draft coming through hinges in tilt and turn windows

alfa beta

Hi

I have munster joinery tilt and turn windows (standard UPVC frames) in my house and unfortunately every time the wind blows - which is quite often on our rather exposed site - air comes in through where the hinges are, more especially the lower hinge. (By putting your hand near the hinge you can feel the draft coming in.)

From the outside the windows appear to be prefectly well sealed with the rubber butting up against the frame evenly all round so I can 't figure out where the air is getting in. I also can't figure out exactly what part of the hinge (or that area of the window) is leaking the air - and I don't want to start taking things apart myself.

I've had MJ out to look at the problem - but unfortunately when they came it was a lovely calm day and they basically said everything was in order and all looked fine.

So thought I'd ask here before doing anything else to see if anyone here has the same windows and the same problem - or indeed if anyone can recommend someone in the Cork / Waterford area that might be able to help fix the problem.

thanks

slimjimmc

Take a smoking piece of wood or burning candle (remove all flammable blinds/curtains) and gently move it around the suspect areas checking for which way the draught blows the smoke/flame. It might not be coming from the hinges, it could be coming in from the reveal (between the frame and wall). Could it be that the frames are vented and the draught your feeling is coming through screw holes or other piercings?

grange mac

You are correct, mj window seals are poor. have ecactly same problem esp around lower window hinge. when you close the window they dont seal properly. have no solution though as if you use a foam draught excluder on the seal it will render the original seals useless

alfa beta

thanks slimjim and grange mac,

it's definitely the hinges jim - and especially the lower ones. Where the frame of the window meets the wall is perfectly well sealed.

I also thought it was to do with the windows being vented - ie, air was coming into the hollow frames through the vent and then into the room through a screw hole or similar - so I experimented with one window and sealed up the vent (both the inside and outside of the vent!) and also sealed the little holes that leave water/condensation out (on the lower outer fixed part of the frame) and still had noticeable amounts of air coming in.

So I've come back to the conclusion that it's the sealing around the hinge, but no matter what I do with those little self-adhesive draught excluder things, I can't seem to remedy it (as seems to be your experience too grange mac)

Probably wouldn't notice it as much only for the fact that we're on a very windy site, on a hill on the coast. Very dissappointing though after having put a lot of thought, time and effort into insulating the house to a high standard and then be stuck with a factory made product that renders your on-site efforts a wee bit redundant...

kadman

alfa beta wrote: »

thanks slimjim and grange mac,

it's definitely the hinges jim - and especially the lower ones. Where the frame of the window meets the wall is perfectly well sealed.

I also thought it was to do with the windows being vented - ie, air was coming into the hollow frames through the vent and then into the room through a screw hole or similar - so I experimented with one window and sealed up the vent (both the inside and outside of the vent!) and also sealed the little holes that leave water/condensation out (on the lower outer fixed part of the frame) and still had noticeable amounts of air coming in.

So I've come back to the conclusion that it's the sealing around the hinge, but no matter what I do with those little self-adhesive draught excluder things, I can't seem to remedy it (as seems to be your experience too grange mac)

Probably wouldn't notice it as much only for the fact that we're on a very windy site, on a hill on the coast. Very dissappointing though after having put a lot of thought, time and effort into insulating the house to a high standard and then be stuck with a factory made product that renders your on-site efforts a wee bit redundant...

If its a standard bubble gasket, then buy the next size up and try one window.
It could also be shrunken gaskets. When the gaskets are cut in, they should be cut in over length to allow for shrinkage, most dont do this.

prospect

If you open the window and look into the open frame, at the bottom corner (hinged side), you will probably see a plastic bracket with a wedge shaped cut out.
On the actual window (i.e. the bit that opens and closes), in the corresponding position there will be a metal wedge sticking out.

When you close the window, the metal wedge should slide into the plastic bracket and they are shaped so that this then pulls the window in tight to the frame causing all the seals to compress.

Sometimes, if the hinges are off, or the window has not been fitted properly, the metal wedge stays outside the plastic bracket. This has the opposite effect of pushing the closed window out from the frame (although you may not see it).


To check if this is your issue, You can close over the window to the point just when the metal wedge and plastic bracket meet. Then get someone to push the bottom corner of the window inwards so the wedge stays inside the bracket, and close over the window the rest of the way.

You may have to have the hinges replaced if this is your issue.

alfa beta

thanks prospect, but that mechanism is all working fine -

that's the thing that I'm not getting, the windows when shut appear to be very tightly sealed and 'pull' up against the frame as they should - yet, when I put my hand nesr the lower hinge on a windy day, I can feel air coming in just at the bottom of the hinge.

I'm just looking now at the way the rubber seal (the bubble gasket, I think!) finishes where the hinge is attached to the moving part of the frame - I think it all comes back to this and to what kadman was saying.

Basically, at the point where the hinge is attached to the frame, you've just got metal pressing against the pvc when the window is closed. The rubber seal ends just below the metal of the hinge and then starts again just above the hinge. I guess that on a windy day, the air that comes in through the little condensation holes get's blown right through where the point where the metal isn't sealed fully. So I'll go expereimenting with trying to seal that section better.

fingers crossed.

(really poor design though if that is the problem....)

grange mac

Did u manage to fix your issue? window draft annoying me now too much...how much cost for bigger window seals as mine are now flat and draughts all around the window.