Nurses

road_high

FTA69 wrote: »

On the common sense basis that dealing with horrific injury, constant bereavement, night shifts, 12 hour shifts, days of unpaid work every year, no breaks, unsocial hours, working during holidays, understaffing, drug dependency, infant mortality, severe alzheimers and dementia, alcoholism, physical violence, verbal abuse, aggression; all generally mean a tougher working enviornment than the likes of your typical office job.

Have you any idea what goes on in hospitals? What do you think it's like working in A and E on Saturday night?

Choice is simple. If you don't want to work with the above for the salaries on offer, move along to something else.

FTA69

WileyCoyote (Accelleratii Incredibus!) wrote: »

IMO any unemployed nursing graduate who fails to apply for one of these jobs should be denied Social welfare, after all to qualify for Social Welfare you must be activly seeking work.

Chances are the majority of them will emigrate to countries that respect nursing staff and don't pay them like shelf-stackers in a supermarket.

FTA69

mfitzy wrote: »

Choice is simple. If you don't want to work with the above for the salaries on offer, move along to something else.

That's a grand attitude to have. Let's take a highly-overworked and valuable societal profession, cut their pay to subsistence and if they don't like it they can f*ck off to England. Great stuff.

mikom

mfitzy wrote: »

Choice is simple. If you don't want to work with the above for the salaries on offer, move along to something else.

Knowledge economy innit'...........

road_high

FTA69 wrote: »

That's a grand attitude to have. Let's take a highly-overworked and valuable societal profession, cut their pay to subsistence and if they don't like it they can f*ck off to England. Great stuff.

In your opinion....again why are nurses more special than the many thousands of others that have had to emigrate?

FTA69

FTA69 wrote: »

Chances are the majority of them will emigrate to countries that respect nursing staff and don't pay them like shelf-stackers in a supermarket.

How much does the average shelf stacker earn these days? (rate per hour and average hours?)

road_high

Deleted User wrote: »

How much does the average shelf stacker earn these days? (rate per hour and average hours?)

Plus their wage has to be earned via profits from the shop i.e. private enterprise.

mfitzy

mfitzy wrote: »

In your opinion....again why are nurses more special than the many thousands of others that have had to emigrate?

Well for a start, the work has not dried up here like it has for most who emigrate. The opposite in fact, there is a severe shortage of nurses but not very much hiring. Now that they have decided to start hiring again they should be paying a proper wage not a pittance that you would nearly be better off on the dole.

You don't appear to understand the concept of paying people proper salary in jobs that deserve it.

mfitzy wrote: »

Plus their wage has to be earned via profits from the shop i.e. private enterprise.

This is irrelevant, nursing is a highly skilled and demanding job and if you want good people you have to pay them. The full nurses salary falls well short of what they deserve never mind this joke salary they are offering.

FTA69

mfitzy wrote: »

In your opinion....again why are nurses more special than the many thousands of others that have had to emigrate?

They aren't, I've had to emigrate myself. It's just another sad indictiment of a country where young people are flooding out of it because there is nothing there for them. It's even more sad when some of the most vital workers we have in society aren't going to be paid properly and are leaving en masse also.

How much does the average shelf stacker earn these days? (rate per hour and average hours?)

If someone is getting €9 an hour for a 40 hour week they'll be getting around €18,000 a year; which is what nurses will be getting after deductions.

road_high

Luka Handsome Fingertip wrote: »

Well for a start, the work has not dried up here like it has for most who emigrate. The opposite in fact, there is a severe shortage of nurses but not very much hiring. Now that they have decided to start hiring again they should be paying a proper wage not a pittance that you would nearly be better off on the dole.

You don't appear to understand the concept of paying people proper salary in jobs that deserve it.

I do, but let the market not the unions decide, same as most other professions.
We are running a defict of over €8 billion still, but yet we still "should" be paying certain professions over and above "because they do such a hard job". That makes no sense to me.

road_high

FTA69 wrote: »

They aren't, I've had to emigrate myself. It's just another sad indictiment of a country where young people are flooding out of it because there is nothing there for them. It's even more sad when some of the most vital workers we have in society aren't going to be paid properly and are leaving en masse also.



If someone is getting €9 an hour for a 40 hour week they'll be getting around €18,000 a year; which is what nurses will be getting after deductions.

And someone on that wage has no deductions you're assuming?

There are jobs here at €22k, just not paying what you feel you deserve and are perfectly entitled to go elsewhere in that scenario. That's the market deciding.

mikom

mfitzy wrote: »

I do, but let the market not the unions decide, same as most other professions.
We are running a defict of over €8 billion still, but yet we still "should" be paying certain professions over and above "because they do such a hard job". That makes no sense to me.

"How much am I bid for the administering of this painkilling injection"
"I'll start the bidding at 80 Euro"

"Up next, lot 1678, and you'll be bidding on dealing with an aggressive drunk in A & E."

mfitzy

mfitzy wrote: »

I do, but let the market not the unions decide, same as most other professions.
We are running a defict of over €8 billion still, but yet we still "should" be paying certain professions over and above "because they do such a hard job". That makes no sense to me.

But its not over and above, as I said the old starting salary is not even great considering the type of work involved etc. When the country was flying it the nurses were not raking it in like a lot of others so now that times are tough they shouldn't be punished either.

18k after tax is a pittance, I'm a post grad student and that's in and around my funding for a year. Its nothing, only reason I put up with it is I know its a means to an end e.g. good qualification and I will go onto good money quickly after qualifying.

FTA69

mikom wrote: »

"How much am I bid for the administering of this painkilling injection"
"I'll start the bidding at 80 Euro"

"Up next, lot 1678, and you'll be bidding on dealing with an aggressive drunk in A & E."

Yeah, sure the market can also decide that someone who can't afford an operation will also be left to die. Or an elderly person will be refused medical care because the market deems it incorrect to provide a state pension and related services. The market has also brought us such beauties as migrant workers on Irish Ferries being paid less than €2 an hour while working ten hour shifts.

It's also hilarious about someone who hasn't the first clue about the sh*te and dangerous conditions that nurses work in lecturing people about "the real world."

mikom

FTA69 wrote: »

It's also hilarious about someone who hasn't the first clue about the sh*te and dangerous conditions that nurses work in lecturing people about "the real world."

The real world...... time to bring on the yellow-pack teachers........... or maybe not....

mfitzy wrote: »

Hey all,

Starting the PGDE in Maynooth in September (which won't be long coming around). Just wondering has everybody got a TP place by now, or am I the only one who hasn't! Been trying, ringing schools etc; a lot of em seem to say they have taken on their placements already

Am I too late??

road_high

mikom wrote: »

The real world...... time to bring on the yellow-pack teachers........... or maybe not....

Seriously...you must be busy to go routing around my post history

Thanks for the interest though (some might call it obsessive), clearly struck a raw nerve with you somewhere, which is nice to know .

mikom

mfitzy wrote: »

Seriously...you must be busy to go routing around my post history

Thanks for the interest though (some might call it obsessive), clearly struck a raw nerve with you somewhere, which is nice to know .

Approximately four clicks of a mouse........ no bother.

The word is rooting, by the way, not routing.
See what I mean about yellow-pack teachers.

road_high

mikom wrote: »

Approximately four clicks of a mouse........ no bother.

The word is rooting, by the way, not routing.
See what I mean about yellow-pack teachers.

I really wasn't that interested in your posts myself let alone your opinions on anything for that matter...but nice to know you were in mine...wow nurses can spell, who knew...surely that's worth another few grand

mikom

mfitzy wrote: »

I really wasn't that interested in your posts myself let alone your opinions on anything for that matter...but nice to know you were in mine...wow nurses can spell, who knew...surely that's worth another few grand

I am the farthest thing from a nurse you could meet.

The smileys are out I see.
Always a good sign.

christina_x

mfitzy wrote: »

I do, but let the market not the unions decide, same as most other professions.
We are running a defict of over €8 billion still, but yet we still "should" be paying certain professions over and above "because they do such a hard job". That makes no sense to me.

What makes even less sense to me is that nurses appear to be the only healthcare profession that are constantly getting hit. What about those who are on higher wages, like occupational therapists, social workers, psychologists, doctors. All these wages are high and if reduced would still leave the person with a pretty decent wage at the end. The defence would normally be but these are highly trained specialists. I'd like to see you manage the care of on avg. 9 clients with mental health issues for 12hrs and then come back and tell me that it does not demand a highly trained specialist to do so.

FTA69

christina_x wrote: »

What makes even less sense to me is that nurses appear to be the only healthcare profession that are constantly getting hit. What about those who are on higher wages, like occupational therapists, social workers, psychologists, doctors. All these wages are high and if reduced would still leave the person with a pretty decent wage at the end. The defence would normally be but these are highly trained specialists. I'd like to see you manage the care of on avg. 9 clients with mental health issues for 12hrs and then come back and tell me that it does not demand a highly trained specialist to do so.

Nine only being the average, I've heard of nights with 16 patients with only an agency care assistant to help.

christina_x

FTA69 wrote: »

Nine only being the average, I've heard of nights with 16 patients with only an agency care assistant to help.

i think id cry

christina_x

christina_x wrote: »

i think id cry

I have seen my sister more or less crying and horribly stressed after working a 13 hour shift with maybe a couple of minutes for a cup of tea if that, more or less expected to look after a large number of patients alone, deal with emergency situations when someone takes a bad turn etc etc all while only a few months into her first year as a fully qualified nurse.

People expect young nurses to do this for 18k in their hand per year, its f**king disgraceful.

Gumbo

Luka Handsome Fingertip wrote: »

I have seen my sister more or less crying and horribly stressed after working a 13 hour shift with maybe a couple of minutes for a cup of tea if that, more or less expected to look after a large number of patients alone, deal with emergency situations when someone takes a bad turn etc etc all while only a few months into her first year as a fully qualified nurse.

People expect young nurses to do this for 18k in their hand per year, its f**king disgraceful.

would they even get 18k in their hand after :

PAYE
PRSI
USC
Pension contribution
Pension Levy

More like 15k i would imagine

kceire

kceire wrote: »

would they even get 18k in their hand after :

PAYE
PRSI
USC
Pension contribution
Pension Levy

More like 15k i would imagine

I saw a back of the envelope calculation which would put them at around 18k, it was a rough estimate though so they could actually come out with less.

Jarrod

What an absolute farce. If you want a skilled work force, pay what a skilled work force deserves. I know people in part time unskilled jobs earning more than 22, 000 a year, pro rata. I wouldn't consider doing the job for that money and I would hope that young nurses aren't considering taking these jobs. Can anyone update me on the latest goings on regarding this?

tayto lover

Fair play to these young nurses for seeing through the bulls*** and refusing to bite.
I would also like to congratulate Liam Doran who as a union leader is doing great work for this profession. It's a pity the other union leaders haven't the balls he has.

Brussels Sprout

Looks like the HSE are getting desperate. They've extended the scheme to include graduates from 2011 and 2010 now as well.

link

Mrs. Draper

Brussels Sprout wrote: »

Looks like the HSE are getting desperate. They've extended the scheme to include graduates from 2011 and 2010 now as well.

link

Now they cannot disguise this as a 'graduate scheme'. The 2010 and 2011 graduates have a couple of years experience under their belts at the right pay so why would they apply for these jobs?

tayto lover

There have been 30 applications for 1,000 places.
Fair play to the nurses who boycotted.