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Nurses

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24567…19

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    #32
    Madam_X
    Closed Accounts Posts: 6,327 ✭✭✭Madam_X


    As a private sector worker, I don't feel hard-pressed and bitter.

    And fair play to nurses - very tough job and crap hours.


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    #33
    Odysseus
    Registered Users Posts: 6,754 ✭✭✭Odysseus


    pragmatic1 wrote: »
    The public sector are going to have to get used to this because we just don't have the cash anymore.

    Get used to what, bad posts? Posting in the wrong forum? These newly qualified professionals are going to head off to what they pay is comparable with their skills. I know I would if I was just starting out again and I was asked to work for less than the people I was working with.


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    #34
    syklops
    Closed Accounts Posts: 18,966 ✭✭✭✭syklops


    woodoo wrote: »
    Every one of these new nursing positions will be filled regardless of what Liam Doran says.

    I think they should start on the same money as existing nurses but i think the allowances should be done away with.

    A graduate IT engineer does not earn what an IT engineer with 5 years experience earns.
    A graduate Doctor does not earn what a Doctor with 5 years experience earns.
    A graduate Vet does not earn what a Vet with 5 years experience earns.


    The first IT job I had I was on 18k. After 5 years of experience I was on 42k. This "insulting", "degrading" salary they are talking about is 80% of experienced nurses.

    Boo-f^%king-hoo. Go emigrate and get better pay, and you will be paying the difference to Aer Lingus to come home for Christmas.


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    #35
    Odysseus
    Registered Users Posts: 6,754 ✭✭✭Odysseus


    woodoo wrote: »
    Every one of these new nursing positions will be filled regardless of what Liam Doran says.

    I think they should start on the same money as existing nurses but i think the allowances should be done away with.

    What allowances do you think they should do away with?


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    #36
    woodoo
    Closed Accounts Posts: 5,219 ✭✭✭woodoo


    syklops wrote: »
    A graduate IT engineer does not earn what an IT engineer with 5 years experience earns.
    A graduate Doctor does not earn what a Doctor with 5 years experience earns.
    A graduate Vet does not earn what a Vet with 5 years experience earns.


    The first IT job I had I was on 18k. After 5 years of experience I was on 42k. This "insulting", "degrading" salary they are talking about is 80% of experienced nurses.

    Boo-f^%king-hoo. Go emigrate and get better pay, and you will be paying the difference to Aer Lingus to come home for Christmas.

    That's not what i'm talking about, they should be on the same scale.


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    #37
    Odysseus
    Registered Users Posts: 6,754 ✭✭✭Odysseus


    syklops wrote: »
    A graduate IT engineer does not earn what an IT engineer with 5 years experience earns.
    A graduate Doctor does not earn what a Doctor with 5 years experience earns.
    A graduate Vet does not earn what a Vet with 5 years experience earns.


    The first IT job I had I was on 18k. After 5 years of experience I was on 42k. This "insulting", "degrading" salary they are talking about is 80% of experienced nurses.

    Boo-f^%king-hoo. Go emigrate and get better pay, and you will be paying the difference to Aer Lingus to come home for Christmas.

    A new nurse would start on point 1 of the pay scale.

    A nurse with 5 years experience would be on the 5th point of the pay scale.

    So I think you are missing the point. The would not be getting the same as anyone with experience. That is why there are pay scales


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    #38
    Odysseus
    Registered Users Posts: 6,754 ✭✭✭Odysseus


    woodoo wrote: »
    That's not what i'm talking about, they should be on the same scale.

    Most people just don't know about pay scales to be fair.


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    #39
    woodoo
    Closed Accounts Posts: 5,219 ✭✭✭woodoo


    Odysseus wrote: »
    What allowances do you think they should do away with?

    Education allowance for degree, location allowance, weekend allowances, bank holiday allowances.


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    #40
    mountai
    Registered Users Posts: 953 ✭✭✭mountai


    Strange that no one has picked up on the point made about the countrys ability to Pay. Yes it would be great if we all could go back to Celtic Tiger rates of pay , which most of the "Caring" professionals are still on. How many examples have we seen of the greedy Consultants in their ivory towers "Yes it will be 150 Euro for your consultation ( which may take 10 mins) and bring cash". . GPs charging 50-60 per visit . When I queried why charge so much? (from a current GP AND serving TD) "Because thats the rate" was the response.Value for money?? . What a joke. How come its far cheaper to have a scan in a Private Hospital than a NHS one??. Why does the NHS refuse to use scans from these facilities for follow up treatment??.Every country in the world uses XRays ,Scans etc from previous medical units in these circumstances. I Know why -- Greed-- Do their own and charge double for it.
    A huge amount of current borrowings go to pay for inflated PS pensions. In the private sector, if you get a letter form your provider stating that because of losses, your pension is reduced , or even gone altogether, there is nothing you can do. Yet ,the country is Broke and we STILL borrow to give INCREASES to these people.This is the real world -- welcome to it.


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    #41
    Odysseus
    Registered Users Posts: 6,754 ✭✭✭Odysseus


    woodoo wrote: »
    Education allowance for degree, location allowance, weekend allowances, bank holiday allowances.

    I don't think any of the nurses in my part of the HSE get any of that; and AFAIK things are the same in all parts of the HSE.

    When you say education do you mean a higher rate for having a degree? Could you explain the other for me; I'm 16 years in the HSE and never got any of them or know of people getting them.

    Overetime rates for weekend and BHs of course, but you are naning something different I think?


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    #42
    pragmatic1
    Registered Users Posts: 5,573 ✭✭✭pragmatic1


    Odysseus wrote: »
    Get used to what, bad posts? Posting in the wrong forum? These newly qualified professionals are going to head off to what they pay is comparable with their skills. I know I would if I was just starting out again and I was asked to work for less than the people I was working with.
    They have every right to head off and look for better pay but their positions will be filled quickly. The world owes you nothing.


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    #43
    Odysseus
    Registered Users Posts: 6,754 ✭✭✭Odysseus


    mountai wrote: »
    Strange that no one has picked up on the point made about the countrys ability to Pay. Yes it would be great if we all could go back to Celtic Tiger rates of pay , which most of the "Caring" professionals are still on. How many examples have we seen of the greedy Consultants in their ivory towers "Yes it will be 150 Euro for your consultation ( which may take 10 mins) and bring cash". . GPs charging 50-60 per visit .

    When I queried why charge so much? (from a current GP AND serving TD) "Because thats the rate" was the response.Value for money?? . What a joke. How come its far cheaper to have a scan in a Private Hospital than a NHS one??. Why does the NHS refuse to use scans from these facilities for follow up treatment??.Every country in the world uses XRays ,Scans etc from previous medical units in these circumstances. I Know why -- Greed-- Do their own and charge double for it.

    What has NHS rates for a scan got to do with this? Same with private consultants and private GP rates?


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    #44
    TheUsual
    Closed Accounts Posts: 2,288 ✭✭✭TheUsual


    Mmmmmmm nurses.


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    #45
    Madam_X
    Closed Accounts Posts: 6,327 ✭✭✭Madam_X


    TheUsual wrote: »
    Mmmmmmm nurses.
    Coppers man eh?


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    #46
    Odysseus
    Registered Users Posts: 6,754 ✭✭✭Odysseus


    pragmatic1 wrote: »
    They have every right to head off and look for better pay but their positions will be filled quickly. The world owes you nothing.

    Will they? I can't see this happening, I could be wrong. However, I think this will be over ruled.


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    #47
    Odysseus
    Registered Users Posts: 6,754 ✭✭✭Odysseus


    TheUsual wrote: »
    Mmmmmmm nurses.

    Yes lots of them all for you








    Big, hairy Psych Nurses


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    #48
    Sparklygirl
    Registered Users Posts: 62 ✭✭Sparklygirl


    Our family have used the HSE three times this year. The nursing care was excellent, the staff were interested, hard working, knowledgable, efficient and above all caring. IMO they are not paid enough. If you won't pay a decent wage to people, the best people will emigrate leaving the mediocre here. Not really what you want when your life hangs in the balance.

    This really should not be a private and public sector battle. You want decent nurses, you pay for them.


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    #49
    ToxicPaddy
    Moderators, Business & Finance Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 9,763 Mod ✭✭✭✭ToxicPaddy


    A cousin of mine passed away this year after a long term illness. From what I've heard from his wife and parents, the nurses in the ward were nothing short of saints and the way they looked after him and the family was amazing. Yes its their job, but they went way beyond their normal duties to make sure they could accommodate them in anyway they could. They even all came to his funeral and every person who visited my cousin in hospital couldn't praise them enough for the work they did.

    I personally couldn't think of a more thankless and underpaid job, between the hours, the type of work, what they can experience on a daily basis in their role. I know I couldn't do it.

    IMO, they are severely under appreciated and underpaid. Its more of a vocation than a career.

    Sorry OP I have to disagree with your opinion of nurses.


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    #50
    Madam_X
    Closed Accounts Posts: 6,327 ✭✭✭Madam_X


    Wouldn't do it if it made me rich. They're not paid enough IMO.

    Are consultants paid those huge salaries by the HSE or just privately? Sorry, I'm not au fait with the structure.


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    #51
    mikemac1
    Closed Accounts Posts: 12,395 ✭✭✭✭mikemac1


    ToxicPaddy wrote: »
    Its more of a vocation than a career.

    The union won't thank you for saying that

    It used to be a vocation

    Now it's a graduate career and graduate salaries are expected


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    #52
    Hogzy
    Registered Users Posts: 7,544 ✭✭✭Hogzy


    Starting salaries for Nurses in Australia are $38k-40k which is around €30,000. In the UK its £20K-22K which is €25-28K.

    Nurses have extremely tough jobs with little appreciation, awful working hours and woeful pay considering the work they do. Its middle management in the HSE who should be getting cut out. Not frontline staff.


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    #53
    Madam_X
    Closed Accounts Posts: 6,327 ✭✭✭Madam_X


    mikemac1 wrote: »
    The union won't thank you for saying that

    It used to be a vocation

    Now it's a graduate career and graduate salaries are expected
    It's both IMO.


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    #54
    Odysseus
    Registered Users Posts: 6,754 ✭✭✭Odysseus


    Madam_X wrote: »
    Wouldn't do it if it made me rich. They're not paid enough IMO.

    Are consultants paid those huge salaries by the HSE or just privately? Sorry, I'm not au fait with the structure.

    Their money is usually made up of both public and private, if a person pays it is private, but they generally see both groups of patients.


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    #55
    Hogzy
    Registered Users Posts: 7,544 ✭✭✭Hogzy


    I personally wouldnt feel comfortable if I am ever in hospital knowing that the person responsible for health and day to day care is earning around €11 per hour.


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    #56
    Odysseus
    Registered Users Posts: 6,754 ✭✭✭Odysseus


    mikemac1 wrote: »
    The union won't thank you for saying that

    It used to be a vocation

    Now it's a graduate career and graduate salaries are expected

    Well to be fair now that you need a degree to get started it is a graduate career, a lot if not most go on to do masters.


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    #57
    Hogzy
    Registered Users Posts: 7,544 ✭✭✭Hogzy


    Odysseus wrote: »
    Their money is usually made up of both public and private, if a person pays it is private, but they generally see both groups of patients.

    But they will bend over backward to get a private patient because they get a greater remuneration from private than they do from public patients.
    Odysseus wrote: »
    Well to be fair now that you need a degree to get started it is a graduate career, a lot if not most go on to do masters.

    But you need to practice as a nurse for at least 2 years to be elegible for a masters.


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    #58
    Madam_X
    Closed Accounts Posts: 6,327 ✭✭✭Madam_X


    Odysseus wrote: »
    Their money is usually made up of both public and private, if a person pays it is private, but they generally see both groups of patients.
    That's what I assumed. Those salaries are spoken of as if they're entirely HSE funded. I do agree though the charges can appear pretty exorbitant on the surface - like, €150 just for a check-up and an opinion.


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    #59
    Rasheed
    Closed Accounts Posts: 2,117 ✭✭✭Rasheed


    I trained are a nurse and qualified in 2010. We were well treated while we trained, got our uniforms free, travel allowance of €50 a week while on placement, that kinda thing.

    When I entered nursing studies in 2006, you basically guaranteed a permanent job when you finished, Unfortunately not so in 2010. We got on with it, took agency, went private or went abroad. That was the economic situation at the time.

    So it seriously annoys me to hear, that in 2012, nurses just qualified, are cribbing about being offered a two year contract for 80% of a newly qualified nurses wage.

    If that was me, in 2010, I would have snapped their hand off to be guaranteed a experience in a hospital for circa €26,000 a year. With added benefits of sick pay or maternity pay if I needed it, which I wouldn't get with agency.

    No sympathy from me. I do my job because I love my job. I'd never do another job, it is a vocation. Not because of the pay.


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    #60
    sfwcork
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 1,203 ✭✭✭sfwcork


    Imo nurses should take what is offered.saying that its middle and top management that should be hit further,theyre still laughing from the comfy chairs.


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    #61
    Hogzy
    Registered Users Posts: 7,544 ✭✭✭Hogzy


    Rasheed wrote: »
    I trained are a nurse and qualified in 2010. We were well treated while we trained, got our uniforms free, travel allowance of €50 a week while on placement, that kinda thing.

    When I entered nursing studies in 2006, you basically guaranteed a permanent job when you finished, Unfortunately not so in 2010. We got on with it, took agency, went private or went abroad. That was the economic situation at the time.

    So it seriously annoys me to hear, that in 2012, nurses just qualified, are cribbing about being offered a two year contract for 80% of a newly qualified nurses wage.

    If that was me, in 2010, I would have snapped their hand off to be guaranteed a experience in a hospital for circa €26,000 a year. With added benefits of sick pay or maternity pay if I needed it, which I wouldn't get with agency.

    No sympathy from me.

    Its €22K, and agency work is becoming rarer and rarer nowadays. Remember, you were also paid for your placement all through college which these 2013 nurses will not have been.


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