Had Travellers at my Door Tonight Looking for a Hand-Out

orestes

nuxxx wrote: »

Why so? Most of these reregs are just trolls who've been previously banned from boards

:facepalm:

Hank Scorpio

Am I missing something? Guy joined a few weeks ago and is saying travellers are a positive entity to Ireland. Well whatever

Lenin Skynard

nuxxx wrote: »

Am I missing something?

Either the fullness of your shilling or the last can in your six pack I reckon.

ColeTrain

orestes wrote: »

I haven't at any point in this thread given my personal opinion on travellers, I have just said that the way the thread was posted was going to lead to sterotypical vitriol rather than discussion.

I see your point that there will be people on this thread who have maybe just met a few travellers and their experiences will be skewed.

Still, given the amount of people who hold a negative viewpoint ( that I know ) well you know everyones not wrong on this.

Personally I consider myself a decent person. I really don't care about anyones creed, skin colour or nationality. But when I see ( imo ) a big share of one group out committing crime and not contributing like everyone else in the state then I don't see why I should shut up because it's not seen as being politically correct.

orestes

nuxxx wrote: »

Am I missing something? Guy joined a few weeks ago and is saying travellers are a positive entity to Ireland. Well whatever

Have you given any thought to the irony of making such a generalised post in the context of this thread?

Hank Scorpio

Lenin Skynard wrote: »

Either the fullness of your shilling or the last can in your six pack I reckon.

If you think travellers have a positive impact on this little island your taking something alot stronger than drink or out of touch with reality

Max Power

nuxxx wrote: »

Am I missing something? Guy joined a few weeks ago and is saying travellers are a positive entity to Ireland. Well whatever

I joined the same time and disagree with him/her. What's your point exactly?

Boards was created in 1998, does that mean you were banned between 98 and 2007 at some stage?

Defiler Of The Coffin

orestes wrote: »

Have you given any thought to the irony of making such a generalised post in the context of this thread?

It's backed up by experience in both cases

NegativeCreep

nuxxx wrote: »

Why so? Most of these reregs are just trolls who've been previously banned from boards

So it couldn't just be that he joined as a new member in October of this year? People have different views and just because his views are different to yours doesn't mean he's a troll.

Hank Scorpio

No, I've just been using message boards/teh internetz for a long long time and it's a bit strange for someone like yourself to be a "new" user with so many posts while subscribing. Maybe you closed a previous account or you were previously banned. I don't know. Anyhow bailing out of this thread now.

Lenin Skynard

nuxxx wrote: »

No, I've just been using message boards/teh internetz for a long long time and it's a bit strange for someone like yourself to be a "new" user with so many posts while subscribing. Maybe you closed a previous account or you were previously banned. I don't know. Anyhow bailing out of this thread now.

None of it is any of your business.

Stained Class

I remember a time when I was a kid & the traveller women would come into our house to get clothes that myself & my siblings had grown out of.

Mam would have Tea and cake with them afterward, have a chat, etc..

That kinda thing was normal back then in the '70s.

20 years later I was running a market stall & came across them quite a lot.

More wary of them then, but still made a few friends with them.

These days, they seem to have an arrogance about them that outweighs their importance to our society.

It's steadily getting worse & well they only have themselves to blame...

supackofidiots

Hope you told the dirty gypos to Fuck Off outta it.
My family and I barely have a pot to piss in nor a place to throw it out at this stage and we still get dirty gypsies calling here once a quarter telling us they're getting married and have we a few bob to give them. Me auld lad told em to clear off last time around October and the tossers threw a ****ing lighted firework in through the letterbox. a right proper shootey one it was too. a super sonic boom. lucky no one was injured. have absolutely no time for those dirty shower after that.

tdv123

Lenin Skynard wrote: »

None of it is any of your business.

Well thats were you are wrong. It's everybody's business.

orestes

ColeTrain wrote: »

I see your point that there will be people on this thread who have maybe just met a few travellers and their experiences will be skewed.

Still, given the amount of people who hold a negative viewpoint ( that I know ) well you know everyones not wrong on this.

Personally I consider myself a decent person. I really don't care about anyones creed, skin colour or nationality. But when I see ( imo ) a big share of one group out committing crime and not contributing like everyone else in the state then I don't see why I should shut up because it's not seen as being politically correct.

I have no problem with that, I just think that the way this thread was set up was just going to lead to people ranting rather than a discussion. That the subject happens to be travellers is kinda irrelevant to me, it's the pitchfork raising, shit-stirring mentality that I have issue with. It's just an excuse to throw shit at stereotypes.

Max Power

supackofidiots wrote: »

Hope you told the dirty gypos to Fuck Off outta it.
My family and I barely have a pot to piss in nor a place to throw it out at this stage and we still get dirty gypsies calling here once a quarter telling us they're getting married and have we a few bob to give them. Me auld lad told em to clear off last time around October and the tossers threw a ****ing lighted firework in through the letterbox. a right proper shootey one it was too. a super sonic boom. lucky no one was injured. have absolutely no time for those dirty shower after that.

I'm sorry but I lol'd hard. Especially the bolded part.

Headshot

Op is from Limerick where their travellers get free housing in tipp town and they made the town even worse (thought it wasn't possible) . I actually saw the travellers that stabbed that American tourist (not the actual incident) on St Patricks day

I've been threatened by travellers and numerous houses near me being broken into by travellers. I have not one good word you say about travellers

Ihatecuddles-old

FionnMcCool87 wrote: »

I'm sorry but I lol'd hard. Especially the bolded part.

Me too, 'shootey one' is what set me off

Lenin Skynard

tdv123 wrote: »

Well thats were you are wrong. It's everybody's business.

My join date? Well I'm flattered

ColeTrain

orestes wrote: »

I have no problem with that, I just think that the way this thread was set up was just going to lead to people ranting rather than a discussion. That the subject happens to be travellers is kinda irrelevant to me, it's the pitchfork raising, shit-stirring mentality that I have issue with. It's just an excuse to throw shit at stereotypes.

I can see why these threads get locked, put it that way but I think the average opinion on this thread is reflected in Irish society.

Millicent

ColeTrain wrote: »

Travellers in Ireland are not comparable to black people in America. The blacks there have integrated into society while Travellers here remain on the fringes, in most cases willingly. They want all the benefits of society without any of the responsibilities.

For their small number they have a disproportionate amount of troublemakers. The stereotype didn't come out of thin air.



Or perhaps the majority are just calling it as they see it and the minority are living in a bubble or in a tree.

Did you know that at one point in history the Irish government actually classed travellers as "retarded" (as an official educational policy) complete with putting all traveller children, regardless of ability, into special classes? Or that they performed lice checks on those children in front of others?

The State also forced assimilation policies on the community-- a "be like us or f.uck off" sort of thinking that still prevails.

Even now you have people who are quick to call travellers stupid, lawless, savage, ignorant, thieves, etc. etc.

Why the f.uck, given all that and much, much more, would travellers want to integrate into a society that largely views them as scum?

tdv123

Lenin Skynard wrote: »

My join date? Well I'm flattered

Your welcome.

tdv123

Man City 10 wrote: »

I might be a kid but let me say this
My dad or mom(depends who is going to open the door) When anyone comes knocking on the door we simply and my parents thought me that aswell just look out the window
For exampe 1 week ago a man came knocking middle age around 40 not a traveller we could see he wanted to sell something as he had a van so we just did not bother opening the door
Now say if we did open the door and they come asking for money we just simply as what they want and say ''Have you got any money''
(If the people are those like who want to waste your time or by your looks of it are travellers,messers what ever you want to call them
We just simply shut the door on their face straight away after they say Do you have money ?We simply say No and shut the door right across their face. That would ought to shut them up sure they would say a few bad words but what more can they do steal my house pull a gun I say they might aswel pull out a tommy 20 for all we care the time they would take to either ruin the car or break in the house would be enough time to call the police and to arrest them now if they come over night So what go and fight its your car you paid for it and if you die you would know you died trying
(Now if they were not messer or by looks it travellers,knacker what ever you want to call them)

Now if it was serious people we would somethimes hand over a few coins or just explain lol we need some money our self !!! and justsay we cannot give any and shut the door even if they keep persuaing(I know it might seem rude but like what other option you got you know they never stop so...)
I learned from my experience in this little life be scared from no one sure they might be bad and all the news killing and guns and stealing so let them do it and let them try see how well it goes

Do you smoke lots & lots of crack by any chance?

kowloon

Millicent wrote: »

Did you know that at one point in history the Irish government actually classed travellers as "retarded" (as an official educational policy) complete with putting all traveller children, regardless of ability, into special classes? Or that they performed lice checks on those children in front of others?

I remember a traveller kid in school with me, he was put into a class with people his own age (5th/6th class I think it was). He couldn't read and eventually left. Felt terrible for him years later when I understood what it was all about properly. He never stood a chance. There's also a bias against education in the travelling community that doesn't help.

ColeTrain

Millicent wrote: »

Did you know that at one point in history the Irish government actually classed travellers as "retarded" (as an official educational policy) complete with putting all traveller children, regardless of ability, into special classes? Or that they performed lice checks on those children in front of others?

The State also forced assimilation policies on the community-- a "be like us or f.uck off" sort of thinking that still prevails.

Even now you have people who are quick to call travellers stupid, lawless, savage, ignorant, thieves, etc. etc.

Why the f.uck, given all that and much, much more, would travellers want to integrate into a society that largely views them as scum?

I don't see why I should answer for a governments decision decades ago. They may have been treated poorly in the past but from what I can see, they're not doing anything to rise above it.

Do I think Travellers are born equal? Yes
Do I think Travellers need to change how they bring up their kids? Yes.

Merch

Millicent wrote: »

Did you know that at one point in history the Irish government actually classed travellers as "retarded" (as an official educational policy) complete with putting all traveller children, regardless of ability, into special classes? Or that they performed lice checks on those children in front of others?

The State also forced assimilation policies on the community-- a "be like us or f.uck off" sort of thinking that still prevails.

Even now you have people who are quick to call travellers stupid, lawless, savage, ignorant, thieves, etc. etc.

Why the f.uck, given all that and much, much more, would travellers want to integrate into a society that largely views them as scum?

Wasnt the state active or complicit in a lot of dealings with people in particular children that were not positive too in the past and in many ways presently also??

It wasnt only travellers that got screwed over or a raw deal,or continue to do so for that matter.

I dont consider them to be stupid, they have played the system and they are quite astute at it, however a large number of them are lawless, and most of the other things you have mentioned.

VinLieger

The only people who have a good word to say about travellers are the doo-gooders PC brigade/professional apologists who dont have anything better to do but get involved about something they know nothing about, ive had several meetings with travellers none of them positive and thus have no respect for them or those who defend them.

Everyone else gets branded a certain way due to a minority in their own group/culture/demographic why not travellers?

orestes

ColeTrain wrote: »

I can see why these threads get locked, put it that way but I think the average opinion on this thread is reflected in Irish society.

I agree that the average opinion here is about accurate for Irish society, but it's the way they are expressed that is the problem. That's what I meant about the difference between discussion and rabble. Pitchforks just go around in circles, discussion leads to progress.

Defiler Of The Coffin

Millicent wrote: »

Why the f.uck, given all that and much, much more, would travellers want to integrate into a society that largely views them as scum?

If they hate this society so much why do they take its handouts?

No one is saying the Travellers should be assimilated. Others cultures on this island co-exist here just fine. People on this thread are angry at their behaviour

WallyGUFC

Lenin Skynard wrote: »

It's an invalid question because travellers are here and they always will be.

Do you think Ireland is a better place for having disabled people?

Do you think Ireland is a better place for having gay people?

Do you think Ireland is a better place for having black people?

1) Yes. Plenty of disabled people contribute to society here.
2) Yes. Plenty of gay people contribute to society here.
3) Yes. Plenty of black people contribute to society here.
Travellers do not. They are leeches, taking everything they can possibly get off the state without giving anything in return. Maybe they wouldn't be hated so much if they wern't consistently involved in fighting and a broad range of criminality.

mikemac1

Millicent wrote: »

Or that they performed lice checks on those children in front of others?

I went to primary school in the nineties and all children did this

We even had a thread on it in All Things Retro
http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showthread.php?p=80363513
Further down near the end

Did the public health nurse never visit your school and line you all up?

Can I sue Ruari Quinn for some €€€ :pac:

VinLieger

WallyGUFC wrote: »

1) Yes. Plenty of disabled people contribute to society here.
2) Yes. Plenty of gay people contribute to society here.
3) Yes. Plenty of black people contribute to society here.
Travellers do not. They are leeches, taking everything they can possibly get off the state without giving anything in return. Maybe they wouldn't be hated so much if they wern't consistently involved in fighting and a broad range of criminality.

Exactly, travellers or as the used to be traditionally reffered to as "Tinkers" had a place in irish society, they had a skillset of mending and fixing copper and other metals that was useful, however as that skillset fell into uselessness and less profit they didnt pick any other up and just decided ****ing about and existing was enough to have as a culture.
Give me one positive positive example that current travellers contribute to modern irish society?

Dave147

Man City 10 wrote: »

I might be a kid but let me say this
My dad or mom(depends who is going to open the door) When anyone comes knocking on the door we simply and my parents thought me that aswell just look out the window
For exampe 1 week ago a man came knocking middle age around 40 not a traveller we could see he wanted to sell something as he had a van so we just did not bother opening the door
Now say if we did open the door and they come asking for money we just simply as what they want and say ''Have you got any money''
(If the people are those like who want to waste your time or by your looks of it are travellers,messers what ever you want to call them
We just simply shut the door on their face straight away after they say Do you have money ?We simply say No and shut the door right across their face. That would ought to shut them up sure they would say a few bad words but what more can they do steal my house pull a gun I say they might aswel pull out a tommy 20 for all we care the time they would take to either ruin the car or break in the house would be enough time to call the police and to arrest them now if they come over night So what go and fight its your car you paid for it and if you die you would know you died trying
(Now if they were not messer or by looks it travellers,knacker what ever you want to call them)

Now if it was serious people we would somethimes hand over a few coins or just explain lol we need some money our self !!! and justsay we cannot give any and shut the door even if they keep persuaing(I know it might seem rude but like what other option you got you know they never stop so...)
I learned from my experience in this little life be scared from no one sure they might be bad and all the news killing and guns and stealing so let them do it and let them try see how well it goes

Best troll post I've read in a long time.

ColeTrain

orestes wrote: »

I agree that the average opinion here is about accurate for Irish society, but it's the way they are expressed that is the problem. That's what I meant about the difference between discussion and rabble. Pitchforks just go around in circles, discussion leads to progress.

Yes there will always be pitchforks out for them even if the majority were behaving properly.

I respect that they have traditions and are proud of them. I'm proud to be Irish and If I was move to America in the morning I would definitely try to hold onto my heritage and would never let my kids forget their roots. The difference would be I would appreciate the fact I was in a different society and would to try to integrate and adapt to my surroundings. Travellers don't do this in my experience.

token101

Millicent wrote: »

Did you know that at one point in history the Irish government actually classed travellers as "retarded" (as an official educational policy) complete with putting all traveller children, regardless of ability, into special classes? Or that they performed lice checks on those children in front of others?

The State also forced assimilation policies on the community-- a "be like us or f.uck off" sort of thinking that still prevails.

Even now you have people who are quick to call travellers stupid, lawless, savage, ignorant, thieves, etc. etc.

Why the f.uck, given all that and much, much more, would travellers want to integrate into a society that largely views them as scum?

Why are you quoting history? Lots of things happened 'in history' that weren't just, like the laundries, the place of the catholic church, school abuse, it's not just travellers who experienced a harsh time in history. The state tries to enforce the law upon these people, and that's universal. I can't just pitch a tent on some farmers land or some green area, so why are these people excepted from that? I don't care if fighting on some country road is 'culture' to them, if I can't do it neither they can they. If I were to go door to door and pop around the back of someone's house to stare in the windows to see what could be taken, I would be arrested too. What about this 'grabbing' stuff? Is that ok because it's 'culture' as well? Are you really trying to say that a vast proportion of travellers don't fit those 'stereotypes'? That many aren't lawless? That many aren't ignorant? That many aren't thieves? Aside from all the anecdotes that have been given, look at the statistics posted here earlier about battered women, prison populations. Is all of that based on stereotypes? Every bit of it? Every judge who imprisoned a traveller did so due to prejudice? It's ridiculous. Every traveller in Ireland is an Irish citizen, with the same legal rights as anyone else. They get the same rights and benefits as every other person in the state. And with rights come responsibilities and one of those responsibilities is to assimilate to a reasonable point. If they want to willingly live on the fringes, that's fine, but having halting sites as no-go areas for Gardai, having brawls on country roads, bringing up kids to act like animals and behaving like thugs at horse fairs is not assimilation.

If people want to eradicate prejudice in Ireland start with immigrants and refugees who are genuinely discriminated against by the narrow minded with little evidence; the real bigoted stuff against people who have tried to assimilate into society and do it perfectly well most of the time.

seven_eleven

nuxxx wrote: »

No, I've just been using message boards/teh internetz for a long long time and it's a bit strange for someone like yourself to be a "new" user with so many posts while subscribing. Maybe you closed a previous account or you were previously banned. I don't know. Anyhow bailing out of this thread now.

If you have been using boards for a long time then you would know that people often reg and re-reg after closing their accounts for personal reasons. This happens to be my second account

zenno

A spaceman came traveling from the road to my house,
and little did he know i was well above the bounce, and over the hill did this traveler appear and he rang my front door and i could hear.......the sound of cries.......

And just after that, he said do not fear, i come from a land that will make you believe, and over his shoulder he produced a roll of silk and the light of that silk in the sky...... just shined all night......

And just before dawn, while the haggle did still exist, i said will you kindly leave here and not resist but over the road a small bit from here, did i see the most amazing .......silk light shine in the sky......And it went na na na na na na na na na na

na na na na na na na wow wow na na na na na na na na na na peace and good-will to all mankind.

Defiler Of The Coffin

zenno wrote: »

A spaceman came traveling from the road to my house,
and little did he know i was well above the bounce, and over the hill did this traveler appear and he rang my front door and i could hear.......the sound of cries.......

And just after that, he said do not fear, i come from a land that will make you believe, and over his shoulder he produced a roll of silk and the light of that silk in the sky...... just shined all night......

And just before dawn, while the haggle did still exist, i said will you kindly leave here and not resist but over the road a small bit from here, did i see the most amazing .......silk light shine in the sky......And it went na na na na na na na na na na

na na na na na na na wow wow na na na na na na na na na na peace and good-will to all mankind.

Travellers in space - coming soon to TV3

Where To

I've had plenty of dealings with travellers who were a pleasure to do business with.

I've had plenty of dealings with settled people who were a nightmare.

In a thread a few days ago the OP asked what we Irish people invented. We invented stereotyping.

token101

Where To wrote: »

I've had plenty of dealings with travellers who were a pleasure to do business with.

I've had plenty of dealings with settled people who were a nightmare.

In a thread a few days ago the OP asked what we Irish people invented. We invented stereotyping.

That's more anecdotal stuff though, plenty of people could give you alternate opinions. The statistics quoted earlier are based on facts, not stereotyping. There's obviously problems within travelling communities that are having a knock on effect in the rest of society. And we didn't invent stereotyping FFS, Irish people are as much victims as any other people, in the US, UK and now Australia, leave the self loathing out of it.

Da Shins Kelly

There's an awful amount of sh*te talk going on in this thread.

barney 20v

I grew up in rural Co Wexford , in our primary school their were some kids from a travelling family.
Everyone was told to treat them with respect and not pick on them,they were treated well and moved on in life.
One of them,a boy called Thomas came to my attention in recent years after he was jailed for smuggling in class A drugs inside the bodies of living horses .
He was importing them and butchering them to access the drugs, he's in Jail now....I wonder if the boys in mountjoy will respect him like we were made to?
I firmly Believe that drugs and drug smuggling will ruin the social structures that the travelling community have used to evade capture and prosecution all these years.
How long more until CAB etc will have to start tackling this issue head on?

zenno

the traveller community are no different to our so-called stable community (housed)

I have met some beautiful travellers and by jasus they really know how to have a good time and they have a lot more respect to others than you can possibly think of.

A girl I used to know from the travelling community in dublin was Philomena guitarist and singer now in canada and she was one sound girl and of course you will meet hardened travellers drunk that will start up a row but my experience with them was good and they are the real Irish, not because they know how to party but because they are sound when you get to know them and can handle a conversation till the end.

They are geniuses in the sales business i have to say. Sound all round but you will get a few nutcases but that goes with the Island.

barney 20v

zenno wrote: »

the traveller community are no different to our so-called stable community (housed)

I have met some beautiful travellers and by jasus they really know how to have a good time and they have a lot more respect to others than you can possibly think of.

A girl I used to know from the travelling community in dublin was Philomena guitarist and singer now in canada and she was one sound girl and of course you will meet hardened travellers drunk that will start up a row but my experience with them was good and they are the real Irish, not because they know how to party but because they are sound when you get to know them and can handle a conversation till the end.

They are geniuses in the sales business i have to say. Sound all round but you will get a few nutcases but that goes with the Island.

Its easy to sell on what you didn't pay for in the first place.

zenno

barney 20v wrote: »

Its easy to sell on what you didn't pay for in the first place.

Explain ?.

barney 20v

zenno wrote: »

Explain ?.

No need to.

zenno

barney 20v wrote: »

No need to.

There is a need to.

If you are making a comment then it is necessary to explain the detail in your said comment ?

Anyway, be well barney Slan.

barney 20v

zenno wrote: »

There is a need to.

If you are making a comment then it is necessary to explain the detail in your said comment ?

Anyway, be well barney Slan.

If you can show me where it says that on the site/forum charter then by all means.....

zenno

barney 20v wrote: »

If you can show me where it says that on the site/forum charter then by all means.....

It is not on the forum charter, it is in respect to the questioner that's all.

working fool

We are missing out on a Huge opportunity here .
We should have the traveller community run FÁS !
I've yet to meet or make eye contact with a traveller who hasent found something for me to do .