Its about Time

pconn062

RunningKing wrote: »

End of Month report for July. - Keeps me honest and helps me look at things in a holistic way.

Focus for July

*13-15 mile run with 7-8 at HMP - :mad: - remember the 3 pages of debate
*Longest run since DCM (anything over 15.42m) :mad: 15.21 over 2 runs
*Clontarf Plan -Gold Medal: 1:27 Half Marathon / Silver Medal: Sub 1:30 HM (all weather dependent) :mad: weather & demon issues!!
*2 weeks off from running (Holidays) - 2 ickle runs while in Greece. Nice break
*Finalise Marathon training plan 99% there
*80 miles total planned for the month 109 miles for the month

Focus for August:

* Over 200 miles for the 1st time ever.
* Highest week planned at 59m
* Longest run planned at 18m
* 3 Hill sessions as part of DCM training
* Frank Duffy 10 mile race - under 65 mins (soft?)
* Final project for MBA due in on 24th Aug

Yup! 63 or GTFO!

RunningKing

Holidays are over (longest 2 weeks ever!)

I hmmmd (not quite sure how to spell that) and hawed (that either) about my running plan for DCM 13.
By my nature, I quite like the speed training, I love doing sessions at 5k pace, 200's at all out, long intervals etc - they add a good variety and keep 'running' interesting.
But I've read a lot in the past few weeks regarding Marathon 'specific' training and am going to give it a bash by utilising P&D 12/70.

Yep - there's some vo2 stuff in there but its only 3-4 sessions in 12 weeks.
My year to date has followed the following pattern:
5k Plan
10k Plan
HM Plan
Mar Plan

So I feel I've got a good base, some decent speed (relative to myself 1 year ago) and a lot more confidence in what I'm able to achieve.

For my Marathon plan, I will be trying to run the MP sections at 6:45-6:50 pace - but I'm NOT committing to a sub3 performance in DCM 13, by virtue of the fact that I've an MBA to finish between now & October. Last project this month and an assessment in Oct.

It may turn out that my training is hampered by the MBA & work travel, but I know that the training will serve a great foundation for a sub 3 attempt in the spring.

I'm going to attach my plan in the knowledge that it will certainly change about 100 times between now & next month.
Feel free to use the template, for the fee of 1 pint of Guinness. :P

Feedback welcome !!

RunningKing

pconn062 wrote: »

Yup! 63 or GTFO!

yep - thinking same. Commitment is tough.

Gavlor

Plan is wonderful

Having read it in great detail i especially like the way Martha comes back from the dead to kill Sean. Great stuff.

RunningKing

Gavlor wrote: »

Plan is wonderful

Having read it in great detail i especially like the way Martha comes back from the dead to kill Sean. Great stuff.

in fairness, he deserved it. Happy ending all around.

Gavlor

RunningKing wrote: »

in fairness, he deserved it. Happy ending all around.

Seriously though I'll have a proper look tomorrow when I'm in work. There's a nice bit of detail and it looks like you've left no stone unturned.

statss

that's a nice shiny spreadsheet, but I can't believe you still have football in there!

career_move

I can't open your plan ... can you put it in a different format or something

blockic

career_move wrote: »

I can't open your plan ... can you put it in a different format or something

What version of excel do you have? 2003? Its in the 2007+ format.

Possibly saving it as . xls instead of .xlsx should sort it!

Really solid plan RK, a lot of similarities to mine I believe our mileage is the exact same! One question, what is the difference between actual miles and planned miles?

5 weeks out there seems to be a big difference? 59 and then 70...

Great that you can squeeze in 3 70 mile weeks..

RunningKing

blockic wrote: »

What version of excel do you have? 2003? Its in the 2007+ format.

Possibly saving it as . xls instead of .xlsx should sort it!

Really solid plan RK, a lot of similarities to mine I believe our mileage is the exact same! One question, what is the difference between actual miles and planned miles?

5 weeks out there seems to be a big difference? 59 and then 70...

Great that you can squeeze in 3 70 mile weeks..

Planned miles is what I should be doing!
Actual miles is what I will be doing based on reducing mileage due to races etc.
The spreadsheet is set up so I can keep track of the actual miles I do in the week versus the planned miles.

The 3x70 miles are a typo - only meant to be 2 as per P&D - maybe thats why the actual miles are hugely different.

CM - try this:

career_move

blockic wrote: »

What version of excel do you have? 2003? Its in the 2007+ format.

Possibly saving it as . xls instead of .xlsx should sort it!

Thanks I have the 2007 version. Laptop is being annoying because it won't let me open any downloaded files for some reason. Anyway it's sorted now.

Tough enough plan RK I think considering everything else you've got going on. Since it's pouring rain out and I'm happy to delay having to go out here are some things I would do differently:

Wk 11: Leave out the hill session. I don't think you need to one 3 weeks in a row. Do the MP miles in the middle of the long run as 2 x 4m instead of 8m straight
Wk 10: Move the recovery run to the Sat. I think you'd get more benefit from it there
Wk 9: Drop one of the MLR. I think 14 on tues followed by 11 w strides on wed is too much when you're racing the 10m at the w/e
Wk 8: Looks a bit too jampacked. I don't really get the 11m @ 7:15 in the MLR and then another session with 5m @ HMP. I would do 2 x 4m or 6m @ MP in the 20m run
Wk 5: I don't see the advantage of doing 4(10 x 100) the day before the HM after doing speed work on the Wed
Wk 2:I got great benefit out of a straight 12m @ MP and maybe you could do that instead of the 13m MLR you have planned and drop the speed session
Wk 1: I'd do the 8m aerobic as 8m @ MP

Apart from that nice plan:D:D:D

RunningKing

career_move wrote: »

Thanks I have the 2007 version. Laptop is being annoying because it won't let me open any downloaded files for some reason. Anyway it's sorted now.

Tough enough plan RK I think considering everything else you've got going on. Since it's pouring rain out and I'm happy to delay having to go out here are some things I would do differently:

Wk 11: Leave out the hill session. I don't think you need to one 3 weeks in a row. Do the MP miles in the middle of the long run as 2 x 4m instead of 8m straight
Wk 10: Move the recovery run to the Sat. I think you'd get more benefit from it there
Wk 9: Drop one of the MLR. I think 14 on tues followed by 11 w strides on wed is too much when you're racing the 10m at the w/e
Wk 8: Looks a bit too jampacked. I don't really get the 11m @ 7:15 in the MLR and then another session with 5m @ HMP. I would do 2 x 4m or 6m @ MP in the 20m run
Wk 5: I don't see the advantage of doing 4(10 x 100) the day before the HM after doing speed work on the Wed
Wk 2:I got great benefit out of a straight 12m @ MP and maybe you could do that instead of the 13m MLR you have planned and drop the speed session
Wk 1: I'd do the 8m aerobic as 8m @ MP

Apart from that nice plan:D:D:D

CM - you're just superb.

Great to have another pair of eyes looking at things.

Week 11: Think I'll persevere with it, its a 3 week progression of hills.
Week 10: Good suggestion - Done.
Week 9: Maybe I'll shorten the run, but the 10m race isn't the 'Main thing'
Week 8: you are correct - the '7:15' is makey uppy - maybe this be a MLR.
Week 5: Correct. Done
Week 2: good suggestion - but after 15 @MP the previous Sun, not too sure if I'd manage it.
Week 1: That would scare me!!

Great input CM - much appreciate you taking the time to review it in detail.

pconn062

career_move wrote: »

Wk 5: I don't see the advantage of doing 4(10 x 100) the day before the HM after doing speed work on the Wed

Whatever about the benefits of doing the strides, I certainly don't see any problem with doing them the day before a race. Ten is probably overkill but 4-6 strides the day before a race is a good way of getting the legs turning over (as well as doing 4-6 directly before the race as well). In fact RK you should do strides a few days a week every week after some of your runs, ten is probably too much but do a few. Your legs can stagnate a bit with all the slow running during a marathon plan and strides will help with that. Don't bother writing them into the plan, just make then part of your run 2-3 days a week.

Good luck with the plan, looks daunting to me, I don't envy you! The only other thing I would advise is doing your long runs on a hilly course if possible, good for leg strength. (Not the ones with MP miles, just your normal runs).

RunningKing

12 week P&D Marathon Plan starts next week - this week is just about getting back into it after the holidays.

16th-24th July:
Walked to the bar a few times. Had a lot of fruit........grapes to be precise.........fermented grapes actually - liquid form.
Also took on plenty of vitamin D. Something I think I'll be lacking in the coming few months.

25th July: Slow 4 mile run around hilly Zakanythos - 8:02 average pace. 26 degrees at 8am.
Funny story on this run - makes me think of a comment Blockic made following my HM in clontarf - As I was running, there was a crowd of people waiting for a tour bus. I could have ran on the road to avoid them, but there was a big truck coming towards me, so I went on the path, through a tree that I though was all leaves, but no - a great big branch took a lump out of my nose.
If that wasn't bad enough, my hat fell off, so I had to wade through the masses of people to get my hat as they sniggered etc at my 'bloody' misfortune. In fairness, when I told wifey and the 2 girls, they also laughed.

26th July: took in a 5 mile loop that covered part of the beach, the resort and some of the many hills. Was sweating buckets on this as the temp was high and the lack of a breeze made it worse. (Kudos to MS for her runs in warmer/humidor conditions). Avoided the killer trees.

Main reason for those runs was to ensure I got back into the groove on my return & hit the ground running.

31st July: Back from holliers - 6.81 miles with the dog in the PP - nice run. Pace 8:03 - Ave HR was 137 with a max of 144 (right now I've no idea what that means).

1st Aug: 5:51 miles with 10x100 hill bursts.
Not quite sure of the 100m, but it was one of the hills at the bottom of the Khyber. Took about 13 secs to go up on average (so maybe less than 100m).
Nice workout - was thinking to include a few hill bursts in other easy runs during the schedule.
Average HR was 140 with a max of 158 on the hills.

1st Aug PM - 1 hour of football. Despite wearing 1000m socks and using vasline on the soles of my feet, I got a massive blister that has since peeled :mad: - now cut off and mended with plasters (apologies to those eating)

Went out for a 1m warm down after football (10:30pm) (something I never do) and felt the better of it on Friday.

2nd Aug
6.9 miles at 7:52 - no dog today - torrential rain as I ran in the PP - I'm sure people thought I was a total headbanger as they sheltered.
Feet were soaked in about 5 mins - didn't help the blisters.

Great run in the rain - feels 'different', but did feel a bit weak afterwards - maybe my eating/drinking habits have changed in the last couple of weeks!!

HR Ave 137 - max 144.

College all day Saturday - but will get a 4m recovery run in before Dublin beat Cork

15m (4@PMP) Long run on Sunday am in the PP.

blockic

RunningKing wrote: »

College all day Saturday - but will get a 4m recovery run in before Dublin beat Cork

I'm not thanking that post simply because this will not happen!

Ye can have the football if ye give us the hurling. Deal? :pac:

RedRunner

blockic wrote: »

I'm not thanking that post simply because this will not happen!

Ye can have the football if ye give us the hurling. Deal? :pac:

Clearly blockic was talking about the 4m recovery run there! Go on the Dubs!:D

tang1

As much as it kills me, they were very impressive this evening. Should have had it won at half time, Jack McCaffrey and James McCarthy are two serious footballers. Only thing that would bother me is Cluxton was the top scorer. Honestly can't see past them for All Ireland, one day all those goals chances are going to go in and god help the team on the receiving end. Hate talking up the Dubs!!

RunningKing

How you getting on Tang?

tang1

RunningKing wrote: »

How you getting on Tang?

Getting there, thanks for asking. No running since operation, some cycling to keep me going. Hoping to make a return to running in next few weeks. Hope your own training and studies are going well.

RunningKing

Saturday: 4m recovery run @ 8:36.
Legs were in bits on Saturday. Wore compression socks & thigh thingys into college on Sat - I reckon this was DOMS from Thursday (Hills & Football). The recovery run was needed, but the 1st mile was painful. Took it slow and it loosened out bit in time to see the Boys in Blue do their thing.

Sunday: 15m LSR

Plan was to do 4 PMP during this run - but given how the legs had been, I removed that from the plan. Probably more benefit & less risk in doing a straight 15 miles.
For breakfast I had a couple of spoons of Granola - no more - I wanted to try this running on empty business.
Found it very tough. Very humid this morning and I hadn't brought any water with me (must invest in a water belt this week).
Chose a hilly route in the PP that included all the main hills outside the PP- Knockmaroon to Farmleigh.

Legs were like lead, I deviated from my route a bit in search of water - down to 15 acres - nothing - over to the cricket club - couldn't find it - but I recall Quirky posting something recently about one there.
Persevered and finished (14.81m) @ 8.16 pace (ave HR 149).

Despite me drinking a pint of Electrolytes, a protein shake, pint of ISO drink, and more water afterwards - when I weighed myself, I was still 3-4lbs under normal.

All in all - not an enjoyable run - some schoolboy errors around hydration the day before and forgetting a drink (& money) - coupled with the fact that I now have 2 sore nipples - I mean ffs, why do men even have nipples!)

Other schoolboy error was loading my post holiday plan so heavy - 39 miles from Wed to Sun as well as an hour of football.
Maybe next weeks schedule will seem easier.

Starting P&D on Monday (with a rest day!) - plan calls for 55 miles for the week, but am only going to do 43-45 to gradually build it up.

Might also knock football on the head, given how my legs felt this week.

blockic

RunningKing wrote: »

Might also knock football on the head, given how my legs felt this week.

I think the time has come!

Yeah, it takes a few runs on empty for the body to adapt I heard. I'm a great beleiver in it and I will be doing many LSR this time round like this. I feel it will benefit in the long run.

However, empty doesn'r mean no water! Must get a waterbelt too.

BeepBeep67 has a lovely one but think they are no longer on the market. Bottles are small and tidy. They seem to be more bulky these days. Hard to find a neat one.

TRR

I'm not a believer in this running on empty philosophy. It all sounds great in theory i.e training yourself to burn fat more efficiently etc but I've never seen any statistically significant scientific studies to back this up. There maybe but I've yet to see them.

Even if there was good supporting evidence for it I personally wouldn't do it. Lets say you manage to improve your fat burning ability by 5% by doing 4-6 LSRs on empty. I have always found if I'm under fueled my pace can be up to 30 seconds slower per mile on average. My gait can be significantly impaired late on due to cramps etc which increases the possibility of injury and to top it off where as a normal LSR may take 1-2 days to recover from, if I've ran empty it can take twice that. In other words sub standard LSRs. All in all the risks and downsides way out number any of the potential positives.

Just my opinion and I know some guys, some of them much faster than me who swear by running on empty. I guess it may be one of those things that could work for somebody and not work for others. Probably have to experiment yourself to determine that. I always have the feeling though that it is a fad, a bit like bare foot running amongst other things that will slowly fade out of fashion over time!

RunningKing

Cheers Dave, love reading those posts. I definitely noticed a change in my form today, more of a plod.
I'll be spending my week looking up research on this and also HR training.

Appreciated.

TRR

RunningKing wrote: »

Cheers Dave, love reading those posts. I definitely noticed a change in my form today, more of a plod.
I'll be spending my week looking up research on this and also HR training.

Appreciated.

The HR training is worth looking into.

Big Logger

Males start off as females...that's why you have nipples

drquirky

RunningKing wrote: »

Saturday:
Legs were like lead, I deviated from my route a bit in search of water - down to 15 acres - nothing - over to the cricket club - couldn't find it - but I recall Quirky posting something recently about one there.
Persevered and finished (14.81m) @ 8.16 pace (ave HR 149).

Water in PP-

Taps next to the pavilion at the Polo playing area
Vistior Centre Cafe
Cafe @ Farmleigh
Small food hut near the zoo
Various Ice Cream Trucks
Just out the main gate on Parkgate St. Spar etc...

Hope that helps! Make sure you bring a couple quid though for most of those...

Marthastew

Welcome back:D

2 things;
1. Did your dog lose much fitness while you were away?;)
2.

RunningKing wrote: »

coupled with the fact that I now have 2 sore nipples - I mean ffs, why do men even have nipples

.... Digger, I can't believe you missed this?;)

TRR

Marthastew wrote: »

2. .... Digger, I can't believe you missed this?;)

Digger has clamps for his nipples!

RunningKing

Monday 5th: Rest Day

Tuesday 6th: Start of P&D

P&D called for 8m with 10x100 - my adapted plan called for 7m with 7x400 hills.
I done some reading up on hill work and decided to scrap the hill work that was in my adapted plan, but do a hill variation run - a Hill Fartlek.

Went down to the Khyber for this one as there are plenty of different hills down there with different lengths and gradients (although all steep!)

I done 9 hill bursts - for the log record (& not to bore the reader of this )they were:

1. 14 seconds (0.05m)
2. 21 seconds (0.06m)
3. 15 seconds (same hill as (1)
4. 20.9 secs (same hill as (2)
5. 15 secs (hill up to Mag fort)
6. 51.7 secs (Military Road - 0.16m)
7. 52.8 secs (as above)
8. 49.5 secs (as above)
9. 84 secs (400m up the Khyber - at 5.50/m)

The shorter hills were done virtually flat out, Military road was controlled - ave 5:10/m as it was short enough.

Followed up with a few slow miles to warm down the legs.

Total workout: 8.18 miles / 7.57 ave.
HR ave 146 (maxed at 173 - 94% up the Khyber)

Delighted with that work out and plan to do similar next week - will see how the legs feel tomorrow though.

In other news............

Been hearing a lot about the Athlone HM (Flatline) and although I've paid for the Dub half - I'm contemplating doing the Flatline instead, with the simple intention of posting a good time.

Advice?

dazza21ie

RunningKing wrote: »

Monday 5th: Rest Day

Tuesday 6th: Start of P&D

P&D called for 8m with 10x100 - my adapted plan called for 7m with 7x400 hills.
I done some reading up on hill work and decided to scrap the hill work that was in my adapted plan, but do a hill variation run - a Hill Fartlek.

Went down to the Khyber for this one as there are plenty of different hills down there with different lengths and gradients (although all steep!)

I done 9 hill bursts - for the log record (& not to bore the reader of this )they were:

1. 14 seconds (0.05m)
2. 21 seconds (0.06m)
3. 15 seconds (same hill as (1)
4. 20.9 secs (same hill as (2)
5. 15 secs (hill up to Mag fort)
6. 51.7 secs (Military Road - 0.16m)
7. 52.8 secs (as above)
8. 49.5 secs (as above)
9. 84 secs (400m up the Khyber - at 5.50/m)

The shorter hills were done virtually flat out, Military road was controlled - ave 5:10/m as it was short enough.

Followed up with a few slow miles to warm down the legs.

Total workout: 8.18 miles / 7.57 ave.
HR ave 146 (maxed at 173 - 94% up the Khyber)

Delighted with that work out and plan to do similar next week - will see how the legs feel tomorrow though.

In other news............

Been hearing a lot about the Athlone HM (Flatline) and although I've paid for the Dub half - I'm contemplating doing the Flatline instead, with the simple intention of posting a good time.

Advice?

Just read your log title!