updates for the sake of posting it then no one is going to do either. The same applies for twitter, just because it appears on the persons timeline doesnt mean it engages them or they even see it. In fact with the rate at which peoples timelines update on twitter its probably harder to get seen on there but again it comes down to the quality of the post.

As regards your other point about twitter, your tweets only appear on the timeline of those who follow you - the same as facebook. The only way their followers would see it is if they retweet your tweet in the similar way to sharing a post on facebook.

If you are spamming the same post about an offer then you arent posting valuable or engaging content and the chances are you will just get blocked. You could be posting tips, advice, offers and a range of other content to keep it mixed and informative.

Peterdalkey

I would very much doubt that the FBers and twitterati of north Dublin represent a huge constituency of potential sunroom/conservatory buyers. If you did a survey of your past customers and asked them how many use or respond to Twitter or Facebook when making any purchases, I would doubt you would get a yes from even 5%.
You are not in a mass market activity and need thus need to target realistic prospects. Social Media has been grossly oversold as a business tool, it is a hobby and gossip/activity sharing pursuit for the vast majority of users. If you were running a disco, funky hairdressers, fashion retailer and wanted to promote a special offer, then it often makes good commercial sense to reach that demographic. For the vast majority of businesses selling more mundane products or services, it is a complete waste of effort. Oversold and overhyped, just like their share prices.

I am afraid you are chasing rainbows on this one. Business is so slow for many of us that we end up trying anything that might offer hope. Social Media at our level is snake oil, promises much and delivers little. I will be blunt and comment that you seem to gloss over the old fundamentals when they are stated by various posters here, I suspect because you are rather anxious to find a magic cure. The bad news is there is none for such traditional business other than doing the basics correctly. Using the Internet properly is a fundamental of today's business, but it is also has a huge element of hubris, white noise and latest fads. Just do the basics well and you will get a result.

Cheers

Peter

martinn123

thanks for that @peterdalkey

No I am taking in all the comments being made, good and otherwise, and my thanks to all who took the time to post.

Its not that I am looking for a majic cure, more that i have too much time on my hands to persue, anything that might help, meanwhile I am also addressing the very valid points made

Oh, and I keep playing Lotto as well.