Time for Local TD's to start supporting Knock.

Sponge Bob

I'll link the stories without quoting from them (per rules). I'll just COMMENT on them.

I do not believe either or both of these links prove that €460m has been invested by the taxpayer, in Shannon, since 2003.

1. This confused mess emanating from a Sinn Féiner may say that €460 has been invested since 2003 in Shannon or may say €160m instead...and that same €160m number is mentioned twice.

> http://www.mayonews.ie/index.php?option=com_content&view=article&id=16932:government-called-on-to-act-fast-to-secure-knocks-future&catid=23:news&Itemid=46

Quoting Sinn Féin numbers at FG councillors (EG most in Mayo) or FG ministers (all Mayo ministers) is not a good idea. Even if the Shinners are right.

2. If we look at this article here > http://www.donegalnow.com/sp/article_manager/detail/govt_pledges_to_back_future_development_of_knock_airport which states Shannon WILL RECEIVE €300

We can tenously arrive at a figure of €460m from:

1) The Shinners and their €160m + 2) 'Varadkars €300m'

Which is a start I suppose. However I doubt both of these equally....most especially the €300m.

WHO EXACTLY estimated the taxpayer is puting €300m into Shannon....I''ll concede the €100m Aer Rianta debt takeover to help start the count to €300m if that is any help.

Sponge Bob

Sponge Bob wrote: »

Local politicians can realistically either have Knock or the Western Rail Corridor but not both.

When were we given a choice ?

Sponge Bob

Deleted User wrote: »

When were we given a choice ?

When the councillors decided to forego the expenses they get for going to Western Inter County Railway Committee meetings and supported the WRC free of chareg from the decency of their hearts.

This committee has quietly kept on a giving of the expenses since 1977 by the way,

Sponge Bob

Sponge Bob wrote: »

I'll link the stories without quoting from them (per rules). I'll just COMMENT on them.

I do not believe either or both of these links prove that €460m has been invested by the taxpayer, in Shannon, since 2003.

1. This confused mess emanating from a Sinn Féiner may say that €460 has been invested since 2003 in Shannon or may say €160m instead...and that same €160m number is mentioned twice.

> http://www.mayonews.ie/index.php?option=com_content&view=article&id=16932:government-called-on-to-act-fast-to-secure-knocks-future&catid=23:news&Itemid=46

Quoting Sinn Féin numbers at FG councillors (EG most in Mayo) or FG ministers (all Mayo ministers) is not a good idea. Even if the Shinners are right.

2. If we look at this article here > http://www.donegalnow.com/sp/article_manager/detail/govt_pledges_to_back_future_development_of_knock_airport which states Shannon WILL RECEIVE €300

We can tenously arrive at a figure of €460m from:

1) The Shinners and their €160m + 2) 'Varadkars €300m'

Which is a start I suppose. However I doubt both of these equally....most especially the €300m.

WHO EXACTLY estimated the taxpayer is puting €300m into Shannon....I''ll concede the €100m Aer Rianta debt takeover to help start the count to €300m if that is any help.

You don't believe councillors, or Ministers, what about Senators ?
http://www.sligotoday.ie/details.php?id=23983

I have a feeling if the Shannon PR told you it was only a 5 Million bailout you would prefer that number and take it as fact. Some can see no wrong when it comes to Shannon. Your 100 million value is counting all that land as zero, and the annual 13 million in taxpayers rent as zero.

Sponge Bob

Deleted User wrote: »

I have a feeling if the Shannon PR told you it was only a 5 Million bailout you would prefer that number and take it as fact.

I conceded €100m did I not. Its a good start when one must reach a figure of €460m spent since 2003

I'd be as leery of an FF senator as I would be of any Shinner, even a Shinner who can count. > http://www.sligotoday.ie/details.php?id=23983

Sponge Bob

Sponge Bob wrote: »

I conceded €100m did I not. Its a good start when one must reach a figure of €460m spent since 2003

I'd be as leery of an FF senator as I would be of any Shinner, even a Shinner who can count. > http://www.sligotoday.ie/details.php?id=23983

You needn't worry about the WRC, never going to happen. If the Sligo Charlestown road gets done it will kill it off for good. Time for the western ministers to deliver some goodies before 2016.

Sponge Bob

Time for the Government to get rid of the Western Intercounty Railway Committee then and appoint ONE councillor ONLY from each of Galway Mayo and Sligo to the Board of Knock Airport instead. Cheaper, more practical, and gives entities outside Mayo some skin in the game.

If Knock is to survive it must appeal to Galway and Sligo as well....surely. I live equidistant form Knock and Shannon but rarely have any reason to use Knock....no way to get in and out of London in a day via Knock.

Sponge Bob

Sponge Bob wrote: »

If Knock is to survive it must appeal to Galway and Sligo as well....surely. I live equidistant form Knock and Shannon but rarely have any reason to use Knock....no way to get in and out of London in a day via Knock.

Thats solely down to a lack of funding. They keep the airport open for limited hours to save money.

If they got 10% of the funding Shannon gets they would not have this problem, its very easy to have a full service airport if the taxpayer keeps bailing it out.

It would make sense for the government as it would allow further business to be assisted through this regional gateway.

Sponge Bob

I think you need to be more scrupulous in saying that Shannon Airport receives 10x what Knock receives and to be very careful about relying on numbers kited by an FF Senator and by SF to arrive at a frankly outlandish figure of €460m.....and which outlandish figure was not spent since 2003 as you asserted.

Sponge Bob

Sponge Bob wrote: »

I think you need to be more scrupulous in saying that Shannon Airport receives 10x what Knock receives and to be very careful about relying on numbers kited by an FF Senator and by SF to arrive at a frankly outlandish figure of €460m.....and which outlandish figure was not spent since 2003 as you asserted.

As i have already explained. Shannon had already recieved 160 million from 2003 onwards. It got a further debt write off of 100 million last year.

Thats €260 million so far in direct cash funding.

It also got a massive land bank to do with as it see's fit. Parts of this is in Limerick city and Tralee. It will also get rents of 13 million every year, this previously went to the taxpayer. These two combined have been estimated as 200 million over a number of years.

That gives a total of €460 million. I do not know how to make it any clearer. If you want to believe otherwise that's up to you.

Sponge Bob

Any FG TD who learns that off and goes off to lobby Varadkar on that basis will be laughed off as a right healyraeesque bumpkin...but you are free to peddle your €460m figure in the past 10 years as you wish.

irishgeo

the lack of ability to get in and out of London in one days is going to be the end of knock.

From Galway technology park its an 1hr to shannon airport and an hour to knock airport.

cant understand why they dont push aer lingus or ryanair on this.

Sponge Bob

irishgeo wrote: »

the lack of ability to get in and out of London in one days is going to be the end of knock..

Could be the end of Knock. If they dedicate themeselves to getting a 7-8am to London coming in at 10pm that night then no.

Business travellers tend to be versed in contract law and this silly €10 charge won't go down well with them, that'll have to go as well.

Neworder79

cant understand why they dont push aer lingus or ryanair on this.

Both are keen from what I hear, EI stuck on LHR slots.

From April Ryanair are operating double daily Stansted with evening services on Friday and Sunday to facilitate day return, London workers and weekend visitors (as well as Gatwick and Luton daily). See homepage news http://www.irelandwestairport.com

Not a full double daily service yet, the airport contend that they are constrained by the cost of operating a full evening schedule.
Would hope once the financial structure is agreed with Government they will be in a more secure situation to expand.

silly €10 charge won't go down well with them

I don't understand how everyone thinks they can just scrap this in the morning when the CEO has said on several occasions it's the main funding source and without it they would close in the morning, and that they would need to be carrying 1m+ to change it.

And I doubt business travellers of all people would give a damn about €10 if it offered them convenience and direct access locally (frequency is their concern).

The best way forward is following the 4 month development plan, Government agree a long-term, sustainable funding and capital development program with the airport. That levels the playing field somewhat, and then it's up to Knock to deliver on the promised growth and jobs and reach a sustainable income level, just as Shannon has to now.

Shannon and Knock are both valuable assets, and can thrive and serve business and tourism air access, as well as job creation across the SW/W/NW regions, if consolidated, run sustainably and supported by sensible national policy. This was the policy recommend in the last VFM review of regional airports, an no doubt will be the same advice given in the new aviation policy document due next year.

Sponge Bob

Neworder79 wrote: »

And I doubt business travellers of all people would give a damn about €10 if it offered them convenience and direct access locally (frequency is their concern).

All they have to do is collect the €10 charge at booking like every other airport charge. I have no issue with it once disclosed at booking.

The new 'morning' flight to Stansted will do nothing to change my view. If I fly Shannon - Stansted in the morning I'll be in Liverpool St at around 9am where the Knock flight does not take off for Stansted until nearer 10am which means I wont be in Liverpool St till nearer midday. No thanks.

Always remember I am in Galway and I am indifferent as to whether I fly from Knock or from Shannon. I must also get through Claregalway by 7:30 am latest and will find myself heel kicking for an hour in Knock as a side effect. There is no heel kicking with Shannon, straight there and on the plane a few minutes later, no traffic issues.

The new Knock Stansted flights are great for weekenders but not for business travellers outbound from the west ....although coming in for a days business from the UK and getting out same day is now entirely feasible. I can see myself collecting people in Knock more often...on a friday only.

finisklin

looks like internal strife in fine gael over this and Inda has made a hames of coordinating an internal FG approach. :eek: Interesting that Mulherin is coming out smelling of roses on this.

It doesnt help Knock though......

From here

finisklin

finisklin wrote: »

looks like internal strife in fine gael over this and Inda has made a hames of coordinating an internal FG approach. :eek: Interesting that Mulherin is coming out smelling of roses on this.

It doesnt help Knock though......

From here

Enda's seat will be on the line for ignoring this for so long. Noonan took care of Shannon while Kenny/Ring sat there like a dummies.

nuac

Enda's seat in Mayo is safe as long as he is Taoiseach.

Ml Ring's seat is safe whether or not he is a Minister.

Mulherin's seat under more risk. She is right to assert herself.

the other 3 FG TDs are reaching pensionable retirement age.

She is younger. If she wishes to stay in politics she needs to keep her profile high

finisklin

nuac wrote: »

She is younger. If she wishes to stay in politics she needs to keep her profile high

Her choice of issues hasn't exactly resonated with her constituents to date......:rolleyes:

Not sure if pissing off your constituency colleague who happens to be the taoiseach is a wise move.

Once Inda relinquishes Taoiseach-ship, he won't run agin. His brother will run in his place.

nuac

finisklin wrote: »

Her choice of issues hasn't exactly resonated with her constituents to date......:rolleyes:

Not sure if pissing off your constituency colleague who happens to be the taoiseach is a wise move.

Once Inda relinquishes Taoiseach-ship, he won't run agin. His brother will run in his place.

Some of M Mulherin's issues may resonate with her electorate.

Many Mayo people would be agin fornication, and have a conservate view on abortion.

As for disagreeing with Enda - hasn't done Lucinda much harm.

If Enda retires, Jude might well run, but there would be competition for the nomination - e.g. Paddy Bourke ( if Seanad abolished ) Cyril Bourke, Patsy O'Brien ( big LE vote-getter ) plus Castlebat TC FG Councillors

greenlakes1

I do not think that Michelle Mulherin will be taking a seat in the 32 dail whenever that election is called. Her recent argument with Enda Kenny will annoy all those that are great supporters of his around Mayo. I know that her local FG team dont really support her with little to know one from the party supporting her event evenings. I have been to one and while I was there I could see why. She went off the point and talked about something totally different to the fiscal stability treaty and then took to the bar after the discussion speaking only to a small group of people that included her (special) guests and staff and didnt really take any questions for those who attended the event.
She has fought with radio presenters live on air and has lambasted members of her own party for not telling her what they are up to. She has lost staff due to her in ability to hold on to them and was caught by a staff member lying to her constituents about where they came from and what office they had previously worked in.

I cant see her taking her seat again. She needs to have her head screwed on to be a TD and thats not the case.
I live in her town and I used to attend FG meetings until about 6 months into her first term.

nuac

greenlakes1 wrote: »

I do not think that Michelle Mulherin will be taking a seat in the 32 dail whenever that election is called. Her recent argument with Enda Kenny will annoy all those that are great supporters of his around Mayo. I know that her local FG team dont really support her with little to know one from the party supporting her event evenings. I have been to one and while I was there I could see why. She went off the point and talked about something totally different to the fiscal stability treaty and then took to the bar after the discussion speaking only to a small group of people that included her (special) guests and staff and didnt really take any questions for those who attended the event.
She has fought with radio presenters live on air and has lambasted members of her own party for not telling her what they are up to. She has lost staff due to her in ability to hold on to them and was caught by a staff member lying to her constituents about where they came from and what office they had previously worked in.

I cant see her taking her seat again. She needs to have her head screwed on to be a TD and thats not the case.
I live in her town and I used to attend FG meetings until about 6 months into her first term.

Your very first post, Greenlakes1?

Pity it had to be so negative

http://www.mayonews.ie/index.php?option=com_content&view=article&id=17096:knock-airport-loses-two-continental-routes&catid=23:news&Itemid=46

Two routes now gone from knock, With shannon appearing to only target the routes that Knock use it could be the start of the end for Knock
This was always going to be the plan for Shannon, remove Knock as competition by using taxpayers money. They will have the taxpayers money to undercut Knock until it closes.

Well done Enda Kenny you have driven another nail into the West of Ireland coffin.

nuac

Deleted User wrote: »

http://www.mayonews.ie/index.php?option=com_content&view=article&id=17096:knock-airport-loses-two-continental-routes&catid=23:news&Itemid=46

Two routes now gone from knock, With shannon appearing to only target the routes that Knock use it could be the start of the end for Knock
This was always going to be the plan for Shannon, remove Knock as competition by using taxpayers money. They will have the taxpayers money to undercut Knock until it closes.

Well done Enda Kenny you have driven another nail into the West of Ireland coffin.

Yes loss of these routes is worrying.

That taskforce or whatever chaired by John O'Mahoney would need to report quickly'

Neworder79

The "task force" is not even set up yet! Will take 4 months to tender for consultants alone according to JOM...
The airport already have a 20 year development plan and a Enterprise plan done by Shannon Development.

Enda: