Clattenburg cleared by FA

Sgt Pepper 64

Telegraph reporting that Chelsea's Bruce Buck will meet with the ref's but no direct apology because (as I suspected) Ramires still maintains he said Monkey

Clattenburg was cleared by the Football Association on Thursday, after an independent QC ruled the allegations that he called Jon Obi Mikel “monkey” were unfounded.

The Gosforth official will return to work on Saturday as the fourth official for Tottenham’s home game against West Ham, and will take charge of the Southampton v Norwich game on Wednesday night.

Riley, the chief executive of the Professional Game Match Officials Limited, is understood to have no concerns about Clattenburg officiating so soon after being cleared. He has been training as normal during the past four weeks and, despite acknowledging his mental stress, he is ready to return.

The FA’s decision prompted the referees’ union to call for a full apology and compensation for the slur on Clattenburg’s character.

Chelsea are unlikely to make a direct apology for their actions, primarily because to do so would be to undermine Ramires, who still maintains that he heard the referee say “shut up, monkey” to team-mate Jon Obi Mikel.

Mikel has been charged with using threatening words and behaviour after the game against Manchester United, and while he has admitted the charge he has requested a personal hearing to try to mitigate the sanction. Chelsea are conscious that any apology might undermine his case. It could also prejudice their defence of any legal action brought by Clattenburg of his union.

In an attempt to try to repair some of the damage the club will seek talks with Riley with the club acknowledging that Clattenburg has suffered as a result of a career-threatening allegation, and that the scrutiny has been stressful.

The club would also not raise any objection to Clattenburg refereeing a Chelsea match, something Riley said was not out of the question, though it may not happen in the near future.

A private expression of regret from Chelsea will fall short of the demands of his union however.

Alan Leighton, general secretary of the referees’ union Prospect, said he would pursue an apology and compensation from Chelsea until it was clear that there was no point.

Leighton said Clattenburg was fearful that the allegation would damage his chances of officiating at the World Cup in Brazil.

“Mark is very keen to be England’s representative at the World Cup in Brazil, and with the allegation coming from Ramires, who is a Brazilian international, he does not know how Fifa will react to this. With the globalisation of reporting millions of people have seen these allegations.

“I don’t know if we get an apology from Chelsea. I hope we will. It would be the classy thing to do, it would be the right thing to do more importantly.

“There needs to be a recognition that Mark’s reputation has been tarnished, been dragged through the mud, his integrity has been impugned and it’s unfortunate that the Chelsea statement makes not a scintilla of recognition of the damage that has been done to Mark.

“Chelsea didn’t need to do what they did in the way that they did it. They could have kept the reporting of the incident confidential and they didn’t need to pursue it once they’d realised that the only evidence they had was the statement of Ramires when there was contradictory evidence.”

Professional Footballers’ Association chairman Clarke Carlisle welcomed the conclusion of the process and said Chelsea were right to pursue a complaint made in good faith, but, like Leighton, regretted that it did not take place in private.

“All in all, the process has shown that no one should be afraid to report allegations of abuse,” he said. “They will be taken seriously and investigated thoroughly. Equally, someone wrongly accused can have faith that the process is thorough enough, and not afraid, to vindicate them of any wrong doing.

“Where this process fell down was at two points. Firstly, the allegation was put to the press by Chelsea FC before any formal process had been concluded. This meant that a huge media frenzy whipped up around Mark Clattenburg and his family. He has stated how this was the most stressful period of his life.”

Peter Herbert, of the Society of Black Lawyers, said lessons had been learnt from the case, and the recording in future of officials’ communication was positive. But, he said: “The FA must adopt a proper set of procedures for hate crime, and the McPherson definition of those, so that in future procedures can be dealt with consistently.”

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/sport/football/teams/chelsea/9699766/Chelseas-chairman-Bruce-Buck-may-meet-referees-chief-Mike-Riley-to-smooth-fallout-from-Mark-Clattenburg-row.html

geeky

jonnyfingers wrote: »

Your points are valid. However it's the way they acted on the allegation that is the problem.

If they did investigate "to great lengths" as you said they would have found that a single player, Ramires, heard something he took to be racial abuse. Players that were close to the ref, including Mikel (who the remark was apparently aimed at) and Cole, did not hear a thing, immediately casting doubt on Ramires's claim. Backing that up is that Ramires can't remember when exactly he heard the alleged comment. If I was investigating this I would conclude that Ramires is genuine in what he believes he heard but most likely misheard something, based on the evidence. Because of that I wouldn't discount his claim as he feels it's valid, but I would deliberate very carefully about making an official complaint. I'm sure the Chelsea investigation found similar.

Absolutely, and when you read the timeline of events released by the FA, it's clear that they took time to confirm they wanted to proceed officially after raising the issue with the match delegate.

At this point, I would expect that they feared it might have been a misunderstanding, having spoken to 11 (?) people who couldn't corroborate what Ramires' story was. But, on balance, it was right that they should pass on the complaint on behalf of their employee, and the evidence they had gathered.

jonnyfingers wrote: »

This is where some common sense should come in. In today's modern age of instant information Chelsea should have known that any claim made against Clattenburg would come out in the press. Based on the evidence they had to them they should have carefully considered going ahead with that claim, knowing the consequences of it on Clattenburg, and Chelsea's, reputation, if Clattenburg is found to not be at fault. Yes they had every right to make a complaint to the FA but in this case, based on the evidence, I think it was unwise. And it seems this decision was made very quickly, further casting doubt on their "full investigation".

Now Chelsea may well have decided to make a complaint in good faith, as is their right to do so as set out by the FA procedures, but it should have never come out in public before any FA investigation could take place. This is the real issue. Allowing the media to find out, however that happened, is the real crime, especially considering the flimsy evidence. Equal care should have been given to keep this matter private between only the parties involved and the FA.

This is where Chelsea are at fault and I think someone needs to own up to it. Someone mentioned earlier that the media overheard a conversation so Chelsea are not at fault for the leak, well that conversation should never have taken place within earshot of the media.

Regardless of how it happened, the allegation against Clattenburg became public knowledge before any of the evidence did and, even though he has been cleared of any wrong doing, his reputation and his livelihood has been adversely affected through no fault of his own. For this Chelsea owe him an apology.

This is all correct. The ruckus that tipped a lot of the press pack off should not have happened. And players should not have talked to their mates either - that also contributed to the press pack finding out. But it is virtually impossible to gag anyone, let alone a highly-paid footballer, from talking about a highly emotive issue.

The news was out by the time the club issued a statement, through the club's inability to manage Mikel's understandable anger and their players. Sending out a statement on the issue was the least bad option.

I would imagine that the decision-making process might have been different if the club wasn't already under the spotlight. Ideally, someone should have calmed down the dressing room, told the players that they're going to pursue a complaint through the proper channels and to be quiet about it until it runs its course. But at a club like Chelsea, with the added sensitivity of the JT affair, that was never going to happen.

I would like it if Chelsea apologised to Clatenburg for the misunderstanding, and paid him the matchday fees he missed out on. But it drives me light to see people talk about the complaint as sour grapes, malicious, or "slime". It was a difficult issue that hit the club in a difficult situation, the club staff managed it as best they could but made mistakes in the process. Clatenburg is entitled to an apology, but Chelsea shouldn't be vilified either for how they dealt with it.

GavRedKing

A good sign and hopefully a big step in the right direction eventually by Chelsea FC.

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/sport/football/teams/chelsea/9704946/Chelsea-hold-private-talks-with-referee-Mark-Clattenburg-in-a-bid-to-resolve-damage-caused-by-racism-case.html

Bruce Buck, the Chelsea chairman is understood to have travelled to the National Football Centre at St George’s Park in Burton to speak to Clattenburg and 15 of his elite referee colleagues to repair the damage that was caused when the club made a formal complaint that the Gosforth official racially abused John Obi Mikel during a match with Manchester United last month by calling the midfielder “a monkey.”


Clattenburg strenuously denied the allegations, which were thrown out last week by the Football Association. He said he feared that the claims would wreck his career and left him with sleepless nights. Although he was encouraged by his colleagues to demand an apology and compensation, Clattenburg made it clear that he wished to make peace with Chelsea to allow him to return to officiating at the earliest opportunity.


Now it appears Chelsea want to move on from the damaging episode. The talks yesterday are understood to have gone so well that the prospect of Clattenurg officiating at a Chelsea match in the near future was also discussed.

If and when Clattenburg gets a Chelsea match I hope he hasnt vilified by some stupid fans.

greendom

GavRedKing wrote: »

A good sign and hopefully a big step in the right direction eventually by Chelsea FC.

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/sport/football/teams/chelsea/9704946/Chelsea-hold-private-talks-with-referee-Mark-Clattenburg-in-a-bid-to-resolve-damage-caused-by-racism-case.html



If and when Clattenburg gets a Chelsea match I hope he hasnt vilified by some stupid fans.

Why should Bruce Buck have anything to do with whether Clattenburg refs a Chelsea game or not ?

GavRedKing

greendom wrote: »

Why should Bruce Buck have anything to do with whether Clattenburg refs a Chelsea game or not ?

He doesn't,

Bruce Buck, the Chelsea chairman is understood to have travelled to the National Football Centre at St George’s Park in Burton to speak to Clattenburg and 15 of his elite referee colleagues to repair the damage

Its not up to him who ref's the game but by at least approaching Clattenburg and the rest of the officials it's a step in the right direction after not directly issuing an apology on their official statement after the FA cleared him.

PhlegmyMoses

"Shut up, monkey"

That sounds like the least likely racist slur a British person would ever say. Alarm bells must have been ringing for the Chelsea backroom staff when they heard that.

homerjay2005

GavRedKing wrote: »

If and when Clattenburg gets a Chelsea match I hope he hasnt vilified by some stupid fans.

considering the mindless booing of Wayne Bridge, Anton and Rio Ferdinand amongest other things, as well as the epispode on Sunday with Rafa, i can guarantee you that Chelsea fans will use show their usual lack of decency towards Clattenburg.

and didnt two top refs quit over treatment they received after doing Chelsea games? Chelsea players and fans, are amongest the most ignorent in the game.

MUSEIST

homerjay2005 wrote: »

considering the mindless booing of Wayne Bridge, Anton and Rio Ferdinand amongest other things, as well as the epispode on Sunday with Rafa, i can guarantee you that Chelsea fans will use show their usual lack of decency towards Clattenburg.

and didnt two top refs quit over treatment they received after doing Chelsea games? Chelsea players and fans, are amongest the most ignorent in the game.

Clattenburg deserves abuse (within obvious boundaries) from chelsea fans for his last performance against us regardless of the complaint about racist abuse.

Crann na Beatha

This post has been deleted.

GavRedKing

homerjay2005 wrote: »

considering the mindless booing of Wayne Bridge, Anton and Rio Ferdinand amongest other things, as well as the epispode on Sunday with Rafa, i can guarantee you that Chelsea fans will use show their usual lack of decency towards Clattenburg.

Wayne Bridge I can understand, his ex-missus came out and said it didnt happen at all.

Anton, unjustified all together.

Rio, deserved for his re-tweeting about Cole.

Rafa got a mixed reception, some dont want him at all and some do.

and didnt two top refs quit over treatment they received after doing Chelsea games?

Only 1 I can think of but thats still 1 to many.

Chelsea players and fans, are amongest the most ignorent in the game.

Ha, good one.

Sgt Pepper 64

GavRedKing wrote: »

He doesn't,

Its not up to him who ref's the game but by at least approaching Clattenburg and the rest of the officials it's a step in the right direction after not directly issuing an apology on their official statement after the FA cleared him.

Just to remind a few people that Clattenburg wasnt allowed to ref a merseyside derby for 4 years.
West Ham fans chanting
Celtic\rangers\N Ireland fans sending bullets to everyone
Kolo Toure cheating on his missus and pretending not to be himself!
But hey, those disgusting Chelsea fans and their filthy lucre.

Anyone hopefully, Buck has got his cheque book out and we are all nicely sorted (Obviously Man U had fully paid up - oh Sir!)

Al Capwned

ffs

Phoenix

Phoenix wrote: »

Usual lack of decency?
Are you tarring all Chelsea fans?

You couldn't make it up.

Homer with a classic.

GavRedKing

alproctor wrote: »

ffs

Care to expand on your insightful post?

Al Capwned

GavRedKing wrote: »

Care to expand on your insightful post?

Yeah, sorry bout that..... Was a bit frustrated reading this earlier.

This whole thread (or a lot of it, at least) is being turned into a stand-up-for-your-club shouting match. There is sh1te being spouted, by supporters of all clubs, and it is turning into a competition to see who can get one over someone else more quickly.

Suppose it was always going to happen though in fairness.

Sgt Pepper 64

alproctor wrote: »

Yeah, sorry bout that..... Was a bit frustrated reading this earlier.

This whole thread (or a lot of it, at least) is being turned into a stand-up-for-your-club shouting match. There is sh1te being spouted, by supporters of all clubs, and it is turning into a competition to see who can get one over someone else more quickly.

Suppose it was always going to happen though in fairness.

Thread probably needs a decent ref

bucketybuck

GavRedKing wrote: »

Wayne Bridge I can understand, his ex-missus came out and said it didnt happen at all.

Anton, unjustified all together.

Rio, deserved for his re-tweeting about Cole.

Rafa got a mixed reception, some dont want him at all and some do.

MUSEIST wrote: »

Clattenburg deserves abuse (within obvious boundaries) from chelsea fans for his last performance against us regardless of the complaint about racist abuse.

You are in denial lads. Its quite revealing that your response to instances of abuse is "They deserved it".

Sgt Pepper 64

bucketybuck wrote: »

You are in denial lads. Its quite revealing that your response to instances of abuse is "They deserved it".

what so no other team shouts abuse like "are you blind ref"

GavRedKing

Sgt Pepper 64 wrote: »

Thread probably needs a decent ref

Eeeehhhh.......oh you said decent, carry on.

bucketybuck wrote: »

You are in denial lads. Its quite revealing that your response to instances of abuse is "They deserved it".

I never said Clattenburg should get abuse, I'm hoping he doesn't but it wont happen as a miniority will boo or heckle him for a bit and it will go away then.

The only person on Homerjay's list that shouldnt have been abused was Anton.

Every other player was fair game for some sections of the crowd.

I suppose we might as well go crying because Lamps gets abuse from the West Ham fans for leaving or Cole from the Arsenal fans for leaving.

Every set of fans have an axe to grind with a player, some justified some not so, can it be contorlled, no.

intellectual dosser

Not trying to stir the pot (famous last words I know, maybe it's been said already)

In the media this has really died down and IMO I'd attribute this to the sacking of RDM and the appointment of Rafa Benitez soaking up all the ink on the back pages.

Is there any chance this was intentional by Chelsea? Did they see the ruling coming from the FA and decide RDM was going at some stage - no time like the present.

If Clattenburg looks at the bigger picture I dont think he'll press charges or pursue any further - so in fact he would also be glad for the distraction.

Sgt Pepper 64

Chelsea have now issued an apology

The European champions issued a joint statement with referees body Professional Game Match Officials Limited and the Premier League in which they admitted they should have "given more consideration" before making their allegation public.


The Football Association last week decided to take no disciplinary action against Clattenburg following an investigation into Chelsea's allegation he used "inappropriate language" against midfielder John Obi Mikel, while the police also shelved a probe into the matter.


Today's statement followed a meeting on Monday between the three parties involved and included Clattenburg, Chelsea chairman Bruce Buck, the remaining 15 Select Group referees, PGMOL general manager Mike Riley and Premier League chief executive Richard Scudamore.


The statement reads: "Following the completion of the investigation by the FA into the case involving Chelsea FC and Mark Clattenburg, the Premier League and Chelsea FC requested, and PGMOL agreed, to meet in order to discuss the issues surrounding the reporting of the allegation.


"The Select Group appreciated the opportunity to speak to Bruce Buck personally. His willingness to engage and answer all the questions put to him was welcomed.
There was a constructive and open discussion. The club regrets not having given more consideration before issuing a statement on the evening of Sunday 28th October.
"The club also regrets the subsequent impact the intense media scrutiny had on Mark Clattenburg and his family.

"The referees accept that, given Chelsea FC had received a good faith claim from one of their employees, the club had an obligation under FA rules to report the allegation.

"There was recognition by all parties that the impartiality and integrity of refereeing in this country remains paramount. Chelsea FC made it clear they would welcome Mark Clattenburg back to Stamford Bridge in the future and PGMOL would have no issue in appointing him to a Chelsea FC match going forward.

"It was a thoroughly professional meeting. All parties now believe it is time to draw a line under this incident, learn from it and move on for the good of all Premier League clubs, players and match officials."

The_Kew_Tour

No apology there. Just regret. Disappointing, but not surprising.

Sgt Pepper 64

The_Kew_Tour wrote: »

No apology there. Just regret. Disappointing, but not surprising.

Only a public hanging would satisfy you eh?

GavRedKing

Thats a joint statement by the way, agreed upon by all parties.

The_Kew_Tour

Sgt Pepper 64 wrote: »

Only a public hanging would satisfy you eh?

Nobody is looking for something like that. Just simple apology to Clattenburg.

It would give me respect for club again. All be it small if they proved a bigger club for it.

Sgt Pepper 64

The_Kew_Tour wrote: »

Nobody is looking for something like that. Just simple apology to Clattenburg.

It would give me respect for club again. All be it small if they proved a bigger club for it.

Surely an apology is an expression of regret?

Here you go anyway...

"Chelsea FC would like to apologise for not being able to prove that you did indeed say Monkey, even though one of our players still maintains that you really did say that. Congrats on getting away with it and the FA just want to sweep it all under the rug and pretend a player who has lived in England for over 2 years cant actually speak the language and it was all just one big mis-understanding, like when Fifa was offered a bribe or two"

Mr.Micro

Sgt Pepper 64 wrote: »

Surely an apology is an expression of regret?

Here you go anyway...

"Chelsea FC would like to apologise for not being able to prove that you did indeed say Monkey, even though one of our players still maintains that you really did say that. Congrats on getting away with it and the FA just want to sweep it all under the rug and pretend a player who has lived in England for over 2 years cant actually speak the language and it was all just one big mis-understanding, like when Fifa was offered a bribe or two"

In fairness, it would not take the opinion of a QC to tell Chelsea that a case could not be proved if it boiled down to the word of Mikel Vs Clattenburg, anyone with common sense would have told Chelsea that. Yet it continued to pursue the claim........ the FA was never going to find against itself on that basis, even if Mikel's claims are true. Only 2 people know the truth and one is a liar then.

Just An Opinion

Solicitor I know said if Chelsea actually 'apologise' it could leave them wide open in court for damages. So 'regret' seems to be sorry with a condom on

Tubbs4

Mr.Micro wrote: »

In fairness, it would not take the opinion of a QC to tell Chelsea that a case could not be proved if it boiled down to the word of Mikel Vs Clattenburg, anyone with common sense would have told Chelsea that. Yet it continued to pursue the claim........ the FA was never going to find against itself on that basis, even if Mikel's claims are true. Only 2 people know the truth and one is a liar then.

It was Rameries that heard the word monkey not Mikel I thought I read. That's why he went mad at the end of the game and could be in big trouble.

Mr.Micro

Tubbs4 wrote: »

It was Rameries that heard the word monkey not Mikel I thought I read. That's why he went mad at the end of the game and could be in big trouble.

Either way, if Ramires heard it then, either he or Clattenburg is wrong. One is possibly mistaken( misheard) or a liar. The FA has ruled and the former is one or the other. Chelsea were foolish to pursue a case on such evidence, as it is impossible to prove.

Compton

Clattenburg should be fined for his horrendous decisions in the match which cost chelsea the match. 3 points in the league are not cheap.

He is obviously not capable of refereeing in the Premier league and should be demoted.

Tubbs4

Chelsea were in an impossible situation. After the Terry case if they did not pursue it they be called a racist club.
I think the reports at the start said 2 players heard monkey being used.
I feel sorry for the ref as he will be abuse from fickle fans.
The only good thing to come if refs getting taped at matches. So they can go after players abusing them.

Fuhrer

Tubbs4 wrote: »

Chelsea were in an impossible situation. After the Terry case if they did not pursue it they be called a racist club.
I think the reports at the start said 2 players heard monkey being used.
I feel sorry for the ref as he will be abuse from fickle fans.
The only good thing to come if refs getting taped at matches. So they can go after players abusing them.

Suppose they probably could have quietly investigated the incident and brought it to the FA rather then piping their vile innuendo out to any journalist that would listen.

grenache

Chelsea seem to really like going out of their way to ensure the public at large dislike them.

All was needed was a simple apology. An admission of liability. Not a cheap cop-out with this "regret" nonsense.

Cowardly to say the least.

Sgt Pepper 64

Fuhrer wrote: »

Suppose they probably could have quietly investigated the incident and brought it to the FA rather then piping their vile innuendo out to any journalist that would listen.

Really? And I suppose the Terry and Suraez case could have been handled in the same "quiet" manner?

Maybe Clattenburg could apologise for actually saying the remark as well
"All was needed was a simple apology. An admission of liability."
Cowardly to say the least."
The assumption that he didnt actually say it, shows the weight of bias against Chelsea rather than a balanced view

The_Kew_Tour

Sgt Pepper 64 wrote: »

The assumption that he didnt actually say it, shows the weight of bias against Chelsea rather than a balanced view

Most people base that on little common sense. Do people honestly believe he said it? Chelsea players not even sure what they heard. Linesman heard nothing racist.

Sgt Pepper 64

The_Kew_Tour wrote: »

Most people base that on little common sense. Do people honestly believe he said it? Chelsea players not even sure what they heard. Linesman heard nothing racist.

the player who heard it (Ramires) still maintains that he did. That is why Chelsea will not apologise



The club believe they cannot apologise for bringing the racism allegation because Ramires, the only player who claimed to have heard the comments, still believes he heard Clattenburg use the offensive words.

To apologise fully would, they believe, expose Ramires and suggest they do not believe him.

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/sport/football/teams/chelsea/9706661/Chelsea-regret-treatment-of-referee-Mark-Clattenburg-after-complaint-of-racist-abuse-towards-John-Obi-Mikel.html

grenache

Sgt Pepper 64 wrote:

The assumption that he didnt actually say it, shows the weight of bias against Chelsea rather than a balanced view

I appreciate that Chelsea had a difficult balancing act to carry out, backing their own player while still co-operating with the FA investigation.

But since the FA investigated and found Clattenburg had no case to answer, surely it's more than an "assumption" that he didn't say anything untoward.

Mocha Joe

Compton wrote: »

Clattenburg should be fined for his horrendous decisions in the match which cost chelsea the match. 3 points in the league are not cheap.

He is obviously not capable of refereeing in the Premier league and should be demoted.

Meh he was wrong to not send Torres off for high challenge and he was wrong to give him 2nd yellow for diving. What else did he do?

Mr.Micro

grenache wrote: »

I appreciate that Chelsea had a difficult balancing act to carry out, backing their own player while still co-operating with the FA investigation.

But since the FA investigated and found Clattenburg had no case to answer, surely it's more than an "assumption" that he didn't say anything untoward.

That is the sum of it... and if he did, no corroboration or proof. Not a great referee after all that, but the FA will promote him as the best. Chelsea need to move on now and not get hung up on the issue, whilst Clattenburg will be under scrutiny for some time re his ability or not, to referee at this high level.

Washington Irving

Mikel receives three game ban and £60,000 fine for threatening Mark Clattenburg following Chelsea-Man Utd game on 28th October.

Mikel ends up being the guilty party. Who'd have thunk it?

The_Kew_Tour

Some Justice served thankfully.

MUSEIST

Not suprised, apparently mikel, was livid after the game, should have behaved better despite believing he was racially abused.

GavRedKing

Hopefully thats the end of it now.

Soups123

I said from day one that I felt Chelsea claim went in to minimize the punishment being dished out to Mikel because they knew he was in serious ****, Job complete 3 games would have been more had he not 'taught' he was racially abused