Amber [RTE] [** Spoilers **]

Mardy Bum

Balaclava1991 wrote: »

I don't know but the ground did not open up and swallow Jo Jo Dollard.
Unless I am mistaken when she went missing she was in a rural phone box and the last thing she said on the phone to her family was that she was waiting for a bus or a lift of something. Just then she said she saw a car pull up and she was going to get a lift and she hung up. The Gardaí tried to trace every single motorist who traveled that road that night and turned up nothing while there were extensive searches of farmland up and down the length of that stretch of road. They checked high and low aboard too in case she left the country.
The only way should could have left on her own and covered her tracks is if she create new identity - fake passport, a bank account under an assumed name etc etc.
I think an opportunist pulled up gave her a lift turned down a back road, overpowered her, raped and murdered her to silence her and then had some farm or remote area ready where he could dig a hole and bury her or else a motorist knocked her down accidentally, put the body in their boot and buried it.
If anyone else knows they are keeping it quiet to protect themselves or out of loyalty to the culprit with whom they are in relationship with or closely related to.

So all you can do is hypothesize about the possible outcomes of Jo Jo?
The gardai don't know and neither do the family and all they can do is hypothesize.
This is the scenario that was dramatised. You watched a drama about the fallout of this hypothesizing.

Hippo

I abandoned it after the phone was thrown down the drain. An entire episode that went nowhere, and indicative of lazy writing.

freshpopcorn

Calliope Chubby Larvae wrote: »

I know but she was only going back one stop, could have held onto her ticket and explained what had happened in the very unlikely case that an Inspector would have come along. It made more sense than wandering off around a strange area with no idea of where she was going.

How do you know she didn't know her way home?
Also if she did run into the ticket inspectors they might have still given her a fine and then she would have to tell her parents.

c68zapdsm5i1ru

Mardy Bum wrote: »

So all you can do is hypothesize about the possible outcomes of Jo Jo?
The gardai don't know and neither do the family and all they can do is hypothesize.
This is the scenario that was dramatised. You watched a drama about the fallout of this hypothesizing.

No, we didn't. We watched a drama that allowed us to see some of Amber's movements on 'Day 1' that none of the other characters knew about. Therefore it was not simply about the fallout, but was allowing us information that set us apart from the other characters but then left us in the same situation as them in the end. This drama was neither one thing nor the other, and that is its real flaw.

Balaclava1991

Mardy Bum wrote: »

So all you can do is hypothesize about the possible outcomes of Jo Jo?
The gardai don't know and neither do the family and all they can do is hypothesize.
This is the scenario that was dramatised. You watched a drama about the fallout of this hypothesizing.

You can hypothesize but logic and reason point to only a few possibilities.
She and other missing persons do not disappear in a puff of smoke.
So at the end of the show Amber is walking down a lane and what?
Does the lane go into the bowels of hell or go into heaven or what?
4 hours of pointlessness.

Ash.J.Williams

Balaclava1991 wrote: »

I don't know but the ground did not open up and swallow Jo Jo Dollard.
Unless I am mistaken when she went missing she was in a rural phone box and the last thing she said on the phone to her family was that she was waiting for a bus or a lift of something. Just then she said she saw a car pull up and she was going to get a lift and she hung up. The Gardaí tried to trace every single motorist who traveled that road that night and turned up nothing while there were extensive searches of farmland up and down the length of that stretch of road. They checked high and low aboard too in case she left the country.
The only way should could have left on her own and covered her tracks is if she create new identity - fake passport, a bank account under an assumed name etc etc.
I think an opportunist pulled up gave her a lift turned down a back road, overpowered her, raped and murdered her to silence her and then had some farm or remote area ready where he could dig a hole and bury her or else a motorist knocked her down accidentally, put the body in their boot and buried it.
If anyone else knows they are keeping it quiet to protect themselves or out of loyalty to the culprit with whom they are in relationship with or closely related to.

really?

c68zapdsm5i1ru

freshpopcorn wrote: »

How do you know she didn't know her way home?
Also if she did run into the ticket inspectors they might have still given her a fine and then she would have to tell her parents.

She looked around her when she got out and clearly didn't know where she was. I think she was more likely to draw her parents' attention to the fact that she wasn't where she was meant to be by arriving home hours late because she was wandering around lost, than by risking hopping onto the luas for one stop with a clear explanation in the tiny chance that she would be apprehended by an inspector in the short time it took to get to the next stop.

humanji

Of all the problems the show had, I wouldn't have thought the ending would be an issue. It's practically signposted from the beginning that there'd be no closure. The creators seemed to put more effort into trying to make a show they can sell to other countries, than actually developing the story. To me it all just seems like yet another wasted opportunity for a how.

freshpopcorn

Calliope Chubby Larvae wrote: »

She looked around her when she got out and clearly didn't know where she was. I think she was more likely to draw her parents' attention to the fact that she wasn't where she was meant to be by arriving home hours late because she was wandering around lost, than by risking hopping onto the luas for one stop with a clear explanation in the tiny chance that she would be apprehended by an inspector in the short time it took to get to the next stop.

If missing one stop would throw her off that much I'd be slightly worried about her to be honest.
Also if you do miss your stop off a bus/Lucas and get off at the next stop chances are it isn't a huge walk and when you do get off you look around to get used to your surroundings and you think of the possible ways you could get home if you have more than one option.

c68zapdsm5i1ru

cletus van damme wrote: »

i think people want it all wrapped up in a nice conclusion for them.
real life isn't like that and it was a accurate portrayal

I guess some people don't get that , go watch friends re-runs then

Sorry to burst your bubble but that's not the case. We are talking about the way in which this drama lead to it's final scene, and the mis-match between the overall format of the programme and it's ending. ~The format was pretty ordinary, with stock stereotypical characters and then an attempt was made at a subtle, elliptical ending that just didn't sit correctly with the previous four hours.

8mv

For all it's flaws, I think it was ultimately a success. Some characters were totally unlikable (the journalist, the business partner, the D.I.) while other were interesting and symphatetic (Terrence, Charlie, the guard (Karen?)) and over the four episodes I warmed to the parents and Amber. I expected the lack of conclusion and thought it was handled well, especially the last few minutes with the creepy guy on the Luas and the obligatory white van. I think the writers, producers and director delivered what they intended rather than what people expected.

c68zapdsm5i1ru

freshpopcorn wrote: »

If missing one stop would throw her off that much I'd be slightly worried about her to be honest.
Also if you do miss your stop off a bus/Lucas and get off at the next stop chances are it isn't a huge walk and when you do get off you look around to get used to your surroundings and you think of the possible ways you could get home if you have more than one option.

She's fourteen. Most fourteen year olds know the area around where they live and where their school is, and how to get into town and home again. A lot of middle class Dublin teenagers live in a kind of bubble and haven't a clue about anywhere beyond a small radius. I know. I used to be one!

Eight Ball

Amazing what a bit of PR can do for a show. I don't believe for a second it was held up for two years before being showed here for "legal reasons" I actually think they where ashamed to put it out there. Terrible waste of the licence fee.

Larbre34

There are enough unresolved disappearances on the News, in the papers, in documentaries, with the lives of the affected families presented in sufficient detail for the viewer to feel sympathy and put themselves in the families' position. That angle is covered.

The point of drama should be to show all the motivations of the characters and to show the parallel scenarios around the whole event, to see what the characters cannot see and do not know. I know real life is full of holes and unsatisfactory outcomes, but for that to be the case in a dramatisation is a fail.

BKWDR

We all thought that lad with the headphones on the Luas looked shady as fcuk....

Shine7

Balaclava1991 wrote: »

Did she fall into quicksand, was she gobbled up by a jelly monster or pulled into a PTO shaft.

Thank you so much for this comment. This is what I now believe happened!

Ash.J.Williams

Shine7 wrote: »

Thank you so much for this comment. This is what I now believe happened!

She was wearing loose clothing and that's the biggest "no no" ever regarding pto shafts!

IrishLad2012

Ash.J.Williams wrote: »

She was wearing loose clothing and that's the biggest "no no" ever regarding pto shafts!

As Miley would say 'They will play Action Man no more'

BabysCoffee

Hippo wrote: »

I abandoned it after the phone was thrown down the drain. An entire episode that went nowhere, and indicative of lazy writing.

I wish I had as much sense as you :-(

I Heart Internet

I complained about it at the start, but all-in-all I think it was pretty decent.

The ending was good. They had us guessing right to the bitter end.

One of the writers was on the radio this morning and was asked, "do you know what happened to Amber?" and he sad "Yes".

So it's up to each of us to decide for ourselves.

I'd say she slipped into a ditch on the walk home. Bag got washed out to the river.

c68zapdsm5i1ru

Given how intensely the man on the Luas was looking at her, would he not have remembered seeing her when her picture was all over the papers and come forward? He wasn't up to anything so presumably had nothing to hide.

nidgeboy

drink! feck! amber!.......

Teabreak

what a load of rubbish Amber was

risteardb

Ash.J.Williams wrote: »

The point was...there is no end.. She's gone

Yes that is true, but we knew all that in the first episode!!!

EricPraline

cletus van damme wrote: »

i think people want it all wrapped up in a nice conclusion for them.
real life isn't like that and it was a accurate portrayal

I guess some people don't get that , go watch friends re-runs then

A lot of the people defending Amber here and on Twitter seem to suggest that people "don't get" the sophisticated and subtle ending, which is rather condescending.

I really enjoyed the first episode and hoped that the series would be well-received. I can also appreciate the ending, and the scene with the father taking futile photos at the beach was poignant. But for me the biggest issue is that the "realistic" ending was completely at odds with the inaccuracies, plot-holes and general soap-like elements that were present in almost everything up until the last 10 minutes. There was very little "accurate portrayal" in episodes 2 & 3, and the "red herrings" were placed as subtlety as a slap in the face.

RTE's marketing of the show and the four-part format didn't do it any favours either. Perhaps a carefully edited two-part version might have worked (largely dumping content from episodes 2-3). But the show tried to be 80% Fair City and 20% adult drama, and unfortunately failed at both.

bored_newbie

I liked the ending. I think it fitted in well with the theme of the last episode.

The paranoia of the dad, the feeling that everyone was a suspect but in truth nobody knew who took her.

The series had its flaws but overall, I liked what they did with it.

c68zapdsm5i1ru

bored_newbie wrote: »

I liked the ending. I think it fitted in well with the theme of the last episode.

The paranoia of the dad, the feeling that everyone was a suspect but in truth nobody knew who took her.

The series had its flaws but overall, I liked what they did with it.

I thought that was good, and I liked the contrast between that and the mother who was beginning to move on with her life and accept that Amber was probably dead.
However, that all only happened in the last half hour or so. The other episodes were completely at odds with this. It was as if the writer didn't have the confidence to sustain this for the full four hours so hooked people in, in the usual formatted way, and then tried to be clever towards the end. It just didn't work.


And I really do find some of the posts on here incredibly patronising. Yes, we 'got' what the writer was aiming for, we just didn't feel he achieved it. Maybe some people are too easily impressed by anything that is a bit different and assume it must be wonderful.

bored_newbie

Calliope Chubby Larvae wrote: »

I thought that was good, and I liked the contrast between that and the mother who was beginning to move on with her life and accept that Amber was probably dead.
However, that all only happened in the last half hour or so. The other episodes were completely at odds with this. It was as if the writer didn't have the confidence to sustain this for the full four hours so hooked people in, in the usual formatted way, and then tried to be clever towards the end. It just didn't work.
And I really do find some of the posts on here incredibly patronising. Yes, we 'got' what the writer was aiming for, we just didn't feel he achieved it. Maybe some people are too easily impressed by anything that is a bit different and assume it must be wonderful.

Fair enough, but its also a bit patronising to say some people are 'too easily impressed by anything that is a bit different'.

People have different tastes and expectations when it comes to tv, we don't all have to agree. I find the outrage at the ending a bit strange to be honest. Would it really have satisfied people if she'd been dragged into the back of that van instead? There were parts of the show I didn't like, the phone down the drain still irks me for example and I didn't like the way they 'closed' a few loopholes but I don't have any problem with the ending. If anything, I think it adds to the show as you're still thinking about it when the show has ended.

c68zapdsm5i1ru

bored_newbie wrote: »

Fair enough, but its also a bit patronising to say some people are 'too easily impressed by anything that is a bit different'.

People have different tastes and expectations when it comes to tv, we don't all have to agree. I find the outrage at the ending a bit strange to be honest. Would it really have satisfied people if she'd been dragged into the back of that van instead? There were parts of the show I didn't like, the phone down the drain still irks me for example and I didn't like the way they 'closed' a few loopholes but I don't have any problem with the ending. If anything, I think it adds to the show as you're still thinking about it when the show has ended.

Sorry, that point wasn't directed at you at all. I found your post perfectly polite and many others from posters who liked the ending.
It was aimed at posts from people saying things like people who didn't like it should go back to watching Friends as they obviously didn't appreciate what the writer was trying to do. I find that patronising and a bit postured.

Mardy Bum

Calliope Chubby Larvae wrote: »

I thought that was good, and I liked the contrast between that and the mother who was beginning to move on with her life and accept that Amber was probably dead.
However, that all only happened in the last half hour or so. The other episodes were completely at odds with this. It was as if the writer didn't have the confidence to sustain this for the full four hours so hooked people in, in the usual formatted way, and then tried to be clever towards the end. It just didn't work.
And I really do find some of the posts on here incredibly patronising. Yes, we 'got' what the writer was aiming for, we just didn't feel he achieved it. Maybe some people are too easily impressed by anything that is a bit different and assume it must be wonderful.

I don't think many people have said it was an excellent production. Most posts have lamented the lack of a conclusion. A few posts have clarified that this was not the point of the show anyway and it was an examination of the effects of the disappearance. This was very evident from the outset but some posters are still criticising Charlie and the prisoner's story line for the wrong reason. It is vitally important to the show. It was about their lives, not Amber's. We see Charlie as a compassionate person who is trying to carve out a place in the world but ends up back where he started. We are given a brief picture of a man who appears to have a very shady past and who is ultimately overcome with grief. We see a journalist who tries anything to get a head in her profession. Amber's friend ends up with Manga Boy. The mother gets over her early grief whereas the father is overcome with his suppressed grief. I found the different story lines interesting. Obviously it is not the best show ever or even close but it was different and for a television programme that in itself should be lauded because 99% of stuff is generic crap.