Spectre (Bond 24)

BuilderPlumber

fitz wrote: »

I'd like to see them address the actor changeover as part of the plot.

Craig's movies have an overall arc...why not have that arc build to a climactic challenge in his last movie, with him saving the day while not wiping out Spectre entirely, but barely surviving the effort and having to retire through injury.
The next actor then takes on the "Bond" identity.
essentially use it as an alias...have them assign people to the 007 alias who fit a type and skill set. Establish the James Bond name as a code name in the same manner as 007.

You could then have scope to kill a Bond. Hell, you could even do it with Craig, with the Bond name retention being an MI6 nod to his sacrifice.

On the topic at hand, Elba would be a great Bond. He's got the same kind of physical presence and charisma as Connery imo.

Interesting. Up until 2002, Bond was an ageless character and it is implied he is the same person with the same history throughout. And we can be definite he is the same character (played by Connery, Lazenby, Moore and Dalton) because of the various references made to Bond's dead wife in the Diamonds are forever, at least 2 of Moore's Bonds and Dalton's last film.

While no mention either way is made, we are lead to presume that Brosnan's films are also the same character. We are then lead to presume Craig's Bond is a different person. A reboot. But Dench's M character is the same (so, are the 4 Brosnan films also part of this reboot and set somewhere between Casino Royale and Skyfall?)

Ending Bond on a Dallas or Love/Hate style cliffhanger would be interesting. Bond gets shot and then we are wondering is he dead or alive. Much like Nidge, Darren, JR or Bobby. OHMSS was the only series to end something like this though not a cliffhanger. We were certain at its end that Tracy (Bond's girlfriend and wife during the film) is dead and Bond himself is alive and physically unhurt.

Having James Bond as a codename is another dimension. Would this ruin the feel of the film? Personally, I'd prefer to have one Bond and maybe have films set in different times. As said before, a revenge sequel with Bond truly avenging the death of his wife would be excellent. Have it set around 1972 and have it based on the sentiment in but not copied from (as at least 50% of the book is in the film too) Fleming's You Only Live Twice book (which was the revenge sequel in the books and quite different to the movie version).

Brendan Flowers

BuilderPlumber wrote: »

Felix Leiter of course provided the Bond ally in the field. Funnily enough, his character was played by both black and white actors throughout the series!

Reminded me of this!

Iranoutofideas

Eh Moneypenny?

OldeCinemaSoz

"By the powers invested in me I hereby do comandere this vechile and all persons within...

and that means YOU smart a....!!!"

watched the LIVE AND LET DIE resurrection earlier on blu and boy,
does it just look smart. rog's first OUTING, and probably HIS BEST.

HankScorpio1985

http://www.empireonline.com/news/story.asp?NID=42923

eviltimeban

Man, I'm going to have to re-watch QoS as I can't remember a thing about it.

Sleepy

How has everyone missed it?

Bond has been re-booted.
We have a Bond "girl" that's the right age for him to marry.
The poster is showing us a bullet-hole in a windscreen...

BuilderPlumber

Sleepy wrote: »

How has everyone missed it?

Bond has been re-booted.
We have a Bond "girl" that's the right age for him to marry.
The poster is showing us a bullet-hole in a windscreen...

I feel this is going to be OHMSS redone????

dastardly00

Sleepy wrote: »

How has everyone missed it?

Bond has been re-booted.
We have a Bond "girl" that's the right age for him to marry.
The poster is showing us a bullet-hole in a windscreen...

BuilderPlumber wrote: »

I feel this is going to be OHMSS redone????

Well I suppose if they were going to "re-make" one of the previous films/books, then OHMSS is the ideal choice. The book/film details a significant part of Bond's life, but the majority of people dislike the film because of Lazenby.

BuilderPlumber

dastardly00 wrote: »

Well I suppose if they were going to "re-make" one of the previous films/books, then OHMSS is the ideal choice. The book/film details a significant part of Bond's life, but the majority of people dislike the film because of Lazenby.

That is true. OHMSS has been underrated in my view. Lazenby was a good Bond but suffered comparison to Connery. OHMSS was also the last film to be almost entirely faithful to the books. Some say that this was the start of a rot that set in at this time but I think that rot set in later. OHMSS is to me a serious thriller that ended with Bond losing instead of winning.

A new reboot of this as a two part story with be good. Part 1 with Bond doing battle with Blofeld and then marrying and his wife getting shot. Then, Part 2 with Bond chasing down Blofeld and seeking revenge. Fleming did both in his OHMSS book and You only live twice followup. But the films never really did. Diamonds are forever started off this way but moved quickly on to other things after the pretitle. The start of For your eyes only likewise: 5 minutes at the start is hardly closure to such a significant story. The films have never really done revenge all that well other than Licence to kill. Dalton's Bond would have been ideal for all revenge focused films imo. Like Diamonds are forever, Quantum of solace moved quickly on from Bond's revenge for the death of his love interest: albeit, Vesper betrayed Bond unlike Tracy so Bond got his act together early on and said she was not worth it. But, Tracy was someone the series has always shown he never truly got over (she is referenced directly or otherwise in Diamonds are forever, Live and let die, The spy who loved me, For your eyes only and Licence to kill). So, I think we do need a revisit to these Fleming storylines.

eviltimeban

I don't think they're gonna do a "Bond gets married" storyline. Certainly not to Monica Bellucci. What's Lea Seydoux doing there then? I'd say Bellucci's character will be some kind of informant, or perhaps partner of Waltz's character - the seductive accomplice to the villain. Sort of like her character in the Matrix in fairness.

Lea Seydoux I can see running around the place with Bond. Sure she's younger, but this is Bond right?

It just doesn't fit or feel right to have Bond get married in this era, the way Craig has played him, and the way Skyfall has gone. He's very much a lone wolf, out on his own. He's not just gonna meet someone and get married.

Where they could've done that was actually in Skyfall itself - he's assumed dead, goes into hiding, lives on the beach for a bit, meets a girl, gets married on the beach, she gets shot, he comes back.

But they wouldn't be able to use a story arc like Bond disappearing again.

I'd say Spectre is going to be a good old fashioned chase around the world. Good characters, good acting, reasonable amount of action, maybe one or two impressive set pieces, "something that's never been done before", a nice song (though hopefully not Sam Smith), sharp suits, Q being smart, M and Tanner characters developing... that's your lot.

Sleepy

I'd really like to see Craig get to do the revenge film, he has Dalton's ability to portray the cold rage of a Bond that's been wronged... Add to that, his "Whatever is left of me - whatever is left of me - whatever I am - I'm yours" speech to Vesper in Casino Royale was excellent so I think he could quite credibly do Bond falling in love again in order to build up to the loose canon, rogue agent on the rampage. I'd agree that for this Bond to fall in love again, it'll take some seriously good writing (and possibly another few months passing by off screen during the credit sequence as we saw in Skyfall....)

OHMSS is one of my favourite Bond movies and I'd agree with BuilderPlumber that Lazenby has been unfairly remembered. I believe his replacement was more due to contract re-negotiations than critical reception. He was a nobody when he was hired and started demanding star money after OHMSS which pissed off the Brocollis. His wife being killed by SPECTRE has always been a fairly defining aspect of Bond's character (though, perhaps Vesper has already filled that role in this incarnation of Bond?). I remember it being beautifully alluded to during Travelyan's taunting of him in Goldeneye: "I might as well ask you if all those vodka martinis ever silence the screams of all the men you've killed... or if you find forgiveness in the arms of all those willing women for all the dead ones you failed to protect."

The Wild Bunch

Skyfall is incredible

Buzzing for this

Wedwood

This looks very promising. If they cant/wont set Bond back in the '60s, then the next best thing is to bring what was best in Connery's movies into the present, SPECTRE being chief among them. Bringing Blofeld back to the Bond movies is like bringing Moriarty back to Sherlock Holmes.

You never know, the next movie might be about a guy who craves precious metals !!!!

eviltimeban

Wedwood wrote: »

Bringing Blofeld back to the Bond movies is like bringing Moriarty back to Sherlock Holmes.

Yes but with a modern twist. Who knew that Moriarty could be so psychotic, the way Andrew Scott played him?

Christoph Waltz, if he is the main villain, could potentially be the best Bond villain ever, based on his previous form. He was outstanding as Hans Landa and 100% mad Inglorious Basterds the movie it was. If he can take that approach and apply it to Spectre, well... I for one will be very excited to see that.

BuilderPlumber

The old SPECTRE of the books was comprised of a bizarre mix of hardline communist agents considered an embarrassment to the USSR, ex Nazis and varied Mafia. The new SPECTRE would have to be somewhat updated but in today's PC orientated world, their composition would not be mentioned. Afterall, the early films never ever mentioned a nationality for SPECTRE. It clearly was an enemy of the UK, Europe, Japan, USSR, and the USA. Was Goldfinger SPECTRE? It was not specifically mentioned but I would feel he was aligned to them and if so, North Korea were allies as he had NK hencemen. Today's SPECTRE we would guess would be comprised of the following:

-an assortment of right and leftwing fanatics from all over Europe from the UK to Russia.
-hardliners working against moderate elements in Iraq, Syria, Iran, Afghanistan, Pakistan and other such countries.
-terrorists from al Qaeda, ISIS and others.
-the hard/racist right in the US.
-ex rogue KGB.
-varied Mafias.
-Corrupt big businessmen.

Perhaps the latter 2 would be emphasised? Perhaps, an allusion to North Korea may not change either. Some things don't!

And who will Blofeld be? In the books, he was a Polish born opportunist (with German blood I assume with this sort of name?) who used all he had to become rich from the Nazis and enemies of the Nazis alike. And then he sets up SPECTRE as an aspiring superpower that wants the 'West' and 'East' to collide with him gaining world domination. The post-Fleming books then dealt with Blofeld's daugher taking to the helm and then later still a terminally ill Iranian called Tamil Rahani (most likely inspired by the Western media's perception of Ayatollah Khomeini) becoming its leader with a deputy called Jay Autem Holy which again seems a play on religious nationalism (these were by John Gardner in the late 1980s). None of these characters ever appeared in a film and these books were fairly obscure so no danger the Revolutionary Guards heard of them unlike Salman Rushdie!!

Today's Blofeld would have also to have emerged out of some war. Because of Salman Rushdie, I think the focus on 'Islamic nationalist' baddies is not a runner (the Revolutionary Guards put Rushdie into hiding and they were much more moderate than what came next: al Qaeda, ISIS!). But the former Yugoslavia opens up options where someone from Eastern Europe with a Germanic name could have gotten rich and now wants revenge after he loses his capital after the fall of Milosevic. Here, Blofeld is seen as nonaligned and Milosevic as one of the MANY sides he has taken to get rich. It could be implied he is neither for 'East' or 'West', for any country or against any country, for religion or not for religion, but a guy who uses all of these and sets all of these off against each other on behalf of himself and his dream to be the next non-nation orientated superpower.

eviltimeban

Well let's think about where its being shot - London, Rome, Mexico, Tangier, Morocco, and Austria. Of course, any of these locations could be doubling for anywhere else, but its a pretty broad range. However there looks like there'll be some "desert" scenes perhaps, as well as the snowy ones. So he could be chasing Spectre in any and all countries.

Let's not forget this is a reboot - Spectre could be anything now. It may have nothing to do with the original concept at all.

Fuzzy_Dunlop

It annoys me how in Skyfall they just dispensed with all the quantum stuff from the two previous movies (and also jumped from it being his first missions as a 00 to suddenly being washed up and too old).

Hopefully they bring quantum back and incorporate it into SPECTRE in some fashion.

SouthTippBass

Noooo mr bund I vill zit in ze bock. I ham an agent of spoctre.

My first thought when I saw the new title

Sofiztikated

Fuzzy_Dunlop wrote: »

It annoys me how in Skyfall they just dispensed with all the quantum stuff from the two previous movies (and also jumped from it being his first missions as a 00 to suddenly being washed up and too old).

Hopefully they bring quantum back and incorporate it into SPECTRE in some fashion.

It was more that he was M's choice as a 00, and completely the wrong one from the get go.

OldeCinemaSoz

Asides apart, FRWL is probably the BEST BOND. For a film from the early '60s
it's pretty DARN GOOD, IMO.

Goldstein

Early version of the Spectre script has been leaked as part of the Sony hack. No putting that genie back in the bottle. Wonder will they tear it up and start again?

FunLover18

Goldstein wrote: »

Early version of the Spectre script has been leaked as part of the Sony hack. No putting that genie back in the bottle. Wonder will they tear it up and start again?

How early? It has definitely been rewritten/touched up.

Goldstein

Correction: script confirmed by Sony to have been stolen but it hasn't been leaked yet. Surely just a matter of time before it surfaces though.

BuilderPlumber

OldeCinemaSoz wrote: »

Asides apart, FRWL is probably the BEST BOND. For a film from the early '60s
it's pretty DARN GOOD, IMO.

That is true. FRWL is timeless and sums up all that is best about Bond. Full of action and suspence, both Connery and Robert Shaw are at their best here.

Every Bond film since has at least based some elements on this. Definitely one of if not the best of the series, it also is one of the most definitive.

George White

BuilderPlumber wrote: »

An earlier poster noted that in reality, Bond would be fighting ISIS, al Qaeda and other 'Islamic' extremists. The films have never really focused on this theme and have rarely been set in the Middle East. Some hinted: here's a history of Bond's association with the Middle East:

The Man with the golden gun: Lebanon features briefly but no mention of its politics..

Golden Gun was supposed to be set in Iran, originally. The book is set in the Caribbean, but Live and Let Die was the previous film and that had the same setting, so they differentiated by trying to find a different locale. Apparently, they'd seen a Lamorisse short about a fox in a lost city in Iran, ancient lost city. And they flew to the Lost City of Bam, and they discovered it was the wrong city. And Tom Mankiewicz, the scriptwriter asked producer Cubby Broccoli, "why don't we ring Lamorisse?" "He's dead". Cubby replies. "He died in a plane crash in Iran." True. So they filmed in Hong Kong instead, after the kung fu boom.
The scenes in Beirut are clearly the Pinewood lot.

OldeCinemaSoz

Sitting in last sunday afternoon and I popped on the man with the golden gun
on the real utv for a bit of a nosey and discovered rog banging a thugs head against the wall
a few times clipped the the belly dancer's fight scene.

to paraphrase sherrif jw peppa; "what the hell's goin' on???"

BuilderPlumber

George White wrote: »

Golden Gun was supposed to be set in Iran, originally. The book is set in the Caribbean, but Live and Let Die was the previous film and that had the same setting, so they differentiated by trying to find a different locale. Apparently, they'd seen a Lamorisse short about a fox in a lost city in Iran, ancient lost city. And they flew to the Lost City of Bam, and they discovered it was the wrong city. And Tom Mankiewicz, the scriptwriter asked producer Cubby Broccoli, "why don't we ring Lamorisse?" "He's dead". Cubby replies. "He died in a plane crash in Iran." True. So they filmed in Hong Kong instead, after the kung fu boom.
The scenes in Beirut are clearly the Pinewood lot.

I have to watch the film again. I remember it all but do not remember why Bond had to go to Beirut. Only he did and got into a fight.

A lot of the original books had a Caribbean setting and Jamaica in particular. Fleming lived there of course. It features a lot of times in the films too actually: Dr No, Thunderball, Live and let die, Octopussy (?if the start is Cuba which it seems to be), Licence to Kill, Goldeneye, and Quantum of Solace are all set in a Caribbean location.

If The Man With the Golden Gun was set in Iran, it would have been interesting. 1974 was before the Revolutionary Guards took over and the Shah was comfortable. Who would be the bad guys in it? Would it be some kind of dissident Soviet hitman theme with a lair on a Caspian sea island of disputed status?

Like many Bond films of its day, this film was no shy about incorporating elements of other popular films of the time. Clearly, there is a homage to Bruce Lee with the Kung Fu/Karate type fight and there's also Smokey and the Bandit terrority in the car chase near the end. Evel Knievel type stunt featured too. 2 films later, Moonraker did the same for the space adveture genre. And Octopussy felt very like Indiana Jones at times.

George White

Actually, Smokey came out 3 years later but there had already been a whole genre of B-rate exploitation deep fried good old boy car chase movies.

In Golden Gun, Bond goes to Beirut because he has to find the bellydancer girlfriend of the British agent who was killed by Scaramanga, who keeps his golden bullet that killed him as a lucky charm. Bond has to get the charm/bullet back to the UK so Q can identify its maker. The fighters are club bouncers.

eviltimeban

Behind the scenes video from set of Spectre:

http://www.independent.ie/entertainment/movies/movie-news/watch-first-behindthescenes-clip-and-image-of-daniel-craig-as-bond-in-new-movie-spectre-30985929.html

VG31

Teaser trailer out at 23:45 tonight at http://www.007.com/ !

VG31

Teaser trailer:

https://youtube.com/watch?v=GvQJbF2CXLQ

FunLover18

I groaned when Skyfall was mentioned. I thought this message from his past was going to be from his professional past not his childhood. Just have M send him on another mission, why there have to be personal stakes.

That teaser did nothing for me.

Adamantium

You're a cuunt dancing in a hurricane Mr Bond.

ricero

Can't wait. A great teaser

eviltimeban

Ooh! I liked it! I prefer mystery and intrigue rather than explosions and shoot outs. Although I'm sure they will feature too, but probably will be a nice balance.

Good teaser. Though watch the French dubbed version that lines up after the video plays - that's even better.

Sad Professor

Is this the teaser or the teaser for the teaser like M:I5?

OU812

I'm confused. What's his secret?

Very dark looking movie. Looking forward to it.

FortuneChip

I want Christophe Waltz to talk at my wedding, funeral, hell I'd let him narrate my breakfast....

OU812

I've just figured out what the "secret" is & I really hope they're not going down that road.

FloatingVoter

FortuneChip wrote: »

I want Christophe Waltz to talk at my wedding, funeral, hell I'd let him narrate my breakfast....

"No, Mr Egg, I expect you to crack."

Sad Professor

Bond battles personal demons and nods to past films. Looks like a sequel to Skyfall.

FunLover18

OU812 wrote: »

I'm confused. What's his secret?

Very dark looking movie. Looking forward to it.

OU812 wrote: »

I've just figured out what the "secret" is & I really hope they're not going down that road.

I looks to me, from the charred and very badly photoshopped photo we see him looking at, that

Bond may have a brother

I also note that the pattern of cracks in the glass from the bullet hole match up with the pattern on the ring we see Bond hand Mr White.

ricero

FunLover18 wrote: »

I looks to me, from the charred and very badly photoshopped photo we see him looking at, that

Bond may have a brother

I also note that the pattern of cracks in the glass from the bullet hole match up with the pattern on the ring we see Bond hand Mr White.

Dunno about the brother but I was more thinking his parents were murdered by spectre or had some sort of involvement with them.

FunLover18

ricero wrote: »

Dunno about the brother but I was more thinking his parents were murdered by spectre or had some sort of involvement with them.

Yeh I was thinking that. Could there be something fact they've photoshopped a face onto his dad, they haven't just used a stand-in. We might be getting flashbacks or am I reading too much into things.

I'm definitely more intrigued than I was last night but the personal stuff still irks me.

saintsaltynuts

**** for a split second I thought that was O' Connell St. Bridge at the start of the teaser.

FunLover18

Someone on reddit has drawn attention to the document Bond is looking at, the Order of Temporary Guardianship. I'll spoiler it just in case anybody is that sensitive about knowing too much but it is in the trailer after all.

Legal Guardian: Charmain Bond
Temporary Guardian: H Oberhauser

Iranoutofideas

Major spoilers ahead that discuss the ending of the movie according to the leaked script.

Ok having read the leak script this is my interpretation of the trailer.

Moneypenney tells Bond about a secret from his past

We see Bond holding a certificate and a photo

The cert. is a Foster paper and Bonds name is on it along with a H. Oberhauser

From the books Hans Oberhauser was a ski instructor who was a mentor of sorts to a young Bond

The photo Bond is holding shows him as a boy with presumably his Foster father Hans Oberhauser and another boy (Oberhausers son) whose face is missing due to the photo being burnt.

So Bond basically has a Foster brother whose last name is Oberhauser.

Then at the end of the trailer we have a Spectre meeting. Waltz welcomes Bond and by the sounds of it he knows him a long time. Waltz is the head of Spectre. We all know the head of Spectre is Blofeld. So Waltz is Blofeld.

However Waltz is listed as playing Franz Oberhauser. Franz Oberhauser is Hans Oberhausers son. Bond is his foster brother.

So basically Bond is Blofelds foster brother.


Which is ridiculous. Again the trailer uses the well known trope of having Blofelds face obscured both in the photo of him as a boy, and at the end where Waltz is sitting in the shadows. This makes the connection so explicit that it is sort of self defeating.

Why establish a secret concerning Bonds past and then simultaneously give it away in the trailer. That's daft and extremely poor storytelling. So I think it may be a deliberate misdirection. Deception and double-identities is also a feature of Blofeld.

However another thing that bothers me is that according to the script Bond kills Waltz. This led to a flurry of emails from execs who explicitly questioned the wisdom of Bond killing Blofeld (Waltz) in this movie. Why would they spend years trying to get the rights to the character only to kill him off straight away. It makes no sense. Blofeld always gets away.

So there is certainly more to this than meets the eye. Otherwise, Mendes will be responsible for bringing back Blofeld, making Bond his foster brother and then killing him off all in the one movie.

Surely they'd never do that. There'd be outrage. So there must be a twist somewhere, right?

BuilderPlumber

Interesting. Very much looks like a sequel to both Skyfall and Quantum of Solace.

I'd guess that perhaps the secret could be that Bond has a brother who was brought up by (neo Nazi) criminals and who now has become the head of SPECTRE (aka Quantum). His family are called Blofeld and he know goes by this name. Perhaps 'Mr White' knows of this. I have the feeling too that SPECTRE/Quantum run deep into the secret service and that Bond's brother/Blofeld could be a double agent. That's just one possibility and to be honest would be too far fetched.

Farty88

Could Andrew Scott play a important role here as to regards to previous post????without giving too much away people who have read the spoilers could elaborate more on this.my take on the trailer I thought it was brilliant and also a great misdirection to what could happen.remember it's a world full of lies and misdirection in bond world so i guess we'll know more in time.also a slight touch of N.W.O to it ha :P