Neuter our Samoyed or not?

ShaShaBear

Synyster Shadow wrote: »

slookie- I've heard that one litter can help prevent cancer of the womb (told by vets) and I know with my Granny's German Shep that she is always looking to mother pups that are brought over there when family is visiting with there newest family member, she pines for days after they leave again so getting her neutered before having a litter of pups wont make her forget what she's missing out on its part of them. I think keeping one pup out of the litter for her own company and yours is nice and we were thinking of doing the same last year when a friend of ours had our Doberman bread with there bitch and just at the last minute we decided not to (the thought was nice though as he's getting the snip early next year and he's unique colour wise-blue)

You should take the advice you need and make your own mind up in the end. Best of luck either way

Removing the womb prevents cancer of the womb :rolleyes:
Letting her have a litter of pups and then taking them all away from her is no different than letting your dog mother someone else's pups and then taking them away from her. Except it's much less expensive and safer for the bitch

fatmammycat

doubter wrote: »

The only reason I am pro neutering is that there are too many unresponsible breeders- and owners - in this country. Male dogs tend to stray after a bitch in heat, and before you know it theres pups..Currently I know of 4 litters in our irish pounds..dogs that will DIE tomorrow if no rescue steps in - and all recsues are full.Latest a husky mother with 3 1 day old pups dumped in someones back yard in Tullamore...and very often, due to the fact that pups are too young to be vaacinated they will contract Parvo in the pound..and die a horrible death.Please neuter your animals..dog,cat,rabbit...doesn't matter.

Yes, but it does matter. It matters a great deal. You say 'male dogs tend to stray after a bitch in heat'- this may be true, but the problem here is not hormonal, but security. A dog should not be able to stray, period. Owners who are not responsible for their dogs are unlikely to worry about unwanted pups and security, but in my view that just means they shouldn't have dogs at all, not that every male dog should be neutered.
I am responsible for my dog; for his health, his safety, and for his well being, both mental and physical. And at the moment there are more cons to neutering him than there are pros, and I imagine this is the case for a number of people. The blanket 'neuter your dog' needs to be addressed calmly and rationally: as said, it has become a catch all meme these days, frequently with little thought behind the why.

Synyster Shadow

well I just wanted to put in what I've heard and going on what the OP wants to do I wanted to state something positive about neutering after a litter of pups. Neutering doesnt mean the womb is gone so the risk can still be there but having one litter at least can lessen the chances.

All of us here are aloud an opinion and not be shot down including OP and none of us are trained professionals. If someone wants to breed there dogs they should be entitled to do so and as she said she is not out to sell and make money off them she's giving them to family. We shouldnt assume she cant afford the costs I dont think she would enter into a situation she cant handle

I dont get why people cant give there opinion in a positive way instead of coming off like the person asking is wrong and the worst in the world for asking, I thought that was part the point of these forums? How else can we better educate ourselves??

SillyMangoX

I agree everyone is entitled to their opinion but facts are also important, neutering does mean the womb is gone its an ovariohysterectomy so the womb and ovaries are gone so no cancer!

doubter

Bullseye1 wrote: »

I appreciate that there are irresponsible breeders in this country but there are also responsible breeders. I'm not saying that the OPs reasons are possibly breeding their dog is legitimate. It is probably more appropriate to source a companion dog through other means be it from a responsible breeder or from a pound or rescue.

Personally I would recommend anyone considering breeding dogs for he love of he breed to contact the relevant dog club for advice. Your dog may not be suitable for breeding healthy dogs. Have the necessary health checks as advised by the dog club.

This is not the best place for sourcing information on breeding. There are far too many people with their own agenda, good and well meaning but if thy had their way there would be little or no breeding.

Hi,
I do appreciate your point..but there is not one single breed I have not come across in the pounds.From Alsation to Shi tzu, from Bernese mountain dog to yorkshire Terrier -they have all passed through the pounds. And many of them have been killed. Yes I have my own agenda - no more killing of dogs.As long as there is an 'endless' supply of cute puppies, dogs will die.

tk123

doubter wrote: »

Hi,
I do appreciate your point..but there is not one single breed I have not come across in the pounds.From Alsation to Shi tzu, from Bernese mountain dog to yorkshire Terrier -they have all passed through the pounds. And many of them have been killed. Yes I have my own agenda - no more killing of dogs.As long as there is an 'endless' supply of cute puppies, dogs will die.

As long as there is an irresponsible owner culture of 'disposable dogs' dogs will die. Responsible breeding and responsible ownership go hand in hand - you are no less of an owner or person for that matter if you do your research and source a well bred healthy pup who is less likely to have the behavioural and health issues than see a lot of dogs surrenendered or pts in the first place?

Slookie at the end of the day it's up to you but you can see from this thread that more and more people are more clued in on irresponsible breeders - by that I mean they're aware that there is a standard and expect the parents to be fully health checked etc and know what to look for - you need to keep that in mind if you do breed and end up with more pups than expected so contacting the breed club for advice is probably the best way to go. You can talk to breeders and get advice from them on their experiences - maybe you have all your bases covered already or maybe you'll find you need to do more research.... I still wouldn't be able to part with them lol!!!

Synyster Shadow

I dont think picking on the one person is going to change the problems in our dog pounds there is always goin to be bad people out there its not necessarily down to the breeder but the people buying the dogs from them then not giving a damn or looking after them the way they should. Not all breeders are bad its each persons right to do this if the circumstances are right. I also know a lot of people who take dogs home from the pound too they dont buy from breeders just proves there's all kinds of people and there not all bad. there's a lot of negitive people here facts or not. there is tactful ways to get the point across. Telling someone what to do instead of advising is a bit much

borderlinemeath

I posted on a similar thread a while back about my dog..

http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showthread.php?p=80873912

When we got our first irish setter 5 years ago we got a female. We always thought we would breed her as she is from fantastic hunting lines, and is highly intelligent and a wonderful temperament and like you we thought we would love to keep one of her puppies.

But.. and there was always a but - what if she has a huge litter? She was one of a dozen so it was possible, how would we rehome all the pups? We wouldn't want to for a start and would be very very choosy as to who would be up to standard to take one.
Also the health risks to her. Why would we put her through it? It's unnecessary and could leave her open to further health problems, even though she's an exceptionally healthy dog with only the very odd minor problem.

Then we took in a rescue dog, another Irish setter, and the more we thought about it, why the hell would we breed just to 'keep a pup' when there are such fantastic dogs out there in rescues and pounds. And the very reason they are there is because people like you and me breed for all the wrong reasons. The pups from the puppy farmers and the back yard breeders and the people who just want to 'keep a pup' all end up in the same pound and rescue when their owners either cant afford them, emigrate, a child comes along, move to an apartment, change in circumstances etc.

The only difference between the puppy farmers who have such a bad rep and all the other breeders is that the conditions that the dogs and pups are kept in are usually squalid and cramped. The majority of back yard breeders and one off breeders don't health test their dogs, and by health testing I mean xraying, screening for inherited problems etc - not just a health check at the vets. So the resulting pups are all the same, untested, possibly unhealthy, possibly too closely bred and sold to unsuspecting punters who just want a cute bundle of fluff.

My setter is neutered now, no pups for her and my other setter came from the rescue neutered so no go for him either. It's not about being all high and mighty and a 'responsible pet owner' but if you actually visited a pound or a rescue and imagined your dogs offspring ending up there then it might change your mind. I certainly couldn't breed a dog once I fully comprehended the bigger picture.

tk123

Whenever you write about Benson his name always reminds me of FENNNTONNNNNNNN!

Sorry everyone if I'm coming across as anti-rescue - I'm not - I just don't agree with the way some people try to guilt trip others for not rescuing.

borderlinemeath

tk123 wrote: »

Whenever you write about Benson his name always reminds me of FENNNTONNNNNNNN!

Sorry everyone if I'm coming across as anti-rescue - I'm not - I just don't agree with the way some people try to guilt trip others for not rescuing.

Poor aul Benson!:D. I'm working for my OH today because he was meant to go and collect stuff today for his work. Anyhow it fell through and his stuff isn't in so I'm working away and the fecker rings me and he's on the beach with our two and I can hear Benson barking away at the birds in the background, he's like a bloody siren after them:D. Some 'working' setter instincts!! Coco looks at him as if to say "What the hell are you doing, we're meant to creep up on them:P", but it's the one thing he never manages to get the hang of!

I know where you're coming from TK, I was the same when I only had Coco, I followed rescues on facebook but never took the plunge and when Benson came home it was COMPLETELY different to getting a breeder pup. Here's a dog with learned behaviours, scared of most things and people, chewed crazy stuff (decking lights, trailer electricals:eek:) but I wouldn't change him for the world.

I think that's why people push the rescue agenda, (apart from the obvious) because once you overcome the obstacles the rewards are so great. Benson actually gazes into your eyes when you're petting him as if to say "I'm so grateful". I don't get that with Coco because she's only ever known affection, she gives off a look that says "I deserve it":D but Benson is infinitely more affectionate than she is, and demonstrably more emotional.

ShaShaBear

Synyster Shadow wrote: »

I dont think picking on the one person is going to change the problems in our dog pounds there is always goin to be bad people out there its not necessarily down to the breeder but the people buying the dogs from them then not giving a damn or looking after them the way they should. Not all breeders are bad its each persons right to do this if the circumstances are right. I also know a lot of people who take dogs home from the pound too they dont buy from breeders just proves there's all kinds of people and there not all bad. there's a lot of negitive people here facts or not. there is tactful ways to get the point across. Telling someone what to do instead of advising is a bit much

Since the title of the post was "Neuter our Samoyed or not" I think it is safe to assume the OP was looking to the answer to their question, which is in most cases - no, no you should not. Why on earth would anyone go through the pressure of having a litter of pups for a myth of possibly preventing cancer when they could have their dog spayed and factually prevent cancer? And OP couldn't even account for what they were going to do with all of 5 pups, when samoyeds could have anywhere up to 10! So, in the OPs case it is a bad idea. Breeding an entire litter for just one pup is a risk in itself, especially when you assume family members will take some of them and you don't know what you're going to do with the rest :rolleyes:
We gave advice based on the information OP gave us

ISDW

Synyster Shadow wrote: »

well I just wanted to put in what I've heard and going on what the OP wants to do I wanted to state something positive about neutering after a litter of pups. Neutering doesnt mean the womb is gone so the risk can still be there but having one litter at least can lessen the chances.

All of us here are aloud an opinion and not be shot down including OP and none of us are trained professionals. If someone wants to breed there dogs they should be entitled to do so and as she said she is not out to sell and make money off them she's giving them to family. We shouldnt assume she cant afford the costs I dont think she would enter into a situation she cant handle

I dont get why people cant give there opinion in a positive way instead of coming off like the person asking is wrong and the worst in the world for asking, I thought that was part the point of these forums? How else can we better educate ourselves??

Very sweeping statement to make and an incorrect one. There are vets, vet nurses, qualified behaviourists and trainers that post on here so yes some are trained professionals.

Synyster Shadow wrote: »

I dont think picking on the one person is going to change the problems in our dog pounds there is always goin to be bad people out there its not necessarily down to the breeder but the people buying the dogs from them then not giving a damn or looking after them the way they should. Not all breeders are bad its each persons right to do this if the circumstances are right. I also know a lot of people who take dogs home from the pound too they dont buy from breeders just proves there's all kinds of people and there not all bad. there's a lot of negitive people here facts or not. there is tactful ways to get the point across. Telling someone what to do instead of advising is a bit much

Disagree it is down to the breeder. I am not anti-breeding at all, I am pro responsible breeding. By being a responsible breeder you take on responsiblity for every pup you breed for its life. So if an owner's circumstances change you take the dog back no matter how old it is. So don't breed dogs that you can't take back if you breed 100 dogs no way are you going to be able to take them all back if necessary. Only breed the dogs that you are capable of being responsible for.

doubter wrote: »

Hi,
I do appreciate your point..but there is not one single breed I have not come across in the pounds.From Alsation to Shi tzu, from Bernese mountain dog to yorkshire Terrier -they have all passed through the pounds. And many of them have been killed. Yes I have my own agenda - no more killing of dogs.As long as there is an 'endless' supply of cute puppies, dogs will die.

Sorry disagree again and I run a rescue. Responsible breeding does not lead to dogs being in pounds. But it does ensure well breed healthy dogs so there is absolutely nothing wrong in my opinion with someone getting a pup from a responsible breeder. The problem is that there really aren't many of them out there:(

Apologies the comma isn't working so the words are all just flowing together.

Wibbs

ShaShaBear wrote: »

Since the title of the post was "Neuter our Samoyed or not" I think it is safe to assume the OP was looking to the answer to their question, which is in most cases - no, no you should not. Why on earth would anyone go through the pressure of having a litter of pups for a myth of possibly preventing cancer when they could have their dog spayed and factually prevent cancer? And OP couldn't even account for what they were going to do with all of 5 pups, when samoyeds could have anywhere up to 10! So, in the OPs case it is a bad idea. Breeding an entire litter for just one pup is a risk in itself, especially when you assume family members will take some of them and you don't know what you're going to do with the rest :rolleyes:
We gave advice based on the information OP gave us

Just to point out the OP/original poster of the thread has a male that is escaping. Ye're talking about a later poster. My response was to the OP. Personally I'd not castrate a dog, but would neuter a bitch. Both for health reasons.

I'd also agree with ISDW, breeding isn't the issue, it's the lack of responsible breeders that is the problem and there are sadly far lass of the latter from what I've heard and seen. Even among outwardly responsible breeders who do stand over their pups and make all the required precautions some breeds(the list is long) have become shadows of their former vigour, because of severe inbreeding for the sake of fashion and form over function and the breeders as well as the public are driving that, but that's a story for another day.