has motor tax passed the "is it worth buying" rate?

Supergurrier

Roverjames you have to be trolling tbh. As it appears you have taken the side of "Shurre nothing will change it is the way it is" which really isn't a viewpoint

Supergurrier

Supergurrier wrote: »

Roverjames you have to be trolling tbh. As it appears you have taken the side of "Shurre nothing will change it is the way it is" which really isn't a viewpoint

I've expressed my viewpoint on motor tax many times............

http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showthread.php?p=82220603

RoverJames wrote: »

No further increases on the cc system is a best case scenario imo, there won't be any change to make 2.0++ stuff taxed on the cc system any cheaper. They'll probably keep increasing it to appease those on the 2008 on rates and to ensure the gulf remains between pre and post 2008 yokes to make newer stuff no less attractive than it is at the moment to tax in relative terms.

A minority (common sense dictates that's what they are ) of motorists drive 2.0++ stuff taxed on the cc system, neither the government or the average Joe in the smaller engined car gives a feck what those rates are

http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showthread.php?p=81974744

RoverJames wrote: »

Going over old ground
I believe the vast majority of people do tax their cars and will continue to do so. The vast majority won't find the increase a huge burden and the minority who won't now pay are a drop in the ocean. The government have no regard for the minority of motorists with motor tax rates over a grand on the cc system and there's less of them on the emissions system. As long as the average Joe stumps up the extra percent on the 250 to 700 he's already paying and most others on the higher to tax stuff do too which I think will than the result is increased revenue
Most people who don't pay motor tax won't regardless of any increases or decreases, imo they're analgous to folk who buy rip off DVDs, smuggled cigarettes etc etc or the muck savage who has never taxed his 1.3 corolla

http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showthread.php?p=81939954

RoverJames wrote: »

Nope, as per the notice one receives for motor tax renewal.

I think as there is a minority of people paying large motor tax rates we can fully expect another rise in them as the lower rates will he going up. Increases across the board.

.... best case scenario imo is no further increases to the cc bands.

I can 100% appreciate there are many people out there who see motor tax rates as one of the biggest injustices against the Irish motorist.


When you bought your ST recently did you not expect a rise in motor tax rates in budget 2013? Is the little rise in the rate making you regret your purchase?

If it was cheaper to tax you'd have paid a lot more to buy it, I'm sure you can acknowledge that.

Seems as you have poorly summarised my views on motortax what are yours?

166man

RoverJames wrote: »

I can make an educated guess based on recent budgets
I'm happy to say with 99% certainty that none of the current cc rates for Private Cars registered before 1 July 2008 will double in budget 2014, if you think it's likely they will I find that amusing if not bordering on ridiculous



I do believe my comments were that " I'll pay whatever tax is due on the car I own" (including if the car is a 2.5) and "As I've mentioned more than a few times motor tax rates (the fairness of them, the cost of them etc etc) rank quite low on my list of things I give a sh1t about".

If cc rates do double next year (which I'm 99% sure they won't as I've explained) my views won't change

For a €1000/annum rate to hit €2000/annum I reckon it would take 11 years of 7% rises. I imagine that's not likely to happen either but I'll say again I'm 99% sure none of the cc rates will double next year

To put the current cc rates in perspective if a single person with no dependents (taxed at the higher rate) received a Christmas bonus of €2500 the government would get €1200 ish of that €2500 in PRSI, PAYE and USC and they'd also get a few more €€s in employers PRSI if the person was a PAYE worker as opposed to being self employed. That's the annual motor (best part of) tax for a 3.0 car, so when you look at the levels of direct tax people pay over 12 months a 7% or so rise in motor tax is really a drop in the ocean.

Now considering the standard rate cut off is €35k ish how people can't understand or find it amusing how someone isn't overly bothered about a small few quid extra in motor tax I find baffling.

I was in the A&E of Cork University Hospital recently, during the day I may add not on a Saturday night/peak time, a shocking scene and the rest of the A&Es in the country are hardly any better.

To reiterate, motor tax rates, not on my list of give a sh1ts about.
And that's the day after I taxed my yoke for 6 months

By all means do continue to rant and rave and send emails to whoever about motor tax rates, have a protest, organise "mass" non payment of same but don't expect everyone to join in and don't expect people to focus on motor tax when many of us feel there are far more pressing problems that need more focus at the current time.

I think what I find ridiculous is how you could possibly claim that a bill of over €1000 a year is 'low on your list of priorities'' and still maintain you are not fabulously wealthy. For the vast majority of users here I'd imagine a bill like that would be quite a large sum of money. Maybe it isn't to you though, I don't know.

It's not even motor tax though, any bill that would eat into my useable income to such an extent as a €1k tax bill would certainly be on my list of priorities.

Also, of course there's more pressing issues that could be discussed, but this is a motoring forum, speaking specifically about the unfairness of the Irish tax system.

I'd love to be the person getting a €2500 euro bonus this Christmas by the way, can't be too many of them out there. I doubt too many Irish people are getting €2.5k bonuses this Christmas either so a pretty poor example to give really, to try and justify the tax rate.

Also a direct tax is just that, it's taken at source so it doesn't get taken out of your pocket when you are trying to budget for something else, childrens education for example. Attempting to extort over €1000 of peoples after-tax income will have a far greater effect than a bonus being paid to the government...:pac:

166man

166man wrote: »

I think what I find ridiculous is how you could possibly claim that a bill of over €1000 a year is 'low on your list of priorities'' and still maintain you are not fabulously wealthy.......................

Also a direct tax is just that, it's taken at source so it doesn't get taken out of your pocket when you are trying to budget for something else, childrens education for example. Attempting to extort over €1000 of peoples after-tax income will have a far greater effect than a bonus being paid to the government...:pac:

The way I see the bit in bold is as follows, you yourself have mentioned more than once that the budget increase wasn't going to overly bother you, iirc you are a student working part time. I find it quite puzzling how you can than turn around and claim you find my feeling on motor tax are ridiculous, given my motor tax is slightly over double what you are paying when my net earnings are presumably multiples more than yours.

I wouldn't consider myself "fabulously wealthy" either. It's a tenner a week extra to tax the ZT compared to the 1.6 Rover I used to drive, it's not a significant amount of cash.

To address the rest of your post that I've quoted above I reckon there are more Irish people getting an annual end of year bonus of €2500+ than there are paying €1000+ in motor tax, also anyone paying that motor tax was paying the guts of it before the two increases so the effect of the extortion as you refer to it is minimal. People losing half their bonus in tax has a greater efffect on them than an extra €100 on motor tax, it's still money out of their pocket. If you have a car you need to budget accordingly to keep it on the road. Most people who are working are paying more in USC than motor tax, an increase in direct taxation would effect most people much more than the increases we have seen in motor tax.

Also I am not trying to justify the tax rate, I am simply saying I pay it and it doesn't bother me hugely, if it did I'd drive a car with lower tax, of course I'd sooner pay nothing, much like income tax etc.

So to reiterate I'll continue to pay my motor tax and the cost of it doesn't bother me at all, it's less than 25% of what I spend on petrol annually, however my total running costs would be quite likely less than many people as the depreciation is minimal and my insurance is only a tad over €300

I can keep answering your questions on the topic as you like but I do believe I'm simply repeating myself at this stage.

Trhiggy83

RoverJames wrote: »

The way I see the bit in bold is as follows, you yourself have mentioned more than once that the budget increase wasn't going to overly bother you, iirc you are a student working part time. I find it quite puzzling how you can than turn around and claim you find my feeling on motor tax are ridiculous, given my motor tax is slightly over double what you are paying when my net earnings are presumably multiples more than yours.

I wouldn't consider myself "fabulously wealthy" either. It's a tenner a week extra to tax the ZT compared to the 1.6 Rover I used to drive, it's not a significant amount of cash.

To address the rest of your post that I've quoted above I reckon there are more Irish people getting an annual end of year bonus of €2500+ than there are paying €1000+ in motor tax, also anyone paying that motor tax was paying the guts of it before the two increases so the effect of the extortion as you refer to it is minimal. People losing half their bonus in tax has a greater efffect on them than an extra €100 on motor tax, it's still money out of their pocket. If you have a car you need to budget accordingly to keep it on the road. Most people who are working are paying more in USC than motor tax, an increase in direct taxation would effect most people much more than the increases we have seen in motor tax.

Also I am not trying to justify the tax rate, I am simply saying I pay it and it doesn't bother me hugely, if it did I'd drive a car with lower tax, of course I'd sooner pay nothing, much like income tax etc.

So to reiterate I'll continue to pay my motor tax and the cost of it doesn't bother me at all, it's less than 25% of what I spend on petrol annually, however my total running costs would be quite likely less than many people as the depreciation is minimal and my insurance is only a tad over €300

I can keep answering your questions on the topic as you like but I do believe I'm simply repeating myself at this stage.

You must be enda Kennys lovechild ............. sorry i couldnt resist:D

Trhiggy83

Trhiggy83 wrote: »

You must be enda Kennys lovechild ............. sorry i couldnt resist:D

Hardly I listed quite a few things the government need to address imo a page or so back.

166man

RoverJames wrote: »

The way I see the bit in bold is as follows, you yourself have mentioned more than once that the budget increase wasn't going to overly bother you, iirc you are a student working part time. I find it quite puzzling how you can than turn around and claim you find my feeling on motor tax are ridiculous, given my motor tax is slightly over double what you are paying when my net earnings are presumably multiples more than yours.

I wouldn't consider myself "fabulously wealthy" either. It's a tenner a week extra to tax the ZT compared to the 1.6 Rover I used to drive, it's not a significant amount of cash.

To address the rest of your post that I've quoted above I reckon there are more Irish people getting an annual end of year bonus of €2500+ than there are paying €1000+ in motor tax, also anyone paying that motor tax was paying the guts of it before the two increases so the effect of the extortion as you refer to it is minimal. People losing half their bonus in tax has a greater efffect on them than an extra €100 on motor tax, it's still money out of their pocket. If you have a car you need to budget accordingly to keep it on the road. Most people who are working are paying more in USC than motor tax, an increase in direct taxation would effect most people much more than the increases we have seen in motor tax.

Also I am not trying to justify the tax rate, I am simply saying I pay it and it doesn't bother me hugely, if it did I'd drive a car with lower tax, of course I'd sooner pay nothing, much like income tax etc.

So to reiterate I'll continue to pay my motor tax and the cost of it doesn't bother me at all, it's less than 25% of what I spend on petrol annually, however my total running costs would be quite likely less than many people as the depreciation is minimal and my insurance is only a tad over €300

I can keep answering your questions on the topic as you like but I do believe I'm simply repeating myself at this stage.

I do think your feelings on motor tax are slightly ridiculous, to not be ''overly bothered'' by the tax rate of your car. That's my opinion anyway. I find the rise in tax this year for me weren't much of an issue, relative to the current price, however over €500 a year for a car worth not much more is insane, and it certainly does have a priority for me. You must make very decent money to make your salary multiples of mine.

The effect of the extortion is not minimal as the increase in tax is added to many other tax increases as well as expenditure cuts, add to this overall falling incomes, and I'm sure motor tax going isn't as minimal as you might thing. It would also appear from your post that you are trying to suggest that people paying €1000 a year tax are also or were also all getting a bonus of €2500 per year, which clearly is ridiculous to assume.

Keep answering my questions all you like, but I'm not asking questions. I'm merely stating that I think to not be bothered by €1000 a year is a little odd tbh.

Trhiggy83

RoverJames wrote: »

Hardly I listed quite a few things the government need to address imo a page or so back.

only risin ya

cfc1888

godtabh wrote: »

If you cant afford the tax you cant afford the car so get rid of it.

If the tax for a 2l car is to much downgrade. Its your choice what car you drive and your responsibility to ensure its taxed accordingly.

The sense of entitlement in this threads make me sick. Every one knows motor tax is likely to go up and up. So maybe reassess if that 2005 2l car is worth buying long term. You may want it and you maybe able to afford the tax this year but what about next year?

Maybe the 1.2l Punto is the more prudent option. It maybe not what you want to drive but if it gets you from A-B and you can afford the tax whats the problem. I'd have no problem with a punto. Drove one for 5 years

You couldnt have picked a worse car to make your point.I'd roller-skate to work before Id drive a punto. An absolute disgrace of a car.

166man

166man wrote: »

........ You must make very decent money to make your salary multiples of mine. ...........

You're a full time student working part time afaik, someone on average enough money earns multiples what you earn I would expect.

166man wrote: »

.........It would also appear from your post that you are trying to suggest that people paying €1000 a year tax are also or were also all getting a bonus of €2500 per year, which clearly is ridiculous to assume..........

That's simply your poor interpretation of what I posted............ "I reckon there are more Irish people getting an annual end of year bonus of €2500+ than there are paying €1000+ in motor tax" is not at all suggesting what you think it is.

cfc1888

RoverJames wrote: »

You're a full time student working part time afaik, someone on average enough money earns multiples what you earn I would expect.

Bonus of 2500. Ya for sure.lads all around the country are getting these.are you for real or are you on another fcuking planet?

Supergurrier

My bonus was a selection box and the crunchy was half eaten

166man

RoverJames wrote: »

You're a full time student working part time afaik, someone on average enough money earns multiples what you earn I would expect.



That's simply your poor interpretation of what I posted............ "I reckon there are more Irish people getting an annual end of year bonus of €2500+ than there are paying €1000+ in motor tax" is not at all suggesting what you think it is.

Yep, well remembered. Currently on 30 hours a week at above minimum wage. As I work in a service industry this doesn't include any other financial gains such as tipping. It can result in a large proportion of one's wages. I'm not trying to make it out that I make alot because all of it is carefully looked at and spent and having paid any other bills, college fees, insurance and phone bills for example, that €150 every 3 months can be quite a decent chunk of money.

I don't know why you're bringing my business into it though. I was talking about your idea's as regards your motor tax. You say you aren't bothered by it (although I highly doubt that) and I simply think that's an odd opinion to have when relating to spending so much money for which so little benefit is obtained.

A poor interpretation or not, I don't know a single Irish person who has seen his wages rise in the last 12 months, making a €2.5k end of year bonus seem a little unlikely. Do you know many making that money? I would doubt that.

Supergurrier

Maybe RJ works in Dail eireann ?

cfc1888

cfc1888 wrote: »

Bonus of 2500. Ya for sure.lads all around the country are getting these.are you for real or are you on another fcuking planet?

lol, I take it your not getting one.

I know many people on salaries of €50k/annum working for various multinationals and performance related bonuses of up to 10% aren't uncommon.

Lads all around the country would indeed be getting them.

It was merely an example of the level of taxation that exists aside from motor tax, I do reckon there are more people getting bonuses of €2.5k+ than there are people driving 2.5+ engined cars taxed on the cc system though

Supergurrier wrote: »

Maybe RJ works in Dail eireann ?

nope.

Any updates on your views on motor tax seems as you've incorrectly interpreted and summarised mine?

166man

RoverJames wrote: »

lol, I take it your not getting one.

I know many people on salaries of €50k/annum working for various multinationals and performance related bonuses of up to 10% aren't uncommon.

Lads all around the country would indeed be getting them.

It was merely an example of the level of taxation that exists aside from motor tax, I do reckon there are more people getting bonuses of €2.5k+ than there are people driving 2.5+ engined cars taxed on the cc system though



nope.

Any updates on your views on motor tax seems as you've incorrectly interpreted and summarised mine?

A multinational company with it's headquarters in Ireland for 12.5% tax isn't a fair representative of the percentage of Irish people who are getting bonuses these days. To suggest that in one of the worst periods in Ireland economic history that bonuses are not uncommon is just plain silly, and verging on trolling if you ask me.

My view on motor tax system in Ireland is simple. It's been hit way to hard and heavy because it's such an easy thing to increase and in theory people must pay it. I'd be in favour of a flat charge and then tax on fuel I think although it probably requires more thought from my side.

166man

166man wrote: »

........... You must make very decent money to make your salary multiples of mine. ..............

166man wrote: »

............

I don't know why you're bringing my business into it though. I was talking about your idea's as regards your motor tax. You say you aren't bothered by it (although I highly doubt that) and I simply think that's an odd opinion to have when relating to spending so much money for which so little benefit is obtained.

A poor interpretation or not, I don't know a single Irish person who has seen his wages rise in the last 12 months, making a €2.5k end of year bonus seem a little unlikely. Do you know many making that money? I would doubt that.

You don't know why I'm " bringing my business into it though" ? Maybe because you're commenting on my income as per the quote above in bold

I know many people on €50k+ annum who are inline for bonus' of over €2.5K.

I also know many people earning lots less and know loads who are out of work at the moment too.

When I was a full time student I knew very few people in such situation as my circle of acquaintances at the time were mainly students, apprentices or people working on low enough wages.

166man

166man wrote: »

........ To suggest that in one of the worst periods in Ireland economic history that bonuses are not uncommon is just plain silly...........

Not uncommon amongst the pool of people I would know I think I said, not the population in general. For you to be surprised that someone working full time earns multiples of your part time income is ludicrous imo.

lol at the trolling, you're purposely misinterpreting every thing I post for whatever reason.

166man

166man wrote: »

............

My view on motor tax system in Ireland is simple. It's been hit way to hard and heavy because it's such an easy thing to increase and in theory people must pay it.........

How much has it increased by over the last decade?

cfc1888

RoverJames wrote: »

You don't know why I'm " bringing my business into it though" ? Maybe because you're commenting on my income as per the quote above in bold

I know many people on €50k+ annum who are inline for bonus' of over €2.5K.

I also know many people earning lots less and know loads who are out of work at the moment too.

When I was a full time student I knew very few people in such situation as my circle of acquaintances at the time were mainly students, apprentices or people working on low enough wages.

Your becoming a little tosserish now to be honest.But do continue please

166man

RoverJames wrote: »

You don't know why I'm " bringing my business into it though" ? Maybe because you're commenting on my income as per the quote above in bold

I know many people on €50k+ annum who are inline for bonus' of over €2.5K.

I also know many people earning lots less and know loads who are out of work at the moment too.

When I was a full time student I knew very few people in such situation as my circle of acquaintances at the time were mainly students, apprentices or people working on low enough wages.

I'm commenting on your income as relation of mine and also as regards the tax you pay and the ease and lack of care you show about forking over that much money each year.

I'm sure you know plenty of people heading for bonuses of €2.5k or more. Not really though.

I'm not surprised that someone working full-time earns more than me. I'm not purposely mis-interpreting anything actually. I think you need to read back over the last few pages to see where mine and a few other posters are coming from. It's interesting that you are very much in the minority on this one too.

166man

166man wrote: »

...........

I'm sure you know plenty of people heading for bonuses of €2.5k or more. Not really though. ..............

Here we go again, you don't like the answers
Not my problem.

cfc1888

cfc1888 wrote: »

Your becoming a little tosserish now to be honest.But do continue please

Coming from you that's quite a comment, a Punto is a very decent little car to be fair and it's not my fault you are begruding of folks being well paid and rewarded for their endeavours

cfc1888 wrote: »

You couldnt have picked a worse car to make your point.I'd roller-skate to work before Id drive a punto. An absolute disgrace of a car.

cfc1888 wrote: »

Bonus of 2500. Ya for sure.lads all around the country are getting these.are you for real or are you on another fcuking planet?

Supergurrier

Fact remains wages/hours have stagnated/gone down while taxes continue to raise and motor tax is just one example really although the one we happen to currently be discussing.

I just think in general for motorists across the board to be hit with all of these tax raises with absolutely nothing to show for it every year is unfair while it seems to be the popular irish political done thing to not touch income tax at any rate apart from screwing the little guy on his few bob PRSI free. Seems to be a case of death by a thousand cuts as Irish people loved being walked all over and having something to complain about but a taxation system that leans too heavily on one thing may find itself in trouble when combustion engines are done away with, and i for one am looking forward to hearing what excuse we will get for extortionate tax on electric vehicles in the future. "Shurre ya don't need that many watts"

166man

166man wrote: »

....... It's interesting that you are very much in the minority on this one too.

In the minority around here is a good thing

Supergurrier

Supergurrier wrote: »

............while it seems to be the popular irish political done thing to not touch income tax at any rate apart from screwing the little guy on his few bob PRSI free. ............

Ever here of the universal social charge?

Would you prefer they increase income tax and left motor tax alone?

cfc1888

RoverJames wrote: »

Not uncommon amongst the pool of people I would know I think I said, not the population in general. For you to be surprised that someone working full time earns multiples of your part time income is ludicrous imo.

lol at the trolling, you're purposely misinterpreting every thing I post for whatever reason.

Please stop looking for notice.'any man who boasts about his income is an ignorant man.Im not going to comment on my own earnings.ONLY IN IRELAND.In continental Europe speak of ones earnings is frowned upon.But go ahead.Off you go.Embarrass yourself.

Supergurrier

RoverJames wrote: »

Ever here of the universal social charge?

Would you prefer they increase income tax and left motor tax alone?

Yes

166man

RoverJames wrote: »

How much has it increased by over the last decade?

No idea, but in the last two budgets for a 2 litre car it's gone up about €100. On top of all the other tax increases and wages falling, I'm sure it isn't minimal like you said earlier.

RoverJames wrote: »

Here we go again, you don't like the answers
Not my problem.

It's not that I don't like your answers don't get me wrong, I just don't believe them. [/QUOTE]

cfc1888

cfc1888 wrote: »

Please stop looking for notice.'any man who boasts about his income is an ignorant man.Im not going to comment on my own earnings.ONLY IN IRELAND.In continental Europe speak of ones earnings is frowned upon.But go ahead.Off you go.Embarrass yourself.

I'm after saying repeatedly I'm not wealthy, also my income etc was introduced to this topic by 166man, not my me. As I said someone on a modest full time income would earn multiples of what a student earns part time, quite a simple theory to be honest.

Photoshop

Supergurrier wrote: »

Maybe RJ works in Dail eireann ?

It's another thread ruined by him anyway.

Would love if some future goverment would scrap the motor tax altogether
and come up with a new system.

Call it a license to drive or something with a single charge of 500 euro for everybody.

You need the license to get insurance, do nct and speed camera vans would scan for it when you pass them.

166man

166man wrote: »

No idea, but in the last two budgets for a 2 litre car it's gone up about €100. On top of all the other tax increases and wages falling, I'm sure it isn't minimal like you said earlier.

Well re read what you said about the potential increases before the budget

166man wrote: »

It's not that I don't like your answers don't get me wrong, I just don't believe them.

You don't believe them? So you reckon I'm a liar so? Again not my problem

Our man in Havana

This ends now.

Thread closed. This thread will be reviewed with a view to further action.