Another mass shooting in the U.S

Optimalprimerib

I don't think the gun laws have as much to do with this as people think. If you needed a weapon there are ways and means to get one law or no law.

There is a mentality with some nut jobs that put the columbine killers on a pedestal and they see fit to replicate that. I don't see an easy solution to prevent this from happening again. Abolishing weapons will only slow it not stop it.

MadsL

CoDy1 wrote: »

Done reading the thread, So basically its not the gun laws?? Canada have similar laws yet no massacres etc.. so its the Mericans? seems to easy?

None you say?

Lépine, Marc, 25 Dec. 6, 1989, Montreal, Canada. Killed 14 Injured 14
Chiasson, Louis, 64, Dec. 2, 1969, Notre-Dame-du-Lac, Canada. Killed 40 Injured 2
Guay, Albert, 32, Sep. 9, 1949, Charlevoix, Canada. Killed 23

Weird spacings 20 years apart...none in 2009 though.

Father Damo

Blay wrote: »

Has anyone see the post about the shooting on Obama's facebook page? There's people in the comments saying that these shootings are taking place because there's no morning prayer in schools anymore..........

And those folks are even marginally less retarded than these types!

Not to mention their spititual leader


http://www.infowars.com/category/featured-stories/

The sooner Alex Jones croaks it from the amount of KFC the fat fcuk is shovelling down his gullet the better. And besides that we will be entertained by his followers claiming assasination rather than fast food suicide.

MadsL

MadsL wrote:

Do you drink? Because one person dies every 30 minutes of a drunk driving related accident. But you keep drinking, bury your head in a bottle, you are killing innocents. Think of the innocents.

token101 wrote: »

Jesus Christ. There's no words for how ****ing stupid that comparison is.

I was being satirical but tell me....

If banning guns prevents shootings, banning alcohol prevents drunk drivers. Tell me where the logic fails?

If you support a total gun ban, why do you not support an alcohol ban?

Overheal

wonderfullife wrote: »

Yes reducing the tools to commit mass-murder is more important than understanding why people do it. Make it more difficult for them to do. Simple. It's ridiculous to think understanding the reasons behind it can offer any meaningful solutions to prevent it. There will always be sick, twisted, deranged people out there. Making it harder for them to commit mass murder is a more important step.

Sorry, but this notion is ridiculous. Let's stop understanding Alzheimer's then, and HIV and Cancer. Who really needs to study thermodynamics for that matter. Sure **** it, what's the point of understand anything, really.

gandalf

I've been lurking in this thread since I saw it yesterday evening. Firstly as a father to a young boy I can only imagine the horror those poor parents are going through right now. I thought about those parents when I gave my boy a hug this morning.

How anyone can justify having high round, high calibre weapons available over the counter is beyond me. Most are designed for warfare and designed to kill people. I can understand having bolt action rifles and low capacity shotguns for hunting purposes but in reality to have any other weapons as freely available as they are is a recipe for disaster that is being reaped regularly in the US. To the outside observer a block of US citizens seem to care more about having guns than the consequences that it has for their fellow citizens.

I see that the pro gun lobby are arguing that having schools as gun free zones are to blame for tragedies like this. Do they honestly feel arming teachers is the answer? The shooter used his mothers (who was a teacher) legally held firearms to carry out this massacre.

Arawn

anyone see cnn's **** up?? They named and showed a picture of the killers brother and named him as the killer.

Father Damo

gandalf wrote: »

The shooter used his mothers (who was a teacher) legally held firearms to carry out this massacre.

What kind of woman feels the need to own a military grade firearm? Even in terms of property protection I fail to see a legitimate use- rapid fire guns in the US are nicknamed street sweepers due to the only general accuracy of the shot One Jamacian gang was known as the Shower Posse in NYC due to their habit of showering bullets in the direction of their target with such weapons, leading to obvious bystander casualties.. How in the **** can a society tolerate people firing semi accurate machineguns at burglars in suburban densely populated areas beggars belief. Im all for shooting burglars on sight, the likes of Padraig Nally are nothing short of heroes for ridding the world of the Frog Ward types, but the need for military hardware is idiotic. The Cold War arguement of stockpiling for rebel resistance in the event of a foreign invasion is pretty redundant and all.

crazygeryy

why does a woman or anyone for that matter, who lives in suburban America need a high powered rifle in their home?if they like target shooting as is being reported, why can't the gun clubs just rent the guns out as needed. and if it's for hunting,put laws in place that screen the **** out of anyone wanting a gun for that purpose.

Arawn

They're often called spray and prey weapons, spray an area with bullets and prey it hits something^^

Red Crow

There is a far bigger issue here than gun control. The gun makes it easier for him to kill these children but its the mentality of this monster that needs to be identified long before he carries out the crime.

If you ban guns, he'll just use a knife or make a bomb etc. the gun isn't making this monster commit this atrocity; it's another underlying mental factor that needs to be identified as somebody just doesn't wake up and decide to kill nearly two dozn children. That's a behaviour that is in development for years.

aloyisious

To the parents and families of the murdered children and teachers, my condolences, to the murdered children and teachers, R.I.P.

gandalf

Eli Manning wrote: »

There is a far bigger issue here than gun control. The gun makes it easier for him to kill these children but its the mentality of this monster that needs to be identified long before he carries out the crime.

If you ban guns, he'll just use a knife or make a bomb etc. the gun isn't making this monster commit this atrocity; it's another underlying mental factor that needs to be identified as somebody just doesn't wake up and decide to kill nearly two dozn children. That's a behaviour that is in development for years.

Of course the cause needs to be identified but someone with a knife cannot cause the same kind of damage and can be tackled easier as the incident in China yesterday shows.

If you combine a unbalanced person with a gun then you have a massacre in the making, especially high capacity ones like this! (that was one of the guns that Adam Lanza had. The others were a Sig Sauer and a Glock both hold around 18 rounds each as standard and can take extended mags! I don't know about you but I would definitely not be happy if the local Tesco sold this kind of material.

Red Crow

Oh absolutely, some of the guns that are available over there shouldn't be. But then again if the guy shot his own mother in the face I doubt the lack of availability of a semi auto was going to stop his completing this atrocity.

gandalf

Eli Manning wrote: »

Oh absolutely, some of the guns that are available over there shouldn't be. But then again if the guy shot his own mother in the face I doubt the lack of availability of a semi auto was going to stop his completing this atrocity.

Who knows but without semi automatic weapons the casualty list would more than likely be far smaller than the 20 children and 7 adults who are now resting in a morgue.

Run_to_da_hills

Obama shows all the signs of a psychopath.

He appears deeply upset over this atrocity and yet he shows no signs of remorse for engaging in the slaughter of countless children from his illegal drone warfare in other parts of the world.

Perhaps the US president should now get an Oscar to go along with his Nobel peace prize!

Wibbs

Yep gun ownership in the US is a large part of the problem, but there seem to be other social factors at play. If you look at the countries per capita gun ownership stats and then look at the homicide by gun stats they don't match up particularly well and the murder spree type horrors while they have happened in other countries they don't happen to nearly the same extent as in the US. Hell they didn't happen to nearly the same extent in the US two generations ago when gun laws were even more lax. Something in society is making it more likely that disenfranchised/mentally ill young(for the most part) men will "go postal"(an American expression). Men that after the fact it's discovered were well known to be in dire need of help.

It's become near a repeated ritual of responses played out on rolling news. All sorts of stuff will be looked at and blamed(video games, movie violence, the interweb etc). one side will argue for more gun control, another will argue for less and sadly we'll again see a new example of this kind of horror in 2013 and 2014 and so on.

On the gun front, how do you get the genie back in the bottle? Americans have something like 8 firearms for every 10 people. Trying to round up/control that won't be easy. Let's say they take "assault rifles" and "military pistols" out of the mix. That's usually good for headlines. A nutcase can still do a lot of damage with a hunting rifle/pistol. Someone with a repeating shotgun pump or auto can do horrible damage and that class of firearms are usually the last to be targeted for control. Even in Ireland with our very strict gun control shotguns are relatively easy to acquire.

Terrible situation and horrific for the families and the community involved. Mowing down children. Children FFS. :(:mad:

Sunnyisland

Run_to_da_hills wrote: »

Obama shows all the signs of a psychopath.

He appears deeply upset over this atrocity and yet he shows no signs of remorse for engaging in the slaughter of countless children from his illegal drone warfare in other parts of the world.

Perhaps the US president should now get an Oscar to go along with his Nobel peace prize!

Your a fool rtdh

pgmcpq

MadsL wrote: »

Actually the second amendment is for the establishment of civilian control of a peacetime army, nothing to do with England.

33 kids in China stabbed. What's your position on that?

Psycos go psyco. Fact of life. Tragic, but this will happen and continue to happen regardless of weapon controls.

22 and ZERO dead. You are a bit loose with your facts.

Just to hammer it home. Two incidents - one where there was access to a gun - 27 dead - the other - 22 injured, no one dead. Pretty obvious conclusion.

joydivision

Run_to_da_hills wrote: »

Obama shows all the signs of a psychopath.

He appears deeply upset over this atrocity and yet he shows no signs of remorse for engaging in the slaughter of countless children from his illegal drone warfare in other parts of the world.

Perhaps the US president should now get an Oscar to go along with his Nobel peace prize!

Why do you have it in for us presidents so much . What did they ever do to you .
Its like your whole life is centred around Obama.

tigger123

Eli Manning wrote: »

There is a far bigger issue here than gun control. The gun makes it easier for him to kill these children but its the mentality of this monster that needs to be identified long before he carries out the crime.

If you ban guns, he'll just use a knife or make a bomb etc. the gun isn't making this monster commit this atrocity; it's another underlying mental factor that needs to be identified as somebody just doesn't wake up and decide to kill nearly two dozn children. That's a behavior that is in development for years.

Gun control is the first logical step. There's many people shot in the heat of the moment, during robberies that go wrong etc. From wiki...

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gun_violence_in_the_United_States

"There were 52,447 deliberate and 23,237 accidental non-fatal gunshot injuries in the United States during 2000.[4] The majority of gun-related deaths in the United States are suicides,[5] with 17,352 (55.6%) of the total 31,224 firearm-related deaths in 2007 due to suicide, while 12,632 (40.5%) were homicide deaths.[6] In 2009, according to the United Nations Office on Drugs and Crime, 60% of all homicides in the United States were perpetrated using a firearm.[7]"

There is no logical argument against much tighter gun controls in the US.

Wibbs

Wibbs wrote: »

Yep gun ownership in the US is a large part of the problem, but there seem to be other social factors at play. If you look at the countries per capita gun ownership stats and then look at the homicide by gun stats they don't match up particularly well and the murder spree type horrors while they have happened in other countries they don't happen to nearly the same extent as in the US. Hell they didn't happen to nearly the same extent in the US two generations ago when gun laws were even more lax. Something in society is making it more likely that disenfranchised/mentally ill young(for the most part) men will "go postal"(an American expression). Men that after the fact it's discovered were well known to be in dire need of help.

Someone posted 3 sprees from Canada. Given the roughly 10:1 difference in population does that not seem about right? There haven't been any in a while but if one happens there could a cluster, though it could depend somewhat on how responsible the Canadian media was feeling.

pgmcpq wrote: »

22 and ZERO dead. You are a bit loose with your facts.

Just to hammer it home. Two incidents - one where there was access to a gun - 27 dead - the other - 22 injured, no one dead. Pretty obvious conclusion.

If someone can stab 22 kids and not kill any I'd have to question how hard they were trying to kill them.

Flier

I would have to agree that gun control is not the only issue here. But it certainly is part of the problem. Along with social and cultural issues that need to be addressed. As many have pointed out, the US is not the only country with a high level of gun ownership, but it does see a disproportionate amount of gun crime, and particularly this type of incident which afaik seems to happen with legally held weapons. I don't think this can be sorted out overnight - it'll take years, maybe even generations, because people are very resistant to changing attitudes, and this is a very complex social / health / justice problem. But I find it hard to see how gun control can not play an important part in improving the situation.

deandean

What is a horrible incident. I waiting for the response of the NRA they will probably call for all teachers to carry sidearms. And for a well stocked armory in the principal's office.

Father Damo

joydivision wrote: »

Why do you have it in for us presidents so much . What did they ever do to you .
Its like your whole life is centred around Obama.

For entertainment.

You dont actually think anyone from Ireland believes this sh1t? Some Republicans MAY believe it, in the US, but I steadfastly refuse to believe anyone outside of the redneck states truly believes this false flag stuff. Even Alex Jones, for all his talk, is little more than a sick minded self publicist extracting donation money from idiots. Even he doesnt believe his own vile crap.

gandalf

deandean wrote: »

What is a horrible incident. I waiting for the response of the NRA they will probably call for all teachers to carry sidearms. And for a well stocked armory in the principal's office.

Errr this happened because one teacher legally had two semi-auto pistols and a semi-auto high capacity rifle. Because of this her supposedly mentally unstable son had access to these weapons.

Father Damo

gandalf wrote: »

Errr this happened because one teacher legally had two semi-auto pistols and a semi-auto high capacity rifle. Because of this her supposedly mentally unstable son had access to these weapons.

Brilliant point. The laws vary by state- even if Connecetuit gun owner laws would have regarded the boy to be too mentally unstable to buy his own firearm (as is the case in many more liberal states and cities), it allowed family members to have them in easy access. Military grade weapons should not be allowed by anyone bar swat teams and the army itself, end of. With all due respect his idiot mother bares as much responsibility keeping military weapons in the same house as a mentally ill boy, as he himself does over these deaths.

APM

gandalf wrote: »

Errr this happened because one teacher legally had two semi-auto pistols and a semi-auto high capacity rifle. Because of this her supposedly mentally unstable son had access to these weapons.

and where did he get the body armour that he supposedly had on him too?

gandalf

APM wrote: »

and where did he get the body armour that he supposedly had on him too?

Probably from the same places that James Holmes the Aurora shooter got his? However I don't remember body armour being capable of blowing a 5 years olds head off.

Witcher

What's interesting about this thread is that somebody mentioned s/a rifles on the first few pages and everyone just ran with it and blamed them...despite the guy using 2 pistols in the shooting. Hysteria about 'teh assault gunz' in action.