Buying a house 2013!

makeorbrake

kennyb3 wrote: »

Depends - banks stress +2%, it's whether they'll keep adding this 2% as rates rise (or whether they'll reduce the stress level - they shouldn't but nothing would surprise me anymore)

Ok, well - I guess that's always possible (afterall, we have all seen that play out previously). However, you would hope that there would be a common sense approach. Hope being the operative word as the real tragedy is that the fatal flaws that brought about the demise for us nationally have not been remedied.

makeorbrake

doc_17 wrote: »

Saw a 4 bed house on website for €90,000. House beside it was bought by a friend of mine 6/7 years ago for €250,000.

Think it requires a bit internal redecoration but it wouldn't be excessive. I would have a good bit of that saved but just wondering what the people here think about that price?

There might be a bid of €70,000 in at the minute. Think it's owned by the bank now.

I have no clue - but one thing I would say to you is to completely put out of your mind the price of this (or any other property you look at) house as it was at the height of the tiger. Dwelling on that is not going to help you reach a rational decision on what any property is currently worth.

AlanG

Shedite27 wrote: »

Also, what level is that rent:cost ratio at currently in your opinion?

I only really know the Dublin area but in some newer areas which have suffered major price drops like around Ongar and Tyrrelstown where there are a lot of IT jobs and also a rent floor due to Rental Supplement you have a ratio around 160 time monthly rent or less due to various factors including a lot of supply in the area and PP for more houses.
In more mature areas they are still up around 250. A house that rents for 1200 per month in Raheney, Navan Road, Castleknock, Portmarnock or other middle class areas will still be around 300k or so.
In some more affluent areas like Donnybrook and Clontarf the ratios are far higher again so renting is by far the best option if you want a taste of these areas.

AlanG

Shedite27 wrote: »

What effect will the ECB rates rising have on the market do you think? Do you expect that to increase the price of mortgages, and thus remove some buyers from the market?

Don’t think of it as removing buyers from the market. As long as house prices cover the cost of building and a reasonable profit there will be supply in a stable market (approx. €100 per square foot). If you increase the cost of finance for the majority of buyers (ie. ECB rates rise, cost of financing to BOI and AIB rises so their Variable rates rise) then it will decrease the premium people can afford to pay for the site and Location.
Less money chasing the same number of houses should lead to lower prices in real terms.
As mentioned previously there are some other factors at play including stress test levels and inflation.

AlanG

makeorbrake wrote: »

I have no clue - but one thing I would say to you is to completely put out of your mind the price of this (or any other property you look at) house as it was at the height of the tiger. Dwelling on that is not going to help you reach a rational decision on what any property is currently worth.

Absolutely – you can get Bank of Ireland shares at less than 1% of their peak boom price. If someone offered you them at a 70% drop on boom prices would you think it was good value.

AlanG

doc_17 wrote: »

Saw a 4 bed house on website for €90,000. House beside it was bought by a friend of mine 6/7 years ago for €250,000.

Think it requires a bit internal redecoration but it wouldn't be excessive. I would have a good bit of that saved but just wondering what the people here think about that price?

There might be a bid of €70,000 in at the minute. Think it's owned by the bank now.

If this is a good house and good location for you then you would be unlikely to be able to build it at this price (assuming it is a reasonable spec and size).
Therefore while other houses may come up at similar or lower prices due to historical oversupply you will not see new ones being built for sale at that price. Go for it if the house is right for you. Be sure to research any management company obligations well beforehand. Some houses are very cheap due to high annual costs.

EAFC_rdfl

Rather than start a new thread I said I would ask in here first. We got our LPT letter yesterday, no problem there. What I am wondering is whether we can avail of the exemption - we are first time buyers. Our situation was that we signed the contracts around 18th December last year, but the solicitor only took care of the registration during January. So which date would revenue work off? Is it when the ownership of the property was registered with land register? We obviously are hoping to avail of the exemption.

If there is somewhere else more relevant to post questions like this I'd appreciate a link.

killers1

EAFC_rdfl wrote: »

Rather than start a new thread I said I would ask in here first. We got our LPT letter yesterday, no problem there. What I am wondering is whether we can avail of the exemption - we are first time buyers. Our situation was that we signed the contracts around 18th December last year, but the solicitor only took care of the registration during January. So which date would revenue work off? Is it when the ownership of the property was registered with land register? We obviously are hoping to avail of the exemption.

If there is somewhere else more relevant to post questions like this I'd appreciate a link.

Did you claim TRS? The important date is not the date you signed contracts nor the date the property was registered. What date did the sale close i.e. when did you get your keys & sign the mortgage deed?

D3PO

EAFC_rdfl wrote: »

Rather than start a new thread I said I would ask in here first. We got our LPT letter yesterday, no problem there. What I am wondering is whether we can avail of the exemption - we are first time buyers. Our situation was that we signed the contracts around 18th December last year, but the solicitor only took care of the registration during January. So which date would revenue work off? Is it when the ownership of the property was registered with land register? We obviously are hoping to avail of the exemption.

If there is somewhere else more relevant to post questions like this I'd appreciate a link.

LPT is due for second half of 2013 therefore you owe LPT for this year. Why do you think you would be exempt ???

killers1

D3PO wrote: »

LPT is due for second half of 2013 therefore you owe LPT for this year. Why do you think you would be exempt ???

First time buyers who complete a purchase during 2013 are exempt until the end of 2016..

D3PO

killers1 wrote: »

First time buyers who complete a purchase during 2013 are exempt until the end of 2016..

wasnt aware of that thanks for the clarification

kennyb3

Right i'm hitting the impatient stage - paid booking deposit 4 weeks ago this Friday - survey done, valuation done, loan offer to hand. Haven't received contracts yet though and my solicitor wrote to the vendors one a week ago requesting same. How long does this usually take? Thought there would be little hold up as the house is on the market a few months (time for them to get organised) and it's an executor sale (no negative equity/bank issues).

Time to ask my solicitor to give theirs a ring and see what the hold up is?

.jacksparrow.

kennyb3 wrote: »

Right i'm hitting the impatient stage - paid booking deposit 4 weeks ago this Friday - survey done, valuation done, loan offer to hand. Haven't received contracts yet though and my solicitor wrote to the vendors one a week ago requesting same. How long does this usually take? Thought there would be little hold up as the house is on the market a few months (time for them to get organised) and it's an executor sale (no negative equity/bank issues).

Time to ask my solicitor to give theirs a ring and see what the hold up is?

Definitely,if you don't ring and push for these things to happen it won't,well that's from my experience.

EAFC_rdfl

killers1 wrote: »

Did you claim TRS? The important date is not the date you signed contracts nor the date the property was registered. What date did the sale close i.e. when did you get your keys & sign the mortgage deed?

Yes we have the TRS in place thankfully. We would have got the keys around the same date as contracts signed, a week before Christmas or so. I guess that rules us out of the exemption category. The TRS was our bigger priority anyway so I was being wishful more than anything in relation to the LPT . Thanks a lot killers1.

D3PO wrote: »

LPT is due for second half of 2013 therefore you owe LPT for this year. Why do you think you would be exempt ???

killers1 has already cleared up the reason for my question, ease up on the tone

killers1

EAFC_rdfl wrote: »

Yes we have the TRS in place thankfully. We would have got the keys around the same date as contracts signed, a week before Christmas or so. I guess that rules us out of the exemption category. The TRS was our bigger priority anyway so I was being wishful more than anything in relation to the LPT . Thanks a lot killers1.


killers1 has already cleared up the reason for my question, ease up on the tone

The TRS is a lot more valuable to you than the property tax exemption. Revenue moved the goalposts in relation to TRS after the budget by saying the funds had to be used for the purchase as opposed to just Intetest accruing on your mortgage in order to qualify. I think this was done to close off a loophole which would enable people claim TRS and get the property tax exemption too. It's one or the other I'm afraid...although you did avail of the more beneficial option.

killers1

kennyb3 wrote: »

Right i'm hitting the impatient stage - paid booking deposit 4 weeks ago this Friday - survey done, valuation done, loan offer to hand. Haven't received contracts yet though and my solicitor wrote to the vendors one a week ago requesting same. How long does this usually take? Thought there would be little hold up as the house is on the market a few months (time for them to get organised) and it's an executor sale (no negative equity/bank issues).

Time to ask my solicitor to give theirs a ring and see what the hold up is?

4 weeks would be a typical enough timeframe for contracts although there are a million reason why this can be delayed. The majority of sellers do nothing in relation to the legal side of the process until they accept an offer and very few have authorised their solicitor to take up the title deeds before that. Get your solicitor to put a call in to find out the reason for the delay and when they can expect to receive the contracts.

kennyb3

killers1 wrote: »

4 weeks would be a typical enough timeframe for contracts although there are a million reason why this can be delayed. The majority of sellers do nothing in relation to the legal side of the process until they accept an offer and very few have authorised their solicitor to take up the title deeds before that. Get your solicitor to put a call in to find out the reason for the delay and when they can expect to receive the contracts.

Thanks Killers, just got an e-mail back from my own solicitor to say they'd contacted the vendors one. Seems the vendors solicitor only got the title deeds now and they'd draw up contracts swiftly. So we should have them late next week. Glad i made the enquiry as puts my mind at rest over Easter that there is progression (patience is not a strong point)

killers1

kennyb3 wrote: »

Thanks Killers, just got an e-mail back from my own solicitor to say they'd contacted the vendors one. Seems the vendors solicitor only got the title deeds now and they'd draw up contracts swiftly. So we should have them late next week. Glad i made the enquiry as puts my mind at rest over Easter that there is progression (patience is not a strong point)

Yeah sounds as though they only went looking for the deeds when the offer was accepted - normal enough...

Never be afraid to hound your solicitor for answers or to make enquiries on your behalf. You're paying them to carry out your instructions..

jython98

I think EAs will love this news title http://www.independent.ie/business/personal-finance/property-mortgages/property-prices-in-capital-rise-by-3pc-but-rural-values-plummet-29156774.html

but then disappointed when they read on ...

looks like the typist or Mr O'Leary was in a hurry too

"The rush to buy before Christmas, to avail of mortgage tax relief, was also likely to distort he market, Mr O'Leary added."

wandatowell

I bought in late 2011 while my neighbours 2 doors down bought only last December.

They paid 13,000 more than I did but yet we haven't hit the bottom of the market yet.

I think the way the market is now its very much based on what the buyers are willing to buy at rather than the properties actual value.

Very interesting times imo

darklighter

Solicitor just rang me to tell me he has contracts for the house. I've been lazy on my side getting things sorted so hoping someone can answer a few questions for me:

1. What is the going rate to get the valuation survey done? Is it worth shopping round EA's on the panel (mortgage is with AIB)?
2. Is it the amount from the valuation survey that is used for House Insurance?
3. AIB say they need details of House Insuance/Life Assurance tp issue the loan pack to the solicitor. Do I pay for these now even though I wont actually sign the contract until at least Tue week due to Solicitors holidays?
4. The Mortgage term is over 34 years but ill be in a position to pay off more than the monthly repayment each month from Day 1. Said this to the mortgage advisor & she said not to do this and save up a lump sum & then pay off that amount. Does that make sense? Also, if the repayments are being Direct Debited, how does one go about paying off the amount over the repayment?

Thanks in advance for you answers Boardsies!

gaius c

quad_red wrote: »

Went to see a house for a repeat viewing today.

Made a bid during the week. EA came back the following day saying there were three other bidders and we'd been outbid by 2k.

Looked at the house again today. I don't think the EA realized who we were. He said bidding was currently at the price we had bid previously. No mention of the supposed new price.

Now - there were too many people around to chase this down and he rushed off.

Is that a simple mistake on his part I wonder? Or are we competing with phantom bidders here. Or else the other bidder pulled out I suppose.

I wonder.

Went to see another house that is being sold for 45k more than it was sold for in mid 2011. House has had some work done on it alright. Would it count as an (attempted) flip?

Obvious phamtom bidders. They are playing on peoples' fear of "missing the bottom" but what I don't get is why bother risking the sale for an extra couple of K, which makes very little difference to their commission.

killers1

darklighter wrote: »

Solicitor just rang me to tell me he has contracts for the house. I've been lazy on my side getting things sorted so hoping someone can answer a few questions for me:

1. What is the going rate to get the valuation survey done? Is it worth shopping round EA's on the panel (mortgage is with AIB)?
2. Is it the amount from the valuation survey that is used for House Insurance?
3. AIB say they need details of House Insuance/Life Assurance tp issue the loan pack to the solicitor. Do I pay for these now even though I wont actually sign the contract until at least Tue week due to Solicitors holidays?
4. The Mortgage term is over 34 years but ill be in a position to pay off more than the monthly repayment each month from Day 1. Said this to the mortgage advisor & she said not to do this and save up a lump sum & then pay off that amount. Does that make sense? Also, if the repayments are being Direct Debited, how does one go about paying off the amount over the repayment?

Thanks in advance for you answers Boardsies!

1. A bank valuation costs €130. I wouldn't use the EA who sold you the house. Get someone else from the Panel to do it. You should also get a structural survey done for your own peace of mind.
2. The Valuer decides the reinstatement sum for the home insurance - it will be Section 12 on the Val report
3. AIB only need life cover/home ins prior to cheque issue and it is NOT required to enable them issue a loan offer to your solicitor
4 No, your AIB advisor is incorrect. It's more cost effective for you to increase the monthly repayment from day 1 as opposed to saving and paying a lump sum off. Interest is calculated on a daily basis on the amount o/s so if you are making overpayments each month the balance reduces quicker and the interest being charged is lower becuause it's being calculated on a lower o/s balance.

kennyb3

darklighter wrote: »

Solicitor just rang me to tell me he has contracts for the house. I've been lazy on my side getting things sorted so hoping someone can answer a few questions for me:

1. What is the going rate to get the valuation survey done? Is it worth shopping round EA's on the panel (mortgage is with AIB)? I got 100+vat = 123 from Dalton Bradshaw Kelly in Drumcondra - vincent Kelly there was quick and efficient
2. Is it the amount from the valuation survey that is used for House Insurance? It's the re-instatement value on the survey
3. AIB say they need details of House Insuance/Life Assurance tp issue the loan pack to the solicitor. Do I pay for these now even though I wont actually sign the contract until at least Tue week due to Solicitors holidays? I didn't need these to get my loan offer (AIB also) but you need them before drawdown/closing (usually a month after exchange of contracts)
4. The Mortgage term is over 34 years but ill be in a position to pay off more than the monthly repayment each month from Day 1. Said this to the mortgage advisor & she said not to do this and save up a lump sum & then pay off that amount. Does that make sense? Also, if the repayments are being Direct Debited, how does one go about paying off the amount over the repayment?

Thanks in advance for you answers Boardsies!

Some answers in red

darklighter

Thanks Killers & KennyB. Appreciate the quick & concise responses.

Just on the overpayments, how does that work re. the Direct Debit mandate? Do I tell the bank each month how much extra I want to pay off & then do a bank transfer?

killers1

darklighter wrote: »

Thanks Killers & KennyB. Appreciate the quick & concise responses.

Just on the overpayments, how does that work re. the Direct Debit mandate? Do I tell the bank each month how much extra I want to pay off & then do a bank transfer?

You pick an amount and stick to it, for example repayment is €1k per month, you tell the bank to increase DD amount to €1200pm and repayments stay at that level until you tell them otherwise.

StillWaters

wandatowell wrote: »

I think the way the market is now its very much based on what the buyers are willing to buy at rather than the properties actual value.

Very interesting times imo

That has always been a houses actual value - what a buyer is prepared to pay.

tvc15

killers1 wrote: »

If you are both in permanent employment, paying rent & creche fees via your bank a/c's at the level stated for at least the past 6 months, your application has been incorrectly presented to the Underwriters by your advisor. I am confident you should still be eligible for approval at the €240k+ level.

Well our updated offer is a loan of €150k so almost exactly twice our salary. We have a joint account which we both get paid into (last 6 years) and pay our creche (last 3 months) and rent (last 6 years) from. I couldn't get any good info from the bank but I am assuming my wifes maternity leave (not on full pay and 4 months of unpaid leave) may have changed their assessment of our earnings.

Looks like we might need a mortgage broker, I don't suppose you could recommend one killers?

kennyb3

tvc15 wrote: »

Well our updated offer is a loan of €150k so almost exactly twice our salary. We have a joint account which we both get paid into (last 6 years) and pay our creche (last 3 months) and rent (last 6 years) from. I couldn't get any good info from the bank but I am assuming my wifes maternity leave (not on full pay and 4 months of unpaid leave) may have changed their assessment of our earnings.

Looks like we might need a mortgage broker, I don't suppose you could recommend one killers?

Go with Killers himself, PM him - highly recommended round here (do a search). Very nice guy and very prompt.

wandatowell

StillWaters wrote: »

That has always been a houses actual value - what a buyer is prepared to pay.

True to a point but when we had people desperate to get onto the property market they paid massively over the odds.

Id think alot of the prices people ended up paying were artificial tbh