The once mighty Dutch league?

NIMAN

I think any team that played Man City off the park with 7 players that came through their youth system and who cost €3million is to be admired in this day and age of wasting money on mercenaries who care not a jot about the club they play for.

8-10

Just a follow up on the selling-club label. That's not necessarily a bad thing. It actually gives a feeling of pride to have players go on from Ajax to be successful.

I regularly look at Schalke's scores to see if Huntelaar played and scored. I follow Liverpool in England so it's great to be able to see Suarez playing so well and scoring goals. Ibrahimovic is Ibrahimovic, not a player we brought through, but a player we were lucky to have for a few seasons, he's awesome. I hate Arsenal but used to look out for Overmars and Bergkamp as much as I could. Kluivert to a certain extent. And more recently lesser-successful players like Hedwiges Maduro or Mitchell Donald who I really liked at Ajax have at least got me increasing my football knowledge by looking at their games here and there.

Every club sells their players. But when you support a team that brings a lot of players through, there's a certain satisfaction in following their career progress after, and a feeling of pride when they do well. You can probably find the old interviews with our current assistant Bergkamp where he'll mention how being forced to play in every position going through the ranks in the Ajax academy made him into the player he became. He said only by playing extensively at centre-half could he have become such a good forward player, as it gave him the knowledge of how the opposition player thinks and moves.

If anyone ever goes to Amsterdam, I hugely recommend trying to get to view some of the youth training sessions or games. I haven't been to one in the guts of 10 years, but if you're a football fan and watch or have played under-age yourself, it's really really terrific watching these kids playing the same formation and system as the first team. Right down to under-4's (I think that's the youngest). If you get the chance in the pre-season, August sort of time, you'll get good access to the first team training (if it's still the same as it was), as they'll play regular practice matches.

We may not be CL contenders anymore, but it doesn't mean we're not still a strong club.

And for the quote about PSV, I 100% agree, they were phenomenal over a couple of seasons back then, and even looking very dominant this year though not sure they'd be as competitive in Europe. Another very well run club, who are going to win the league I reckon (currently a point off)

8-10

Also can we make this the Ajax Superthread?

Would like a place to discuss this season if people are interested in following (I know it's not quite Boards' favourite Go Ahead Eagles...)

Cienciano

8-10 wrote: »

Just a follow up on the selling-club label. That's not necessarily a bad thing. It actually gives a feeling of pride to have players go on from Ajax to be successful.

I regularly look at Schalke's scores to see if Huntelaar played and scored. I follow Liverpool in England so it's great to be able to see Suarez playing so well and scoring goals. Ibrahimovic is Ibrahimovic, not a player we brought through, but a player we were lucky to have for a few seasons, he's awesome. I hate Arsenal but used to look out for Overmars and Bergkamp as much as I could. Kluivert to a certain extent. And more recently lesser-successful players like Hedwiges Maduro or Mitchell Donald who I really liked at Ajax have at least got me increasing my football knowledge by looking at their games here and there.

Every club sells their players. But when you support a team that brings a lot of players through, there's a certain satisfaction in following their career progress after, and a feeling of pride when they do well. You can probably find the old interviews with our current assistant Bergkamp where he'll mention how being forced to play in every position going through the ranks in the Ajax academy made him into the player he became. He said only by playing extensively at centre-half could he have become such a good forward player, as it gave him the knowledge of how the opposition player thinks and moves.

If anyone ever goes to Amsterdam, I hugely recommend trying to get to view some of the youth training sessions or games. I haven't been to one in the guts of 10 years, but if you're a football fan and watch or have played under-age yourself, it's really really terrific watching these kids playing the same formation and system as the first team. Right down to under-4's (I think that's the youngest). If you get the chance in the pre-season, August sort of time, you'll get good access to the first team training (if it's still the same as it was), as they'll play regular practice matches.

We may not be CL contenders anymore, but it doesn't mean we're not still a strong club.

And for the quote about PSV, I 100% agree, they were phenomenal over a couple of seasons back then, and even looking very dominant this year though not sure they'd be as competitive in Europe. Another very well run club, who are going to win the league I reckon (currently a point off)

Not only do they play in the same formation, but it's very unusual to get a player that can just play in one position, they can always play about 3 or 4 very well. Sort of a team of skillful john osheas

dreamers75

NIMAN wrote: »

I think any team that played Man City off the park with 7 players that came through their youth system and who cost €3million is to be admired in this day and age of wasting money on mercenaries who care not a jot about the club they play for.

Irony of your post is that those 7 and many many many others will go on to be mercenaries for other clubs.

Ajax are rubbish because everyone copied their model, copied and injected millions into copying it, steal kids from anyone and everyone at whatever age and then professionaly coach them from a young age.

So in theory its their own fault :pac:

Jelle1880

dreamers75 wrote: »

Irony of your post is that those 7 and many many many others will go on to be mercenaries for other clubs.

Ajax are rubbish because everyone copied their model, copied and injected millions into copying it, steal kids from anyone and everyone at whatever age and then professionaly coach them from a young age.

So in theory its their own fault :pac:

And how exactly are Ajax 'rubbish' ?

dreamers75

Jelle1880 wrote: »

And how exactly are Ajax 'rubbish' ?

By being not very good

Have you watched them since 95? Have you watched them in Europe? They were top of the food chain at one point.

Jelle1880

Yeah, and ?

Times change, the EPL and the inflated Sky money, the duopoly in Spain,... all meant that powers shifted.

That doesn't mean Ajax are 'rubbish' though, they're just not filthy rich.
On the contrary, I sometimes watch highlights of the Eredivisie and saw some of their CL games, and I think they're playing some beautiful football at times, back to their roots if you will.

Frank de Boer and Bergkamp really turned that team around.

super_furry

They just can't afford to keep their best players for more than two seasons. There's no shortage of European clubs wait to give Ajax's best players 60,000 a week.

dreamers75

Jelle1880 wrote: »

Yeah, and ?

Times change, the EPL and the inflated Sky money, the duopoly in Spain,... all meant that powers shifted.

That doesn't mean Ajax are 'rubbish' though, they're just not filthy rich.
On the contrary, I sometimes watch highlights of the Eredivisie and saw some of their CL games, and I think they're playing some beautiful football at times, back to their roots if you will.

Frank de Boer and Bergkamp really turned that team around.

From top of the food chain to bit part players and mostly because of how they targetted and trained players.

They have been playing 433 for 40 odd years so unsure of what you mean by "back to their roots".

They havent turned the team round, please read up on Ajax and how the entire board resigned. I dont think there are highlights on tv about that.

And yes they are rubbish, but rubbish in the sense of not being a top club anymore or someone to be feared. im sure the dutch league fears them.....well some of them.

Jelle1880

I think you need to re-evaluate your views on 'rubbish'

I'm fully aware of what happened with Cruijff etc., de Boer and Bergkamp have most definitely turned things around in that Ajax is back to playing some very good stuff.

Their formation doesn't mean anything, the few years before they took over Ajax was pretty crap.

NIMAN

Ajax play decent football but the fact that they lost 8-2 to Madrid on agg suggests that the top level teams are in a different class to them.

No shame in that though, as the likes of Madrid, Barca etc have so much money its hard to compete with them.

8-10

super_furry wrote: »

They just can't afford to keep their best players for more than two seasons.

Zlatan Ibrahimovic lasted more than 2 seasons, Luis Suarez more than 2 seasons, Rafa van der Vaart more than 2 seasons, Stekelenberg, Sneijder, Tommy Vermaelen, Chivu, Emanuelson, Christian Eriksen who's still there, Nigel de Jong, Vertonghen, Siem de Jong, Huntelaar, van der Wiel.....

all lasted more than 2 seasons. What players are you talking about? Who in the last 10years has been one of our best players yet played less than 2 seasons?

(older players like Litmanen, Jaap Stam and Edgar Davids wouldn't count, I think your argument is about younger players.)

I'm genuinely interested in who you mean. For me Suarez, Zlatan, Chivu (though slightly longer ago) and van der Vaart were our best players in that timeframe.

pmy.murphy

8-10 wrote: »

Zlatan Ibrahimovic lasted more than 2 seasons, Luis Suarez more than 2 seasons, Rafa van der Vaart more than 2 seasons, Stekelenberg, Sneijder, Tommy Vermaelen, Chivu, Emanuelson, Christian Eriksen who's still there, Nigel de Jong, Vertonghen, Siem de Jong, Huntelaar, van der Wiel.....

all lasted more than 2 seasons. What players are you talking about? Who in the last 10years has been one of our best players yet played less than 2 seasons?

(older players like Litmanen, Jaap Stam and Edgar Davids wouldn't count, I think your argument is about younger players.)

I'm genuinely interested in who you mean. For me Suarez, Zlatan, Chivu (though slightly longer ago) and van der Vaart were our best players in that timeframe.

Just thought Id restart this Ajax discussion again because its very interesting as they would be my favourite team aside from Liverpool. Interesting to see rumours of so many of their best players leaving again this summer, Niklas Moisander, Van Rhijn, Viktor Fischer, Daley Blind the obvious one after his great World Cup. Siem de Jong has already left for Newcastle and Kolbeinn Sigthorsson is also due to leave for QPR. Its sad that they cant keep these players for a couple of seasons and be competitive onto the scale of a Porto or a Benfica who were in the Europa League Final again the season just gone

8-10

pmy.murphy wrote: »

Just thought Id restart this Ajax discussion again because its very interesting as they would be my favourite team aside from Liverpool. Interesting to see rumours of so many of their best players leaving again this summer, Niklas Moisander, Van Rhijn, Viktor Fischer, Daley Blind the obvious one after his great World Cup. Siem de Jong has already left for Newcastle and Kolbeinn Sigthorsson is also due to leave for QPR. Its sad that they cant keep these players for a couple of seasons and be competitive onto the scale of a Porto or a Benfica who were in the Europa League Final again the season just gone

I'd want Blind and Fischer to stay as I think they have a lot to contribute. Siem did a great job for a number of years and I'm 'happy' to see him go, will be keeping an eye on his performances at Newcastle.

van Rhijn is ripe for a move and couldn't really begrudge him if he goes to a big team.

Davy Klaassen is the man to watch at the moment though, think he'll have a good season. Will be interesting to see what the first XI will be this year once transfer stuff has settled. Not overly optimistic about winning the title this year, as you say a lot of departures might mean a period of transition but in fairness I'd have said the same last summer.

As usual I'm hoping for a kind CL group and as usual I'm expecting the group of death! Like you I'm also a Liverpool fan and have never seen the teams meet (don't think they ever have competitively?) which is mad for 2 teams with 9 European cups between them! But unfortunately it looks like both will be 3rd seeds for the group stages and I don't expect Ajax getting out.

Would be nice if there's enough interest to keep this like a Superthread. I watch pretty much all games so will post this season with anything of note going on!

pmy.murphy

8-10 wrote: »

I'd want Blind and Fischer to stay as I think they have a lot to contribute. Siem did a great job for a number of years and I'm 'happy' to see him go, will be keeping an eye on his performances at Newcastle.

van Rhijn is ripe for a move and couldn't really begrudge him if he goes to a big team.

Davy Klaassen is the man to watch at the moment though, think he'll have a good season. Will be interesting to see what the first XI will be this year once transfer stuff has settled. Not overly optimistic about winning the title this year, as you say a lot of departures might mean a period of transition but in fairness I'd have said the same last summer.

As usual I'm hoping for a kind CL group and as usual I'm expecting the group of death! Like you I'm also a Liverpool fan and have never seen the teams meet (don't think they ever have competitively?) which is mad for 2 teams with 9 European cups between them! But unfortunately it looks like both will be 3rd seeds for the group stages and I don't expect Ajax getting out.

Would be nice if there's enough interest to keep this like a Superthread. I watch pretty much all games so will post this season with anything of note going on!

I would probably say Blind is more ripe to go myself than Van Rhijn, he is older and way more experienced especially after a great World Cup that he just had Fischer is still very young too, cant see him leaving this summer, Id reckon we'll get another 2 seasons out of him, has all the talent in the world but hasnt matured just yet. Its a pity Siem de Jong left though although he has given the club great service and has stuck around longer than most, in that regard you wouldnt begrudge him the move. What Id like to see though is a consistent core group of players staying so De Boer can build the squad around for 2-3 seasons, its so tough when you have players leaving every year and Im not surprised De Boer himself is constantly linked with a move away. Id imagine he is really frustrated and again I think its only a matter of time before he leaves, he will be a tough man to replace.

Say for the next 2 seasons you would like to see a team built around the likes of Cillessen, Blind, Van Rhijn, Moisander, Veltman, Fischer, Lasse Schone. All these guys if they can be kept together for another season or 2 it would be great. Its a pity Ajax dont sign as many experienced players either, Id like to see Van der Vaart brought back, he was linked with a move back in April/May similar to what Van Gaal did with us in the nineties, he brought in Frank Rijkaard and the likes who were on the wrong side of 30 to bring an experienced head to the team. Ajax definately needs 2 or 3 of those guys i think.


Davy Klaasen is one i have heard a lot about too, hes very highly rated, ill be watching a lot of him in the coming season. Along with Liverpool, Ill be keeping a close eye on Ajax this season in the Champions League, Its mad they havent met.

Im sure a superthread would work, plenty of people would be interested in Ajax especially with the way they struggle to keep hold of players. Feyenoord are looking very strong although much depends on how many players they can keep, theyve lost Martins Indi and Graziano Pelle already. PSV could win it this season, they have a pretty strong team especially midfield and Jetro Willems being injured before the World Cup could be a blessing in disguise in that they could keep him for another season

pmy.murphy

8-10 wrote: »

I'd want Blind and Fischer to stay as I think they have a lot to contribute. Siem did a great job for a number of years and I'm 'happy' to see him go, will be keeping an eye on his performances at Newcastle.

van Rhijn is ripe for a move and couldn't really begrudge him if he goes to a big team.

Davy Klaassen is the man to watch at the moment though, think he'll have a good season. Will be interesting to see what the first XI will be this year once transfer stuff has settled. Not overly optimistic about winning the title this year, as you say a lot of departures might mean a period of transition but in fairness I'd have said the same last summer.

As usual I'm hoping for a kind CL group and as usual I'm expecting the group of death! Like you I'm also a Liverpool fan and have never seen the teams meet (don't think they ever have competitively?) which is mad for 2 teams with 9 European cups between them! But unfortunately it looks like both will be 3rd seeds for the group stages and I don't expect Ajax getting out.

Would be nice if there's enough interest to keep this like a Superthread. I watch pretty much all games so will post this season with anything of note going on!

Were you watching the Ajax/PSV game today?

I watched it myself and we enjoyed plenty of the ball really thought we lacked that bit of cutting edge especially up front, got caught out on the break for Depays goal when Lasse Schone had a fantastic chance to put us 2-0 up and PSV went down the other end and scored.

Another thing is Anwar El Ghazi looks class, the next in the conveyor belt of talent, shame he went off injured I think we would have gotten something out of the game if he had stayed on, Schone was quieter today than he normally is. Another thing is Daley Blind, I was actually surprised he played today, think it could be his last game, hes been linked with Man Utd yet again and I do think he will move, there seems to have been movement with regards a potential transfer. Van Rhijn I thought played well today too. Fischer is also due to return from injury soon.

All in all for my first Eredivisie game I found it very enjoyable. Made a promise to start watching Ajax regularly this season. Lacking cutting edge up front I think, Shame we couldnt pull off the Samuel Etoo signing, he chose to follow the money instead of playing in front of 50 odd thousand at the Arena in the Champions League cos lets face it his days as a top player are very much over. If rumours of a bid for Man Citys John Guidetti are to be believed then I think that would be a fantastic signing up front

8-10

pmy.murphy wrote: »

Were you watching the Ajax/PSV game today?

I watched it myself and we enjoyed plenty of the ball really thought we lacked that bit of cutting edge especially up front, got caught out on the break for Depays goal when Lasse Schone had a fantastic chance to put us 2-0 up and PSV went down the other end and scored.

Another thing is Anwar El Ghazi looks class, the next in the conveyor belt of talent, shame he went off injured I think we would have gotten something out of the game if he had stayed on, Schone was quieter today than he normally is. Another thing is Daley Blind, I was actually surprised he played today, think it could be his last game, hes been linked with Man Utd yet again and I do think he will move, there seems to have been movement with regards a potential transfer. Van Rhijn I thought played well today too. Fischer is also due to return from injury soon.

All in all for my first Eredivisie game I found it very enjoyable. Made a promise to start watching Ajax regularly this season. Lacking cutting edge up front I think, Shame we couldnt pull off the Samuel Etoo signing, he chose to follow the money instead of playing in front of 50 odd thousand at the Arena in the Champions League cos lets face it his days as a top player are very much over. If rumours of a bid for Man Citys John Guidetti are to be believed then I think that would be a fantastic signing up front

I still think Eto'o is a possibility. And no unfortunately I was out all afternoon so just had to follow on my phone, haven't gotten around to looking up highlights yet, to be honest I might not in the short term given the result.

I expect to watch a lot more games this season than last though with the new Sky Sports deal.

pmy.murphy

Niki Zimling signed on loan from Mainz to replace Daley Blind

IRISHSPORTSGUY

Ajax is just 1 example of why the abolition of the 3 foreigner rule was terrible for football from a competitive perspective

Countries with the most economic power like England can just cherry pick all the best players. The Eredivisie is now second rate and will never recover

losthorizon

pmy.murphy wrote: »

Niki Zimling signed on loan from Mainz to replace Daley Blind

And Mainz is only a very small German city with quite a small stadium. And on loan.

Remember going to see my team playing Cork City playing Breda and Breda being outplayed.

Was on Holiday in the Netherlands and went to see an Ajax match and you know what? Thers not much difference between the LOI and the Dutch league.

8-10

losthorizon wrote: »

Was on Holiday in the Netherlands and went to see an Ajax match and you know what? Thers not much difference between the LOI and the Dutch league.

:rolleyes: sure there's not

Backstreet Moyes

losthorizon wrote: »

And Mainz is only a very small German city with quite a small stadium. And on loan.

Remember going to see my team playing Cork City playing Breda and Breda being outplayed.

Was on Holiday in the Netherlands and went to see an Ajax match and you know what? Thers not much difference between the LOI and the Dutch league.

Two games fair play a good sample size anyway.

LuckyLloyd

IRISHSPORTSGUY wrote: »

Ajax is just 1 example of why the abolition of the 3 foreigner rule was terrible for football from a competitive perspective

Countries with the most economic power like England can just cherry pick all the best players. The Eredivisie is now second rate and will never recover

Serious question: why should anyone care about that?

The CL is a Beast competition, a pinnacle of sport. Once I'm being entertained I truly do not give a ****.

LuckyLloyd

losthorizon wrote: »

And Mainz is only a very small German city with quite a small stadium. And on loan.

Remember going to see my team playing Cork City playing Breda and Breda being outplayed.

Was on Holiday in the Netherlands and went to see an Ajax match and you know what? Thers not much difference between the LOI and the Dutch league.

lollingtons

losthorizon

Nuts102 wrote: »

Two games fair play a good sample size anyway.

Well I imagine three games is more than youve seen.

You really shouldnt go back more than five years to judge how strong a country's league is imo as they do change quite quickly but LOI teams havent played Dutch teams that many times. And if you read my post I said there wasnt much diffference between the League not that they were the same. Indeed besides the Top four in Holland I would argue that the teams are broadly similar. Vitesse and SC Heerenveen were two others to play here in the 1990s. Broadly similar standard especially SC Heerenveen. if Dordrecht were meeting Cork City I know who I would have my money on.

8-10

losthorizon wrote: »

You really shouldnt go back more than five years to judge how strong a country's league is imo

losthorizon wrote: »

Vitesse and SC Heerenveen were two others to play here in the 1990s. Broadly similar standard especially SC Heerenveen.

Again... :roll eyes:

...why are you quoting 1990 if you're saying not to go back more than 5 years? They've had some quality players since then that you would never see at a LOI club.

You really need to watch more than 2 games.

MightyMandarin

losthorizon wrote: »

if Dordrecht were meeting Cork City I know who I would have my money on.

I know, I'd bet on Dordrecht too

losthorizon

8-10 wrote: »

Again... :roll eyes:

...why are you quoting 1990 if you're saying not to go back more than 5 years? They've had some quality players since then that you would never see at a LOI club.

You really need to watch more than 2 games.

So you have watched no Dutch teams is that what you are saying?

I think you need to go to Holland and watch a few games and then come back here and watch a few games.

Been to games involving many leagues around Europe From Iceland to Sweden To Lithuania To Serbia. And it has to be said that in most cases the standard outside the top one or two teams drops off alarmingly.

In Sweden even found that the champions Djurgardens one of the major clubs there and a household name were alarmingly bad and Cork City had no problems in disposing of them.

8-10

losthorizon wrote: »

So you have watched no Dutch teams is that what you are saying?

Where did you get that from? Now I'm confused!

I didn't mean that at all, I'd estimate I've been to 20-25 eredivisie games but none since 04/05 season (last year I lived over there). Since then I've been mainly watching online but Sky got the rights this season which is great.

It's a poorer league now than 10 years ago, I'll give you that!

losthorizon

Interesting.. what club were you a member of?

pmy.murphy

losthorizon wrote: »

Interesting.. what club were you a member of?

Id probably say the complete opposite, Ive only started watching the Dutch League regularly this season and to be honest its a lot better in quality than I expected. The Ajax V PSV game from a few weeks back was as good a game in terms of open and attacking as I have seen in a long time. It was a very entertaining game and good to watch

spiralism

losthorizon wrote: »

And Mainz is only a very small German city with quite a small stadium. And on loan.

Remember going to see my team playing Cork City playing Breda and Breda being outplayed.

Was on Holiday in the Netherlands and went to see an Ajax match and you know what? Thers not much difference between the LOI and the Dutch league.

Jesus wept.

League snobbery is hilarious sometimes, if its not La Liga, Bundesliga or the Premiership then it's obviously ****e in many people's eyes.

Eredivisie is a great league and one of the most enjoyable things about living in holland. It's a good standard of football, just because it's not the pinnacle doesn't mean it's the LOI either. The atmospheres are generally excellent and it's cheap. I've started making regular trips down from Amsterdam to De Kuip (because i just have to be ****ing different i guess) and i love it. Vak W in De Kuip costs about 23 euro and you have great seats in one of the most atmospheric sections. Give me that over blowing 200 euro in total on going to a Premiership match with no atmosphere these days.

What i love about the league is that it's pure. It is real football with real fans and it's not been spoilt by money, the drawback being that it's been left behind at the top tier.

In that light, ajax's achievements arent to be sniffed at the past few years to whoever's saying it. Sell everyone, often with a day or two left in the window each year and the trophies keep flowing in. De Boer is a genius. Should have got to the Round of 16 last year in europe too only for getting shafted by a Balotelli dive in the group.

8-10

Don't get me wrong I'm not dissing LOI either, have been to a lot of games here too (Mainly Bohs), I just completely dismiss the notion that the leagues are similar. I reckon a top LOI side would struggle in the league, even playing the lower half teams. Agree to disagree on this one I reckon!

8-10

spiralism wrote: »

In that light, ajax's achievements arent to be sniffed at the past few years to whoever's saying it. Sell everyone, often with a day or two left in the window each year and the trophies keep flowing in. De Boer is a genius. Should have got to the Round of 16 last year in europe too only for getting shafted by a Balotelli dive in the group.

Between that and Jon Dahl Tomasson's injury time goal in 2003...not a big fan of Milan. That night was heartbreaking, second's away from a CL semi final at a time when the team was good enough to go on and win it.

spiralism

8-10 wrote: »

Don't get me wrong I'm not dissing LOI either, have been to a lot of games here too (Mainly Bohs), I just completely dismiss the notion that the leagues are similar. I reckon a top LOI side would struggle in the league, even playing the lower half teams. Agree to disagree on this one I reckon!

Still reckon a top LOI side would struggle badly and maybe get points off Dordrecht, Willem II, NAC and a couple of others but on the other hand get absolutely spanked going to Phillips Stadion, Amsterdam Arena or De Kuip. No way would they get anything against AZ, Twente, Hereenveen, Zwolle or Vitesse either. Standard is better than is let on, maybe people will start to realise now that sky sports is showing games.

Skylinehead

losthorizon wrote: »

Thers not much difference between the LOI and the Dutch league.

Blind, Tasic, Finnbogasan, Indi, de Vrij, Janmaat, the de Jong brothers, Strootman, Bony, Eriksen, Mertens, van Ginkel, Lens, Chadli, Maher, Alderweireld.

That's just a small selection of players from the Eredivise over the last 2 years. Find me a single LOI player that would come close to any of those.

MightyMandarin

Skylinehead wrote: »

Blind, Tasic, Finnbogasan, Indi, de Vrij, Janmaat, the de Jong brothers, Strootman, Bony, Eriksen, Mertens, van Ginkel, Lens, Chadli, Maher, Alderweireld.

That's just a small selection of players from the Eredivise over the last 2 years. Find me a single LOI player that would come close to any of those.

In fairness, the LOI has produced some great players too, Coleman and Long both came from the LOI and if/when Towell, Finn or Forrester go to England they'll shine too. That said, the Eredivisie is a much better league with better teams and better players. Ajax, PSV, Feyenoord, Vitesse and Twente would easily beat any top Irish side and the atmosphere and support is much better in the dutch leagues, having been to a few Pats matches and an Ajax match myself. But for the wage caps and financial restraints imposed on the big clubs, the teams would be able to recruit better players but also hold on to their talents. The amount of ex-Eredivisie players at top European clubs is actually insane.

weisses

Comparing the Eredivisie with the Irish league is the same as Dutch rugby with Irish rugby

IRISHSPORTSGUY

LuckyLloyd wrote: »

Serious question: why should anyone care about that?

The CL is a Beast competition, a pinnacle of sport. Once I'm being entertained I truly do not give a ****.

If you are happy with the same teams in the business end of the Champions League every year that's your business, but I for one preferred it when the clubs in the leagues with the most financial power had to make do with what they had in their own countries.
A reduction in quality for an improvement in the number of teams that can actually win the competition is grand with me

CSF

Why the f*ck are we comparing the LOI and Eredivisie??

LostBoy101

Christ the Eredivisie is light years ahead of the LOI.

CSF

LostBoy101 wrote: »

Christ the Eredivisie is light years ahead of the LOI.

So?

LostBoy101

CSF wrote: »

So?

In fairness to the LOI, football isn't the most popular sport and is well under funded in comparison to Holland where football is the main sport along with hockey. If we look at the underage set up in Holland and if we had the funding we would be doing to build a decent national team.

MightyMandarin

LostBoy101 wrote: »

In fairness to the LOI, football isn't the most popular sport and is well under funded in comparison to Holland where football is the main sport along with hockey. If we look at the underage set up in Holland and if we had the funding we would be doing to build a decent national team.

It's not just a funding or GAA issue though. The FAI is corrupt from top to bottom, mostly from the top though. Delaney's salary is unbelievable, more than the Spanish FA's CEO's is I think. The FAI consistently wastes money on un-needed resources whilst neglecting the LOI beyond belief. Clubs earn pittance for playing in the league, even winning the league isn't as lucrative as one victory in Europe. And despite all of this, the LOI even blocks big-money friendlies for clubs such as Limerick, who had an agreement for a friendly with Barca, until the FAI blocked it, yet Rovers were allowed to fill the Aviva for the Liverpool game. Makes me sick to see that crook Delaney get a €300k+ salary a year, whilst teams like Monaghan go bust and our league consistently suffers.

LostBoy101

MightyMandarin wrote: »

It's not just a funding or GAA issue though. The FAI is corrupt from top to bottom, mostly from the top though. Delaney's salary is unbelievable, more than the Spanish FA's CEO's is I think. The FAI consistently wastes money on un-needed resources whilst neglecting the LOI beyond belief. Clubs earn pittance for playing in the league, even winning the league isn't as lucrative as one victory in Europe. And despite all of this, the LOI even blocks big-money friendlies for clubs such as Limerick, who had an agreement for a friendly with Barca, until the FAI blocked it, yet Rovers were allowed to fill the Aviva for the Liverpool game. Makes me sick to see that crook Delaney get a €300k+ salary a year, whilst teams like Monaghan go bust and our league consistently suffers.

Aye Delaney must be laughing at us right now with his new €300k salary a year. I feel the FAI will stay corrupt as it is because when Deleany is gone someone else will pick up where he left off.

MightyMandarin

LostBoy101 wrote: »

Aye Delaney must be laughing at us right now with his new €300k salary a year. I feel the FAI will stay corrupt as it is because when Deleany is gone someone else will pick up where he left off.

It's unbelievable how he gets away with it really. And the man says he had 'more lucrative offers elsewhere', acting like he's doing a public service. As if there weren't enough reasons to hate the guy.

LuckyLloyd

IRISHSPORTSGUY wrote: »

If you are happy with the same teams in the business end of the Champions League every year that's your business, but I for one preferred it when the clubs in the leagues with the most financial power had to make do with what they had in their own countries.
A reduction in quality for an improvement in the number of teams that can actually win the competition is grand with me

8 different teams have won the CL since 2004!!

LuckyLloyd

LuckyLloyd wrote: »

8 different teams have won the CL since 2004!!

That just shows that anyone can win it so therefore it isn't competitive.

spiralism

LostBoy101 wrote: »

In fairness to the LOI, football isn't the most popular sport and is well under funded in comparison to Holland where football is the main sport along with hockey. If we look at the underage set up in Holland and if we had the funding we would be doing to build a decent national team.

Holland does have a population of nearly 17 million as well. But football is a national obsession over here. It's probably the highest profile national team not to have won a World Cup and i'd say the Eredivisie is actually a top 5 league in Europe. Comparing the LOI and the FAI to the Eredivisie and the KNVB is putting it a bit out of its depth to be honest.

On that note, it's not just a funding issue, but if we got our **** together it would certainly help. Definitely the standard of our league is shocking compared to many countries a similar size.