FIFA Ballon d'Or 2012 *MOD NOTE POST #1*

Washington Irving

Liam O wrote: »

That's bollocks in fairness. Ronaldo was the least popular person in the PL when he won player of the years during his time there. Though I feel Messi does get more votes in this type of thing because of his personality over Ronaldo. Sure even in the Ronaldo gives to charity thread there were people trying to diminish his character.

As opposed to getting more votes because he's a better footballer?

764dak

TheComeUp wrote: »

Go on??

http://www.goal.com/es/news/3542/copa-am%C3%A9rica/2011/07/02/2557672/argentina-nos-sorprendieron-con-un-gol-de-mierda-dice-un-enojado-

http://www.goal.com/en-us/news/3297/argentina/2011/07/02/2556908/lionel-messi-upset-with-argentinas-1-1-draw-with-bolivia

Messi: "Nos sorprendieron con un gol de mierda". Translation: "they surprised us with a goal of ****". This was after game where Messi was poor.

Messi kicks the ball in the face of a fan and does not even attempt to apologize.

Ronaldo accidentally kicks the ball in a guy's face. He apologizes, gives him his jersey, and hugs him (probably did more stuff after the game). People then say "Ronaldo only did it for publicity".

Great personality?

Messi wouldn't even vote for Ronaldo as one of top three players while Ronaldo would vote for Messi.

Bodhisopha

764dak wrote: »

http://www.goal.com/es/news/3542/copa-am%C3%A9rica/2011/07/02/2557672/argentina-nos-sorprendieron-con-un-gol-de-mierda-dice-un-enojado-

http://www.goal.com/en-us/news/3297/argentina/2011/07/02/2556908/lionel-messi-upset-with-argentinas-1-1-draw-with-bolivia

Messi: "Nos sorprendieron con un gol de mierda". Translation: "they surprised us with a goal of ****". This was after game where Messi was poor.

Messi kicks the ball in the face of a fan and does not even attempt to apologize.

Ronaldo accidentally kicks the ball in a guy's face. He apologizes, gives him his jersey, and hugs him (probably did more stuff after the game). People then say "Ronaldo only did it for publicity".

Great personality?

Messi wouldn't even vote for Ronaldo as one of top three players while Ronaldo would vote for Messi.

Excellent post and a real eye opener. Good thing it's not a personality contest. With that in mind, Messi by some distance is my pick for the Ballon d'Or.

Skylinehead

The stats speak for themselves. Ridiculous achievement already, and he's going to beat Mullers.

tolosenc

Both Ronaldo and Messi had 3 games in a week towards the end of last season:

Champions League semi-final away
Classico to decide the league
Champions League semi-final home

Ronaldo scored 3, including the winner in El classico.
Messi went missing, except for smashing a penalty off the crossbar at home to Chelsea.

Talib Fiasco

tolosenc wrote: »

Both Ronaldo and Messi had 3 games in a week towards the end of last season:

Champions League semi-final away
Classico to decide the league
Champions League semi-final home

Ronaldo scored 3, including the winner in El classico.
Messi went missing, except for smashing a penalty off the crossbar at home to Chelsea.

Pretty irrelevant when you're only choosing three games that clearly are biased towards Ronaldo....if you were to be fair here you'd judge it over the year which is what will be done and most can see that Messi has kicked everyones @ss....the guy is constantly outdoing himself so it's pretty simple (to me) that he should win this easily like he has done the last few years as he is improving with every game. And another thing I don't get is the fact that people place so much emphasis on whether or not the player has won loads of titles that year....it's an award for individual brilliance....now don't get me wrong the whole winning of major titles definitely boosts a players chances of winning but honestly it shouldn't be that significant in deciding who wins (again all my own opinion).

Bohrio

764dak wrote: »

Messi wouldn't even vote for Ronaldo as one of top three players while Ronaldo would vote for Messi.

If I could I would vote myself

Owned

764dak

Bohrio wrote: »

If I could I would vote myself

Owned

LQL

You can't vote for yourself. Ronaldo would vote for Messi. However, Messi would vote for overrated Xavi and Iniesta and someone else.

764dak

TheComeUp wrote: »

Pretty irrelevant when you're only choosing three games that clearly are biased towards Ronaldo....if you were to be fair here you'd judge it over the year which is what will be done and most can see that Messi has kicked everyones @ss....the guy is constantly outdoing himself so it's pretty simple (to me) that he should win this easily like he has done the last few years as he is improving with every game. And another thing I don't get is the fact that people place so much emphasis on whether or not the player has won loads of titles that year....it's an award for individual brilliance....now don't get me wrong the whole winning of major titles definitely boosts a players chances of winning but honestly it shouldn't be that significant in deciding who wins (again all my own opinion).

It's funny how when Ronaldo scores more goals than Messi he loses the award because Messi won more silverware. Now when Messi scores more but doesn't have titles he earned it.

"Real Madrid's Cristiano Ronaldo outscores Barcelona's Lionel Messi in 2011 - but the Argentine has the last laugh with five trophies to one"

http://www.goal.com/en/news/1717/editorial/2011/12/25/2815454/real-madrids-cristiano-ronaldo-outscores-barcelonas-lionel-messi-

MaroonAndGreen

Messi has been the best player this year again, and he deserves to win it, I hope he does.

Dont like this attitude it would be nice for Iniesta to win, for a change from Messi.

He's the best, he should get it.

764dak

Bohrio wrote: »

Ok I tell you what,, show me a link where ronaldo says he will vote messi, and another one where messi said I wouldnt have ronaldo in my top 3 or 4 and you win.

Ronaldo was trolling Messi because Messi said he would vote for Xavi, Iniesta and either Aguero, Di Maria or Higuain.

Messi: "Last year, I voted for Xavi, Iniesta and Aguero, in that order." "I reckon this year it will be the same. I have not thought about it yet, but it will be more or less the same." "Xavi and Iniesta will be there for sure and I am thinking between [Gonzalo] Higuain, [Angel] Di Maria or Aguero."

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/sport/football/article-2228180/Cristiano-Ronaldo-vote-win-Ballon-dOr.html

Ronaldo: "Messi and I are different, that's for sure. I respect him a lot. Messi can win [the Balon d'Or] but so can Xavi or [Andrés] Iniesta. And we cannot forget [Didier] Drogba or [Radamel] Falcao. They can also receive the trophy."
http://www.guardian.co.uk/football/2012/nov/06/cristiano-ronaldo-lionel-messi-balondor

Cristiano Ronaldo: "Right now, Messi is the best player in the world."
This quote, although, proves that he would vote for Messi.
http://www.ronaldo7.net/news/archive/news99.html

Cristiano Ronaldo: "This debate shouldn't be about who is better. I simply don't like being compared with anybody at all. Some people say that I'm better than Messi and others say that it's the other way around, but at the end of the day [probably alluding to the FIFA World Player 2012 award], they have to decide who is the best player in World at that moment. I think it's me... [laugh]"
http://www.ronaldo7.net/news/2012/504-cristiano-ronaldo-resparks-the-debate-by-saying-to-CNN-that-he-is-better-than-lionel-messi.html
This proves that he thinks Messi is best player without including himself.

I win.

Oh, and the reason why the BBallon d'Or is given is not for scoring more goals, (that's what the golden boot is for)

Why do people still bring up Messi's stats?

You still havent given any reason why Ronaldo is better, hence, you must be trolling...

You haven't even given a reason why Messi is better.

Skylinehead

764dak wrote: »

You haven't even given a reason why Messi is better.

80-odd goals?

Essien

Eventually, they might start handing out honours like 'The award for footballs all round top bloke who may or may not vote for his rival in a hypothetical situation'.

I reckon that one could be a while away yet, so for now we'll just stick to honours for being the best performer in the game.....which is Messi.

Bohrio

You make it so easy...

764dak wrote: »

Ronaldo was trolling Messi because Messi said he would vote for Xavi, Iniesta and either Aguero, Di Maria or Higuain.

Messi: "Last year, I voted for Xavi, Iniesta and Aguero, in that order." "I reckon this year it will be the same. I have not thought about it yet, but it will be more or less the same." "Xavi and Iniesta will be there for sure and I am thinking between [Gonzalo] Higuain, [Angel] Di Maria or Aguero."

Reason why... two barcelona players and 3 argentinian, he was born in Argentina, and he plays for barcelona... Its normal for a player to do this, casillas did the same thing. But I actually agree with him, at least in 2011, Iniesta and Xavi, IMO were better.

Ronaldo: "Messi and I are different, that's for sure. I respect him a lot. Messi can win [the Balon d'Or] but so can Xavi or [Andrés] Iniesta. And we cannot forget [Didier] Drogba or [Radamel] Falcao. They can also receive the trophy."

Messi can win... Doesnt say he will vote for him

Cristiano Ronaldo: "Right now, Messi is the best player in the world."
This quote, although, proves that he would vote for Messi.

No it doesnt. Ronaldo said that in 2011 because he felt, that, at that moment, messi was better. But he didnt say he will vote for him, otherwise, he wouldnt have said he would vote for himself like he said.

Cristiano Ronaldo: "This debate shouldn't be about who is better. I simply don't like being compared with anybody at all. Some people say that I'm better than Messi and others say that it's the other way around, but at the end of the day [probably alluding to the FIFA World Player 2012 award], they have to decide who is the best player in World at that moment. I think it's me... [laugh]"

This proves that he thinks Messi is best player without including himself.

No it doesnt... although he probably knows he isnt, I mean, I think he might.

You haven't even given a reason why Messi is better.

I never said neither messi was better than ronaldo nor the other way around.
But if you ask, I agree with Ronaldo, Messi is better than him.

Put it this way, when people talk about Messi they compare him with Maradona, Pele, etc...

when people talk about Ronaldo they compare him to Messi.

In fact, I think Ronaldo will like much better if he would be a bit more modest.

Anyway, reasons, a few already have been given...

in reference to Ronaldo, Worse team player, less goals, less assists. Seems pretty obvious at this point (at least to the majority of people) that Messi is the better of the two.

But you said

Ronaldo is superior to Messi and Iniesta but Messi will win it.

So I understand people saying Ronaldo is better (even though you said Ronaldo himself think he isnt so I dont understand why you think Ronaldo is) but I was just wondering in what aspects do you think Ronaldo is better than Messi...

I win.

I am afraid not.

Essien

764dak wrote: »

Best performer? Where was Messi when his team needed him the most in April?

He was getting knocked out of the Champions League semis, just like Ronaldo.

Fortunately, there are 12 months in the year, one where Messi is on the verge of breaking a long standing record for goal scoring in Europe.

764dak

Essien wrote: »

He was getting knocked out of the Champions League semis, just like Ronaldo.

Fortunately, there are 12 months in the year, one where Messi is on the verge of breaking a long standing record for goal scoring in Europe.

Ronaldo scored the winning goal against Barca. He also assisted in the first leg and scored two goals in the second leg against Bayern.

764dak

Skylinehead wrote: »

80-odd goals?

Scoring a lot doesn't make you better.

Talib Fiasco

764dak wrote: »

Scoring a lot doesn't make you better.

Then why is Ronaldo always nominated for these awards???

Bohrio

764dak wrote: »

Scoring a lot doesn't make you better.

True, breaking a 42 year old world record makes you outstanding...

Btw, what is all this argument about, as you have already said, if Ronaldo himself thinks Messi is better there is nothing to argue, so whats the problem?

I still think there is a chance they will give the price to someone else apart from messi.

MaroonAndGreen

Iniesta may win because of the Euros.

But he does not deserve to, no way.

Glico Man

MaroonAndGreen wrote: »

Iniesta may win because of the Euros.

But he does not deserve to, no way.

Why doesn't he? Both Spain and Barça struggle when he doesn't play. He was the key figure to helping Spain win the Euros.

Its unquestionably going to be Messi for his sheer unwavering brilliance, but Iniesta does deserve his name in the top 3 and with a shot of winning.

MaroonAndGreen

aaronh007 wrote: »

Why doesn't he? Both Spain and Barça struggle when he doesn't play. He was the key figure to helping Spain win the Euros.

Its unquestionably going to be Messi for his sheer unwavering brilliance, but Iniesta does deserve his name in the top 3 and with a shot of winning.

He doesnt deserve to win because Messi and Ronaldo have both been better in 2012. Simple as that, not denying that Iniesta has been brilliant, just not been better than the other two.

cournioni

I voted Ronaldo because without him, Real wouldn't have won La Liga, got to the semi finals of the Champions League and Portugal wouldn't have got to the semi finals of the Euros either. He is one player that could make any team in the world successful. I don't believe Messi could do that.

ionadnapokot

Messi.
Level of performances are still outstanding. Consistency levels are amazing. His free role from the point of attack is rare in modern day football. Influence he exerts on games, on and off the ball, are often the decisive elements in games. His hunger is still there. His Respect of his teammates, opponents and the game itself all add up to make him an absolute joy to watch.

Iniesta a close second

Essien

I reckon if any other player did what Messi did (or is still doing) this year, there wouldn't even be 3 options, it would be a shoe in.

I think this a case of a player being a victim of his own success, on some level, we all kind of knew he was capable of it. Now he's on the verge of breaking the record, I don't think many people are particularly surprised by it.

Im not saying he's not getting enough praise, but I reckon if Rooney, Falcao, Ibrahimovic or any other forward in the next tier were to hit these heights, then this poll would be considerably more one sided than it already is.

Andersonisgod

Messi. When you really think about what he has done over the course of the year it is jaw dropping. Though a special mention must go to Andres Iniesta, the best player at the Euros, continues to regularly produce magic in the Barcelona midfield alongside the finest midfielder of his generation, Xavi, a very special player in a once in a lifetime team.

Donnielighto

messi is better in the barca team but wouldnt have the impact that ronaldo would in pretty much any other team in the world id say. unquestionably the two greatest players ever seen but ronaldo wins out

Bodhisopha

Donnielighto wrote: »

messi is better in the barca team but wouldnt have the impact that ronaldo would in pretty much any other team in the world id say. unquestionably the two greatest players ever seen but ronaldo wins out

Why do you think that? Messi is a more complete player, better passer, dribbler, more versatile, regarded by most as a better team player. Interested to hear your views.

cournioni

Bodhisopha wrote: »

Why do you think that? Messi is a more complete player, better passer, dribbler, more versatile, regarded by most as a better team player. Interested to hear your views.

Better passer and a better dribbler I agree, marginally. However I totally disagree with you on Messi being a more complete player or more versatile.

Messi doesn't have the power and ability to score from crosses that Ronaldo has. You only have to look at the amount of headers that Ronaldo scores. You couldn't see Messi doing well as Ronaldo would at Stoke for example. Ronaldo also has a better ability from long range shots and in my opinion is far better when it comes to a counter attack.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nvzJ-tW9sS0

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=t-b2We0-gKQ

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cWnGmBJV4xA

... and those goals are for United alone.

Liam O

As much as I advocate Ronaldo being as good as Messi, the idea Messi would struggle against Stoke is laughable.

Marty McFly

I'd like to see Ronaldo get it, I do feel Messi is the better player but im giving it to Ronaldo purely on sympath ybecasue at any other time in the history of football he probaly would have won it a fw times already, that and along with consistency at the highest level over years now he deserves an accolade to highlight just how good he has been.

GavRedKing

Right lads, I've had to delete a few posts and hand out cards due to trolling/back seat modding.

Try to adhere to the charter please.

cournioni

Liam O wrote: »

As much as I advocate Ronaldo being as good as Messi, the idea Messi would struggle against Stoke is laughable.

Not against Stoke, playing for Stoke.

Liam O

cournioni wrote: »

Not against Stoke, playing for Stoke.

ah right sorry, yeah I'd probably agree but that still doesn't make him a better player. You could say Messi might do better for a load of Argentine or Brazilian clubs than Ronaldo

Bodhisopha

cournioni wrote: »

Better passer and a better dribbler I agree, marginally. However I totally disagree with you on Messi being a more complete player or more versatile.

Messi doesn't have the power and ability to score from crosses that Ronaldo has. You only have to look at the amount of headers that Ronaldo scores. You couldn't see Messi doing well as Ronaldo would at Stoke for example. Ronaldo also has a better ability from long range shots and in my opinion is far better when it comes to a counter attack.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nvzJ-tW9sS0

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=t-b2We0-gKQ

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cWnGmBJV4xA

... and those goals are for United alone.

He is not marginally the better passer and dribbler, he is well ahead of Ronaldo in both regards but granted, Ronaldo is better in the air. He doesn't score that many headers, but he is very strong in that respect.

Messi is easily the most versatile, can play on the wings, play striker and he can drop deep and be just as effective as Iniesta and Xavi through the middle. I could see Messi reinventing himself in a deeper role later in his career when he loses that yard of pace. I think Ronaldo will struggle more than Messi as their physical attributes wane. As for counter attacking, Ronaldo is very effective in teams adept at counter attacking but i see nothing about Messi's game that suggests he couldn't be equally as effective. Great passer, great dribbler, good burst of pace. Why not?

Nuri Sahin

Liam O wrote: »

ah right sorry, yeah I'd probably agree but that still doesn't make him a better player. You could say Messi might do better for a load of Argentine or Brazilian clubs than Ronaldo

Indeed, but for many the football world consists of only the EPL and Barca and Real.. sorry, La Liga

___


On another note, absolute joke Klopp wasn't nominated for coach of the year.