Food Stamps

zenno

Yeah, and bring back at least some respect for your fellow human being no matter what situation they end up in instead of forwarding sh*t-arse comments like this from Elle Whining Insecticide...

We need more poor people to look down on.

Elle Whining Insecticide, if it can happen to him (joe soap), it can happen to you.

If my decoding of your comment is wrong then let me know, as the small comment as i call a slide-note or snide-note you made above seems to me that you like looking down on your fellow man.

Esoteric_

zenno wrote: »

Yeah, and bring back at least some respect for your fellow human being no matter what situation they end up in instead of forwarding sh*t-arse comments like this from Frada...



Frada, if it can happen to him (joe soap), it can happen to you.

If my decoding of your comment is wrong then let me know, as the small comment as i call a slide-note or snide-note you made above seems to me that you like looking down on your fellow man.

.... Am I the only one who read nothing but sarcasm in Frada's post? :pac:

repsol

I think a percentage of the dole should be in the form of stamps or a card as should childrens allowance.There would be no stigma for the unemployed as parents who work would also have the same cards.The government could get a discount from participating supermarket chains (eg 95 cent for a euro value on the card)It would eliminate the problem of foreigners sending vast sums of social payments back to whatever country they came from via Western Union and also sort out the minority who use the childrens allowance as some form of drinking fund instead of buying the things their kids need.Before anyone starts saying this does not happen ask anyone who works in a niteclub in Dublin about "mickey money night" or ask teachers in so called "deprived areas" about the breakfast clubs which are run for the kids coming to school on an empty stomach

Esoteric_

repsol wrote: »

I think a percentage of the dole should be in the form of stamps or a card as should childrens allowance.There would be no stigma for the unemployed as parents who work would also have the same cards.The government could get a discount from participating supermarket chains (eg 95 cent for a euro value on the card)It would eliminate the problem of foreigners sending vast sums of social payments back to whatever country they came from via Western Union and also sort out the minority who use the childrens allowance as some form of drinking fund instead of buying the things their kids need.Before anyone starts saying this does not happen ask anyone who works in a niteclub in Dublin about "mickey money night" or ask teachers in so called "deprived areas" about the breakfast clubs which are run for the kids coming to school on an empty stomach

By getting shops to sell items at a 5% reduction in price, jobs will be lost, resulting in more people on the dole.

zenno

LyndaMcL wrote: »

.... Am I the only one who read nothing but sarcasm in Frada's post? :pac:

LOL No Comment.

Get your ass back here frada pronto and back yourself up before a $hitstorm accumulates.


Here's food stamps for you all, it's called un-stamped/un-connected to the robotic matrix & stamp on the government get your rocks on.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=u3ltZmI5LQw

Oh Yeah.

Azure_sky

Only if they're complimented with booze stamps, smoke stamps, broadband stamps, condom stamps, lube stamps and pizza stamps. People seem to forget that money has the same inherent value as toilet paper. Food stamps is a great way to create another black market and rise crime which would cost the police force more money and the net result would be a loss in revenue.
If it was up to some people we'd be living in a Hunger Games-esque society or a return to British feudalism. If you want that then the U.S.A. is a good place to go.

Sam Kade

DEFTLEFTHAND wrote: »

I've already stated that it doesn't mean a total cut in welfare, it's a reduction. How would somebody like me who's self employed pay for light and heat? Sh1t happens you've got to pull yourself out of it, the real world isn't easy believe me.

I believe you I have been living in it long enough. I am self employed too and have been since I started working. So what will your system of food vouchers achieve other than making sure people eat?

bnt

Anyone bothered to look at the USA system before trashing the idea entirely? They call it the Supplemental Nutrition Assistance Program SNAP. A list of what you can and can't buy with it is here, and it's quite surprising e.g. junk food is eligible. There's quite a lot of bureaucracy involved, of course - and fraud.

Cian92

Pottler wrote: »

the 15k in VAT I hand up every month.

The €15K in VAT isn't actually paid by you. It is paid by your customers, you just collect it on their behalf. As a business you get to claim back the vast majority of VAT you actually pay yourself.

Odysseus

Man007 wrote: »

Yes definitely it would make sure people on welfare have necessities but cut out any spend on luxuries which people on welfare should not be entitled to.

And who decides what are luxuries and what are not? Soe people might say beer, then what about christmas day in somebody's gaff, I would like to offer you a drink but the state does not allow me to purchase it. Some people on the dole abuse alcohol but lets make everybody pay, is that it?

Or people could say the this way the money can't be spend on drugs, so we have people then stealing increasing the levels of criminality. I don't know how some people think the have the right to control other peoples lifes to such an extent.

repsol

Odysseus wrote: »

And who decides what are luxuries and what are not? Soe people might say beer, then what about christmas day in somebody's gaff, I would like to offer you a drink but the state does not allow me to purchase it. Some people on the dole abuse alcohol but lets make everybody pay, is that it?

Or people could say the this way the money can't be spend on drugs, so we have people then stealing increasing the levels of criminality. I don't know how some people think the have the right to control other peoples lifes to such an extent.

Nobody is suggesting that persons on the dole get NO cash.They just shouldn't get it ALL in cash.A certain amount of cash would always be needed.In the course of my work I am regularly in the homes of social welfare dependents and they usually have the full SKY package and a TV the size of a football goal.They nearly all smoke and drink and run a car.I think public transport and the basic TV stations are good enough for everyone on the dole.If you want what I consider luxuries ,car ownership,smoking ,drinking,gambling etc you should have to work.

Esoteric_

repsol wrote: »

Nobody is suggesting that persons on the dole get NO cash.They just shouldn't get it ALL in cash.A certain amount of cash would always be needed.In the course of my work I am regularly in the homes of social welfare dependents and they usually have the full SKY package and a TV the size of a football goal.They nearly all smoke and drink and run a car.I think public transport and the basic TV stations are good enough for everyone on the dole.If you want what I consider luxuries ,car ownership,smoking ,drinking,gambling etc you should have to work.

And in an ideal world, all of these people WOULD be working. Are you really one of those people who believe that everybody on the dole doesn't want a job?

I'm on the dole. I smoke and I drink. It is nobody's business but mine what I spend my money on. I pay rent to my family because I had to move home and I contribute to bills.

I'm on jobseeker's benefit, which is not means tested, it's based on my earnings and tax contributions. Therefore, it's my money and I'll spend it on whatever the hell I like. If I want a night out and I have enough money, I'll go for a night out. Nobody will dictate what I spend my money on. I paid into the system since I was 15, worked through school and college, never applied for a grant, I supported myself. Why should somebody have a say over what I spend money that I PAID FOR on? If I want a cigarette, I'll have one. If I want a drink on the weekend, I'll have one. It doesn't hinder my job hunting and I didn't exactly leave my job through choice, so people really need to stop this crap generalization about all people on the dole being drug taking, sky-watching, broadband-using alcoholics.

Btw, I have Sky and broadband because my parents have it and as soon as I moved back in, I started contributing to it on top of my rent.

Spiritual

Cian92 wrote: »

The €15K in VAT isn't actually paid by you. It is paid by your customers, you just collect it on their behalf. As a business you get to claim back the vast majority of VAT you actually pay yourself.

I think he knows that, he is referring to the amount of VAT which is paid to the Government, money he generates by his business activity and is then squandered on poor management of the services it is suppose to pay for.

I am dumbfounded that people don't seem to understand that a big part problem with this country is the incessant layers of management in the Public Service and add greatly to the fact that we can't get our books balanced. Their activities add greatly to the dole queues as elsewhere people are being pushed to the limit to keep things going. Croke Park is choking this country.

It is easy to pin the deficit on the welfare system when in fact it is only a part of the issue. Job creation is stifled in this country, thus the dole queues remain long and the tax take is reduced, what tax is taken in by the exchequer is then squandered on excessive red tape, management layers and incompetence. What is left is pushed to bank accounts of the previous failures as they ensured their pot will always be full by the decisions they were allowed to make unchallenged because they kept ye quiet with a percentage point drop here and there on your income tax and a few quid extra on your social welfare payments. Mere pennies compared to the cost of these pensions that keeps them in luxury.

The Governments of this country have always been good at dividing the people who are then so blinkered that a blame game becomes their coping measure.

Wake up or you will get what you deserve, they know it, it's time the citizens of this country knew it.

Just a word of warning, the workers of today both public sector and private sector will be the unemployed of tomorrow, think of that when you decide that food stamps are the way forward and luxuries should only be for those that earn a wage.

repsol

LyndaMcL wrote: »

And in an ideal world, all of these people WOULD be working. Are you really one of those people who believe that everybody on the dole doesn't want a job?

I'm on the dole. I smoke and I drink. It is nobody's business but mine what I spend my money on. I pay rent to my family because I had to move home and I contribute to bills.

I'm on jobseeker's benefit, which is not means tested, it's based on my earnings and tax contributions. Therefore, it's my money and I'll spend it on whatever the hell I like. If I want a night out and I have enough money, I'll go for a night out. Nobody will dictate what I spend my money on. I paid into the system since I was 15, worked through school and college, never applied for a grant, I supported myself. Why should somebody have a say over what I spend money that I PAID FOR on? If I want a cigarette, I'll have one. If I want a drink on the weekend, I'll have one. It doesn't hinder my job hunting and I didn't exactly leave my job through choice, so people really need to stop this crap generalization about all people on the dole being drug taking, sky-watching, broadband-using alcoholics.

Btw, I have Sky and broadband because my parents have it and as soon as I moved back in, I started contributing to it on top of my rent.

I don't believe that EVERYONE on the dole doesn't want a job.I know a few guys who have worked all their lives and have lost a job through no fault of their own.I don't begrudge them their payments or anyone else who wants to work.The people I have a problem with are the MAJORITY who wouldn't take a job to save their life.Cast your mind back a few years to the peak of the boom when there were so many jobs going even people with no English could get one and we were told there was 100% employment.There were still circa 300,000 wasters on the dole and these people are still on it.They are career scroungers and will never work.Don't forget,there is a finite pot of money for social welfare.The more undeserving people claiming,the less cash there is for those who do deserve the payments

Esoteric_

repsol wrote: »

I don't believe that EVERYONE on the dole doesn't want a job.I know a few guys who have worked all their lives and have lost a job through no fault of their own.I don't begrudge them their payments or anyone else who wants to work.The people I have a problem with are the MAJORITY who wouldn't take a job to save their life.Cast your mind back a few years to the peak of the boom when there were so many jobs going even people with no English could get one and we were told there was 100% employment.There were still circa 300,000 wasters on the dole and these people are still on it.They are career scroungers and will never work.Don't forget,there is a finite pot of money for social welfare.The more undeserving people claiming,the less cash there is for those who do deserve the payments

You just proved my point about generalising people on the dole. Good work. :rolleyes:

Faith+1

LyndaMcL wrote: »

My welfare is money that I have paid into the tax system since I was 15 and never claimed until recently. Fúck right off if you think you have the right to judge what it should be spent on.

That's Jobseekers Benefit, The OP means Jobseekers allowance .ie. Means tested. In that regard food stamps all the way, it's taxpayers money.

Sir Oxman

repsol wrote: »

I don't believe that EVERYONE on the dole doesn't want a job.I know a few guys who have worked all their lives and have lost a job through no fault of their own.I don't begrudge them their payments or anyone else who wants to work.The people I have a problem with are the MAJORITY who wouldn't take a job to save their life.Cast your mind back a few years to the peak of the boom when there were so many jobs going even people with no English could get one and we were told there was 100% employment.There were still circa 300,000 wasters on the dole and these people are still on it.They are career scroungers and will never work.Don't forget,there is a finite pot of money for social welfare.The more undeserving people claiming,the less cash there is for those who do deserve the payments

I think you have your figures arseways.
The VAST majority of people on the dole are people who want and need employment.
The ignorance on these threads (years after the calamity started) still astounds me.

mattjack

Sir Oxman wrote: »

I think you have your figures arseways.
The VAST majority of people on the dole are people who want and need employment.
The ignorance on these threads (years after the calamity started) still astounds me.

Arseways would be an understatement.

Esoteric_

Faith+1 wrote: »

That's Jobseekers Benefit, The OP means Jobseekers allowance .ie. Means tested. In that regard food stamps all the way, it's taxpayers money.

The OP didn't say JSA. The OP said social welfare.

repsol

LyndaMcL wrote: »

You just proved my point about generalising people on the dole. Good work. :rolleyes:

There are about 450,000 on the dole and I spoke about 300,000 being scroungers. That is a 2/3 to 1/3 split and means I think 150,000 recipients are genuine.How is that generalizing? You should READ what I said before getting all defensive.

Spiritual

repsol wrote: »

I don't believe that EVERYONE on the dole doesn't want a job.I know a few guys who have worked all their lives and have lost a job through no fault of their own.I don't begrudge them their payments or anyone else who wants to work.The people I have a problem with are the MAJORITY who wouldn't take a job to save their life.Cast your mind back a few years to the peak of the boom when there were so many jobs going even people with no English could get one and we were told there was 100% employment.There were still circa 300,000 wasters on the dole and these people are still on it.They are career scroungers and will never work.Don't forget,there is a finite pot of money for social welfare.The more undeserving people claiming,the less cash there is for those who do deserve the payments

During the boom there was such a demand for workers that we saw an increase in migrant workers coming to these shores.
Over that period the live register recorded 110,000 people who were classified as long term unemployed. People who could not or were not able to work.

This was a missed opportunity by the state to carry out a detailed investigation of why this figure generally stays static. A lot of this number are people that may not be in a position to take up employment. The others who are riding the system could have been easily identified.

Currently there are 450000 people on the live register an increase of approx 340000 since the boom went boom. The majority, of people who I can only assume are jobseekers unless an income and a career are no longer valid in their lives!!!

Some news for you there are not 450000 positions available in Ireland let alone 340000 to cater for people who can and want to work.

Be careful you may become a statistic too.

Nodin

repsol wrote: »

I don't believe that EVERYONE on the dole doesn't want a job.I know a few guys who have worked all their lives and have lost a job through no fault of their own.I don't begrudge them their payments or anyone else who wants to work.The people I have a problem with are the MAJORITY who wouldn't take a job to save their life.Cast your mind back a few years to the peak of the boom when there were so many jobs going even people with no English could get one and we were told there was 100% employment.There were still circa 300,000 wasters on the dole and these people are still on it.They are career scroungers and will never work.Don't forget,there is a finite pot of money for social welfare.The more undeserving people claiming,the less cash there is for those who do deserve the payments

No, there wasn't. If you're going to to shite on as if you're knowledgeable, it helps to research.

Esoteric_

repsol wrote: »

There are about 450,000 on the dole and I spoke about 300,000 being scroungers. That is a 2/3 to 1/3 split and means I think 150,000 recipients are genuine.How is that generalizing? You should READ what I said before getting all defensive.

Again, you are generalising. You don't know every single dole recipient, at most you might know 50-100. So to say the majority are scroungers is indeed generalising. I know how to read perfectly, thanks. Your posts are just bordering so close to the ridiculous that I'm addressing the most ridiculous aspects at this point, and nothing more.

mattjack

repsol wrote: »

There are about 450,000 on the dole and I spoke about 300,000 being scroungers. That is a 2/3 to 1/3 split and means I think 150,000 recipients are genuine.How is that generalizing? You should READ what I said before getting all defensive.

Where did you get the figure of 300,000 ?

mattjack

LyndaMcL wrote: »

Again, you are generalising. You don't know every single dole recipient, at most you might know 50-100. So to say the majority are scroungers is indeed generalising. I know how to read perfectly, thanks. Your posts are just bordering so close to the ridiculous that I'm addressing the most ridiculous aspects at this point, and nothing more.

Well he could know the 150,000 genuine ones.

Spiritual

mattjack wrote: »

Where did you get the figure of 300,000 ?

Like the rest of his comments, pulled out of his arse.

El Weirdo

Car ownership is a luxury because public transport is sufficient?

Clearly never left Dublin.

Stheno

repsol wrote: »

I don't believe that EVERYONE on the dole doesn't want a job.I know a few guys who have worked all their lives and have lost a job through no fault of their own.I don't begrudge them their payments or anyone else who wants to work.The people I have a problem with are the MAJORITY who wouldn't take a job to save their life.Cast your mind back a few years to the peak of the boom when there were so many jobs going even people with no English could get one and we were told there was 100% employment.There were still circa 300,000 wasters on the dole and these people are still on it.They are career scroungers and will never work.Don't forget,there is a finite pot of money for social welfare.The more undeserving people claiming,the less cash there is for those who do deserve the payments

repsol wrote: »

There are about 450,000 on the dole and I spoke about 300,000 being scroungers. That is a 2/3 to 1/3 split and means I think 150,000 recipients are genuine.How is that generalizing? You should READ what I said before getting all defensive.

Unemployment in 2006 was on average 4.4%

Unemployment in 2012 is on average 14.8%

So an increase of over 300% probably closer to 333%

This would indicate that of the 450,000 unemployed we currently have, no more than 150,000 were unemployed at the height of the boom.

Try and get your facts straight?

repsol

LyndaMcL wrote: »

Again, you are generalising. You don't know every single dole recipient, at most you might know 50-100. So to say the majority are scroungers is indeed generalising. I know how to read perfectly, thanks. Your posts are just bordering so close to the ridiculous that I'm addressing the most ridiculous aspects at this point, and nothing more.

Ridiculous? Ridiculous is having to move back in to live off your parents because you cannot support yourself.And yes I do know about 50 people on the dole and I reckon about half of them are working cash in hand and claiming at the same time.One of them owns a van which is covered in SIGN WRITING advertising his business and nobody seems to be enforcing the rules.

Spiritual

repsol wrote: »

Ridiculous? Ridiculous is having to move back in to live off your parents because you cannot support yourself.And yes I do know about 50 people on the dole and I reckon about half of them are working cash in hand and claiming at the same time.One of them owns a van which is covered in SIGN WRITING advertising his business and nobody seems to be enforcing the rules.

Have you reported him?

Spiritual

Stheno wrote: »

This would indicate that of the 450,000 unemployed we currently have, no more than 150,000 were unemployed at the height of the boom.

Try and get your facts straight?

People always forget that there are a percentage of that 150,000 that cannot and never will be able to hold down employment.

I ask the critics should they be denied a basic standard of living?

Esoteric_

repsol wrote: »

Ridiculous? Ridiculous is having to move back in to live off your parents because you cannot support yourself.And yes I do know about 50 people on the dole and I reckon about half of them are working cash in hand and claiming at the same time.One of them owns a van which is covered in SIGN WRITING advertising his business and nobody seems to be enforcing the rules.

No, ridiculous is being beaten up so badly by a colleague that you had no choice but to leave your job due to being put on medication and in counselling and signed off work due to the severity of the attack, and having no choice but to move home. I would launch a personal attack like you did, but I have more class. Also, my parents don't support me. I pay rent (the going rate for what I'd pay in a rent a room scheme), bills, buy my own food, and also care for my mother and do all the housework.

So thanks for making silly assumptions. I would do the same in return, but I'm better than that.

Stheno

Spiritual wrote: »

People always forget that there are a percentage of that 150,000 that cannot and never will be able to hold down employment.

I ask the critics should they be denied a basic standard of living?

That rate of 4.4% is considered full employment in economics, taking into account that up to 5% of the working population will not be employable.

repsol

Spiritual wrote: »

Have you reported him?

No I have not.Apart from the fact that it is not in my nature to rat on anyone I think driving a van around a small town all the time with signwriting, photos and your phone number on it should be obvious enough to the welfare people.Its a big van and its like a mobile billboard.Every year when he taxes it as a commercial vehicle he is obliged to make a declaration witnessed by the Gardai stating what he uses it for and give this to Revenue so I should not have to do their job for them

jaffacakesyum

It would be impossible to set up but in an ideal world I would substitute dole money for:

-Food stamps
-Transport ticket (bus/train) OR stamps for petrol
-Rent allowance + electricity/heating bills
-Some cash to be spent on whatever the person wants

I don't think anyone is saying all or even the majority of people on the dole are scroungers who don't want a job and spend all their money on drugs and alcohol and no time searching for work.

However, I do believe that A LOT of people on the dole will turn down work that is "beneath them" and/or turn down a job if they would get more money/only a little bit less staying on the dole. While I would not do this if I was on the dole, I do understand why people do it. Why bother your arse working if you get just as much or only slightly less while on the dole and you get all the free time in the world to do what you like.

The above system means people would still have disposable cash but CONSIDERABLY less to spend on "luxuries". It would encourage the people who aren't too fussed about finding the next available job asap to do just that.

Esoteric_

repsol wrote: »

No I have not.Apart from the fact that it is not in my nature to rat on anyone I think driving a van around a small town all the time with signwriting, photos and your phone number on it should be obvious enough to the welfare people.Its a big van and its like a mobile billboard.Every year when he taxes it as a commercial vehicle he is obliged to make a declaration witnessed by the Gardai stating what he uses it for and give this to Revenue so I should not have to do their job for them

Ah okay. So you hate dole recipients for being scroungers, but aren't a 'rat.' I see.

So like, you have a way to stop at least one dole cheat, but choose not to because it's not in your nature?

Words fail me. :pac:

repsol

LyndaMcL wrote: »

Ah okay. So you hate dole recipients for being scroungers, but aren't a 'rat.' I see.

So like, you have a way to stop at least one dole cheat, but choose not to because it's not in your nature?

Words fail me. :pac:

I am sure you don't agree with drink driving Lynda yet I doubt you go ringing the cops if you see someone in your local downing 3 or 4 pints and getting in their car.I feel the same way about dole cheats

mattjack

LyndaMcL wrote: »

Ah okay. So you hate dole recipients for being scroungers, but aren't a 'rat.' I see.

So like, you have a way to stop at least one dole cheat, but choose not to because it's not in your nature?

Words fail me. :pac:

Ya lil charmer

Odysseus

repsol wrote: »

Ridiculous? Ridiculous is having to move back in to live off your parents because you cannot support yourself.And yes I do know about 50 people on the dole and I reckon about half of them are working cash in hand and claiming at the same time.One of them owns a van which is covered in SIGN WRITING advertising his business and nobody seems to be enforcing the rules.

Very well put, bravo, really shows the calibre of the type of person we are dealing with.

Spiritual

repsol wrote: »

No I have not.Apart from the fact that it is not in my nature to rat on anyone I think driving a van around a small town all the time with signwriting, photos and your phone number on it should be obvious enough to the welfare people.Its a big van and its like a mobile billboard.Every year when he taxes it as a commercial vehicle he is obliged to make a declaration witnessed by the Gardai stating what he uses it for and give this to Revenue so I should not have to do their job for them

Well in my eyes you are a hypocrite.

Esoteric_

repsol wrote: »

I am sure you don't agree with drink driving Lynda yet I doubt you go ringing the cops if you see someone in your local downing 3 or 4 pints and getting in their car.I feel the same way about dole cheats

Actually, I called the police with a reg number for one of my best friends when he drank before driving. Hypocrisy isn't an attractive trait, and I'd prefer my friend charged than innocent people dead.

repsol

Odysseus wrote: »

Very well put, bravo, really shows the calibre of the type of person we are dealing with.

Calibre? Its an internet forum not Yale.All you need to get on here is a computer and some spare time.Get over yourself:p

Spiritual

LyndaMcL wrote: »

Actually, I called the police with a reg number for one of my best friends when he drank before driving. Hypocrisy isn't an attractive trait, and I'd prefer my friend charged than innocent people dead.

You rat!!!!:pac::D

Esoteric_

Spiritual wrote: »

You rat!!!!:pac::D

I know, I'm such a horrible person for not wanting people dead.

Spiritual

LyndaMcL wrote: »

I know, I'm such a horrible person for not wanting people dead.

If he was a doler you could have reduced the live register.
You don't get dole in jail.

Odysseus

repsol wrote: »

Calibre? Its an internet forum not Yale.All you need to get on here is a computer and some spare time.Get over yourself:p

Well I don't think you will make Yale with your dole research

Procrastastudy

System has been proven not to work in various countries. Groceries delivered straight to the door... now that's something that could; a) work and b) drastically cut costs and fraud, c) cut costs to the health system. The UK population was never healthier than during rationing - well aside from the bombings.

There would inevitably be some 'black market' trading but the local heroin dealer is only likely to want a finite amount of cauliflower.

Spiritual

Odysseus wrote: »

Well I don't think you will make Yale with your dole research

Key cutting isn't just something you pick up.

Stheno

Spiritual wrote: »

If he was a doler you could have reduced the live register.
You don't get dole in jail.

More expensive to keep someone in jail though

repsol

Odysseus wrote: »

Well I don't think you will make Yale with your dole research

Well I think I will get over that dissappointment .Myself and my wife are very happy in our well paid public sector jobs and we have no need to move overseas or seek further education opportunities.