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Hmv

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12357…15

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    #122
    Myrddin
    Closed Accounts Posts: 33,733 ✭✭✭✭Myrddin


    Adan Noisy Uncle wrote: »
    We'll never know if they knowingly sold vouchers that would be worthless...an unexplained mystery.....ranks alongside bottler,rasher and hatchet explaining confirmation to the bishop (a la Brendan Grace ):D

    So the head honchos might not have known this was coming? Yeah...somehow I'd say those at the top knew this was coming a good while ago.


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    #123
    julie2tubz
    Registered Users Posts: 129 ✭✭julie2tubz


    Yep, I was given a HMV voucher yesterday for my birthday, bought yesterday lunch time on grafton st. :(


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    #124
    Mr E
    Registered Users Posts: 55,512 ✭✭✭✭Mr E


    Joe Duffy is taking calls from enraged voucher holders and relatives of staff at the moment...


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    #125
    Procrastastudy
    Closed Accounts Posts: 6,224 ✭✭✭Procrastastudy


    Mr E wrote: »
    Joe Duffy is taking calls from enraged voucher holders and relatives of staff at the moment...

    Ah thank God - that'll solve it then :D


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    #126
    Myrddin
    Closed Accounts Posts: 33,733 ✭✭✭✭Myrddin


    donegal_man wrote: »
    Godwinesque hperbole of the highest order. I got a voucher which is now apparently useless 'for the time being' and whilst I am not best pleased I wouldn't for one moment insult the memory of the victims of Nazism by comparing a €50 gift voucher to the death of millions.
    Get a grip for God's sake

    Easy come easy go eh?


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    #127
    RoboRat
    Registered Users Posts: 2,559 ✭✭✭RoboRat


    We'll never know if they knowingly sold vouchers that would be worthless

    Course they did, the fact that they closed just after their busiest period and right at the beginning of retail lull is testament to that. It was strategically planned to take as much as possible before they scuttled the ship.


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    #128
    Myrddin
    Closed Accounts Posts: 33,733 ✭✭✭✭Myrddin


    Mr E wrote: »
    Joe Duffy is taking calls from enraged voucher holders and relatives of staff at the moment...

    Apparently there's a woman on the line from Clontarf who is shocked by all of this...


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    #129
    donegal_man
    Registered Users Posts: 5,771 ✭✭✭donegal_man


    EnterNow wrote: »

    Easy come easy go eh?

    I was replying to the post comparing HMV to the Nazis which was hyperbole. However since that post seems to have disappeared I have also deleted mine


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    #130
    Myrddin
    Closed Accounts Posts: 33,733 ✭✭✭✭Myrddin


    donegal_man wrote: »
    I was replying to the post comparing HMV to the Nazis which was hyperbole. However since that post seems to have disappeared I have also deleted mine

    Ah my bad, I hadn't seen it so was obviously deleted :)


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    #131
    omnithanos
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 710 ✭✭✭omnithanos


    1. I was simply making the point that blindly following unlawful orders could be viewed as cohesion.
    2. It's not very rock and roll to let "the man" get away with it.
    3. I doubt if any victims thrall through HMV posts.
    4. How soon will it be before Godwin's law relates to Sir Jimmy Saville?


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    #132
    kennethsmyth
    Registered Users Posts: 1,188 ✭✭✭kennethsmyth


    dudara wrote: »
    Posters - Please, no more suggestions of THEFT (because that is what it is). Boards does not condone criminal activity.

    dudara


    Firstly I am not condoning theft (that is wrong) however it could be said that this was a civil matter and not criminal as you have paid for the goods with the voucher - which is a payment type - just because they say they are not accepting them does not make it not a payment type.


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    #133
    omnithanos
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 710 ✭✭✭omnithanos


    <SNIP>
    Failing this we should establish a media campaign to boycott all HMV stores throughout the country until vouchers are accepted.


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    #134
    Loughc
    Moderators, Business & Finance Moderators, Recreation & Hobbies Moderators Posts: 24,820 Mod ✭✭✭✭Loughc


    omnithanos wrote: »
    Failing this we should establish a media campaign to boycott all HMV stores throughout the country until vouchers are accepted.

    They're already in administration, I don't think that would serve a purpose at all.


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    #135
    Gillo
    Registered Users Posts: 5,566 ✭✭✭Gillo


    omnithanos wrote: »
    <SNIP>
    Failing this we should establish a media campaign to boycott all HMV stores throughout the country until vouchers are accepted.

    That has to be the daftest idea I've read on boards, boycott the business so it definitly goes out of bussiess, you'll have no chance of using redeeming vouchers then.
    As for taking stock down from the shelf, thats jsut immature at best.


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    #136
    Skid
    Closed Accounts Posts: 9,873 ✭✭✭Skid


    omnithanos wrote: »
    <SNIP>

    Failing this we should establish a media campaign to boycott all HMV stores throughout the country until vouchers are accepted.

    The administrators have to follow Company Law. They won't change the law just because you start a silly protest.


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    #137
    omnithanos
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 710 ✭✭✭omnithanos


    They are still open so if nobody buys anything the stock will be useless. Might as well give it out to people who have vouchers. Golden Discs were also in administration but they continue to sell and honour vouchers as they should.


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    #138
    omnithanos
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 710 ✭✭✭omnithanos


    Skid wrote: »
    The administrators have to follow Company Law. They won't change the law just because you start a silly protest.

    They aren't following any law here, they are actually breaking contractual obligations.


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    #139
    miamee
    Moderators, Social & Fun Moderators, Regional East Moderators, Regional North West Moderators Posts: 12,201 Mod ✭✭✭✭miamee


    omnithanos wrote: »
    They are still open so if nobody buys anything the stock will be useless. Might as well give it out to people who have vouchers. Golden Discs were also in administration but they continue to sell and honour vouchers as they should.

    What's to stop them selling the whole lot to another retailer?


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    #140
    Nody
    Moderators, Category Moderators, Arts Moderators, Business & Finance Moderators, Entertainment Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 18,306 CMod ✭✭✭✭Nody


    kennethsmyth wrote: »
    Firstly I am not condoning theft (that is wrong) however it could be said that this was a civil matter and not criminal as you have paid for the goods with the voucher - which is a payment type - just because they say they are not accepting them does not make it not a payment type.
    No it can not; a voucher holder is an unsecured debtor and nothing else. No matter how you try to talk it up differently all it is someone who's paid in advance for a future service; once the company went into administration they no longer has to fulfill any such commitments of future services (which is the whole point of going into administration to try to turn a company around).
    omnithanos wrote: »
    They aren't following any law here, they are actually breaking contractual obligations.
    Actually they are following the law and the administrator is doing what they are tasked to do (maximize the money in the company to try to pay back the debtors in order of priority as established by law).


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    #141
    omnithanos
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 710 ✭✭✭omnithanos


    Gillo wrote: »
    That has to be the daftest idea I've read on boards, boycott the business so it definitly goes out of bussiess, you'll have no chance of using redeeming vouchers then.
    As for taking stock down from the shelf, thats jsut immature at best.

    They deserve to go out of business if they operate sharp practice. A guy on the radio left in 130 second hand dvds last week for €100 store credit which is now useless.
    If the staff have no customers they may as well spend the day restocking the shelves.

    If I am done in a shop they can either waste 2 hours in wages fees to re stock the shelves of give me back my euro. I am not a terrorist I am in the right. In this instance it would be in their interest to give me my euro back rather than waste hours in unnecessary restocking, how is it immature to fight for whats right?

    Was Michael Collins immature?


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    #142
    AnonoBoy
    Closed Accounts Posts: 22,559 ✭✭✭✭AnonoBoy


    omnithanos wrote: »
    Was Michael Collins immature?

    Did you just compare yourself protesting against a business that is following the law to Michael Collins?
    :eek:


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    #143
    Nody
    Moderators, Category Moderators, Arts Moderators, Business & Finance Moderators, Entertainment Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 18,306 CMod ✭✭✭✭Nody


    omnithanos wrote: »
    They deserve to go out of business if they operate sharp practice. A guy on the radio left in 130 second hand dvds last week for €100 store credit which is now useless.
    And the guy in the store accepting them had no clue about that until last night's news.
    If I am done in a shop they can either waste 2 hours in wages fees to re stock the shelves of give me back my euro. I am not a terrorist I am in the right.
    No you are not in the right; you're an disturbance in the store at best and in practice an unsecured debt holder. That gives you no rights to cause additional work in the store for the employees.
    In this instance it would be in their interest to give me my euro back rather than waste hours in unnecessary restocking, how is it immature to fight for whats right?
    Because the people in the store has nothing to do with your so called right for your money back? Becuse they can't change the company policy? Because you have no legal right to your money back until the other debtors have been paid? Because it's a childish behaviour which will only get you banned from the store, cause pain for the poor guys/girls working there who has no say in the matter and have no practical effect on improving your chance of getting any money back (in fact it would reduce it by making HMV brand less valuable and less likely to be sold on to a new company that may give you something back on your voucher). Take your pick.


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    #144
    Gillo
    Registered Users Posts: 5,566 ✭✭✭Gillo


    omnithanos wrote: »
    If I am done in a shop they can either waste 2 hours in wages fees to re stock the shelves of give me back my euro. I am not a terrorist I am in the right. In this instance it would be in their interest to give me my euro back rather than waste hours in unnecessary restocking, how is it immature to fight for whats right?

    Was Michael Collins immature?
    Collins, O'Connell, Gandhi, Mother Theresa etc you'll find they had issue with something a bit more important than a gift card. Don't get me wrong I understand how you feel hard done by however it has already been explained how where gift cards are ranked on the companies list of debts (which is the same for all companies not just HMV).
    Going in and basically being a nuisance to retail staff who ideally are trying to keep their jobs that what I view as being immature.


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    #145
    omnithanos
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 710 ✭✭✭omnithanos


    Nody wrote: »
    No it can not; a voucher holder is an unsecured debtor and nothing else. No matter how you try to talk it up differently all it is someone who's paid in advance for a future service; once the company went into administration they no longer has to fulfill any such commitments of future services (which is the whole point of going into administration to try to turn a company around).

    Actually they are following the law and the administrator is doing what they are tasked to do (maximize the money in the company to try to pay back the debtors in order of priority as established by law).

    Since no Irish court has approved the repudiation of vouchers, tokens, gift cards, and so on, then section 20(1) does not provide a power to get out of the contractual obligation to honour them, and a blanket refusal to do so cannot be justified by the mere fact of an Examinership. (Update: Moreover, in the UK, it would seem that an administrator does not have any similar power at all (see Re P&C and R&T (Stockport) Ltd [1991] BCLC 366); and, if this is the case, then a blanket refusal to honour vouchers, tokens, gift cards, and so on cannot be justified by the mere fact of an Administration).


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    #146
    dudara
    Registered Users Posts: 33,518 ✭✭✭✭dudara


    kennethsmyth wrote: »
    Firstly I am not condoning theft (that is wrong) however it could be said that this was a civil matter and not criminal as you have paid for the goods with the voucher - which is a payment type - just because they say they are not accepting them does not make it not a payment type.

    Taking items and not paying for them is theft. The fact that the payment would have been made via voucher is irrelevant.

    POSTERS - I do not want to see any further discussion regarding entering HMV stores and making protests. This could possibly place you in a position of trespass. Any further discussion of this will result in immediate infractions and/or bans

    dudara


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    #147
    omnithanos
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 710 ✭✭✭omnithanos


    Gillo wrote: »
    Collins, O'Connell, Gandhi, Mother Theresa etc you'll find they had issue with something a bit more important than a gift card. Don't get me wrong I understand how you feel hard done by however it has already been explained how where gift cards are ranked on the companies list of debts (which is the same for all companies not just HMV).
    Going in and basically being a nuisance to retail staff who ideally are trying to keep their jobs that what I view as being immature.

    Half the people who hold HMV vouchers have probably lost their jobs already so have a right to feel more aggrieved than staff who may be able to keep their jobs if head office can be objective and see that a statement allowing the redemption of vouchers is the only way that the store can possibly hope to continue trading effectively.


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    #148
    Sadderday
    Registered Users Posts: 1,229 ✭✭✭Sadderday


    its an absolute disgrace that i could buy a hmv voucher for €200 with cash on sunday and its useless to me now on tuesday.

    they should have stopped selling them. and they should honour the vouchers. the law is messed up whatever way you look at it is somebodies hard earned cash. its fair enough that people feel hard done by. As i said - why not give people a window to utilise their voucher before making them void.


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    #149
    omnithanos
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 710 ✭✭✭omnithanos


    Nody wrote: »
    And the guy in the store accepting them had no clue about that until last night's news.
    .

    That is not true, the manager told they guy that he should have been warned that the store credit may have been no good. This implies that staff may have already known. I bet no staff bought HMV vouchers for xmas.


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    #150
    omnithanos
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 710 ✭✭✭omnithanos


    Nody wrote: »

    No you are not in the right; you're an disturbance in the store at best and in practice an unsecured debt holder. That gives you no rights to cause additional work in the store for the employees.

    In the example I gave I said that is what I would do if I was deliberately overcharged at the till, effectively robbed. I think I would have every right to protest in such a way in that case.


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    #151
    omnithanos
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 710 ✭✭✭omnithanos


    Nody wrote: »
    Because the people in the store has nothing to do with your so called right for your money back? Becuse they can't change the company policy? Because you have no legal right to your money back until the other debtors have been paid? Because it's a childish behaviour which will only get you banned from the store, cause pain for the poor guys/girls working there who has no say in the matter and have no practical effect on improving your chance of getting any money back (in fact it would reduce it by making HMV brand less valuable and less likely to be sold on to a new company that may give you something back on your voucher). Take your pick.

    Since no Irish court has approved the repudiation of vouchers, tokens, gift cards, and so on, then section 20(1) does not provide a power to get out of the contractual obligation to honour them, and a blanket refusal to do so cannot be justified by the mere fact of an Examinership. (Update: Moreover, in the UK, it would seem that an administrator does not have any similar power at all (see Re P&C and R&T (Stockport) Ltd [1991] BCLC 366); and, if this is the case, then a blanket refusal to honour vouchers, tokens, gift cards, and so on cannot be justified by the mere fact of an Administration).

    I think that the HMV brand as you call it should suffer until they agree to redeem these vouchers. Why are you on their side?


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