Hmv

ben101

" but claiming this was one big criminal conspiracy is rubbish IMO.[/QUOTE]
Reckless trading
http://www.smurfitschool.ie/aboutsmurfit/news/facultyviews/title,73224,en.html

That might explain the term better than i.

To be fair ,the voucher issue would probably fail in court,the main issue would be ,did they know they were putting themselves in a position that they would not be able to pay staff and creditors?
You seem to be one of the very few defending HMV's actions.
Plain and simple fact is that for them to survive after xmas they would have had to have had a better turnover than during the boomtimes.
They actually had a better xmas this year than last,they had to have known there was no way they were going to achieve the targets they set to survive.These aren't "conspiracies".Read a bit more about it and get back to me and explain why they continued to trade?Its just baffling and its an attitude that seems to exist in this country that corporate is king,banks and big companies seem to act with impunity which hasn't worked out to well for us so far has it?

ben101

Procrastastudy wrote: »

<SNIP - OFF-TOPIC>

Or a if you don't pay me in cash pay me in Ipads ,PS3's and xbox's-in:P

Occono

Did the sit-in work for GAME staffers?

Procrastastudy

Occono wrote: »

Did the sit-in work for GAME staffers?

In a sense. There were some behind the scenes stuff organised by local management that did them some favours - I wont go into detail but think happy suppliers. It also forced the UK to appoint a reviver in Ireland so the lads could get the proper paperwork for claiming redundancy from the state.

I'm actually surprised people are still seem to be treating this sort of thing with such resignation. It isn't a criminal conspiracy bu that doesn't mean that certain actions by HMV and GAME (and to be fair others) shouldn't spark legislation. A simple change to exist legislation could solve the vouchers thing and the staff pay issues.

Peats managed to wind up without screwing the customers and staff I don't see why a big company like HMV or GAME should hold themselves to a lower moral standard.

Occono

Procrastastudy wrote: »

In a sense. There were some behind the scenes stuff organised by local management that did them some favours - I wont go into detail but think happy suppliers. It also forced the UK to appoint a reviver in Ireland so the lads could get the proper paperwork for claiming redundancy from the state.

I'm actually surprised people are still seem to be treating this sort of thing with such resignation. It isn't a criminal conspiracy bu that doesn't mean that certain actions by HMV and GAME (and to be fair others) shouldn't spark legislation. A simple change to exist legislation could solve the vouchers thing and the staff pay issues.

Peats managed to wind up without screwing the customers and staff I don't see why a big company like HMV or GAME should hold themselves to a lower moral standard.

I'm not being resigned, I just didn't know what happened. They didn't get their final paychecks, though?

Procrastastudy

Occono wrote: »

I'm not being resigned, I just didn't know what happened. They didn't get their final paychecks, though?

I wasn't referring to you. No they dint get paid by GAME.

Procrastastudy

Procrastastudy wrote: »

I'm actually surprised people are still seem to be treating this sort of thing with such resignation. It isn't a criminal conspiracy bu that doesn't mean that certain actions by HMV and GAME (and to be fair others) shouldn't spark legislation. A simple change to exist legislation could solve the vouchers thing and the staff pay issues.

Peats managed to wind up without screwing the customers and staff I don't see why a big company like HMV or GAME should hold themselves to a lower moral standard.

Peats was a solvent liquidation as far as I can remember - it is very easy to keep everyone happy when you have enough money to pay all your bills.

The simple change you are suggesting is essentially to push voucher holders ahead in the queue where there isn't enough money to settle all debts - who do you suggest should be pushed down in the queue to pay out this money?

Procrastastudy

Deleted User wrote: »

Peats was a solvent liquidation as far as I can remember - it is very easy to keep everyone happy when you have enough money to pay all your bills.

The simple change you are suggesting is essentially to push voucher holders ahead in the queue where there isn't enough money to settle all debts - who do you suggest should be pushed down in the queue to pay out this money?

Why should a bank or people who entered into commercial transactions?

jahalpin

Procrastastudy wrote: »

Why should a bank or people who entered into commercial transactions?

Buying a gift voucher is a commercial transaction

Banks will normally get their money first as they would normally have a charge over the assets of the company ie the company has signed over the asset to the bank in return for a loan \ overdraft facilities.

Staff are normally second, after Revenue, in terms of unsecured creditors

Procrastastudy

jahalpin wrote: »

Buying a gift voucher is a commercial transaction

Banks will normally get their money first as they would normally have a charge over the assets of the company ie the company has signed over the asset to the bank in return for a loan \ overdraft facilities.

Staff are normally second, after Revenue, in terms of unsecured creditors

Buying a gift voucher is a consumer* transaction. Both vouchers and staff should come before the bank. Yes that would result in stricter lending criteria and companies going under sooner but having vouchers outstanding, staff having to claim off the state is not an acceptable situation.

*however dumb - who ever came up with the idea of converting €50 of real money into €50 of credit that can only be spent in one place, expires and can be refused must now have a job in Apple's marketing department.

filmbuffboy

Those taking part in the sit in at the Limerick Hmv have been assured they would be paid next week. Some good news for the staff at least!

http://www.rte.ie/news/2013/0119/hmv-workers-end-sit-in-after-pay-assurances.html

Procrastastudy

I suspect stock value in stores is higher than thought

ben101

filmbuffboy wrote: »

Those taking part in the sit in at the Limerick Hmv have been assured they would be paid next week. Some good news for the staff at least!

http://www.rte.ie/news/2013/0119/hmv-workers-end-sit-in-after-pay-assurances.html

Great news,as a nation we need to do things like this a bit more.If this was in France they would have had a full scale riot on their hands.

RobbingBandit

Perhaps the final nail in this coffin.

http://www.irishtimes.com/newspaper/finance/2013/0121/1224329102887.html

ben101

ben101 wrote: »

Great news,as a nation we need to do things like this a bit more.If this was in France they would have had a full scale riot on their hands.

It has happened in France - in a mirror to the HMV case. The Virgin Megastore group filed for insolvency on the 8th of January. http://www.france24.com/en/20130109-virgin-megastore-france-insolvent-amazon There were some protests but it remains to be seen if it will make any difference.

Edit: out of interest I had a look to see what is the situation with gift vouchers in that case (http://www.virginmegastore.fr/carte-cadeau_1001.html) - there doesn't seem to be any restriction at this point. It might be because they aren't in receivership/liquidation yet but are in an examinership situation.

Edit 2: http://www.boursorama.com/actualites/happytime-comment-se-faire-rembourser-094a938ad6230c614385ae674632a00c

En cas de faillite de l'émetteur d'une carte, il existe plusieurs voies de recours pour se faire rembourser. Mais les chances de succès restent assez maigres.
In case of bankruptcy of the issuer of a card, there are several remedies for a refund. But the chances of success are pretty slim.

Blisterman

Some good news
According to the BBC, HMV are accepting vouchers from tomorrow!

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-21118711

Anyone know if this applies to the Irish stores? I'd assume so.

Basq

Blisterman wrote: »

Anyone know if this applies to the Irish stores? I'd assume so.

Since they're closed.. it seems unlikely!

Am in the UK in a fortnight.. so wonder if they'll take ROI vouchers? Also unlikely.

Blisterman

From experience they don't.

Are all of the Irish stores closed for good now?

Basq

Blisterman wrote: »

Are all of the Irish stores closed for good now?

Hasn't been confirmed (still seeking a buyer AFAIK).. but it's more or less a given I'd say.

Morph the Cat

Hi all - I see HMV UK have started taking vouchers again. I'm going to London tomorrow & I have a €65 ROI voucher. What do you reckon?

Paulw

I recon you are bringing an extra piece of paper that is worthless. HMV UK and HMV Ireland are different legal entities.

shed head

worth a try though!! but i agree with the above poster!

Kopparberg Strawberry and Lime

not a hope.

worked in hmv myself a few years ago and we could never take uk cards or pure hmv cards as they couldnt take ours either.

Miaireland

I doubt it. HMV Ireland seems to be in adminastration where as the Uk is in receivership. I am gueesing because of the stage the Irish shops are in and your voucher was issued in Ireland it will be invalid in Uk.

Then again you haven't anything to lose by trying. Just be nice to the person behind the counter, I am sure they are having a horrible couple of weeks!!:)

jeni

Morph the Cat wrote: »

Hi all - I see HMV UK have started taking vouchers again. I'm going to London tomorrow & I have a €65 ROI voucher. What do you reckon?

My aunty always sent me stg hmv vouchers and i spent them in ireland so dont see why it wouldnt work both ways

Morph the Cat

Feck it - I'll try it & play dumb!

ben101

Miaireland wrote: »

HMV Ireland seems to be in adminastration where as the Uk is in receivership.

Wrong way round HMV Ireland is in receivership,worse position than UK.

RobbingBandit

The Irish cards say Republic of Ireland on them.

endacl

miamee wrote: »

What's to stop them selling the whole lot to another retailer?

So people could have the opportunity to not buy it again? From somebody else?

Plankton1

Someone close to me just lost their job in HMV after many years of dedication and hard work. I have to say that reading back over this thread has been an eye opener. Some people's attitudes left me speechless. Your 20e voucher is worth so much to you that you're prepared to cause even more stress and anxiety to staff by stealing from stores?
I hate to point it out, but a lot of outraged people I have heard over the past week are ones who download their music and movies and haven't even shopped in HMV in a long time.
The abuse doled out to staff has been quite frankly disgusting. They have been wronged by the company to a far, far greater extent than someone who got a voucher for a gift at Xmas and didn't use it until they heard they might not be able to any more. There are some who would do well to remember that.