Winter Break

Matt_Trakker

Wee poll ladies and gents.

Should the EPL follow suit with those on the continent and have a winter break?

I think they should, the benefits are clear from the Bundesliga, players get a break, regain full fitness, some have more time to come back from injury.
Yea, I know that Germany and other Central & Eastern European countries are far colder than England and Ireland, but I think it would help players remain fitter over a full season.

If it comes into affect I suppose the EPL might have to lose a couple of teams, or else the season will have to go on for longer into the summer, I don't really see anything wrong with that either.

keith16

Football in December is a massive tradition in England. No way it will ever happen. I personally really enjoy the games, especially Stephens' Day and New years day!

Predalien

I don't think so, there's a lot of nonsense about players getting tired these days, the fitness levels are excellent and there's no reason why players can't play 50 - 60 games a year. It's not as if they run a marathon every weekend. Squads are big enough to deal with injuries.

LuckyLloyd

For the benefit of the players and standard of football they clearly should.

For the benefit of our entertainment and the money to be made from our interest they never will.

Seaneh

winter break is essential for Serie A, gives the papers a chance to ****e on about "winter champions" and allows the hard worked players to feck off to some sunny country for a 2 week "training camp" and escape the cold.

Kylo Ren

No way. I love the madness of the winter games. So many games on and having the St. Stephens day games is a tradition!

Beefy78

Definitely not. Football is a tradition over Christmas, and FA Cup 3rd round is one of the highlights of the year.

The other thing is that the bad weather is so unpredictable. February is the usually the worst month weather-wise yet the last couple of times a lot of games have been postponed it has been in December. So a break in January could miss the worst of it anyway.

Big Pussy Bonpensiero

From a purely selfish point of view, no, definitely not.


They probably should though...

Beefy78

LuckyLloyd wrote: »

For the benefit of the players and standard of football they clearly should.

How will the players benefit from being flown away to a hot country somewhere for a couple of money-spinning friendlies?

TaosHum

The winter break does not have to be in December, they could have it after the 2nd week of January, right after the FA Cup 3rd round fixtures.

IMO it could be done if the FA cup replay's were scrapped.

A winter break? How about a winter world cup? Oh wait...

Iang87

Definitely not, dont see how it would help that much to be honest

greendom

Predalien wrote: »

I don't think so, there's a lot of nonsense about players getting tired these days, the fitness levels are excellent and there's no reason why players can't play 50 - 60 games a year. It's not as if they run a marathon every weekend. Squads are big enough to deal with injuries.

When they play 2 games a week some players would not be far off running the equivalent of a marathon

greendom

One major problem with this is that the weather is just to inconsistent. You could have a very mild January while the players have their feet up only to return to snowstorms and Blizzards in Feb/March.

Corvo

Certainly think it would be a good idea. It would stop things like injuries over the Christmas period on harder pitches (not as applicable to top Premier League grounds), it would ensure there are no postponements (no point saying we love winter football if it is all called off) and it would make it safer for travelling fans on the roads.

Plus, it would help the English sides in the Champions League.

Matt_Trakker

Surprised by most of you saying 'no' tbh.
And although of course I enjoy the amount of games over xmas and all I think for the players it can give them a badly needed break.

someone said before that players should be able to play 50 games a year, but I don't agree with that. Take a look at poor joe allen, he's played nearly all of lfc's games and the poor chap is bollixed...or the entire West Brom team, played their skins off for the first few games and now they can barely walk.

I know the temperature is the major factor in Germany/Austria/Poland/Italy....but Spain, Portugal & France..even feckin Greece.... all also take breaks etc but I also think that it greatly benefits their national teams in the Euros.

Of the 4 semi-finalists all nations take winter breaks (Portugal, Germany, Spain, Italy)
Of the 8 quarter finalists, 7 take winter breaks (above 4 & France, Greece(!) Czech)...England, of course do not.

Regarding fitness, I think they should implement it, regarding out entertainment, of course I want to watch as much football as I can, but y'know there's plenty of other sport on tele over xmas, horse racing, snow/winter sports etc.

aidan24326

I don't see why they should, or what effect it would have only to deprive the fans of the much-loved Stephen's Day fixtures and FA Cup third round.

Why would they need a rest? These guys are supposed to be professional athletes. They get paid enormous amounts of money to play 1 or at most 2 games in a week usually, and with large squads to rotate and deal with injuries.

I know there wasn't quite as many games back then but in the 70s and 80s teams got by with almost the same 11 starting every game. Those players got kicked a lot more too and they weren't being paid Hollywood wages for it either.

Corvo

aidan24326 wrote: »

I don't see why they should, or what effect it would have only to deprive the fans of the much-loved Stephen's Day fixtures and FA Cup third round.

Why would they need a rest? These guys are supposed to be professional athletes. They get paid enormous amounts of money to play 1 or at most 2 games in a week usually, and with large squads to rotate and deal with injuries.

I know there wasn't quite as many games back then but in the 70s and 80s teams got by with almost the same 11 starting every game. Those players got kicked a lot more too and they weren't being paid Hollywood wages for it either.

True, but your hamstrings have no idea how much you get paid!

greendom

Griffin1988 wrote: »

Certainly think it would be a good idea. It would stop things like injuries over the Christmas period on harder pitches (not as applicable to top Premier League grounds), it would ensure there are no postponements (no point saying we love winter football if it is all called off) and it would make it safer for travelling fans on the roads.

Plus, it would help the English sides in the Champions League.

How could you guarantee no postponments - you can get a bad Winter spell any time between November - March ?

FlawedGenius

There payed enough, they should play some ball to entertain us around the Christmas period. As previous poster said Scrap fa cup replays and have a 2 week break in January.

Matt_Trakker

aidan24326 wrote: »

I don't see why they should, or what effect it would have only to deprive the fans of the much-loved Stephen's Day fixtures and FA Cup third round.

So how come the rest of Europe can cope without it?

aidan24326 wrote: »

I know there wasn't quite as many games back then but in the 70s and 80s teams got by with almost the same 11 starting every game. Those players got kicked a lot more too and they weren't being paid Hollywood wages for it either.

Ah when men were men.
Stoke fan?

greendom

Matt_Trakker wrote: »

So how come the rest of Europe can cope without it?



Ah when men were men.
Stoke fan?

A Stoke fan wouldn't need to reminisce - they still play football as if it was the 70s/80s.

Corvo

greendom wrote: »

How could you guarantee no postponments - you can get a bad Winter spell any time between November - March ?

True, but I'm thinking of the last major postponment in January 2010. If you could knock out a lot of December and January, I'm sure you would have a better chance of avoiding the majority. Obviously it may be impossible to judge it exactly, but at least you are minimising the time.

Matt_Trakker

greendom wrote: »

A Stoke fan wouldn't need to reminisce - they still play football as if it was the 70s/80s.

hahaha, touche :D:D

greendom

Griffin1988 wrote: »

True, but I'm thinking of the last major postponment in January 2010. If you could knock out a lot of December and January, I'm sure you would have a better chance of avoiding the majority. Obviously it may be impossible to judge it exactly, but at least you are minimising the time.

Then the problem is that in the odd year when you have unusual weather patterns you've restricted still further the time period for the matches to be played.

Beefy78

Griffin1988 wrote: »

True, but I'm thinking of the last major postponment in January 2010. If you could knock out a lot of December and January, I'm sure you would have a better chance of avoiding the majority. Obviously it may be impossible to judge it exactly, but at least you are minimising the time.

You're potentially minimising the time but you're also potentially making it much worse by trying to squeeze more games into December and February which could equally fall foul of the weather.

Spain doesn't really have that same issue. For them it's a simple question of whether or not they want to give the players a break.

double GG

So we get no Champions League and you want to take the Premier League away from our winter?

Big No for me.

pickarooney

No. Their job is to provide entertainment and the fans who pay their wages deserve to get that.

Rekop dog

Big no from me too, don't particularly see a compelling argument for it either, don't think English sides performance levels on the whole have dipped late on in Champions leagues compared to sides from countries who do take winter breaks. I mean the English often use it as an excuse for poor performances at major competitions, they tend to throw out several such excuses before getting to the most obvious issue, the lack of top class quality in the side.

Matt_Trakker

pickarooney wrote: »

No. Their job is to provide entertainment and the fans who pay their wages deserve to get that.

Unless the fans live in Germany, France, Spain, Italy, Austria, Poland etc etc?
I don't think it's a valid argument to say "we pay their wages, we want to see them every week'
Surely a real football fan would prefer to see his team playing to full strength, with a fully fit squad as often as possible, rather than a bunch of reserve and youth players drafted in because of injuries sustained to first team players over the winter period?
Works in Europe, there's no reason it wouldn't work in the UK.

Guy:Incognito

greendom wrote: »

When they play 2 games a week some players would not be far off running the equivalent of a marathon

They would in fairness.Whats the average? 10km a game? 20km is quite a way off 26 miles.

G.K.

Lloyd has it bang on imo.

tim_holsters

I love watching the football over the christmas where I can get pissed and not have to worry about getting up for work the next day. Leave it as it is I say, squads should be robust enough to handle things anyway.

greendom

Guy:Incognito wrote: »

They would in fairness.Whats the average? 10km a game? 20km is quite a way off 26 miles.

When you add in training time over the course of the week you'd be pretty close i would imagine

Iang87

not necessarily. Marathon runners dont stop for periods in between their running. Either way they're paid a fortune and I dont see how playing 2 games a week is that bad for "fit" men.

Pro. F

The distance they cover is far from the only factor in determining the workload that footballers are getting through each week. Talking about marathons is irrelevant.

Talking about how much the players are paid is ridiculous.

I enjoy having football to watch during the Christmas period, but a break in January would benefit the game overall imo. The players are more likely to stay fit through the rest of the season so we would get to see more of the best players and the teams with the smaller squads wouldn't be so harshly punished, making the league more competitive.

citytillidie

Matt_Trakker wrote: »

Wee poll ladies and gents.

Should the EPL follow suit with those on the continent and have a winter break?

I think they should, the benefits are clear from the Bundesliga, players get a break, regain full fitness, some have more time to come back from injury.
Yea, I know that Germany and other Central & Eastern European countries are far colder than England and Ireland, but I think it would help players remain fitter over a full season.

If it comes into affect I suppose the EPL might have to lose a couple of teams, or else the season will have to go on for longer into the summer, I don't really see anything wrong with that either.

But in Germany they dont really have a break as they do have indoor comps during the league break

Rekop dog

Pro. F wrote: »

I enjoy having football to watch during the Christmas period, but a break in January would benefit the game overall imo. The players are more likely to stay fit through the rest of the season so we would get to see more of the best players and the teams with the smaller squads wouldn't be so harshly punished, making the league more competitive.

Any sort of evidence to back this up or is it all speculative?

Pro. F

Rekop dog wrote: »

Any sort of evidence to back this up or is it all speculative?

For the first point - the players' fitness through the rest of the season - I have a about 15 years experience of sports training and a good knowledge of sport science.

The second point - that it would benefit the smaller squads and so make the league more competitive - is based on logical reasoning, so fire away if you see a flaw with my logic.

nucker

I see no problem with it, but it is a little congested during the Christmas period, there was nothing wrong with it when it was the old Division One, so why should the EPL change just because they have a load of money coming in? Football is about entertaining the crowds who have nothing else to do during the holidays, players should be professional about it and play, though they do have to care about their health

Pro. F

nucker wrote: »

there was nothing wrong with it when it was the old Division One, so why should the EPL change just because they have a load of money coming in?

Has anybody suggested that the layout of the season should change because there is more money coming in now?

I would think that the suggestion that a winter break is needed more now would be based on the fact that the game is far more physically demanding these days.

Rekop dog

Pro. F wrote: »

For the first point - the players' fitness through the rest of the season - I have a about 15 years experience of sports training and a good knowledge of sport science.

The second point - that it would benefit the smaller squads and so make the league more competitive - is based on logical reasoning, so fire away if you see a flaw with my logic.

You still haven't proven anything, I'm not saying a winter break would or wouldn't benefit the Premier League(I genuinely don't know) but in all the posts suggesting it definitely would help I haven't read anything of any substance to convince me. You'd need to compare the league with other leagues who do take breaks and somehow statistically show that time off in winter is advantageous re superior fitness levels later on in the season, well aware that won't be easy to prove but if people are being such strong advocates of the benefits you'd hope they'd have a worthwhile argument to back it up.

Pro. F

Rekop dog wrote: »

You still haven't proven anything, I'm not saying a winter break would or wouldn't benefit the Premier League(I genuinely don't know) but in all the posts suggesting it definitely would help I haven't read anything of any substance to convince me. You'd need to compare the league with other leagues who do take breaks and somehow statistically show that time off in winter is advantageous re superior fitness levels later on in the season, well aware that won't be easy to prove but if people are being such strong advocates of the benefits you'd hope they'd have a worthwhile argument to back it up.

Statistical comparisons of the leagues is just one way of supporting the argument and certainly not one that I have an inclination to carry out. Just do a bit of reading on the importance of rest and recovery in sport and you will understand the benefits to fitness levels.

nucker

Pro. F wrote: »

Has anybody suggested that the layout of the season should change because there is more money coming in now?

I would think that the suggestion that a winter break is needed more now would be based on the fact that the game is far more physically demanding these days.

I agree that there are more games, but teams have bigger squads pre-EPL

Pro. F

nucker wrote: »

I agree that there are more games, but teams have bigger squads pre-EPL

Not just more games but a much faster pace and much more ground covered in each game. And imo the competition of who has the deepest squad is far less entertaining than the competition of who has the best first 11.

Rekop dog

Pro. F wrote: »

Statistical comparisons of the leagues is just one way of supporting the argument and certainly not one that I have an inclination to carry out. Just do a bit of reading on the importance of rest and recovery in sport and you will understand the benefits to fitness levels.

Well I'd suggest it's a completely vital way of supporting the argument on this issue and without such research you cannot give a conclusive answer either way. It's a bit of an epidemic on this forum for people to take such strong lines on subject matters that on scrutiny they don't really know much about.

Pro. F

Rekop dog wrote: »

Well I'd suggest it's a completely vital way of supporting the argument on this issue and without such research you cannot give a conclusive answer either way. It's a bit of an epidemic on this forum for people to take such strong lines on subject matters that on scrutiny they don't really know much about.

First of all, I know a lot about it. I told you what my knowledge is and that is certainly good enough to discuss this type of thing with confidence.

Second of all, you don't need a a statistical study to for an argument to be well supported. An argument can be supported by logical reasoning if you have enough of a base of knowledge to work from.

nucker

Pro. F wrote: »

Not just more games but a much faster pace and much more ground covered in each game. And imo the competition of who has the deepest squad is far less entertaining than the competition of who has the best first 11.

I've actually seen a less faster game, days of yore they were just hoofing the ball up the pitch all the time

I don't disagree with you in terms of the depth of squad, I have seen lots of poor quality players come and go in my favourite team

Rekop dog

Pro. F wrote: »

First of all, I know a lot about it. I told you what my knowledge is and that is certainly good enough to discuss this type of thing with confidence.

Second of all, you don't need a a statistical study to for an argument to be well supported. An argument can be supported by logical reasoning if you have enough of a base of knowledge to work from.

Ok grand, you're clearly at all costs avoiding discussing the actual subject matter here. I work with a few 'experts' in their fields who are absolute morons, so solely stating you're supposed knowledge/experience on this without in any way proving it doesn't earn any credibility.

Time for bed....

Pro. F

Rekop dog wrote: »

Ok grand, you're clearly at all costs avoiding discussing the actual subject matter here. I work with a few supposed experts in their fields who are absolute morons, so solely stating you're supposed knowledge/experience on this without in any way proving it doesn't earn any credibility.

Time for bed....

I'm not avoiding the actual subject matter in the slightest.

Requiring a statistical study before anybody can argue a case is what is moronic. There is more to discussion than comparing numbers.

Edit: As I said before, if you just do a bit of reading on the importance of rest and recovery in sports you will see how much of an effect it has. I'm not going to hold your hand while you catch up on the basics of sports science though.

Pro. F

nucker wrote: »

I've actually seen a less faster game, days of yore they were just hoofing the ball up the pitch all the time

I think you might be surprised by watching some old games again now on youtube. It amazes me how slowly they moved and how little running they did in years past. Even the harder working teams.